Uninsured Brit seriously injured and stranded in hospital after motorbike accident in Hua Hin

[scorecard]

6 hours ago, colinneil said:

In most countries the car drivers insure would have to pay.

This is Thailand, and things do not always go the way you would expect.

Did the car driver have insurance?

Mark Haley stupidly came here without insurance, now his family want others to pay for his stupidity.

 

Should the compulsory third party insurance cover this?

 

 

[scubascuba3]

 
Should the compulsory third party insurance cover this?
 
 

The compulsory insurance medical cover is very low like 50000 baht, it sounds like it was the riders fault so the car drivers insurers wouldn't pay out

[thaibeachlovers]

1 minute ago, Wake Up said:

Where and when have you driven to in Thailand?. I have driven from BKk to Chang Mai, Chang Mai, Loei, Khon Kaen, Buriram, Koh Chang, Krabi, Phuket and many more places. The roads in Thailand are better than most roads in the world and constantly being constructed.  Some potholes exist but very few. Misinformation on TV is not useful. 

5555555555555555555

Thousands of miles around the north, over many years.

If you think the roads are so brilliant try driving on the 2 lane from Lampang to Den Chai. More than a few near death experiences on that one, I've had.

The 1089 from Taton to Mae Chan is almost all potholes.

I can pretty much say for sure that you never took the forest road from Phrae to Tha Pla, and the Thoeng roads are pretty "exciting".

Have you driven the forest roads around Sirikit Dam? They're pretty "interesting".

There are a few classic m'bike traps on the old road to Chiang Mai from Lamphun, but if one only goes on the 11 one would never know, of course.

 

I guess if you just drove on the superhighways you can say that the roads in LOS are world class, but to Mae Hong Son on the 1095 one can't look at the scenery while driving, that's for sure.

[JRUSA]

5 hours ago, lordblackader said:

Why the constant need to attack Thailand when they're begging for money? 

Absolutely nothing wrong with the condition of Thai roads, they're actually very, very good, better than many western countries. The Somchai's driving on them are another matter but that's beside the point. 

I believe the quote was about the road conditions to transport a severed spine broken neck ribs etc..that's why the need of helicopter transport..

[Thaidream]

In this case the car drivers insurance would pay if he was at fault. According to a prior poster the cycle driver swerved into the car driver's lane and caused the collision so the cycle driver's insurance would pay if he had insurance, for everyone.

 

Let's remember that healthcare is a human right -regardless of circumstance- everyone has a right to life.  While everyone has certain responsibilities for caring for oneself- one should not be penalized and not be provided curative healthcare.

 

The problem is that in most countries insurance exists not to assist anyone but to make a profit. The same can be said for doctors, hospitals and the pharmaceutical industry. All of them are making money off someone else's misery and to end this practice we must admit it exists.

 

Most people in every country of the World pay taxes of some sort to the central government and that government exists to serve the people not itself. All healthcare should be provided at no cost everywhere in the World for every person regardless of nationality. The UK has the NHS; Japan has universal healthcare and every industrialised country in the World has some scheme to provide care to its citizens. Every country- except America- which has the highest healthcare costs in the World (and not really the best).

 

The problem is that Thailand wants to follow the American model so doctors; hospitals and insurance companies etc can get wealthy. This should never be allowed. At least Thailand has the 30 Baht scheme which in essence provides free healthcare to those who cannot pay. 

 

In regards to foreigners- how difficult can it be to collect an extra 500 Baht -added to the airline ticket- to go into a healthcare fund to be used by foreigners needing urgent or catastrophic care.  How difficult would it be to develop reciprocal treatment agreement between the United Nations and countries in which the passport country would reimburse the country treating their citizen for costs.

 

None of the above is difficult. What is difficult is for people to stop treatingthealthcare as a privilege. It is a human right and everyone is entitled to it regardless of whether they can pay or not.

[travelerjim]

4 hours ago, Peterw42 said:

Health insurance covers your health, not usually accidents. Treatment of diabetes not skydiving injuries.

Not true.  The policy described above covers both health insurance including accidents.  Read the exclusions regarding skydiving and similar.  But motorbike accidents would be covered .

Edited March 19, 2018 by travelerjim

[ujayujay]

Some never learn! I am speachless.

[stevenl]

4 hours ago, Peterw42 said:

Health insurance covers your health, not usually accidents. Treatment of diabetes not skydiving injuries.

Not true, also medical consequences of accidents are covered under health insurance.

[stevenl]

3 hours ago, SupermarineS6B said:

Hit from behind at a U-turn !   Typical Somchai not watching what he was doing i bet, i expect he also "Fled the scene of the accident as well".........  This is the pratt that should be paying ........

Wrong on both counts.

[stevenl]

3 hours ago, Samui property finder said:

Maybe i am wrong but most health insurance and /or travel insurance will not cover motorbike accidents. so should it normally not be the car drivers insurance that need to pay for his medical expenses.....from what i read the car hit him from behind so....

Yes, you are wrong on both counts.

[Thaidream]

According to what has previously been reported- a Westerner was driving the car and the cycle driver changed lanes abruptly across the path of the car to attempt to make  U turn causing the car to hit the cycle.  If this is indeed the case- the cycle driver is responsible for the entire incident. No Thais were involved.

[Thaidream]

Just because a vehicle driver strikes another vehicle from behind does not automatically make it the  fault of the driver who rear ended the other vehicle. As a former auto accident investigator- I have seen many cases of sudden stops for no reason; late swerves into lanes and even cars stopped on a motorway with no lights on or warning signals in the dark.

The overriding philosophy is- what would a reasonable person be expected to do in each case.

[Just Weird]

6 hours ago, Thian said:

If you hit another vehicle from the back you're guilty in Thailand.

Unless that vehicle that you hit is a trike, perhaps?

[Acemaker]

6 hours ago, colinneil said:

In most countries the car drivers insure would have to pay.

This is Thailand, and things do not always go the way you would expect.

Did the car driver have insurance?

Mark Haley stupidly came here without insurance, now his family want others to pay for his stupidity.

Thank you Mr. Nice, if only we were all as perfect as you !

[sambum]

7 hours ago, hagler said:

Based on very recent experience with a friend while we were riding through  Korat the hospital will be getting him stabilised and at the same time the admissions team will be determining if he has insurance and if so will be contacting the insurance company. 

 

If he doesnt have insurance they will get him stabilised and then he will be given minimal level of care to keep his vitals going. The family will be contacted ( if they cant then the embassy) and money will be sought for further treatment. No money. No more expensive treatment.

 

My friend was fully insured so the Bangkok Hospital in Korat took care of him in a world class manner.

"admissions team will be determining if he has insurance and if so will be contacting the insurance company."

 

Did you read the first line of the headline?  

 

Uninsured Brit seriously injured and stranded in hospital after motorbike accident in Hua Hin

[xen]

It is all very well to say he should have had travel insurance but for some of us, it is prohibitively expensive if there are pre-existing conditions. Have a car accident and you have been prescribed blood thinners for Arterial Fibulation for example and the insurance company will wipe their hands of you, even if you have paid for the super duper policy with a cover that promises everything including free handjobs at the hospital. Before being smug there are some of us with travel insurance that will not cover all events except maybe a bag going missing at the airport. Read your small print and inquire what you are covered for. Insurance will not help you if the company, agency or underwriters can get out of it at all possible. 

Most policies will not cover motorbikes or having had any alcohol at the time of the event plus a list of other exclusions. Laughing and feeling good are add-ons to some policies.

 

Hope this poor bugger survives with no lasting ill effects

[kannot]

6 hours ago, kannot said:

I think another  issue  is  that folks  from the West simply dont realise the sheer  stupidity of Thai drivers, their ability to  pull out  for no reason, gawk at the phone do the most unbelievable things, they maybe think that common sense  will protect them, they have to understand a large percentage of the Thai population simply have none.

Travel insurance really isnt that expensive if he was on a 2-3-4  week  holiday no excuse, long term health insurance especially with age often is ,and often unavailable at a sane price

Here's  an example of  Thai thinking, drove thru Hua  Hin today  Traffic  policeman in the road with whistle  blowing furiously outside market  Village on a zebra  crossing with a  whole army of  people  trying to cross  he was trying to get cars to stop, so I stopped, car behind screech of tyres ,  he was way to close not concentrating (normal) , Policeman points to my car and gesticulates that  I should have   looked behind as the car behind almost hit me!!!!! Yeah PLOD  but  dont for goodness  sake point out to the car behind he therefore  must have been way too  close or totally lacking in attention, and its this  kind of crap where they think its "my fault" and thats from a  "Traffic" policeman, it wasnt  like I slammed the brakes on either just pure lack of attention from moron behind just like the nurse on the motorbike who went on a  flying  trip when the drivers cars "brakes failed BS"

[kannot]

3 minutes ago, xen said:

It is all very well to say he should have had travel insurance but for some of us, it is prohibitively expensive if there are pre-existing conditions. Have a car accident and you have been prescribed blood thinners for Arterial Fibulation for example and the insurance company will wipe their hands of you, even if you have paid for the super duper policy with a cover that promises everything including free handjobs at the hospital. Before being smug there are some of us with travel insurance that will not cover all events except maybe a bag going missing at the airport. Read your small print and inquire what you are covered for. Insurance will not help you if the company, agency or underwriters can get out of it at all possible. 

Most policies will not cover motorbikes or having had any alcohol at the time of the event plus a list of other exclusions. Laughing and feeling good are add-ons to some policies.

 

Hope this poor bugger survives with no lasting ill effects

That's the luck of the draw  in life.He  sounds pretty bashed up mind

[sambum]

11 minutes ago, kannot said:

Here's  an example of  Thai thinking, drove thru Hua  Hin today  Traffic  policeman in the road with whistle  blowing furiously outside market  Village on a zebra  crossing with a  whole army of  people  trying to cross  he was trying to get cars to stop, so I stopped, car behind screech of tyres ,  he was way to close not concentrating (normal) , Policeman points to my car and gesticulates that  I should have   looked behind as the car behind almost hit me!!!!! Yeah PLOD  but  dont for goodness  sake point out to the car behind he therefore  must have been way too  close or totally lacking in attention, and its this  kind of crap where they think its "my fault" and thats from a  "Traffic" policeman, it wasnt  like I slammed the brakes on either just pure lack of attention from moron behind just like the nurse on the motorbike who went on a  flying  trip when the drivers cars "brakes failed BS"

I presume from your "moniker" that you are not Thai? Then you should know that it's ALWAYS your fault! If you hadn't been there it wouldn't have happened! 

 

Sorry -  just seen that you have more than 10,000 posts - in which case you know that already!

Edited March 19, 2018 by sambum

[Acemaker]

3 hours ago, cat handler said:

I wouldn’t give him 1 Baht, he took the risk and lost. I got my bike license in Australia so I wouldn’t be covered by insurance in Thailand, I will be hiring bigger bikes next trip and I will make sure my insurance covers bikes over 250cc. He can rot in a BKK hospital for all I care.

(He can rot in a BKK hospital for all I care.) Wow, what an Ashol,  What goes around comes around, lets hope in your case that Karma really does exist.    

[JAZZDOG]

4 hours ago, RichardColeman said:

And the problem there is, does the perp have the insurance cover in his own policy if he is drunk or even have a policy at all ? Does he have a licence ? Does he even have any money at all ? How long before he can get the money ? Will the hospital wait on a 'promise' of money ? Will the guy who hit him argue it was his fault to delay any payment. Guy in hospital needs the money now - not later. 

In cases like this, hospital care should be free, no matter if you have insurance or not (person hit). It should be the responsibility of the hospital to claim it from the person who hit him.

His "Free care" will be minimum, not top notch as if he paid. Hospitals giving free service amounts to an involuntary go-fund me in that we all pay as costs rise due to inability to collect, The moral answer would be to give care and sue for the bill later. Only other answer let him die for not being able to pay xxxx amount.

[ianf]

Not 100% relevant but I wonder if this guy was wearing a helmet?

[Acemaker]

2 hours ago, Happy enough said:

someone mentioned earlier the driver was also foreign and has dash cam evidence to prove the motorbike was at fault. i do feel sorry for the guy and his family but at his age not taking out insurance then coming to thailand which i'm sure even this fella knows has some of the worst accidents stats in the world and getting on a motorbike is basically stupid. i would be paranoid even crossing the roads here without insurance never mind getting on a bike. go fund me strikes again. be interesting to see how many times this happens here in a year. 

Hey, How about trying to have a little bit of compassion here, yes we all know he was a Fool not to take out Insurance , however the Deed has been done, his Family are desperate, a total cost of £23,000 which will rise no doubt because these people will Milk it Dry, Crowd Funding has Scammers we all know that, and to many its a scammy unsavoury way to raise Money, but in this case it could help the Family greatly, i am sure the Family would be more than willing to provide documented proof that the Money received is going towards paying his Medical Bills.

[cyril sneer]

6 hours ago, kcpattaya said:

Should have stayed in the UK and this accident would have never happened....

also would never have happened if he hadn't been born, i blame the parents

[Acemaker]

2 hours ago, bristolgeoff said:

another one for the begging bowl,please help me.maybe not his fault but once again no travel insurance.the family expect everyone else to foot the bill.go jump is my view

Blah, Blah, Blah, Jeez, how many more its his own fault Posts do we have to put up with ! are you running around your Bedroom singing at the top of your Voice ( Ive got Medical Insurance , NA NA NA NA NA )  

[Maestro]

The Brit in the OP has the misfortune of residing in a country with a compulsory health insurance system that does not cover emergency treatment outside the country's borders except, I understand, in Switzerland and, until "Brexit" is implemented, in the member countries of the European Union.

[jenny2017]

1 hour ago, Thaidream said:

In this case the car drivers insurance would pay if he was at fault. According to a prior poster the cycle driver swerved into the car driver's lane and caused the collision so the cycle driver's insurance would pay if he had insurance, for everyone.

 

Let's remember that healthcare is a human right -regardless of circumstance- everyone has a right to life.  While everyone has certain responsibilities for caring for oneself- one should not be penalized and not be provided curative healthcare.

 

The problem is that in most countries insurance exists not to assist anyone but to make a profit. The same can be said for doctors, hospitals and the pharmaceutical industry. All of them are making money off someone else's misery and to end this practice we must admit it exists.

 

Most people in every country of the World pay taxes of some sort to the central government and that government exists to serve the people not itself. All healthcare should be provided at no cost everywhere in the World for every person regardless of nationality. The UK has the NHS; Japan has universal healthcare and every industrialised country in the World has some scheme to provide care to its citizens. Every country- except America- which has the highest healthcare costs in the World (and not really the best).

 

The problem is that Thailand wants to follow the American model so doctors; hospitals and insurance companies etc can get wealthy. This should never be allowed. At least Thailand has the 30 Baht scheme which in essence provides free healthcare to those who cannot pay. 

 

In regards to foreigners- how difficult can it be to collect an extra 500 Baht -added to the airline ticket- to go into a healthcare fund to be used by foreigners needing urgent or catastrophic care.  How difficult would it be to develop reciprocal treatment agreement between the United Nations and countries in which the passport country would reimburse the country treating their citizen for costs.

 

None of the above is difficult. What is difficult is for people to stop treatingthealthcare as a privilege. It is a human right and everyone is entitled to it regardless of whether they can pay or not.

Don't you think that all adults from "more developed countries" should be able to buy an insurance coverage when holidaying in a country like Thailand? That's common sense and the internet is full of people who are in troubles after bike accidents in Thailand. Are these people blind and deaf? Please read the article about Pai in Mae Hong Son province, insanity pure. But people blame the shops and the country? 

 

   How can it be Thailand's fault when people have accidents? Collecting 500 baht to a ticket for an eventual accident sounds pretty strange to those who never travel without an insurance, myself included.But too many foreigners just rent bikes without even having a license or practice driving on one. 

 

   They won't stop treating the Brit, but the needed and usually very expensive treatments won't be done because nobody yet said that they'll cover all costs. They won't do expensive checks and surgery because nobody will pay for it.

 

Thailand doesn't seem to follow an American model, they're just fed up to sit on huge amounts of unpaid hospital bills. 

 

But a GoFundMe page was set up, why didn't they get in touch with the hospital to ensure that no matter what happens, the bill will be paid? 

 

I'm volunteering for an organization that usually helps such people, and you'd be surprised how many of them exist. The Brit has made a huge mistake and yes, he should receive all possible medical care that's available. But don't you think that his family should as well do all they can?

 

I'm in no way blaming his relatives, but there must be ways to get some money from a bank, a sold car, etc. of course only if his life and wellbeing are important to them. 

 

Thai government hospitals have to treat foreigners from all over the world, their beds are always full with an always increasing number. Many hospitals, especially in tourist areas were treating foreigners but after so many didn't pay their bills, they have changed their policy, which is quite understandable. 

 

Don't blame Thailand, blame the British embassy for not giving the guarantee that the bill will be paid, wouldn't that be one of their responsibilities? Why do we even have embassies if they don't intervene? These days you can see GFM beggars all over the web, and the ones who really need help won't get it if that continues. 

 

 

 

 

Edited March 19, 2018 by jenny2017

[stevenl]

34 minutes ago, sambum said:

"admissions team will be determining if he has insurance and if so will be contacting the insurance company."

 

Did you read the first line of the headline?  

 

Uninsured Brit seriously injured and stranded in hospital after motorbike accident in Hua Hin

Did you read the post he was answering?

[jonclark]

7 hours ago, mjnaus said:

This is stuff is rough. On the one hand, this guy a total moron for not taking out travel insurance. On the other hand, you can't help but feel bad this guy's family. I try and imagine something like this happening to one of my brothers. I'd also try and do everything in my power to get them the help they need... I'd use my own money for sure. If that's not enough? Beg for money online maybe?

And as is always the case, hiring a motorbike is often not covered by any travel insurance. 

 

There is clearly an issue here when the hiring of motorbikes is so completely unregulated and also so widespread. The tourists need to make sure that they are covered in the event of an accident, but as this is (albeit a small part) of the very lucrative tourist industry that drives Thailand's development, there needs to be some provision for medical bills incurred by tourists through local regulation and laws. . 

 

You cannot take someone's money and then wash your hands of any and all responsibility when things go wrong. Motorbike hires must come with compulsory (local) insurance for all, including medical bills. And if motorbikes are hired without insurance then the owner of the motorbike needs to be liable for any costs in the event of an accident. After all they hire the motorbikes to get profit, so they need to make sure the motorbikes are insured and protect their clients and also property. 

 

And if people complain that the cost of a daily hire goes from 200 to 400 baht a day, probably best not to hire one then!

 

 

[dunroaming]

If the motorbike was rented then it should be insured (TIT so who knows?).  It is something I always tell friends on holiday to check.  If he owns the bike then it is ludicrously cheap to insure your own bike.  I did it years ago and when I was taken out by a hit and run pick-up the insurance paid all of my hospital bills and I was treated in Lanna Hospital in CM.  An international hospital and in a private room.

 

As for travel insurance, well that's a no brainer for Thailand although many policies do have a no motorbike accidents clause in them.  Wonder why that is?