BREAKING NEWS British Embassy Bangkok to Stop Certification of Income Letters

[Thaidream]

8 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

3. The BE are worried that they would be legally liable if one of their citizens in possession of one of their letters was proved to have lied about their income.

You  got to Be  joking-  do you  seriously believe that the Thai Government is going to sue the UK Government because one of its citizens lied?   Santa Clause is coming to town!!!  (Sorry JT- actual quote is from the other poster- not you!)

Edited October 15, 2018 by Thaidream

[Jingthing]

You  got to Be  joking-  do you  seriously believe that the Thai Government is going to sue the UK Government because one of its citizens lied?   Santa Clause is coming to town!!!  (Sorry JT- actual quote is from the other poster- not you!)

Yes it is. I would have never written something like that.

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[Rally123]

2 hours ago, Kalasin Jo said:

Not everyone can just rustle up 400k or 800 k baht and just keep it in the bank seasoning.

If you're in hospital requiring open heart surgery I'm sure you'd come up with the dosh? Sell the car. Sell the house. Get yer missus to get a loan. Do whatever it takes. Stop winging.

[totally thaied up]

On 10/12/2018 at 3:12 PM, Jingthing said:

A little detour to give some perspective on the meaning of over 25,000 dollars tied up. Yesterday I read a news item saying SIXTY PERCENT of Americans (one of the world's richest nations) don't even have ONE thousand dollars liquid to deal with a minor emergency. 

Had dinner with an American friend that was a pretty major market player (he was a banker) and he told me much the same thing a few years ago. It pretty much paycheck to paycheck for a lot of these people he said. I pretty well understand via my British friends, many of them are not flush with money. If it was not for the state pension and other pensions or what so not, they would not make the money needed. 

[David Walden]

39 minutes ago, Thaidream said:

Ah yes- but the main point is that the Aussie Stat dec also includes a statement hat what is singing if false incurs a criminal or civil liability.

 

The US Affidavit includes an Oath and a statement hat oneis signing unfer penalty of perjury.

 

Very few Embassies will ever be able to  absolutely  guarantee the applicant is completely truthful- but they do state if the person lies there is an offense -criminal or civil. Thai Imm can have a person sign a similar statement and  randomly check added docs as they do in CM for some Americans.  

 

BE is simply refusing to play ball- and shutting down their system rather than working with everyone to find a solution. At least the Aussies and Americans are indicating to the Thais- if you find a lie- prosecute and notify  us and we can put you on the FBI or Australian Federal Police.

 

The BE i can do what they want but don't expect the Thais to change their system-  BE is throwing down the gauntlet saying our way  or the highway.  Can your imagine a Thai applying for a British Visa and when the BE asks for a certain document the Thai says- can't provide it- Thai government won't give it.  

An affidavit in Australia is a document which you present to a court as sworn evidence to which you are required to give or wish to give.  It is evidence usually given under order of a court and under oath if you cannot attend for what ever reason.  You may be in hospital and not able to attend It maybe different in the US?  A statutory Declaration (Stat Dec) is similar a bit less complicated it is mostly provided by an individual under oath and penalty, (you can buy a blank form at most papershops or download one) it states that you are making a declaration that the information contained there-in is true.  It can in some case also be evidence in a court case.  Often used when you are having a sickie from work but are really going to the horse races and a few drinks after and fun, as one does from time to time.  God help you if the boss sees you being poured into a taxi outside the race track drunk.   You could be arrested and spend up to 4 years in gaol.  Probably not but could be.

[David Walden]

1 hour ago, Jingthing said:

You take their explanation literally. That is cute.

Sent from my Lenovo A7020a48 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

The British Embassy would only use their diplomatic immunity under extreme cases, they could put anything in a letter for you with complete immunity.  That is the sort of thing people are asking the BE to do.  I just saw a flock of polar bears fly over.

 It's time to stop commenting on this site for me it can only be a joke from now on...thank you for reading my comments, by, by.

Edited October 15, 2018 by David Walden

[OJAS]

2 hours ago, David Walden said:

It's a very good alternative.

Especially for fraudsters who stick their middle finger up at the risk of being banged up for 4 years of course!

[OJAS]

10 hours ago, theoldgit said:

This is a lift from the Immigration Div 1 FAQ's page, not what I wanted to read but they seem to make it clear that an Embassy letter is a requirement, this is the link to the whole of the FAQ's, question 22 being the approriate one.
http://bangkok.immigration.go.th/en/base.php?page=faq

Also relevant is question 16 covering marriage. In the light of the Embassy's explicit assurance given in the Fabulous 103FM interview that they had agreed monthly bank statements in lieu of Embassy letters with Bangkok Immigration, one might reasonably expect the specific refs in Q16/5.2 and Q22/2.2 to be amended accordingly. That said if they are still unchanged in, say, 6 months time it would not, of course, necessarily mean that the letter requirement was still in force, but that Immigration Division 1 don't update their website all that often! 

Edited October 15, 2018 by OJAS

[Spidey]

40 minutes ago, totally thaied up said:

Had dinner with an American friend that was a pretty major market player (he was a banker)

As in "merchant banker"?

[OJAS]

22 hours ago, Jingthing said:

No, not dead, but dead-ish. 

Yep, I suppose that the interest payments you would get on it with a savings deposit account would just about keep it on life support!????

[totally thaied up]

40 minutes ago, Spidey said:

As in "merchant banker"?

Lord, that was years ago and in truth, I cannot remember. I just can remember at the time, he was working for a Major Stock Brokerage Company and had a pretty big history in that sector. I never really asked. When Jingthing bought up that comment, I can remember my friend talking something along these lines over dinner. In fact, I will go and do a bit of Googling now as it has perked my interests in seeing how true this is. 

[Spidey]

Just now, totally thaied up said:

Lord, that was years ago and in truth, I cannot remember. I just can remember at the time, he was working for a Major Stock Brokerage Company and had a pretty big history in that sector. I never really asked. When Jingthing bought up that comment, I can remember my friend talking something along these lines over dinner. In fact, I will go and do a bit of Googling now as it has perked my interests in seeing how true this is. 

For goodness sakes! Check merchant banker out in the urban dictionary.

[totally thaied up]

12 minutes ago, Spidey said:

For goodness sakes! Check merchant banker out in the urban dictionary.

I know what a Merchant Banker is. I cannot tell you if he was or wasn't but he told me he has been in the 'banking' industry at one point. I can only point to what Jingthing said and it was an interesting point. For some people, having 800K rotting away in a bank doing nothing is not a good idea if you do not have that much cash to start with. 

[vogie]

4 hours ago, totally thaied up said:

I know what a Merchant Banker is. I cannot tell you if he was or wasn't but he told me he has been in the 'banking' industry at one point. I can only point to what Jingthing said and it was an interesting point. For some people, having 800K rotting away in a bank doing nothing is not a good idea if you do not have that much cash to start with. 

I have an idea that it is cockney rhyming slang. Hope that helps.

[soalbundy]

12 hours ago, Rally123 said:

If you're in hospital requiring open heart surgery I'm sure you'd come up with the dosh? Sell the car. Sell the house. Get yer missus to get a loan. Do whatever it takes. Stop winging.

give a hospital some security and you can pay them on a monthly basis

[Rally123]

3 minutes ago, soalbundy said:

give a hospital some security and you can pay them on a monthly basis

Such as? May be a 'certificate of income' from the BE?  ????

[NanLaew]

12 hours ago, Thaidream said:

Can your imagine a Thai applying for a British Visa and when the BE asks for a certain document the Thai says- can't provide it- Thai government won't give it.  

The impasse where a foreign bureaucracy insists on documentation that doesn't exist is already a feature in the EU where for immigration purposes, the Spanish (for one) insist on proof that a marriage in Thailand between a UK/EU citizen and a Thai national is registered in the UK. The UK does not mandate that any overseas marriage requires to be separately registered in the UK ergo such documentary proof doesn't exist, never has and never will either.

 

So why the perpetual BE bash?

[soalbundy]

9 minutes ago, Rally123 said:

Such as? May be a 'certificate of income' from the BE?  ????

55555555 good one, no, a chanote. I had an OP about 5 years ago, wasn't a big deal really 40,000 Baht but I was putting my step daughter through university at the time and had a few other big bills coming up (building a wall around the house). I have a Thai medical insurance but you have to pay up front and wait 4 months to be reimbursed, my ti rak has 220 rai of rice paddy so she gave them a chanote for 100 rai, they stamped my bill as paid. After 4 months the insurance paid up and I was able to get the chanote back. They told me that I had the option of paying monthly and that many Thais opt for that, private, not a government hospital.

[NanLaew]

12 hours ago, Rally123 said:

If you're in hospital requiring open heart surgery I'm sure you'd come up with the dosh? Sell the car. Sell the house. Get yer missus to get a loan. Do whatever it takes. Stop winging.

And if you are single, old and seriously ill without any income or insurance, then maybe it is time to face up to the reality of your self-made predicament.

 

...and stop 'winging' as well.

[soalbundy]

4 minutes ago, NanLaew said:

And if you are single, old and seriously ill without any income or insurance, then maybe it is time to face up to the reality of your self-made predicament.

 

...and stop 'winging' as well.

Yes the manifestations that we are are only temporary. Imagine at the pearly gates, entrance notice, 'enter only if you have an embassy letter stating income'

[soalbundy]

Any reaction from the ambassador yet?

[jayboy]

Any reaction from the ambassador yet?

A very long serving and distinguished expatriate- the late Dacre Raikes - once told
me that if one raised with an Ambasador any immigration matter, His Excellency suddenly found an urgent reason to speak to somebody on the other side of the room.


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[Rally123]

1 hour ago, NanLaew said:

 

 

...and stop 'winging' as well.

All farang whinge, it's in our nature. But in this case nothing is gonna be done. Just move on to plan B. There doesn't seem to be the same disgust regarding the BE stance on other forums. May be TV members get their knickers in a twist easily?

Edited October 16, 2018 by Rally123

[Tanoshi]

1 hour ago, soalbundy said:

Yes the manifestations that we are are only temporary. Imagine at the pearly gates, entrance notice, 'enter only if you have an embassy letter stating income'

Please keep up to date with the News.

The gypsies had the gates away years ago  ????

[Spidey]

24 minutes ago, Rally123 said:

All farang whinge, it's in our nature. But in this case nothing is gonna be done. Just move on to plan B. There doesn't seem to be the same disgust regarding the BE stance on other forums. May be TV members get their knickers in a twist easily?

"Other forums" don't have anywhere near as many members living here as expats.

 

It's an issue that many members have serious concerns about, certainly the biggest problem that has faced me in my time in Thailand. Also an issue ideally suited to discussion on Thai Visa. This is the forum where people, who normally inhabit other forums, come to when they have visa issues.

 

Not whingeing, discussing genuine concerns.

[Thaidream]

2 hours ago, NanLaew said:

o why the perpetual BE bash?

If you are an Embassy- from any country- one of your mandates is to assist your citizens who reside in a country other than your own-  Since there apparently is some lack of communication between the BE and Thai- the BE has decided to end a needed service.  Thai Imm wants the Letter- BE won't give. Normally- when a situation like this that affects a significant amount of people- a compromise can be made. In addition- there is normally a study group that is formed that takes input from concerned citizens PRIOR to making a final decision.

 

There has been alot of constructive criticism provided and some direct complaining of how this whole incident has been handled by the BE.  This is not bashing- it's seeking an outcome that benefits all.

[soalbundy]

45 minutes ago, Spidey said:

"Other forums" don't have anywhere near as many members living here as expats.

 

It's an issue that many members have serious concerns about, certainly the biggest problem that has faced me in my time in Thailand. Also an issue ideally suited to discussion on Thai Visa. This is the forum where people, who normally inhabit other forums, come to when they have visa issues.

 

Not whingeing, discussing genuine concerns.

well it seems the agent 'fast retirement visa' no funds needed, no visa no fee is still up and running as a last resort.

[Spidey]

Just now, Thaidream said:

Normally- when a situation like this that affects a significant amount of people- a compromise can be made. In addition- there is normally a study group that is formed that takes input from concerned citizens PRIOR to making a final decision.

We're talking about the British Embassy and Thai Immigration here. Dream on.

[Spidey]

Just now, soalbundy said:

well it seems the agent 'fast retirement visa' no funds needed, no visa no fee is still up and running as a last resort.

Last resort for many. 20k and rising isn't cheap though.

 

Also Big Joke is in charge now and I'm wondering how long this loophole will be allowed to continue.

[Thaidream]

2 hours ago, NanLaew said:

he impasse where a foreign bureaucracy insists on documentation that doesn't exist is already a feature in the EU where for immigration purposes, the Spanish (for one) insist on proof that a marriage in Thailand between a UK/EU citizen and a Thai national is registered in the UK. The UK does not mandate that any overseas marriage requires to be separately registered in the UK ergo such documentary proof doesn't exist, never has and never will eith

And  to settle such an impasse- a statement from the UK Embassy indicating it is impossible to provide as it does not exist should end that impasse.

 

If the BE insists it cannot provide a letter to Thai Imm- will they provide a letter in Thai/English indicating that according to policy they cannot provide such a letter but indicate that other documentation proving income can be provided by the applicant direct to the Thai imm.??  If I was British- I would be asking for such a letter.