Overdrawn: Bungling burglar caught cracking into bank in Phuket

[webfact]

U.S. Democrats withdraw offer to fund Trump's border wall

By Richard Cowan and Susan Cornwell

 

DACA recipients and supporters protest for a clean Dream Act outside Disneyland in Anaheim, California U.S. January 22, 2018. REUTERS/Lucy Nicholson

 

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Democrats on Tuesday withdrew an offer to fund U.S. President Donald Trump's border wall, as tough negotiations over the future of young illegal immigrants resumed in the Senate.

 

A day after the end of a government shutdown linked to wrangling over immigration, Senate Democratic Leader Chuck Schumer said he pulled the offer because of what he said was Trump's failure to follow through on the outlines of an agreement the two men discussed last Friday.

 

"So we’re going to have to start on a new basis and the wall offer is off the table,” Schumer told reporters.

 

During the 2016 election campaign, Republican Trump said Mexico would pay the cost of building a wall along the southwestern border of the United States to keep out illegal immigrants. Mexico has rejected the idea.

 

As a result Trump has been forced to ask Congress for U.S. taxpayer funds for the wall; government estimates are that it could cost over $21 billion.

 

With Democrats and many Republicans arguing there are more effective border enforcement tools than a wall, the proposal has become a major sticking point in immigration negotiations, which in turn have complicated talks about funding federal agencies.

 

The Senate's No. 2 Democrat Dick Durbin, asked by a reporter whether Schumer offered Trump $25 billion for the wall in a major concession to the president, did not dispute the figure, but said: "He did it in the context of a negotiation."

 

Democrats have been spearheading an effort to protect around 700,000 young, undocumented immigrants from deportation after Trump last September announced the end of the Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals (DACA) programme instituted by his predecessor President Barack Obama, a Democrat.

 

The programme, which began in 2012, gave qualified so-called Dreamers, immigrants who were brought illegally into the United States as children, temporary protection from deportation and the ability to study and work in the United States.

 

Senator John Cornyn, the No. 2 Senate Republican, criticized Schumer for pulling the wall funding offer.

 

"That basically sets the DACA discussion back," he told reporters.

 

Cornyn said there have been discussions of he and Durbin being a "clearinghouse" for suggestions from senators on legislation to rescue Dreamers from the threat of deportation and provide permanent protections for them.

 

In agreeing on Monday to end a three-day-old government shutdown and fund the government until Feb. 8, Senate Democrats got a promise from Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell that he would allow an immigration debate on the Senate floor in the near future, the first one since 2013.

 

Durbin said a similar commitment is now needed from Paul Ryan, the Republican speaker of the House of Representatives, where a Dreamer bill would presumably face a much harder path to passage than in the Senate.

 

The White House on Tuesday rejected the idea that a bipartisan bill sponsored by Durbin and Republican Senator Lindsey Graham could be the core of a solution.

 

White House spokeswoman Sarah Sanders said the proposal was "totally unacceptable to the president and should be declared dead on arrival."

 

Trump himself has vacillated on immigration between tough rhetoric demanding a U.S. border wall and a softer tone urging a "bill of love" for Dreamers.

 

"Nobody knows for sure that the Republicans & Democrats will be able to reach a deal on DACA by February 8, but everyone will be trying," Trump wrote in a post on Twitter.

 

(Reporting by Richard Cowan, Susan Cornwell, Amanda Becker, Makini Brice and Steve Holland; Editing by Andrew Hay, Bill Trott, Grant McCool)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2018-01-24

[Samui Bodoh]

This whole debate is an embarrassment to the USA.

 

Build a wall that Mexico is (not) going to pay for? And that won't actually work in solving the problem? Deport hundreds of thousands of people who are American in every sense but a bureaucratic form or two? And who are teachers, firemen, soldiers, etc.?

 

Apologies to my American friends, but the world is looking at you with both disgust and concern; you are supposed to be a serious country and we all want you to act like one.

 

Anyone think a new shut down won't happen in a few weeks?

 

What a cluster****.

 

 

Edited January 23, 2018 by Samui Bodoh

[fxe1200]

Building a wall, whilst 73 percent of all immigrants enter the U.S. by plane.

[PhonThong]

12 minutes ago, fxe1200 said:

Building a wall, whilst 73 percent of all immigrants enter the U.S. by plane.

If they come by plane it means that they have a visa and are entering legally.        

[simple1]

1 minute ago, PhonThong said:

If they come by plane it means that they have a visa and are entering legally.        

and then overstay and transition to the status of "illegal immigrants"

 

629,000 overstayers in 2016

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/22/us/homeland-security-foreigners-overstayed-visas.html

[mtls2005]

53 minutes ago, fxe1200 said:

Building a wall, whilst 73 percent of all immigrants enter the U.S. by plane.

 

And ~95% of the drugs come via the sea, and air. (Excluding the opioids manufactured in the U.S. of course.)

 

About the only thing "pouring" over the border are legal imports/exports, cheaper prescription drugs, tourists and legal immigrants.

 

 

[Pib]

 
And ~95% of the drugs come via the sea, and air. (Excluding the opioids manufactured in the U.S. of course.)
 
About the only thing "pouring" over the border are legal imports/exports, cheaper prescription drugs, tourists and legal immigrants.
 
 

Don't worry...Donald plans to install anti-aircraft and anti-ship missiles on his wall. Maybe even a death ray cannon also.

[ToS2014]

2 hours ago, Samui Bodoh said:

This whole debate is an embarrassment to the USA.

 

Build a wall that Mexico is (not) going to pay for? And that won't actually work in solving the problem? Deport hundreds of thousands of people who are American in every sense but a bureaucratic form or two? And who are teachers, firemen, soldiers, etc.?

 

Apologies to my American friends, but the world is looking at you with both disgust and concern; you are supposed to be a serious country and we all want you to act like one.

 

Anyone think a new shut down won't happen in a few weeks?

 

What a cluster****.

 

 

So no wall equates to open borders.  Hmmm, what passport do those travelers hold; ahh wait, no passports required.  What state is it called then?  Why then are American's required to hold passports and travel legally to the EU and get a stamp, or Thailand and report to their parole officer.....err immigration every 90 days?  Why not just run, jump, or swim to your next vacation/work spot?  Paying taxes, heck no.  The state has 'enough money' to support illegals to free schooling, nice roads and other public services.  Shoot, why not just sneak into Iran, (or pick your state that you are not from), and run a business and send all your money back home?

 

I do agree that shutting down ANY government over illegals is utter nonsense.  Thus the deal is build a wall, end a lottery visa program and chain migration.  Since I reside legally in Thailand, I DO NOT have the right to bring my entire family here.  Why is it so 'wrong' for America to do the same?  My family can come and visit, but they must abide by Thai immigration rules.

[Credo]

14 minutes ago, ToS2014 said:

So no wall equates to open borders.  Hmmm, what passport do those travelers hold; ahh wait, no passports required.  What state is it called then?  Why then are American's required to hold passports and travel legally to the EU and get a stamp, or Thailand and report to their parole officer.....err immigration every 90 days?  Why not just run, jump, or swim to your next vacation/work spot?  Paying taxes, heck no.  The state has 'enough money' to support illegals to free schooling, nice roads and other public services.  Shoot, why not just sneak into Iran, (or pick your state that you are not from), and run a business and send all your money back home?

 

I do agree that shutting down ANY government over illegals is utter nonsense.  Thus the deal is build a wall, end a lottery visa program and chain migration.  Since I reside legally in Thailand, I DO NOT have the right to bring my entire family here.  Why is it so 'wrong' for America to do the same?  My family can come and visit, but they must abide by Thai immigration rules.

Not even a close comparison.   You may live in Thailand, but you are only one step above a tourist.   If you live in the states and you are not a citizen, sponsoring a relative is not usually possible and if you do, you must show adequate financial resources to support them.   Oh, and they still have to wait in the queue, they have to be interviewed and meet all the criteria for entry and they can be rejected either at the embassy or after arrival.   Etc., etc., etc.   

 

[kamahele]

3 hours ago, Samui Bodoh said:

This whole debate is an embarrassment to the USA.

 

Build a wall that Mexico is (not) going to pay for? And that won't actually work in solving the problem? Deport hundreds of thousands of people who are American in every sense but a bureaucratic form or two? And who are teachers, firemen, soldiers, etc.?

 

Apologies to my American friends, but the world is looking at you with both disgust and concern; you are supposed to be a serious country and we all want you to act like one.

 

Anyone think a new shut down won't happen in a few weeks?

 

What a cluster****.

 

 

No need to apologize to Americans. We know it.......

[thaibeachlovers]

Back to the OP. If Schumer thinks withdrawing funding for the wall is somehow going to get Trump to legalise the Dreamers, he's a dreamer. Trump knows he needs the wall to placate his base that were upset Obamacare wasn't cancelled, and if he doesn't get it he is in trouble with his base. He also knows that this is probably his only chance to get the money ( the wall was already approved, but not funded ) to build it.

Choice between illegal immigrants vs the wall. Which will Trump stick with? 

In the end, it will depend on how much the Dems want to legalise the Dreamers. Trump doesn't have to do anything to have DACA expire, the Dems have to do something to keep it.

[Pib]

Donald just needs to get Mexico to gladly pay for the wall as that was Donald's campaign promise.  

 

Then again, probably what Donald really meant was he'll hire Mexicans to build the wall with U.S. taxpayer money.      

[Boon Mee]

Schumer's offer was basically made in bad faith so the beat goes on. 

[mike324]

Why aren't Trump supporters here outrage that tax payers have to fund the wall first? Didn't Trump say he is a good negotiator and Mexico will pay? I think getting tax payers to pay first, then raising taxes on Mexico later is just a bait and switch on his promise. Trump supporters rather $21 billion spent on a wall which has minimal impact piece of dead weight, compare to $21 billion spent on either healthcare? education? or even legalizing dreamers who are already contributing to the society?! 

[mikebike]

2 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Back to the OP. If Schumer thinks withdrawing funding for the wall is somehow going to get Trump to legalise the Dreamers, he's a dreamer. Trump knows he needs the wall to placate his base that were upset Obamacare wasn't cancelled, and if he doesn't get it he is in trouble with his base. He also knows that this is probably his only chance to get the money ( the wall was already approved, but not funded ) to build it.

Choice between illegal immigrants vs the wall. Which will Trump stick with? 

In the end, it will depend on how much the Dems want to legalise the Dreamers. Trump doesn't have to do anything to have DACA expire, the Dems have to do something to keep it.

Without Schumer’s statement Dems would have little leverage in the upcoming weeks...

[Becker]

26 minutes ago, mike324 said:

Why aren't Trump supporters here outrage that tax payers have to fund the wall first? Didn't Trump say he is a good negotiator and Mexico will pay? I think getting tax payers to pay first, then raising taxes on Mexico later is just a bait and switch on his promise. Trump supporters rather $21 billion spent on a wall which has minimal impact piece of dead weight, compare to $21 billion spent on either healthcare? education? or even legalizing dreamers who are already contributing to the society?! 

Because the deplorables will continue saying "Thank you Sir, may I have another" as long as they believe the man-child actually wants to MAWA.

 

 

[FritsSikkink]

4 hours ago, PhonThong said:

If they come by plane it means that they have a visa and are entering legally.        

that they HAD a visa

[Thaidream]

The sad part about all this is that the US has had no real budget in place for 3 years. The Us exists on a continuing resolution rather than a new budget being debated and agreed upon each year.

Now we have Donald Trump who is using the status of young illegals brought to America when they were below the age of actual consent as a wedge to get a $21 Million border wall.  Almost 90% of all Americans want DACA extended or a bill to legalise these people.  There is also the Children's healthcare act which has been expired for months and needs to be extended by Congress- also being held hostage to this ridiculous wall.

Most Americans are opposed to the wall and everyone knows Mexico will never pay for it.  If Trump tries and add on tariffs or tax Mexican  exports to the Us- Mexico will simply take its business to other countries and American business will suffer.

This whole issue shows the utter disdain Trump has for  most Americans- he simply wants to win.  The cost of a border wall of $21 Billion would provide a lot of healthcare to sick Americans and also education.

We already have Immigration agents deporting people who have been in America 30 and 40 years who have committed no crimes; worked and paid taxes.

There is something radically wrong with American and it starts with Donald Trump who has absolutely no vision of what really would make America a great country.

[UncleTouchyFingers]

23 minutes ago, Thaidream said:

The sad part about all this is that the US has had no real budget in place for 3 years. The Us exists on a continuing resolution rather than a new budget being debated and agreed upon each year.

Now we have Donald Trump who is using the status of young illegals brought to America when they were below the age of actual consent as a wedge to get a $21 Million border wall.  Almost 90% of all Americans want DACA extended or a bill to legalise these people.  There is also the Children's healthcare act which has been expired for months and needs to be extended by Congress- also being held hostage to this ridiculous wall.

Most Americans are opposed to the wall and everyone knows Mexico will never pay for it.  If Trump tries and add on tariffs or tax Mexican  exports to the Us- Mexico will simply take its business to other countries and American business will suffer.

This whole issue shows the utter disdain Trump has for  most Americans- he simply wants to win.  The cost of a border wall of $21 Billion would provide a lot of healthcare to sick Americans and also education.

We already have Immigration agents deporting people who have been in America 30 and 40 years who have committed no crimes; worked and paid taxes.

There is something radically wrong with American and it starts with Donald Trump who has absolutely no vision of what really would make America a great country.

 

Hes asking for 1.6 billion I believe, to start. Pocket change in the grand scheme of things. To get the ball rolling. He also wants to find a solution for DREAMERS, not illegal immigrants on the whole. The DREAMERS. The polls that you cite, they dont say that "90% of americans want daca bla bla" most say something like they dont want the kids deported. Most people would agree that those kids (the legit ones) should be allowed to stay, the argument arises as to in what capacity. From what I see  online most people agree that a good compromise is that they can stay as long as they want as long as they get the proper available visas (from whatever comes of all this) but cannot ever vote, nor bring family. Give the dreamers a pass, fund the beginning of the wall, enforce E-verify for ANY employer. Etc Etc. Objective being to not have to go through this again and do defer future illegal immigrants. As long as they thing all they have to do is come here and get a job, then they will continue to do so. But we can (and damn well should) take alot of the incentives out of it. 

 

None of this is unreasonable, and STILL more free and lenient than most other 1st world countries. 

 

Alot of your post, as usual, is emotional hyperbole. 

 

Democrats are complicit in this because they want the votes. 

 

We've had several large amnesties over the years with little regulatory enforcement thereafter, and the problem KEEPS happening because of it. The United States is not Mexico/South America and vise versa. 

[Thaidream]

I would agree with the majority of your post- this has to be a one time thing or it will keep happening.  As far as the 'Border Wall'- the budget could live with the amount you stated so if I was the Democrats I would compromise on this. I also want Trump and Congress to agree to fund the children's Healthcare Act which is essential to keeping the most vulnerable alive.

 

I am not in favor of unlimited Immigration- but America really needs an overhaul on its Immigration Law to allow Visas to be issued for laborers to come and do the jobs illegals are already doing.  They come in legal; get Work Permits; and after a certain time depending on the need either renew their permission to stay or  go back home.

 

I am not in favor of the H1B program which has allowed thousands of High Tech Workers to come to places like Silicon Valley in California and take jobs that Americans could fill. Greedy business is using these Visas to pay  non Americans lower wages than they would have to pay Americans. If these companies claim they can't find enough Hi Tech workers how about putting some money into training programs for unemployed Americans.

 

As an aside I do believe Government has a responsibility to provide universal healthcare and education to ALL its citizens and legal residents.  Every industrialized country in the World at least provides healthcare funded by working citizens. Americans continue to suffer and struggle because of this and Americans go broke trying to keep themselves alive. American workers already pay for Medicare every payday so this could easily be expanded to cover everyone. Greedy insurance goes out of business and outrageously priced pharmaceuticals that keep people alive are forced to sell at proper prices

.  Nobody in the healthcare business should ever be able to make a profit off the misery of others.

[UncleTouchyFingers]

16 minutes ago, Thaidream said:

I would agree with the majority of your post- this has to be a one time thing or it will keep happening.  As far as the 'Border Wall'- the budget could live with the amount you stated so if I was the Democrats I would compromise on this. I also want Trump and Congress to agree to fund the children's Healthcare Act which is essential to keeping the most vulnerable alive.

 

I am not in favor of unlimited Immigration- but America really needs an overhaul on its Immigration Law to allow Visas to be issued for laborers to come and do the jobs illegals are already doing.  They come in legal; get Work Permits; and after a certain time depending on the need either renew their permission to stay or  go back home.

 

I am not in favor of the H1B program which has allowed thousands of High Tech Workers to come to places like Silicon Valley in California and take jobs that Americans could fill. Greedy business is using these Visas to pay  non Americans lower wages than they would have to pay Americans. If these companies claim they can't find enough Hi Tech workers how about putting some money into training programs for unemployed Americans.

 

As an aside I do believe Government has a responsibility to provide universal healthcare and education to ALL its citizens and legal residents.  Every industrialized country in the World at least provides healthcare funded by working citizens. Americans continue to suffer and struggle because of this and Americans go broke trying to keep themselves alive. American workers already pay for Medicare every payday so this could easily be expanded to cover everyone. Greedy insurance goes out of business and outrageously priced pharmaceuticals that keep people alive are forced to sell at proper prices

.  Nobody in the healthcare business should ever be able to make a profit off the misery of others.

CHIP has been agreed for 6 years of funding already, even before the shutdown I believe. The sticking point is Shumer grandstanding over daca & illegal immigrants. 

 

2nd paragraph logistically wont ever work and is just polishing a turd. The overhaul needs to come from enforcing E-verify so that employers HAVE TO hire legitimate people, and the wages will follow. Id rather pay more for strawberries or oranges or potatoes knowing they were picked by and support Americans. Wouldnt you?

 

H1B is no problem, every country has similar employment/business visas. Thailand included. Business wants diversity or foreigners and want to pay & sponsor & pay legit wages? No problem. 

 

Universal healthcare? Me too! Where do we get it? The DNC Shit all over bernie and hes an extreme old-man-shouting-at-coulds type. Obama passed a bill while lying his ass off and cost my insurance premiums to go up over 300%. None of this is Trumps fault. None of it. The people that were not happy (understandably) about the lies perpetrated by the Obama campaign over it all really pissed people off (and the Dems are continuing to do it now with DACA). People wanted healthcare, and what the Democrats gave them was MORE INSURANCE for MORE MONEY and LESS COVERAGE. Its outrageous. 

 

You keep banging on about "Trump and his distain for the American people" yet its the democrats that are literally doing what you accuse Trump of. 

 

Im sorry for people that knowingly stay in the US for DECADES illegally and get deported, but that sure as shit inst anybody's fault but their own, and it certainly isnt Trumps. 

The dems fight this just like they fight voter ID. Has nothing to do with decency or racism or hatred. They want the votes and will shame anyone into oblivion to get it. If Americans dont vote for Democrats, then the Dems will just import voters illegally from other countries to bolster their base, all the while pointing at anyone disagreeing a racist bigoted hate monger. 

 

They get on the MSM and grandstand about the "Sanctity of the Vote" and "Meddling in Our Democracy" while pointing to Trump and conservatives, yet are totally ok and complicit in doing just that inside or own borders. 

 

Say what you want about Trump, but the hypocrisy and corruption of todays Democrats is extremely dangerous. DACA is unfortunate but it isnt Trumps making. The fact that hes even willing to continue to compromise after the Democrats took a dump on his efforts by starting the shithole trend is more than he should do considering he holds all the cards. Obama did it for the votes, and the Democrats are foaming at the mouth to keep them. 

[Thaidream]

I do not like Trump for several reasons which include his inability to bring people together and his penchant for talking down to people instead of speaking softly but carrying the big stick. In addition, his background is spurious- he is not smart  and doesn't study the issues and therefore he is ignorant of the real solutions.  The Republicans are as bad- they believe only in the trickle down theory of economics in which the rich will reinvest in America but history has shown the rich only reinvest in themselves and  really will not take less so the rest of society prospers. Pure greed and selfishness.

 

I don't even like the Democrats who can't see the big picture of what really is wrong with America and how to fix it. They merely spend and kick the ball down the road without any real change.

The person closest to my philosophy is Bernie Sanders as he has the fix for Healthcare (Put everyone under Medicare); the fix for Education (Make Tuition Free); the fix for economic inequity (increase taxes on the wealthy- return money to the 99%). I want to see him go further- and end the ridiculous foreign aid that goes to Israel-Pakistan and Egypt;  bring US troops home from the Middle East; and ultimately decrease the US defense budget by 30%. There is plenty more ways to make America really great again but Trump sure as hell can't do it nor could Hillary Clinton.

 

There also has to be a complete reform in the way Presidents are elected and members of Congress-  the money needs to be taken out of the system. How about a one 6 year term for President and term limits on members of Congress.  Once the money is taken out-  donations stopped and influence peddling ended- we might actually see some change in how America is run.

 

In regards to  Americans going out to take jobs now done by illegal labor- it's  never going to happen- the huge conglomerate business that uses illegals will never pay the wages that the Average American needs to be attracted to these jobs.  If you have ever done them- you would know why. I have-Backbreaking and dirty work.  America was made great on foreign labor and we need it .  The real solution is issuing the proper permits and Visas and then tracking the people. In addition- after the border is secured (not by a border wall) but by hiring more agents and hi tech methods- an amnesty and procedure for legitimizing the current illegals can begin. It is impossible to deport 11 million people and the cost prohibitive as well as the bad publicity overseas.

America needs a real President not beholden to any party but  one who works for the people only. That's the only way America will ever regain its greatness.

[thaibeachlovers]

4 hours ago, mikebike said:

Without Schumer’s statement Dems would have little leverage in the upcoming weeks...

I don't see that the Dems have any leverage at all. All they can do is shut the government down again and they were owned in the just gone effort for doing that.

Schumer looks like what he accused Trump of being, the more he waffles about paying, not paying..........................

I think the Donald set a trap when he moved on DACA way back and Schumer/ Pelosi just walked right in.

Meanwhile, tick tock, unless the Dems agree to something he will sign it's bye bye Dreamers ( his base will love him if that happens ). He won on the just ended shut down, so doubt he will cave in February.

However, have to wait and see.

Edited January 24, 2018 by thaibeachlovers

[thaibeachlovers]

3 hours ago, Thaidream said:

The sad part about all this is that the US has had no real budget in place for 3 years. The Us exists on a continuing resolution rather than a new budget being debated and agreed upon each year.

Now we have Donald Trump who is using the status of young illegals brought to America when they were below the age of actual consent as a wedge to get a $21 Million border wall.  Almost 90% of all Americans want DACA extended or a bill to legalise these people.  There is also the Children's healthcare act which has been expired for months and needs to be extended by Congress- also being held hostage to this ridiculous wall.

Most Americans are opposed to the wall and everyone knows Mexico will never pay for it.  If Trump tries and add on tariffs or tax Mexican  exports to the Us- Mexico will simply take its business to other countries and American business will suffer.

This whole issue shows the utter disdain Trump has for  most Americans- he simply wants to win.  The cost of a border wall of $21 Billion would provide a lot of healthcare to sick Americans and also education.

We already have Immigration agents deporting people who have been in America 30 and 40 years who have committed no crimes; worked and paid taxes.

There is something radically wrong with American and it starts with Donald Trump who has absolutely no vision of what really would make America a great country.

There is also the Children's healthcare act which has been expired for months and needs to be extended by Congress-

CHIP was extended for 6 years. 

[thaibeachlovers]

38 minutes ago, Thaidream said:

 

 

 

 

 

In regards to  Americans going out to take jobs now done by illegal labor- it's  never going to happen- the huge conglomerate business that uses illegals will never pay the wages that the Average American needs to be attracted to these jobs.  If you have ever done them- you would know why. I have-Backbreaking and dirty work.  America was made great on foreign labor and we need it .  The real solution is issuing the proper permits and Visas and then tracking the people. In addition- after the border is secured (not by a border wall) but by hiring more agents and hi tech methods- an amnesty and procedure for legitimizing the current illegals can begin. It is impossible to deport 11 million people and the cost prohibitive as well as the bad publicity overseas.

America needs a real President not beholden to any party but  one who works for the people only. That's the only way America will ever regain its greatness.

the huge conglomerate business that uses illegals will never pay the wages that the Average American needs to be attracted to these jobs.  If you have ever done them- you would know why. I have-Backbreaking and dirty work. 

 

I have done plenty of "Backbreaking and dirty work" myself. If Americans won't do the work themselves they deserve to have to pay twice as much for them to be done by properly paid guest workers. Americans are just selfish people that want everything for sod all.

 

In addition- after the border is secured (not by a border wall) but by hiring more agents and hi tech methods

LOL. Anyone that has half a brain cell knows that more agents and hi tech only lasts till another president decides to cut costs.

Only the wall provides permanent protection with a minimal border force.

[Thaidream]

I find your response to be not only wrong but rude.  I hardly think every American wants everything for nothing and your post shows your concepts are wrong and you are being cheeky.

If I really believed that American business would raise prices to allow Americans to take these kind of jobs- I would be happy to pay higher prices.  That is what is done in Japan- the difference being is that Japanese wealth is evenly distributed and people on the bottom make excellent wages. If you pay an American $20 per hour to pick potatoes- you will find American workers but business will never pay it- too greedy. 

The wall provides little protection becuase it could never stretch the whole length of the border- there are too many hazards or mountains. In addition- it has been shown that illegals will find a ladder 21 feet in height to straddle a 20 foot high border wall.  It is a complete waste of money that could be spent helping Americans with healthcare and education. 

America needs a real Immigration law that brings in guest workers legally and an amnesty that provides a way to legality for the 11 million illegals.

Trump would deport them all because he is completely ignorant on how to structure a fair and equitable system and he looks down on people who are struggling and poor. The odd thing is that he uses illegals in all business deals and his own Florida Hotel pays the huge wage to foreign labor of $10-$13 per hour.  Why doesn't he pay a fair wage and hire Americans?  Simple answer- He's greedy and selfish.

[UncleTouchyFingers]

7 minutes ago, Thaidream said:

The odd thing is that he uses illegals in all business deals

Yeah that is fake news. 

 

7 minutes ago, Thaidream said:

his own Florida Hotel pays the huge wage to foreign labor of $10-$13 per hour.

Thats almost double minimum wage, and happens in all tourism industries in the US. Hotels, Resorts, Cruise Ships, Casinos, Restaurants, you name it. Hell, the Marriott inside the Tampa International Airport is full of Caribbean, African, Philippine, South American, etc... Its all about atmosphere and a totally acceptable use of the visa you hate so much. 

 

Geez man you guys will hate on anything.

[thaibeachlovers]

2 minutes ago, Thaidream said:

 

The wall provides little protection becuase it could never stretch the whole length of the border- there are too many hazards or mountains. In addition- it has been shown that illegals will find a ladder 21 feet in height to straddle a 20 foot high border wall.  It is a complete waste of money that could be spent helping Americans with healthcare and education. 

America needs a real Immigration law that brings in guest workers legally and an amnesty that provides a way to legality for the 11 million illegals.

 

It doesn't have to cross the mountains and other natural hazards to start with, as everyone knows full well.

A barrier with razor wire on top would work just fine.

The Israeli wall works just fine, as we are told it has stopped terrorist attacks. Why wouldn't the US one do likewise, provided there are enough patrol people to capture them after they climb the ladder. No wall ever has worked without people to back it up.

Why should US medical insurance companies be given even more money?

The problem with education as is well known is that public schools have terrible teachers that can't be fired. Private schools don't have a problem teaching kids.

I agree that there should be guest worker visas, like Saudi has- that works, and they all go home in the end. None stay on illegally.

I don't say that dreamers should be deported, but they shouldn't get citizenship without going through the same process as anyone else. Stay on a legal DACA, but no vote, no chain migration.

I could have stayed in Thailand since I was a child, but I'd still have to go through the normal process to become a Thai citizen. What makes dreamers different?

[UncleTouchyFingers]

16 minutes ago, Thaidream said:

In addition- it has been shown that illegals will find a ladder 21 feet in height to straddle a 20 foot high border wall.

 

Also this bit, security is rarely about stopping 100% forever - its about increasing the time it takes to penetrate whatever you are looking to get into. That extra time allows border security to actually GET THERE. 20 foot wall with a huge ball on top, topped with concertina wire and lined with infrared cameras and all the bells & whistles and you are gonna sit there and try to tell me that isnt a formidable boundary? That thing would give even the fittest people a REAL hard time to penetrate, even with a 20' foot ladder. 

 

Its a package deal. Besides man just watch this and tell me who the moron is. 

 

 

[Thaidream]

Never said  Dreamers shouldn't be vetted. I  say legalise them and let them apply for citizenship like everyone else.

 

I also say vett the 11 Million current illegals and deport the criminal and legalise the rest.

I am against a useless border wall that costs $21 Billion- I will accept a  barrier in some places and enhanced security -  cost should be about $1 Billon.

 

Using the Israeli Wall as an example is horrid- that wall is reminiscent of the Berlin Wall which separated families for decades and that is exactly what the Israeli Wall does.

 

Regarding Healthcare- I in no way implied   Insurance Companies shud get any money- I said expand Medicare to Universal coverage for every citizen- We do this and we don't need Insurance Companies.  In addition- if the Government is the single payer- Big Pharma cannot keep raising prices on life saving medicines- they have to take what the Government will pay. Should they stop research- the US Government can take over the drug business.  Even Thailand has a Government Pharmaceutical Bureau.

 

I never said High Schools should be tuition free. I am stating that Universities/Technical schools should be Tuition Free as many advanced countries provide.  At present- American University students go into debt for hundreds of thousands of dollars and become indentured stewards of the state for 20 years to pay back the loans.

 

America is way behind the rest of the industrialized world in caring for its citizens. For way too long Americans have seen their overall wealth being redistributed from the 99% to the 1%. In 2017 82% of all income generated went to the 1% while the rest of us twisted in the wind struggling to get ahead.  Luckily- I am retired and away from all the greed that has caused the 99% of Americans to become poorer.

 

Trump has not changing any of the things wrong with America- nothing he is doing or will do will ever make Ameerica a great country again.