BREAKING NEWS Foreigners now need to keep 800k in Thai bank for three months AFTER retirement extension is granted

[elviajero]

35 minutes ago, Toosetinmyways said:

There is one thing that all these topics and posts have confirmed to immigration is that a lot of retirees here dont even have a pot to piss in. 

Or don't have enough income/cash in the bank to be 'retired'. 

 

I don't see how these changes should cause a problem for a legitimate retiree.

[elviajero]

1 hour ago, OneeyedJohn said:

I mentioned elsewhere that reporting a day or two late raised some eyebrows with a mumbled warning not to be late again.

In other words it was frowned upon to be late, despite what the regulations say.

Maybe their computer system is so fcked up, it gets angry with someone reporting a day late.

The requirement to report your address, by law, does not start until day 91. A report is not considered late until after day 96.

[Khaeng Mak]

5 minutes ago, elviajero said:

Or don't have enough income/cash in the bank to be 'retired'. 

 

I don't see how these changes should cause a problem for a legitimate retiree.

Really?

 

If you check one of my other topics you will see that Sheryl is caught by exactly the same problem as me in the face of these new changes.

 

So both Sheryl and I are not legitimate?

 

Please explain.

 

 

[Pattaya46]

delete.

[elliss]

18 hours ago, stud858 said:

Has anybody spoken much to the young falang man employed by jomtien immigration. He was in the photocopy office. I'm guessing he would be a wealth of information. I talked to him for a bit and recommend him for help on finding out about extensions, agents, requirements etc. I was really surprised to see them employ someone so young. He speaks 4 languages. I guess that helped him hit the jackpot.. 

 

 

  

             Work  permit ?,  i doubt  it. 555

[jimn]

4 hours ago, Andrew Dwyer said:

Yup, it works out expensive but is a good option to steer clear of the new rules.

 

Visa -£125

Police clearance -£45

Medical - (can be in Thailand ) £8

Docs notified - around £5 per doc.

 

Flights, if not already going to visit.

Hotel, if not staying local.

Transport, if necessary ( in my case , coach was cheapest from North )

 

I visit every 6 months or so, so worth considering in my case .

Andrew I am thinking of changing to an OA visa next year as I spend 4 or so months in the UK. I am curious you stated that the medical could be done in Thailand. As far as I was aware it had to be done in the country of application?

As an aside the Thai consulate in the UK are changing to online applications on April 1st ( not a joke) with documents being submitted electronically. Its not clear if postal applications will be accepted. Also the visa fee is going up to £150 along with all the other visas.

[stud858]

7 minutes ago, elliss said:

  

             Work  permit ?,  i doubt  it. 555

That's one thing I asked about.

He said. Very quick, they were to give him a work permit. I didn't ask to see it ????

[Tanoshi]

3 hours ago, Sheryl said:

Does anyone clearly understand how the combo method now works?

 

The way it is worded it seems like incoming transfers + funds on deposit must equal 800K AND that there must be a balance of 800K for 2 months prior and 3 months after the date etc etc which makes it no different than the 800K method. This makes no sense.

My 2 cents and interpretation.

Same conditions as (4), means a combination of funds in the bank and income must total 800K for 2 months prior to the date of application and for 3 months after.

You can then withdraw on the funds, but must leave 400K in the bank as per same conditions as (4).

That would mean the minimum fund requirement for a combo would always have to be maintained at 400K.

The income level would be circa 40K per month throughout the year transferred into a Thai bank in order to total the 800K for the year.

 

However if you have to maintain 800K for 2 months prior to and for 3 months after the extension as it seems to suggest, that would be ridiculous. If your one of the nationals who still obtains an Embassy letter just how would that work if they had to maintain an account of 800K for 5 months, then can only draw down on 400K. It defeats the object.

 

 

[jacko45k]

5 hours ago, David Walden said:

Just look at the Royal Thai Embassy web site in your country under RETIREMENT VISA.

Nope. hasn't got one. Closest is a Non Imm -O whose purpose includes retirement with a state pension.

[elviajero]

19 minutes ago, Khaeng Mak said:

Really?

 

If you check one of my other topics you will see that Sheryl is caught by exactly the same problem as me in the face of these new changes.

 

So both Sheryl and I are not legitimate?

 

Please explain.

By "legitimate" I mean someone with an income to support themselves in retirement, or someone with access to a lot more than 800K to 'retire' on.

 

You cannot 'retire' to Thailand with only 800K to your name. Currently whatever you spend of the 800K during the year needs to be topped up after 9 months, and you can't spend any of the 800K for 3 months. So a 'retiree' already needs more available cash or an income to live on during the 3 months.

 

The changes just mean that retirees will have to have more than 800K for 5 months instead of 3 and if they spend more than 400K during the year top up from their other cash/income earlier.

[Tanoshi]

1 hour ago, Toosetinmyways said:

There is one thing that all these topics and posts have confirmed to immigration is that a lot of retirees here dont even have a pot to piss in. 

They do, but now the cracks and holes are starting to appearing, so their getting wet feet.

[Tanoshi]

6 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

Nope. hasn't got one. Closest is a Non Imm -O whose purpose includes retirement with a state pension.

One or two Thai Embassy/Consulates websites do refer to the O-A as a retirement Visa. Australia is one, whereas most refer to it correctly as the long stay Visa. Pound to a penny Dave Walden is an Australian?

 

[jimn]

9 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

One or two Thai Embassy/Consulates websites do refer to the O-A as a retirement Visa. Australia is one, whereas most refer to it correctly as the long stay Visa. Pound to a penny Dave Walden is an Australian?

 

Yes of course he is. He bangs on and on about getting a Retirement visa in Australia all the time. I remember him having a lengthy disagreement with Ubonjoe on the subject last year lol

[Andrew Dwyer]

Andrew I am thinking of changing to an OA visa next year as I spend 4 or so months in the UK. I am curious you stated that the medical could be done in Thailand. As far as I was aware it had to be done in the country of application?
As an aside the Thai consulate in the UK are changing to online applications on April 1st ( not a joke) with documents being submitted electronically. Its not clear if postal applications will be accepted. Also the visa fee is going up to £150 along with all the other visas.

Jim, I got my OA in Oct 2016 , I was already living in Thailand so printed out the medical form ( which is in Thai and English ) and decided to get a medical done here as it was so cheap ( 360 baht ). I was also unsure if it needed to be from the Uk so got a letter from my gp as well.

As it turns out my gp’s letter was rejected and I used the Thai medical certificate.

It was an inspired move and saved me a lot of trouble. !!


I did read about the Thai Embassy going to online applications, but haven’t read up on it much as I haven’t decided whether to go that route or not.

[Canuck50]

6 hours ago, David Walden said:

It seems to me that you would be a very good candidate to apply for you to apply for an O-A   M Retirement visa at the Thai Embassy in your home country.  I've put lots of posts about this on ThaiVisa in the past, many do get their retirement visa in their home country.  It's all on the Thai Embassy web site.  Probably the same cost in Canada as in Australia.  Aus $275 +police and medical reports and a bit of paperwork.  It's good for 2 years.  The 1st year only is multi-entry.  You can make as many entries in the first year free come and go often as you like, no limit.  If you depart Thailand and return a day before the visa expires (12 months) you can then stay for another 364 days. If you depart during the extension period and want to come back you have to start the process all over again. 

   You do have to have equal to Bt800,000 in a bank a/c in your home country or as I do use a statement from my retirement fund's surrender value of more than = to Bt800,000.  I do not have now nor have I ever had a Bank a/c in Thailand in 7 years and I have an O-A   M retirement visa issued in Australia.  This method has been available for years.  I use my ING BANK free of fee's Debit card to get money.  I cannot find a simpler, cheaper or easier way to transfer money Aus to Thailand.  I have an ANZ Bank and a Citibank debit card as a backup, both do charge more than ING BANK.  ING BANK is cheaper and the exchange rate is excellent.  Just go to any ATM in the world and the download money it is free of all charges.

     I agree that the perhaps 1% interest you may receive if you do put money in a Thai bank a/c is very poor.  My across the board modest bank managed blue-chip investment retirement fund increases by about 10% each year.  Usually 6/7% dividends and 3/4 % capital gains ( not so good in the last few months? but coming back).  This fairly safe investment is available to anyone in most countries.  Just about set and forget.  40% Aus blue chips shares (ASX200) 20% international blur chip share and a variety of other investments that the bank fund tell me they are good.  Some in the ANZ Bank and some in the Reserve Bank Of Australia (where they print the Aus money).  If the Aus Reserve Bank goes broke so would the rest of the world (you can't insure against that).  My fund often goes up or down a bit in sympathy with the local and international share markets or if Mr Trump sneezes.

    The about to be released Royal Commission Report into the financial industry is showing that all banks, pension funds and Insurance companies in Australia have been telling fibs or should lies upon lies for years.  Will be available to the public tomorrow Monday 4th Feb 2019.  Sparks will fly.

     It seems to me that there is really only a small noisy minority kicking up a fuss and making a never-ending lot of useless posts on the internet and making problems for the 90% of applicants that are doing things the right way as Thailand insists it is done, yes, their way if you want to get a retirement visa in Thailand read the instruction!!!.  All you have to do to qualify is have Bt800,000 either in a bank a/c in Thailand or equal to the same amount in a bank a/c in your home country and a bit of paperwork.  The 10% who have not got the required money are just "rocking the boat".  Still good to go if you can beg steal or borrow the funds (it not gunna change) bit similar in Thailand with the girls  "no money no honey".  I don't think the Thai government is remotely concerned if the 10% with little or no money just leave, yes go to To Cambodia, Vietnam or the Philippines.  You'll be back soon with the dough soon?.

   To get a retirement visa in Australia $2,00,000 is a good starting point.

Thanks for the advice...I will consider that although I am so discouraged with ongoing changes and attitudes here, seemingly designed to force people out, that if I do come back next year I will likely only stay for a few weeks, if at all. Their loss as they are driving out good people who spend substantial money here to other countries who apprciate it more!

[elviajero]

4 hours ago, Sheryl said:

Does anyone clearly understand how the combo method now works?

 

The way it is worded it seems like incoming transfers + funds on deposit must equal 800K AND that there must be a balance of 800K for 2 months prior and 3 months after the date etc etc which makes it no different than the 800K method. This makes no sense.

 

I suspect what they meant is that you must show monthly transfers and then, if these were less than 65K, the difference between the monthly transfers  * 12 and 800K must be in the bank 2 months before and 3 months after and no more than half spent etc....but this is not clealry stated and I am willing to bet most IOs will not understand, or even if they do will ntoi be willing to risk applying that understanding since it is nto clearly spelt out.

 

????

I doubt it! I will hopefully get some clarification next week.

 

My interpretation is that the combo method needs a minimum for 400K in the bank 2 months before the application and at least 400K thereafter; because you must maintain at least 400K to comply with the withdrawal conditions under the cash only option (4).

[elviajero]

35 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

My 2 cents and interpretation.

Same conditions as (4), means a combination of funds in the bank and income must total 800K for 2 months prior to the date of application and for 3 months after.

You can then withdraw on the funds, but must leave 400K in the bank as per same conditions as (4).

That would mean the minimum fund requirement for a combo would always have to be maintained at 400K.

The income level would be circa 40K per month throughout the year transferred into a Thai bank in order to total the 800K for the year.

 

However if you have to maintain 800K for 2 months prior to and for 3 months after the extension as it seems to suggest, that would be ridiculous. If your one of the nationals who still obtains an Embassy letter just how would that work if they had to maintain an account of 800K for 5 months, then can only draw down on 400K. It defeats the object.

I don't think that's what it suggests. It clearly says a combo totalling 800K.

 

The only conditions that must be the same as (4) are cash in the bank for 2 months before and 3 months after, and a minimum balance of 400K must be maintained if any cash is withdrawn. The last condition suggests - what we both understand - that 400K is the minimum allowed to be used for the combo method.

 

If the 400K minimum is correct it rather defeats the purpose of the combo method, which was to allow people with a small shortfall in income to cover it with cash in the bank.

[notamember]

22 minutes ago, elviajero said:

 

  18 hours ago, elviajero said:

It was reported last year that the British government issued YS with a 10 year visitor visa!

 

A copy of the bank book and letter are required on all files unless waived by a senior officer.

 

Maybe you could ask your ‘freind’ to show you a completed file. Inside you will see a submission form that’s completed by the IO and signed off by the offices senior officer.

 

The form lists everything required to allow the IO/office to issue an extension. If the file were ever audited, and a copy of the bank book was missing and a wavier wasn’t on file, the IO/Supervisor would have a problem.

 

As long as copies are on file the IO has covered their back. If seasoning — or any other requirement — has been waived the file would have to include a request from the supervisor that has been signed off by a senior officer.

A legitimate agent is helping the client put together the documents required to submit to immigration. There is nothing illegal or corrupt about that.

I agree, but if the ‘’legitimate agent’’ you refer to takes it without the applicant, it is illegal

As I said there is no market for this service, the American chef with blog on here, could not find one in Bangkok and had to do what the agent said he should do and did it himself!

 

It was reported last year that the British government issued YS with a 10 year visitor visa!

Reported, yes but not confirmed

BPost reported on 29 May 2018 that the UK foreign ministry nor the Thai foreign ministry knew anything about it

They said BBC Thai, whose editor is based in London, attributed the information to "a source close to Yingluck", whose name was withheld. 

Yes very reliable…………

 

A copy of the bank book and letter are required on all files unless waived by a senior officer.

Yes and no, shown at application but not kept on file permanently

The local immigration centre often recycles these and uses the reverse side for scrap paper or 90 reports paper

It’s been reported on here many times that people have seen other people’s information and they have reported it and think it’s a data breach of personal information

However It’s usually kept for 3 months after the renewal/application takes place and discarded/recycled after 90 days report is made

thats why when internal investigation officers arrive they only ask for the last 3 months of papers

When they do they flick through them all and look only for a bankbook on file, nothing more

Obviously if the application has no bankbook on file and its not an income letter supported application then its suspect

they do not have the time to check every application for 800,000 baht, length of time 800,000 in account etc

If they kept all the paper they generated they would need a new office the size of CW just to store it

 

 

Maybe you could ask your ‘freind’ (it’s actually spelled friend) to show you a completed file. Inside you will see a submission form that’s completed by the IO and signed off by the offices senior officer

Yes I have seen it, lots of boxes for the officers to tick

Including one that says money in bank?

Easy to tick, and there’s many a spill betwixt cup and mouth…

 

The form lists everything required to allow the IO/office to issue an extension. If the file were ever audited, and a copy of the bank book was missing and a wavier wasn’t on file, the IO/Supervisor would have a problem.

Who exactly do you think they would they have a problem with?

 

As long as copies are on file the IO has covered their back. If seasoning — or any other requirement — has been waived the file would have to include a request from the supervisor that has been signed off by a senior officer.

Yes copies of a bank book on file is required these days

The days of presenting with no book was still going on by bottom feeders at 12k until some weeks ago

IO have now told agents there must now be a bankbook on file

Presumably for this reason as you said: ‘’ As long as copies are on file the IO has covered their back’’.

So that’s OK then…..

 

How would anyone know it was a copy of a faked passbook? It’s a copy!

The original passbook with the applicants name on it must be given now

Why would anyone fake/copy a bankbook?

You just give a bankbook that easily available from any bank (if you know how)

You are getting ridiculous now , ha-ha

[Roy Baht]

1 hour ago, Toosetinmyways said:

There is one thing that all these topics and posts have confirmed to immigration is that a lot of retirees here dont even have a pot to piss in. 

Yes. And that's exactly why I don't want the Non-Im O-A visas to be called "retirement visas" because I think that gives some people a false sense of security. Thailand does not offer retirement visas. Only the "temporary residence" Non-Immigrant O-A (long stay) visa, good for one year. It's good for a year. After that, you're on your own. Anyone who has spent any time in Thailand knows that the rules change monthly. And the trick to surviving here is the ability to be flexible enough to adjust to those changes. Thais do it all the time. It's normal life for them. Of course, the other sudden change you have to be able to adjust to is the economy. If you live here, you need to have some cushion. You can't live here month to month, hand to mouth. If 800K baht is so dear to you that you can't dream of parting from it for 5 months, don't retire here. 

[David Walden]

37 minutes ago, jimn said:

Yes of course he is. He bangs on and on about getting a Retirement visa in Australia all the time. I remember him having a lengthy disagreement with Ubonjoe on the subject last year lol

All of my post on ThaiVisa are as a result my own personal experience.  That is where I see on the Thai the web site the Embassy refers to an O-A  M visa as a Retirement visa.  If it's good enough for them it's good enough for thousands to call it a Thai Retirement Visa Also, calling it by its correct name is complete and utterly confusing to most applicants.

[Straight8]

On 2/1/2019 at 12:50 PM, Chivas said:

Yet again another visa thread with half the respondees trying to work out how to circumnavigate the new requirements.

Heres a novel idea why not just comply with them.

Because by the look of things, most don't have the required funds... not even close!!

[bert bloggs]

On 2/1/2019 at 10:32 AM, Lacessit said:

You can leave her cash instead. That's what I am doing.

she gets cash as well ,plus she owns rice fields and a nice building plot (which she owned even before we married)

[bert bloggs]

4 minutes ago, Straight8 said:

Because by the look of things, most don't have the required funds... not even close!!

Or perhaps they are like me ,they do have the funds but object to being made to keep 400,000 baht in a bank and never be able to use it , i like to have the choice ,to do as i please with my own money (Q those saying well then go home,dont bother)

[icare999]

I used to top up to 800k 3 months before and then usually as soon as I got my extension spend 800k on a car or gold or investment. Problem was then always finding money again to top up again 9 months later which meant selling and investment (gold or a condo or something). Im seriously considering elite visa route given I will now need to tie up money for 6-7 months and keep say around ½ million so not to fall under 400k rule. It has a lot of advantages but at my age I probably wont last 20 years but might last more than 5 years. Also it means ½ million or 1 million less for my family (although that’s a small fraction of what they already have). While they wont need it much like inheritance tax in UK I hate simply giving any government any money.

 

So my options and probably many like me are:-

 

Go for Visa elite and have hassle free 5 10 or 20 year but loose between ½ million and 1 million. No more getting up at 5am once a year to get a Q number for my renewal etc. It also has a great advantage of safeguarding against future changes and if I went for 20 year for 1 million provided I lived that long (very unlikely) only 50,000 baht a year or say 5%.

 

Go over to  marriage visa or support a thai child visa but it’s a lot of hassle.

 

Fund 800,000 for ever and at least it would go to my family. However I totally distrust fiat money which can go to zero in next financial meltdown. Shame you cant show it in gold.

 

Borrow 1 million which at prevailing rate would be around 7% (my wife could easily borrow that on some of her land) but weve been totally debt free for 20 odd years and reluctant to have any debt at all.

 

On reflection while elite visa is really attractive and fairly easily affordable I cant bring myself to simply give away ½ to 1 million which would not then go to my family.

 

So ill almost certainly fund extra but 5,10 or 20 year elite visa is very tempting. If I go for that id probably have a massive heart attack next day. 

[notamember]

13 minutes ago, elviajero said:

 

show me an agent. lawyer, any business independent of immigration whatever you want to call it that does not offer a 800k funds supported retirement extension application, renewal or first time amongst there options

some will hand hold, some will accompany for a fee but there are none that will not offer to provide the money

Under your synopsis of agents that makes them all corrupt without exception

name one and i will call them and ask them to lay on the money

even when one seeks Assist ance in CM despite denying all knowledge initially when you get past the gatekeeper they offer it for 25K 

i have it in writing from them

maybe even its you that offers Asisit ance

so make your case, name one 

you can send by PM

[Pattaya46]

56 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

One or two Thai Embassy/Consulates websites do refer to the O-A as a retirement Visa. 

Surely far more than 1 or 2 !

 

56 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

//  whereas most refer to it correctly as the long stay Visa. 

A "long stay" reserved to "old people" and forbidding work sound like a "retirement visa" to me...  and to many...

 

BTW "long stay visa" is not the correct name, as you can't know if it's a O-A or a O-X, both long stay.

[David Walden]

55 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

One or two Thai Embassy/Consulates websites do refer to the O-A as a retirement Visa. Australia is one, whereas most refer to it correctly as the long stay Visa. Pound to a penny Dave Walden is an Australian?

 

http://canberra.thaiembassy.org/Home/visa

[Tanoshi]

25 minutes ago, elviajero said:

If the 400K minimum is correct it rather defeats the purpose of the combo method, which was to allow people with a small shortfall in income to cover it with cash in the bank.

I'd have stated the opposite.

It allowed people with minimum funds to make up the shortfall with income.

 

Previously as an example, 200K in bank, Embassy letter with annual income of 600K.

Whichever way, everyone will now have to keep a minimum of 400K year round in the bank for the combo.

[Roy Baht]

1 hour ago, Tanoshi said:

One or two Thai Embassy/Consulates websites do refer to the O-A as a retirement Visa. Australia is one, whereas most refer to it correctly as the long stay Visa. Pound to a penny Dave Walden is an Australian?

 

Yeah the Royal Thai Embassy in Athens, Greece just call it "TEMPORARY RESIDENCE [ NON-IMMIGRANT "O-A" (LONG STAY)] " http://www.thaiembassy.org/athens/en/services/785/17707-Visa-Issuance-for-temporary-residence-[Non-Immigra.html

[Straight8]

7 minutes ago, bert bloggs said:

Or perhaps they are like me ,they do have the funds but object to being made to keep 400,000 baht in a bank and never be able to use it , i like to have the choice ,to do as i please with my own money (Q those saying well then go home,dont bother)

Sounds like you wanna be the king in someone else's jungle.

 

Not gonna happen, but I'm not going to say it's their country, their rules thingy!!