SURVEY: Will the new financial requirements force you to leave?

[lamyai3]

1 hour ago, marcusarelus said:

To what point?  Thai Immigration wants you to have 800/400 in the bank for whatever reason __________ insert your own reason.  Urban myth or not makes little difference in the fact - the why is irrelevant to the issue.  

 

I don't respond to grammar issues.   

The point is you suggested it could be used to pay for emergencies. Prior to the changes, it most certainly was possible to use the entire deposit (outside the three month seasoning period) for medical emergency, income or repatriation as preferred. After March this amount needs to be untouched for five months, for the remaining year retaining a minimum balance of 400k, a dip beneath which will invalidate the extension.

 

It's a significant change in the terms and conditions, and while there may be nothing that can be done about it (as the impotent embassies have demonstrated), I'm amazed so many on here seem to be practically cheerleading immigration on. 

[Ctkong]

12 hours ago, Dave98 said:

I am leaving very soon for good and taking my family with me.  While I can easily do the 800k in a Thai Bank or the income method, I choose to not keep my money here and have what I can or cannot spend dictated by the Thais.  Their country, their rules, but for me there are many other options that are much more attractive.  Personally I do not think they want retirees here at all.  I also think there is going to be continuing tightening of the rules in the short and long term.  So long and good luck

Unless you are looking at South America, Portugal ,Spain, Central America as options, there are not many places like Thailand with the infrastructures. Moreover your family is thai? If so, even more challenges for them to blend in. I suggest you take a long term view about your situation . Remember, bureaucratic idiocy exist everywhere at the whims of the current ruling party.  There is always hope for a change to the better. Again I reiterate that the current requirement is not a huge hurdle to overcome. If it is, then I think you would face the same hurdle everywhere you go. 

[Ctkong]

13 hours ago, bwpage3 said:

And to think of all the personal bashing I took when my family and I decided to move back to the USA a few years ago.

 

Great, great life and do NOT have to be bothered by income laws, VISA's or anything else.

 

Peaceful and no stress, the way life should be.

 

What about your kids and wife.? no hurdles to overcome ? No social impact? Cultural differences to overcome? Going back home with your family only transfer the challenges to your family members instead of you. 

[LongTimeLurker]

23 hours ago, theoldgit said:

No I will not have to leave but as I get older the constant rule changes with ever ever changing hoops to jump over are becoming tiresome, and I'm really at a loss to understand the reasoning, other than "because we can".

 

I can afford to live here comfortably but I just want a nice quiet and stress free life.

Same here, they're going about stopping agents by making it harder for ALL retirees, not just the few that use agents. This will result in the agents finding a way around the system and continuing to flourish while being a pain in the @rse for the majority.

 

I have to stay for the next 2.5 years for school and had already planned after that to leave for Viet Nam where I get a 5 year visa for being married, it can't come soon enough.

[balo]

"No I will not have to leave" 

 

There is an agent on every corner wanting you to stay for 15k. Sssh don't tell anyone. 

 

 

[Ctkong]

13 hours ago, Sheryl said:

And through what mechanism does your creditor then get the money?  Through what mechanism is it "held hostage"?  What  prevents someone  from withdrawing it and leaving the country with it, bill still unpaid? Or just staying here and dodging their creditors?

 

I don't see it. There does not seem to be any mechanism in place that serves the purpose you mention. Meanwhile, having 400-800K of one's savings taken away will surely increase the frequency with which people here are unable to cover emergency costs, because everyone's financial cushion is going to go down by that amount.

 

Something like this could be designed as a surety bond,  but this has not been done that way.

 

 

 

 

Maybe the ‘surety bond’ of 400,000 is to ensure that worse come to worst, you still have this cushion amount to rest upon. Moreover, your immediate thai family will surely be able to make good use of your bond money when you demise. 

[Surasak]

17 hours ago, Khaeng Mak said:

How did you get your work permit while on a retirement extension?

I don't actually work as such. I just keep an eye on things and advise. The family are a very good team and surprise, surprise, yes they do ask questions, not that I'm the font of all knowledge.

[spidermike007]

20 hours ago, Pattaya46 said:

Big Joke said he wanted to make things easier (he by example talked about finishing the 90-Days reports) but the present change of (some) rules is a consequence of many people staying illegally in Thailand (not all farangs, not all retirees).

If a few farang retirees may now find themselves in a difficult situation it's just some small collateral damage to their war against illegal people. The main people to blame now are those who were using these agents, main reason of this strengthening of laws...

 

Absolutely false information. He said he wanted to make things simpler, and you actually believed him? You believed a lifetime police officer? Why would you do that? What credibility does he have? He has in fact made it far more difficult, and he is taking alot of flak for it. That is why he is waging these PR events, to try to convince us otherwise. Believe me, the Biggest Joke is the true enemy of all ex-pats living in Thailand right now. Besides being completely incompetent, he appears to be a serious racist, and despises foreigners. 

[JLCrab]

6 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

Believe me, the Biggest Joke is the true enemy of all ex-pats living in Thailand right now. He appears to despise foreigners. 

Yes even though you left off incompetent and brain-dead (or was that just MoFA), I believe you.

[JLCrab]

25 minutes ago, balo said:

There is an agent on every corner wanting you to stay for 15k. Sssh don't tell anyone. 

That's right -- if I found agent willing to give me 15K baht to stay, I wouldn't tell anyone either.

[watcharacters]

23 hours ago, theoldgit said:

No I will not have to leave but as I get older the constant rule changes with ever ever changing hoops to jump over are becoming tiresome, and I'm really at a loss to understand the reasoning, other than "because we can".

 

Sometimes I wonder if there'll ever be a standardized requirement for  permission for falangs  to remain in thailand.      I'd be nice  if the Thailand government could settle on a requirement that satisfies the powers  that be  as well as  reasonably quell the concerns of the falangs it impacts. 

 

Likelihood  of it happening,    next to zero?

[Grouse]

I blame the EU

[alohatodon2]

I will have to leave.  I'm not wanted, it's obvious.  Some of you have money.  Soon, the Thai banks will have more because of you.

[steeltownguy]

Although I can meet these new requirements I completely understand the unease the seemingly ever changing requirements create.  In truth both my wife and I would return home if it weren't for some local responsibilities, largely due to the feeling that we are not really wanted (By the elite, government folks, not our friendly neighbors.)  I am fortunate to be able to have options, many do not.

[Dave98]

3 hours ago, Ctkong said:

Unless you are looking at South America, Portugal ,Spain, Central America as options, there are not many places like Thailand with the infrastructures. Moreover your family is thai? If so, even more challenges for them to blend in. I suggest you take a long term view about your situation . Remember, bureaucratic idiocy exist everywhere at the whims of the current ruling party.  There is always hope for a change to the better. Again I reiterate that the current requirement is not a huge hurdle to overcome. If it is, then I think you would face the same hurdle everywhere you go. 

My wife is Thai and my children Thai / American.  I have lived here almost 10 years and it is not that the financial requirements are a hurdle for me,  I just prefer to not tie up money here.  Bottom line IMHO, things are going to continue to be more onerous for expats because they really do not want us here.  Personally, I am  going back to the USA, which will be the right move long term as it will be much better for my children to live there.  A two week visit to Thailand every other year will be fine as I am so over this place.

[Pattaya46]

2 hours ago, alohatodon2 said:

I will have to leave.  I'm not wanted, it's obvious.  Some of you have money.  Soon, the Thai banks will have more because of you.

You don't have to put money 400/800k in a Thai bank to leave here;

It's just one of several methods to stay. You can chose another one.

[NanLaew]

5 hours ago, giddyup said:

So, you do think that being able to deposit 800K makes you rich? Everyone knows what the criteria is to remain in Thailand for a retirement extension, and yet they seem to think the rules should be changed for them because of their lack of financial resources.

I consider commenting on other people's wealth or possible lack thereof based solely on your own financial yardstick is quite vulgar.

[AjarnMartin]

21 hours ago, Suradit69 said:

I believe all TW transfers come to Bangkok Bank first so if you have an account there it's shown as an international transfer.. If you use a different bank, the money is then transferred from Bangkok Bank to your banK so it appears to be a domestic transfer as far as your bank is concerned.

Thanks Suradit69,

I transferred my first TW monies to my BKK Bank today so it will arrive tomorrow! I wait with baited breath to see the record in my bank book. ????????

[giddyup]

30 minutes ago, NanLaew said:

I consider commenting on other people's wealth or possible lack thereof based solely on your own financial yardstick is quite vulgar.

But it's not my financial yardstick, it's the yardstick that Thai immigration uses to allow you to remain in the country, so you'd better direct your "vulgar" comment at them.

[JackThompson]

On 2/3/2019 at 12:48 PM, bojo said:

After all, how many countries in the world are there where one can just rock up with 800K Baht and live there perpetually. I suspect there are non which can match what the kingdom has to offer....

Many, many, require far less to none.  Right next door there are 3.  And it isn't "perpetually" in Thailand w/o PR or Citizenship - it is a year at a time, unless/until they change the rules and you are out. 

 

On 2/3/2019 at 12:53 PM, ozmeldo said:

Not really sorry to see the single men down in Pattaya, Jomtien be forced to move on.

Most are short-term tourists, so will not be affected.  They will continue to take short breaks from celibacy in the West, here (and elsewhere).

 

As to the longer-term guys, what about all the locals employed by the businesses they support?

 

Quote

Married, married with children I'd hope Thailand could sort it out.

No, they make it much harder for us than the retirees who can swap gf at any time, and even easier for the guys who come in for short visits on Tourist Visas.

 

Quote

...

Governments have every right to set criteria. If you don't like Thailand's there are 219 other countries...bye bye

 

On 2/3/2019 at 1:01 PM, ozmeldo said:

For a single guy to spend such little money. The lifestyle must be so wan. Thailand doesn't need this lot. They just exist.

For each of us that leaves, several Thai people lose their jobs.  That is the part you'd think the govt here would care about.  But, evidently not - they seem to share your view, so the affected Thais, and the expats whose lives are turned upside down, are both disposable - since they don't meet your standards.

 

On 2/3/2019 at 1:03 PM, ozmeldo said:

It's a horrible country. Why don't you think more expats live there? Every Filipino that can leaves the country. I hear over 10%. Enjoy

Not horrible at all - not for us - only for those not fortunate to have a job -such as one working in a business that supports us. 

But, not to worry, Thailand's immigration is doing it's best to throw its own citizens out of work, so that Filipinos can take their place.  Continuing on this path, including the importation of cheap workers from neighboring countries, Thailand end up being like the PI, and the PI will become like Thailand once was.

[JackThompson]

On 2/3/2019 at 1:07 PM, Khaeng Mak said:

Expat retirees in Thailand are now viewed as nothing more than a revenue stream. 

We always were, but that's not the problem.  The problem is they are willing to burn oodles of revenue, and throw their own under the bus, in order to get rid of most of us.

 

On 2/3/2019 at 1:10 PM, Benroon said:

Always the Philippines - lovely restful little country where shoot on sight is positively encouraged, one of the highest murder rates in the world, and THE highest in South East Asia - off you go, enjoy ! 

Avoid Manila and the far-south, and you won't face any higher danger than here.  When those are mixed into the averages, you get the bad numbers.  Oh, and stay away from drugs (here and there).

 

On 2/3/2019 at 1:17 PM, Benroon said:

Spot on but so many westerners come here with this sense of superiority and entitlement because they come from the west. 

No.  We come and spend our capital into their economy and support their citizens, so it's a bit shocking when immigration treats us poorly, then shoves us out.

 

On 2/3/2019 at 1:17 PM, Benroon said:

Thailand IMO is simply flushing out those with next to nothing to contribute but a misplaced hiso attitude.

You are the one displaying a hiso attitude - talk about pot calling the kettle black.  They are flushing away thousands of Thai's jobs, by pushing out those that fund the jobs into existence.  You don't care about the expats or Thais being sacrificed for this agenda either, it seems. 

 

On 2/3/2019 at 1:23 PM, ozmeldo said:

What do you expect from the country? Permanent residency for being broke? That's a serious question, not being flippant.

How about not change the rules for those already here? 

In his case, not adding an extra mo of money-seasoning after he submits his application based on marriage without so much as a public announcement?  He and his family might need that money after holding it for 2 mo to apply - per the published rules.

 

On 2/3/2019 at 1:33 PM, Saladin said:

why not make it as easy as possible for retirees, rather than constantly erecting Donald Trump style obstacles

Are self-funded expats entering the USA to spend their own money to hire Americans which is the problem, there?  No, the problem are people who evade the legal process, and if they become legal, are 2x more likely to be a drain on govt programs paid for by others - for generations.  There are no "social programs" for us to drain in Thailand.

 

On 2/3/2019 at 1:33 PM, Saladin said:

Where is the logic in spending $millions to entice foreign tourists to spend their money in Thailand while at the same time, encouraging retirees to spend their money somewhere else?

Because the short-term tourists don't "stick around" - seems to be their attitude.  Even though many of those spend very little, and are a huge infrastructure drain at the same time, and don't interact with us much, so one group doesn't affect the other.

 

Don't look for a logical explanation, because there is only an irrational one.  Hatred.

[BritManToo]

On 2/3/2019 at 12:48 PM, bojo said:

After all, how many countries in the world are there where one can just rock up with 800K Baht and live there perpetually. I suspect there are non which can match what the kingdom has to offer....

All the countries around Thailand require no proof of funding at all to stay for a year.

(Malaysia is the nearest one wanting proof of funding, but they give 3 months waiver on entry)

Thailand is the only one demanding 800k in a local bank account.

Why are you writing this misinformation?

[ozmeldo]

1 minute ago, BritManToo said:

All the countries around Thailand require no proof of funding at all to stay for a year.

(Malaysia is the nearest one wanting proof of funding, but they give 3 months waiver on entry)

Thailand is the only one demanding 800k in a local bank account.

Why are you writing this misinformation?

All the THIRD WORLD countries

 

Fixed it for you.

 

Malaysia, Indonesia, Philippines and Singapore if that's even possible for you all require funds for retirement visas.

[BritManToo]

13 minutes ago, ozmeldo said:

Malaysia, Indonesia, Philippines and Singapore if that's even possible for you all require funds for retirement visas.

As far as I know Indonesia, Philippines and Singapore don't share any borders with Thailand.

But I'm going to put you on ignore, because I'm not keen on communicating with the overly nasty and problematic posters on this forum.

 

Philippines ask you to sign a declaration that you have $10,000 in savings and a monthly pension.

They have never asked me or anyone I know to see any evidence/letter/bank book/etc.

[JackThompson]

20 hours ago, marcusarelus said:

To pay for emergencies you may have while in Thailand as opposed to the Thai government picking up the expenditures. 

Which happens how often?  How does it compare to VAT revenues gained from the same retirees?  How many of such expenditures are from short-term tourists, vs retirees?

 

I don't oppose this idea in principle - but 100K in a locked-account plus a high-deductible "stabilize and send home" insurance policy would take care of this question.  There is no need for micro-managing peoples bank-balances and fund-xfers - and those don't guarantee an unpaid bill vs what I described, which would.

[adam1948]

Due to some recent developments in Thai govt and USA govt policies (p*ssing match) I find my self between a rock and a hard place. I need to find the cheapest way to transfer funds, money, currency from my US bank to my Thai bank and then transfer a small part of those same funds, money, currency from my Thai bank back into my US bank

 

 

Allow me to preface this by saying there are many gentlemen who are fortunate enough and can afford to have 400K/800K baht in bank all the time or have 40K/65K coming into their Thai bank monthly. I’m asking these gentlemen who sometimes gleefully post smug, arrogant, condescending remarks refrain from that practice and instead of being *ssh*les with those types of remarks please contribute some helpful information if you have it. No I’m not a so called “Cheap Charlie” nor do I desire, want or deserve that title nor do I want or deserve to go back to my home country of USA as it is now worse than when I left 13 years ago … Since I have a Thia home and family I would prefer to remain here

 

 

I have lived my entire life with the attitude that anything and everything that happens to me is due to my own actions and blame no one but myself for any good or bad that happens in my life. I am responsible for my own destiny and/or future … no one but me controls my life, I am where I am because of my own decisions

 

 

With that said …..

A little background on how I arrived at/in my current situation … Being retired and fed up with my home country’s govt and seeing where my country’s society was headed I did a long extensive search of where/what foreign country my financial resources and many many other factors would give me the type of life and best enhanced quality of life. My long extensive research (in 2006) showed that Thailand was the place that would best suite my needs and the life style I was seeking. I arrived in Thailand in 2006 on a “O A Retirement” visa. So I’ve been here for 13 years. I had quite a bit (many many thousands) of funds/money/currency when I arrived. In 2007 I married a wonderful Thai woman with 2 boys, 4 and 6 years old. I proceeded to lose a lot of our funds in the stock market. My fault, my bad. In 2010 with our last 1,000,000 Baht we bought some land and built our 3 bedroom 2 bath home. We now had something for our sons future, a paid for home, also as a plus we saved the 10,000 Baht rent we were paying monthly … but our seasoned bank stash to satisfy a Thai Immigration “O A” visa requirement was now gone … No problem, the USD/Baht exchange was at 33+, giving us a monthly income of 40,000+ Baht … also the US Embassy was issuing “Notarized Financial/Income Documents” so we used that to satisfy the 65,000 Baht monthly Thai Immigration income requirement (remember at this point I’m still on the “O A Retirement” visa) … no problem, no foul … We’re married, have our own home, raising our 2 sons and contributing all our monthly funds to the Thai economy … Life’s good, everybody’s happy!

 

 

Fast forward to present day … Thai govt, US govt get into a p*ssing match over the validity i.e. truthfulness of the “Notarized Financial/Income Document”  … US says screw you we will no longer issue that document Naa! Naa! Naa … Thai Immigration says that’s fine with us we’ll just put the screws to all your expats Na Na Na … So here stands many many guys like me who are not “Cheap Charlies” nor “deadbeats” nor “scammers” but simply guys who have been living a nice quiet happy family life in Thailand, with my Thai wife, raising our children in our own home contributing to the Thai economy and enjoying ourselves …

 

Our normal way to access our monthly US funds was to draw it out using ATM and depositing it into our Thai Bank … no problem, easy peasy … but ohhh nooo Thai Immigration threw another little monkey wrench into the works … the real killer here is that my bank book must show funds coming from US(foreign) bank directly into Thai bank so that the bank code shows up as a “out of country/foreign deposit”

 

We are now, (due to drop in USD/ThaiBaht exchange rate) a little short each month of the required 40,000 Baht (sh*t happens) … i.e. I now need to find the cheapest way to transfer funds from US to Thailand and a small part of those funds back to US so that I can satisfy the 40,000 Baht monthly requirement and continue to live in our Thai home with my Thai wife and sons … my biggest sin is contributing all our monthly funds to the Thai economy … wow what a bad parasite evil monster Cheap Charlie of a person am I … OK all the smug, arrogant, condescending ha ha I got money and you don’t *ash*les let’er fly … remember some of you in the future just might be in this same situation, we’ll see how glib you are then … am I angry? … yes I am … will I get over it, yes I will … in the meantime, like the Beatles said “I get by with a little help from my friends”

[ozmeldo]

I just want to wrap up my interest in this thread by stating that each one of you that lied when attesting and maybe even worse those that used agents to procure visa extensions you were never entitled to have it all coming back to them and the pity parade is staggering. It's literally been months.

 

This lot deserves every bit of what's come down. I'm surprised it didn't happen years ago honestly. It was and still is an open joke to get your visa fixed in Pattaya. Who's laughing now?

 

Another irony not lost on me is all the whinging about corruption in 1001 forms here in Thailand. But just as the Thai, when it suits YOU - you're part of it.

 

Anyone that has lied to the consular official and those that had their visas fixed. I've not one speck of sympathy. I imagine the embassies are off the charts ballistic and it's too funny...everyone crying to the embassies for help. They screwed you because of the constant, pathologic lying. Wonder why no help? I'm not.

 

Further, if everyone can please stop pointing out how much the economy is going to tank and tens of thousands commit suicide over being so devastated because a bunch of skint old men living on hot dogs and ham and cheese sandwiches are forced to leave the country - that would be stellar.

 

Please stop carrying on, give the thaivisa servers a break and go plan your exit strategy to one of those regional paradises that require *no funds*. Plenty of cheap junk food in Philippines.

 

Of course this will not deter the dead-enders. They never abided by the law and it will be big joke that rounds them up for overstay all the while continuing to moan about their God given right to be here and how they personally are propping up the economy.

 

If you are a single guy at 60-75 and haven't figured out how to save 800k. That's amazing. If you're drawing a pension of any amount, you're hopeless. That's like 100usd per month for thirty years.

 

Time was when we could float around the world and everyone was happy to have us and our money - great or small.

 

Asia does not need any of us. Wake up, get a clue and move on.

 

[BritManToo]

6 minutes ago, adam1948 said:

Since I have a Thia home and family I would prefer to remain here

Non-o multi from Suvannahkhet, no financials, just marriage cert and 5,000bht.

That'll get you 15 months in 90 day lumps.

[ozmeldo]

18 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

As far as I know Indonesia, Philippines and Singapore don't share any borders with Thailand.

But I'm going to put you on ignore, because I'm not keen on communicating with the overly nasty and problematic posters on this forum.

 

Philippines ask you to sign a declaration that you have $10,000 in savings and a monthly pension.

They have never asked me or anyone I know to see any evidence/letter/bank book/etc.

You stated all the countries around not all the countries surrounding.

 

They all have financial requirements.

 

BTW you can't even get BUSINESS visas in Myanmar let alone retirement. Lao is s weird one and Cambodia well...that place is so damn sketchy they'll have anyone. I know I lived there 93-96 and left largely due to the riff raff and paedophiles.

 

[GeoMill]

5 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Non-o multi from Suvannahkhet, no financials, just marriage cert and 5,000bht.

That'll get you 15 months in 90 day lumps.

Are you sure? When I went for the same visa (single) version, I had to show marriage certificate and proof of finances to support myself. They didn't ask for a specifik number, but I did have to show a bank statement. This was at the Thai Embassy in my home country though.