Where have all the Chinese gone? Thai media say TAT in denial about tourism numbers in Pattaya

[webfact]

Where have all the Chinese gone? Thai media say TAT in denial about tourism numbers in Pattaya

 

Pictures: Sophon Cable

 

Thai media Sophon Cable TV has suggested that tourism officials in Chonburi are in denial about a crisis facing Pattaya.

 

They said that operators were reporting that Chinese visitors to Pattaya were down 60%.

 

But the Chonburi and Pattaya tourism reps were countering that this was not the case. 

 

They were putting a rosy spin on the reality.

 

While accepting that third quarter arrivals of Chinese in Pattaya this year were down on 2017 the situation could be explained in part due to less Chinese visitors coming on group tours, it was claimed. 

 

They said that increasing numbers of Chinese were now known as "FIT" travelers - that is to say they are organizing their own trips and are thus difficult to quantify. 

 

Sophon was reporting after a meeting at Garden Seaview Resort crunched the numbers and heard opinions. Present were TAT officials and local businessmen and operators. 

 

Some claimed Chinese visitors were down 60%.

 

 

Mrs Amphai Sakdanukoonjit from Chonburi Tourism and Sports said that last year 17 million tourists visited Chonburi and 14.6 million came to Pattaya.

 

Figures up to August this year show that there really isn't all that much difference in last year and this when it comes to tourist numbers and tourist spending. 

 

Though she conceded that safety - especially water safety - was of concern to the Chinese.

 

The meeting heard that 40% of all tourist deaths in Thailand were Chinese tourists.

 

Other measures like easier visa on arrival would help the situation, said Amphai. 

 

Others told the meeting that figures for tourism were up in the earlier part of 2018. But since then the drop off in Chinese tourism has meant a third quarter fall of at least 10-12%. 

 

The message was that while the overall 2018 figures don't look too bad something needs to be done to avert a crisis as the underlying trend now is definitely down. 

 

Source: Sophon Cable

 

-- © Copyright Thai Visa News 2018-11-16

[Briggsy]

Why is everyone in Thailand so intently focused on the cost of the visa as the deciding factor for tourists whether they come or not? It is so odd. It is so wide of the mark. Like a mantra repeated without thought.

[sammieuk1]

Drowning them by the boatload could literally affect numbers????

[sanemax]

7 minutes ago, Briggsy said:

Why is everyone in Thailand so intently focused on the cost of the visa as the deciding factor for tourists whether they come or not? It is so odd. It is so wide of the mark. Like a mantra repeated without thought.

Yes, I'm sure that not many people will decide to go to Thailand , just because visas are free

[PREM-R]

11 minutes ago, Briggsy said:

Why is everyone in Thailand so intently focused on the cost of the visa as the deciding factor for tourists whether they come or not? It is so odd. It is so wide of the mark. Like a mantra repeated without thought.

"Like a mantra repeated without thought."

Confucius he say "Thai person who repeats mantra, does so without thought"

Edited November 16, 2018 by PREM-R

[SkyNets]

That's what happens when you take money but do not put any of it back into the system for clean beaches, safety and so on. The no smoking beach idea was clever too, think alot of the Chinese still smoke.

[balo]

Chinese numbers are down ? Not my impression here in the Naklua area, 100's of buses passing every day full of them .  The fruit vendors are busy , the Chinese restaurants are busy .

But please do not send us more of them. 

 

 

[Just1Voice]

TAT will "spin" it any and every way they can to paint a rosy picture, even when the reality of things are slapping them in the face.  Businesses and hotels depending on the Chinese are shutting down daily.  I've read that some hotels are experiencing a 60% drop off rate from last year, and that many small businesses who depend on the Chinese trade have had to shut down due to lack of business.

You can't believe a word of the TAT b.s., as they are always going to make it sound all rosy and well, even when they know it's not. 

[seahorse]

21 minutes ago, Briggsy said:

Why is everyone in Thailand so intently focused on the cost of the visa as the deciding factor for tourists whether they come or not? It is so odd. It is so wide of the mark. Like a mantra repeated without thought.

Projection. They are so obsessed with money that they think everyone else is too. 

[smedly]

Many factors and one of the primary ones is the Strength of the Thai BAHT - big money in Thailand wants a strong BAHT simply because they want to invest overseas both in business and property

 

As for Chinese - I predicted on here a couple of years ago that Chinese tourists will drop for a couple of reasons, been there done that and told friends and family don't bother, very unlikely (unlike western tourists) to be repeat visitors. Safety

[marko kok prong]

Denial is Tat's default position.

[sfokevin]

1 hour ago, sammieuk1 said:

Drowning them by the boatload could literally affect numbers????

When they wash ashore TAT gets to count them as a return visit... 

[Cake Monster]

2 hours ago, Briggsy said:

Why is everyone in Thailand so intently focused on the cost of the visa as the deciding factor for tourists whether they come or not? It is so odd. It is so wide of the mark. Like a mantra repeated without thought.

They would be better employed focusing on Tourist safety me thinks

Better and improved safety standards across the whole Tourist Sector might, - just might bring back some Tourists.

[Kaoboi Bebobp]

Kim J above is on the right path. The Chinese are not blind to the garbage in the streets, the dirty beaches, lack of road safety, the feeling they're being stripped of cash by every provider, the hassles against their Chinese-speaking tour guides, high costs of cigarettes and hard liquor, and repeated news reports of Chinese fatalities in tour bus and ferry boat crashes. And I wonder what they're saying as they watch local police parade around like peacocks. 

[Hayduke]

 

In some ways tourism is like prostitution.

 

The tourist (aka customer) pays to use the country (aka prostitute) for a specified period of time, and then goes away. But the Chinese tourist comes to Thailand, uses the country for his amusement…and then becomes infatuated. He starts coming back to see her and pay her every night.

 

She now has a steady customer. It’s safe, predictable and much easier than having to work someone new every day. There’s a reliable cash flow and business is booming. She can ignore other potential customers because her steady will give her money indefinitely. There’s no need to save money, or invest money, or use the money to create a more sustainable business. Life is good.

 

Then the customer stops coming every day. Maybe he’s busy, maybe he’s bored, or maybe he’s just beginning to feel uncomfortable. She doesn’t understand why and she doesn’t want to admit that her customer has moved on. She makes excuses and keeps watching the door...trying to convince herself that the steady customer will return.

 

But maybe no more happy ending...

 

 

 

Edited November 16, 2018 by Hayduke

[BigBadGeordie]

1 hour ago, Kim J said:

Endless prostitution.

Filthy sea and beaches.

Litter strewn streets.

Constant harassment.

Permanent traffic jams.

Having to walk on roads due to lack of pavements or pavements blocked with vehicles, retailers etc etc.

Nowhere to safely cross busy roads.

It is rife with crime.

It is rife with antisocial behaviour.

It is rife with corruption and dishonesty.

Constant harassment from police if you drive.

Rose tinted glasses.

 

Yeah OK, but it must have some bad points as well.

[simoh1490]

3 hours ago, smedly said:

Many factors and one of the primary ones is the Strength of the Thai BAHT - big money in Thailand wants a strong BAHT simply because they want to invest overseas both in business and property

 

As for Chinese - I predicted on here a couple of years ago that Chinese tourists will drop for a couple of reasons, been there done that and told friends and family don't bother, very unlikely (unlike western tourists) to be repeat visitors. Safety

The issue is more the weakness of the Chinese Yaun than it is the strength of THB.

[BigBadGeordie]

Kim J.

Agreed.

[fruitman]

1 hour ago, Kim J said:

"Where have all the Chinese gone"?

 

Well I would say they have gone just the same way as every group of "quality tourists" that come to Pattaya. Once the reality of the place dawns and word gets around they will simply go anywhere else but here.

My other half was asking me similar questions a few years ago when the Russian families all but disappeared for a time. I simply put one question to her and she has never asked again, that question being: Would you like it and what would we do if we were on holiday here in the middle of Pattaya with our daughter?

Ultimately there is little here to interest or accommodate normal families, take away the bars etc, and what would there be to interest anyone? Here is a brief list of what Pattaya does have.

Endless prostitution.

Filthy sea and beaches.

Litter strewn streets.

Constant harassment.

Permanent traffic jams.

Having to walk on roads due to lack of pavements or pavements blocked with vehicles, retailers etc etc.

Nowhere to safely cross busy roads.

It is rife with crime.

It is rife with antisocial behaviour.

It is rife with corruption and dishonesty.

Constant harassment from police if you drive.

They now want to charge first world prices for third world quality and service.

You can go to nong nooch with her, bring swimgear and wait for a cold day. You can also sleep there in a small bungalow but 1 day is enough.

 

Myself i only like the foreign food in pattaya....

[pattayadgw]

I'll tell you where many of the Chinese have gone... BALI!!  Bali hasn't jumped on the zero dollars tour groups and the place is flooded with Chinese... that's one place they've headed to that I know of for sure.  

 

Difficult to quantify?? haaa?? Whether a Chinese or anyone else is in a group or an individual traveller... 1 person through immigration is one person... 1 = 1.  Group of 100 people = 100 people through immigration. 

 

"While accepting that third quarter arrivals of Chinese in Pattaya this year were down on 2017 the situation could be explained in part due to less Chinese visitors coming on group tours, it was claimed." 

 

"They said that increasing numbers of Chinese were now known as "FIT" travellers - that is to say they are organizing their own trips and are thus difficult to quantify." 

[simoh1490]

1 hour ago, Kim J said:

"Where have all the Chinese gone"?

 

Well I would say they have gone just the same way as every group of "quality tourists" that come to Pattaya. Once the reality of the place dawns and word gets around they will simply go anywhere else but here.

My other half was asking me similar questions a few years ago when the Russian families all but disappeared for a time. I simply put one question to her and she has never asked again, that question being: Would you like it and what would we do if we were on holiday here in the middle of Pattaya with our daughter?

Ultimately there is little here to interest or accommodate normal families, take away the bars etc, and what would there be to interest anyone? Here is a brief list of what Pattaya does have.

Endless prostitution.

Filthy sea and beaches.

Litter strewn streets.

Constant harassment.

Permanent traffic jams.

Having to walk on roads due to lack of pavements or pavements blocked with vehicles, retailers etc etc.

Nowhere to safely cross busy roads.

It is rife with crime.

It is rife with antisocial behaviour.

It is rife with corruption and dishonesty.

Constant harassment from police if you drive.

They now want to charge first world prices for third world quality and service.

So many issues here...

 

Have you ever been to Asia before, Thailand is not that much different from other Asian countries?

 

Have you ever been to Thailand, Pattaya is a tourist destination with a reputation that is slowly changing, did you expect something different, if so, you didn't do your homework.

 

Have you ever been to China, Pattaya is a step up when compared to many places in China!

 

"Rife with crime, corruption and antisocial behaviour"...are you sure you went to Pattaya and not to Bridlington or Blackpool and became confused!

 

The rest of your post is nothing more than a rant about all the negatives in Thailand hence no responses necessary because everyone sees it for what it is.

 

Edited November 16, 2018 by simoh1490

[StayinThailand2much]

5 hours ago, webfact said:

Where have all the Chinese gone? Thai media say TAT in denial about tourism numbers in Pattaya

TAT in denial?? That would be a first! ????

[StayinThailand2much]

1 hour ago, pattayadgw said:

"They said that increasing numbers of Chinese were now known as "FIT" travellers - that is to say they are organizing their own trips and are thus difficult to quantify." 

Next, TAT and other government agencies will claim, is, that they have moved on to other places, e.g. Chiang Mai, or Chaiyaphum, and that they are now 'hard to track', being "FIT" travellers... ????

[overherebc]

3 hours ago, marko kok prong said:

Denial is Tat's default position.

I thought Denial was in Egypt.

[Chelseafan]

Why is it so difficult to quantify how many tourists arrive from each country ?

Arn't passports scanned on arrival through immigration ?

[janclaes47]

4 minutes ago, overherebc said:

I thought Denial was in Egypt.

You got it all wrong

 

[janclaes47]

1 hour ago, pattayadgw said:

"They said that increasing numbers of Chinese were now known as "FIT" travellers - that is to say they are organizing their own trips and are thus difficult to quantify." 

 

They mean the Chinese have become stealth tourists?

[simoh1490]

15 minutes ago, Kim J said:

Yes thanks I have spent considerable amounts of time in Asia, starting around 30 years ago with extensive spells working in predominantly Jakarta and Manila. I first came to Thailand over 20 years ago and have virtually lived here for the last 12 of them so I am fully aware of what is what.

To a point I agree with what you are saying and agree that many of the points I raised do also apply to other places in Asia, however the places I mention above and China as you say do not promote themselves as a family tourist destinations, as Pattaya has been doing for a number of years now, even laying claim to being South East Asia's premier family destination. Given this thread is all about the currently reducing numbers of Chinese tourists, the points I have made are perfectly valid and reasons why Pattaya is anything but a suitable tourist destination for these Chinese families. going by what you have written, I would say you are the one that has little experience of Asia, have you ever been to neighbouring Malaysia, Singapore or Indonesia and visited any of their tourist resorts? If you had you may have appreciated my point here, because there are indeed many places around Asia that have much to offer family tourists, but I am afraid Pattaya is not one of them. The numbers of Chinese tourists in these places are all booming, when here they are fading away. Ask yourself why? Chinese do not come here for the bars and nightlife, what else is there for them?

I see in your final sentence you say "no responses necessary because everyone sees it for what it is" Maybe sticking to that sentiment would have been the best way forward. Yes I can completely see pattaya exactly for what it is, a single man's paradise, but it has never been and never will be a suitable destination for families.

6

Yes, I have lived and worked in SE Asia and The Far East since 1990 and have lived in Thailand permanently since 2004.

 

If your problem is that Pattaya has been described as a family destination, I suggest that, despite living here for 12 years, you are not, "fully aware of what is what"! Pattaya and/or Thailand is not anything like Malaysia for obvious reasons, neither is it a Singapore, for obvious reasons and neither is it an Indonesia, for obvious reasons....to be honest, your comparisons make it sound as though you've only ever been in Asia once and even then only ever for a two week holiday at best, I mean, if you've been here for 12 years and you know that other places in Asia are truly family destinations, why did you even go to Pattaya in the first place! 

 

As for Chinese tourists and their habits: you are correct that the Chinese do not come to Thailand for the bars, instead they come for organised tours, shopping and restaurants, they are perfectly happy with those things and the historically favourable Yuan/THB exchange rate (now much worsened) made it all worthwhile since Thailand is cheap by comparison to China.

 

Finally about Pattaya being a single mans paradise: get over it, Pattaya is not a shade of its former self, it's almost one large Baptist church by comparison to what it was ten or fifteen years ago, today it's no worse that Gaylang in Singapore, Bintan, Wan Chai or any of the other similar places in neighbouring countries.

[balo]

Kim can rant away how bad everything is all he wants, but Pattaya is changing, the new malls arriving, family tourists from India, China and Russia arrive in numbers.  They are the new type of tourists who can afford to travel maybe for the first time outside their own country.

 

Maybe not a paradise, but for them its a nice vacation away from polluted cities like Mumbai, Beijing , Moscow etc. 

 

The sexpats are a minority compared to them. Who will win in the end ? I think both types of tourists will survive. 

 

Edited November 16, 2018 by balo

[worgeordie]

Not only Pattaya, they are becoming rarer in Chiang Mai too,

this is what happens when you don't look after "The Golden Goose",

just take its eggs and don't look after it properly, it's going to get sick,

T.A.T will always deny it,but that's what is happening.

regards worgeordie