Scamming At Immigration

[AGITATORKEN]

I am an American Expat who has been living in Thailand and had a retirement visa since 2008. I just attempted to renew my retirement Visa and was refused.  Here is the story and a real accounting of what is going on:

 

1- Embassy's stopped issuing income certification letters, probably under pressure from the Thai government.

2- No matter what you bring to Immigration, they will not accept.  I brought my bank book with transfer from America in the last six months totaling Bt. 1.4 million.  The bank book clearly states that the money came from an overseas transfer.  I was informed that it has to be Bt. 65,000 every month NOT AVERAGE, and certification has to come from my country.  I could probably get the certification from my bank, but I am positive they would not accept it.  I asked to see a supervisor but was refused.

 

HERE IS THE SCAM.

 

1- You can go to a Thai waiting outside the embassy knowing his buddy just turned you down.

2- For the tidy sum of $1,000 USD he will set up a phony bank account for you, pretend to deposit 800,000 in the account and fix it with his buddy.  You have to use his bank, which does not have internet banking for you to check the transfer.

3- My theory in reality is there is no money, the bankbook is just a piece of paper. There is no money transfer and it is a Thai scam. Pretty good income for a scam artist that earns $500/month.

 

 

For me it is the last straw of dishonesty in Asia and I will be selling my condo and my car and leaving.  If others did the same, they would put a stop to it. The American Embassy does absolutely nothing to help Americans in Thailand.

 

 

[Justin Side]

Yes. The rule states that it has to be 65k every month and not an average.

Bizzare I know but that is the rule.

Not sure how someone outside an Embassy would be trying to force you down the illegal route.

Edited March 1, 2019 by Justin Side

[CharlieH]

And exactly where/which office did this happen ?

[bkk6060]

???

Gee sounds terrible.

A Thai was waiting outside the embassy?

What embassy was that?

[Tanoshi]

5 minutes ago, AGITATORKEN said:

I was informed that it has to be Bt. 65,000 every month NOT AVERAGE,

That's correct, the orders have always clearly stated income of 65,000 baht per month (as a minimum).

[wgdanson]

2 minutes ago, Justin Side said:

Yes. The rules states that it has to be 65k every month and not an average.

Bizzare I know but that is the rule.

Not sure how someone outside an Embassy would be trying to force you down the illegal route.

I think he meant outside the Immigration.

[Essecola]

This happened at an embassy or immigration? 

[roobaa01]

that 800k agent service will stop nationwide as of today for the new rules kick in.

 

wbr

roobaa01

[Mavideol]

very interesting information but missing the most important, where was it? it would help many of us knowing the IMO

[poohy]

I suspect the 1000$ can be negotiated down a bit if you speak to few more of the immigration guys friends

[richard_smith237]

I think if the OP seasons his account at more than 800,000 baht for 3 months is it?... (and now 2 months afterwards)....  he will then meet the requirements... 

 

So.. OP - for how many months have you had more than 800,000 baht in your account?...   It may be possible to fly out and do a visa run or apply for a tourist Vientiane etc while you bide your time seasoning 800,000 baht in your account. 

 

Unless of course I'm missing something. 

 

 

EDIT: And by the way, Embassies stopping the affirmation on Income has nothing to do with the Thai's - its to do with the Embassies themselves being unable to accurately affirm the claims made on income without a great deal of effort, thus opening them up to incorrect statements. Too many people were making false claims which could not be accurately verified opening the Embassy up to criticism of flawed affirmations. 

Edited March 1, 2019 by richard_smith237

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

There probably have been 100+ TVF forum threads on this general topic over the past couple months...

 

And in NONE of them has it ever even been remotely suggested that Immigration would accept monthly payments AVERAGING at least 65K per month.  It's always and only been discussed as a MINIMUM of 65K each and every month.

 

Hard to understand why anyone would go into an extension application process at this point thinking the averaging method was going to be accepted.  But then again, it's a member making what appears to be their first post... so perhaps they haven't been reading or paying attention.

 

 

Edited March 1, 2019 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[connda]

Been here since 2008 and just made his first post in Thai Visa?  Not saying impossible, but.....   :dry

[Tanoshi]

4 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

I think if the OP seasons his account at more than 800,000 baht for 3 months is it?... (and now 2 months afterwards)....  he will then meet the requirements... 

 

So.. OP - for how many months have you had more than 800,000 baht in your account?...   It may be possible to fly out and do a visa run or apply for a tourist Vientiane etc while you bide your time seasoning 800,000 baht in your account. 

 

Unless of course I'm missing something. 

You missed he was using the income method, not funds in an account.

[connda]

10 minutes ago, NCC1701A said:

i want to make up some stuff too.

 

but i cant think of anything right now.

Ditto.

Edited March 1, 2019 by connda

[Tanoshi]

32 minutes ago, CharlieH said:

And exactly where/which office did this happen ?

Guarantee CW because of the mention of Embassies.

[poohy]

4 minutes ago, connda said:

Been here since 2008 and just made his first post in Thai Visa?  Not saying impossible, but.....   :dry

Not surprising whatsoever

Believe me most of my ex pat mates avoid TV like the plague

[worgeordie]

Selling your Condo and car, well I guess you will still be here

a while longer,unless you have a fire sale.

regards Worgeordie

[Tanoshi]

2 minutes ago, poohy said:

Not surprising whatsoever

Believe me most of my ex pat mates avoid TV like the plague

Most of my expat mates don't know of TV, or anything else for that matter - clueless.

[giddyup]

Why didn't you just deposit 800,000 baht of that 1.4 mill into a fixed deposit for 3 months, that would satisfy immigration. I've been using that method for 9 years without any problems.

[Mike Teavee]

45 minutes ago, Justin Side said:

Yes. The rule states that it has to be 65k every month and not an average.

Bizzare I know but that is the rule.

Not sure how someone outside an Embassy would be trying to force you down the illegal route.

I thought they were showing some leeway for this year as people wouldn't have known they had to transfer 65k per month until at least October last year (when the Embassies announced they weren't doing Income letters anymore) & in reality until December/January when the 65k per month rule was officially announced.

 

 

[Tanoshi]

2 minutes ago, Mike Teavee said:

I thought they were showing some leeway for this year as people wouldn't have known they had to transfer 65k per month until at least October last year (when the Embassies announced they weren't doing Income letters anymore) & in reality until December/January when the 65k per month rule was officially announced.

 

 

The requirement has always been 65,000 baht per month.

Quote

(3) Must have evidence of having income of no less than Baht 65,000 per month:

ORDER OF THE IMMIGRATION BUREAU
No. 327/2557

Section 2.22

[thaiguzzi]

24 minutes ago, connda said:

Been here since 2008 and just made his first post in Thai Visa?  Not saying impossible, but.....   :dry

Er, Why?

I've lived here since 03, did'nt join this forum until 2011.

And that was purely to use the classifieds.

Now several years later i've been sucked into posting over 4000 times.

There is more to life than just TV.

And it's certainly not a badge of honour for a Thai expat to contribute or be a member of this forum.

Edited March 1, 2019 by thaiguzzi
punctuation

[Tanoshi]

8 minutes ago, giddyup said:

Why didn't you just deposit 800,000 baht of that 1.4 mill into a fixed deposit for 3 months, that would satisfy immigration. I've been using that method for 9 years without any problems.

That would have only left him 600K to spend in the 6 month period.

Be a little more sympathetic for those who have a hard life.

[DrJack54]

29 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

There probably have been 100+ TVF forum threads on this general topic over the past couple months...

 

And in NONE of them has it ever even been remotely suggested that Immigration would accept monthly payments AVERAGING at least 65K per month.  It's always and only been discussed as a MINIMUM of 65K each and every month.

 

Hard to understand why anyone would go into an extension application process at this point thinking the averaging method was going to be accepted.  But then again, it's a member making what appears to be their first post... so perhaps they haven't been reading or paying attention.

 

 

Very true. Apart from that think that the op is over reacting to his own mistakes with what is required using income method. Rather than sell his condo etc, he is better off getting a non-0 (perhaps Laos) and starting over. Sounds like he is not skint. Just wack 800k in Thai bank.

As TallGuy points out, first post so perhaps unaware. As I mentioned in similar thread....I wonder how many xpats will have trouble for next extension. Many people haven't even heard of thaivisa. Blissfully unaware. As for "scam thing" mentioned by OP. Nothing new here just ignore.

Edited March 1, 2019 by DrJack54
Error

[Olmate]

17 hours ago, XD1 at Phuket said:

http://piv-phuket.com/changes-regarding-retirement-extension-application/

 

New information form Phuket Immigration Volunteer.

My retirement 1 year is THB 800,000 in Thai bank method.

It seems that we do not have to report our bank amount at TM-47 90 days.

But,

> In a random selection process it is possible that applicants will receive a

> 90 days under consideration stamp and have to return to the immigration

> department after 90 days with new bank statements to proof that

> the 800.000 Baht is still in your account after which the remaining months

> will be granted.

Oh no !

 

Did anyone notice this post relating to Phuket I O yesterday from PIV website.States that post application 800k seasoning will be checked randomly. You might think that agent submitted or assisted applications may not be checked randomly if at all? 

[giddyup]

1 minute ago, Tanoshi said:

That would have only left him 600K to spend in the 6 month period.

Be a little more sympathetic for those who have a hard life.

100K a month, I could manage on that as long as I didn't have big rent to pay.

[fforest1]

40 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

 

 

EDIT: And by the way, Embassies stopping the affirmation on Income has nothing to do with the Thai's - its to do with the Embassies themselves being unable to accurately affirm the claims made on income without a great deal of effort, thus opening them up to incorrect statements. Too many people were making false claims which could not be accurately verified opening the Embassy up to criticism of flawed affirmations. 

So the 4 embassies were just fine issuing the income letter for the past 20 years...And then with-in weeks they all decided hey we were pretty stupid for the last 20 years issuing a income letter we can not verify.....Never mind it says right on the letter they are only notarizing a statement...

 

There is a 99.9% chance that it was Thai immigration that was the force behind stopping the letters.....And thats a fact.....

Edited March 1, 2019 by fforest1

[flexomike]

5 minutes ago, Mike Teavee said:

I thought they were showing some leeway for this year as people wouldn't have known they had to transfer 65k per month until at least October last year (when the Embassies announced they weren't doing Income letters anymore) & in reality until December/January when the 65k per month rule was officially announced.

 

 

Was at the Map Tha Phut office In Rayong a couple of days ago and asked him if I could use the income method for my extension in April, he said yes if you have a history of 12 months deposits with none less than 65,000 baht, oh forgot got I am American, asked him about the supposed leeway for first application using this method and he was very adamant that it had to be twelve months

[stud858]

Spoke to a friend today who just completed his extension through a seasoning agent. He was told in a couple of days he wouldn't be able to do the same and time will tell but the next time if possible at all it would cost a lot more.

And also told the election result could shake things for the better.

Edited March 1, 2019 by stud858