Do you believe in God and why

[thaibeachlovers]

3 hours ago, save the frogs said:

how can you prove the soul exists?

how do you define it? 

 

The soul is what makes us "us", an animal with imagination and free will. Some say that it's life force per se, but I don't really believe that as I believe a soul is an individual thing.

If not for our soul, IMO we'd just be a hairless ape looking for berries to eat.

[thaibeachlovers]

3 hours ago, save the frogs said:

sorry, not quite grasping ... maybe i'm tired too. but ... 

Ying and yang. If we were never unhappy, how would we know when we were happy?

[thaibeachlovers]

3 hours ago, save the frogs said:

you would need to expand on that definition.

soul implies that the death of the body is not the absolute death of the person? 

the soul lives on after death? 

That's what we have been saying for over 500 pages. The body dies as it is an animal, the soul returns to God, IMO.

[Hummin]

1 minute ago, thaibeachlovers said:

The soul is what makes us "us", an animal with imagination and free will. Some say that it's life force per se, but I don't really believe that as I believe a soul is an individual thing.

If not for our soul, IMO we'd just be a hairless ape looking for berries to eat.

I am a bit sceptic to call out other species ad just other being, just looking for food. If god is everything, then nature do not discriminate and we all are here on the same premises. We forget easily we are just one of the latest creation of Nature to enter this planet. If there is something as a soul, then everything have a soul, not just us

[Sunmaster]

4 minutes ago, Hummin said:

I am a bit sceptic to call out other species ad just other being, just looking for food. If god is everything, then nature do not discriminate and we all are here on the same premises. We forget easily we are just one of the latest creation of Nature to enter this planet. If there is something as a soul, then everything have a soul, not just us

If we swap the term soul with consciousness, then I agree. Like Tippaporn said, everything is imbued with consciousness as the most basic building block...from the tiniest particle, cell, organ to planets and the vastest galaxies. Infinite expressions of the one Consciousness. And only a small part of those expressions need a material vessel (body). Fields within fields within fields....ad infinitum.

 

[Tippaporn]

32 minutes ago, Hummin said:

I think we have been through how scientists work with a theory, theory proven or not even some indicates it can be something right about it, they continue working with the problems they have. If one have a positive result, then other also continue work with the problem (theory) and often as much prove them right, they also ending up providing them wrong. There is no science that is not up for change as new evidences is proven! No scientists I know of claim anything else, and faith in something, should had same approach, willing to change as new evidences might appear. 

 

How can a scientists if not personal belief, accept a soul if no evidence? 

 

A scientist can say as a believer there is a soul, but as a scientist, he can not! 

Science has created an enormous quandary for itself when it made the decision to ignore a good portion of reality.  In truth, the most important part.  They have made the decision to not include the whole in their attempt to explain the whole.  Please explain that supreme irony.

You are truly an enigma, Hummin.  You come across as an ardent supporter of science in their dismissal of subjective reality and yet are fond of expressing your connection to the subjective aspect of nature when you are within it's midst.

Consider trying to understand the true reality and functioning of the human body in purely mechanistic fashion where the human residing in it has naught to do with the body's reality or functioning?  Science's approach in large measure has been to completely disconnect the subjective experience and reality of the human from the very corporeal image which the human has himself created.  How the f do you ever expect science to succeed in gaining any sort of understanding of the human body through examination of only it's individual parts as they cut off it's subjective head?  You seriously need to reconcile that insane approach with yourself.

 

Science's completely inane approach thus leads to the insane theories of what causes heart troubles as shown in the tweet I posted.  "Solar storms may cause up to 5500 heart-related deaths in a given year."  Come on, Hummin!!!  Do you seriously claim to believe that?  And if you don't then doesn't it at least force the question in your head as to how science could be so completely off the rails to even have such a preposterous theory published?  And if that inanity is subscribed to by at least a portion of scientists then what other inanities have they been convincing you of?   Like, masks work!!  LOL

 

Edited March 2, 2023 by Tippaporn

[mauGR1]

26 minutes ago, Hummin said:

A scientist can say as a believer there is a soul, but as a scientist, he can not! 

Amen to that, but then one can also say that natural science is restricted to physical, measurable phenomena. 

Thus, saying that something which is not measurable, and unprovable by physical means doesn't exist, is a bit of a stretch imho.

[Hummin]

3 minutes ago, Sunmaster said:

If we swap the term soul with consciousness, then I agree. Like Tippaporn said, everything is imbued with consciousness as the most basic building block...from the tiniest particle, cell, organ to planets and the vastest galaxies. Infinite expressions of the one Consciousness. And only a small part of those expressions need a material vessel (body). Fields within fields within fields....ad infinitum.

 

I can always trust you as my wing man even we agree or not.

[Neeranam]

18 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

The soul is what makes us "us", an animal with imagination and free will. Some say that it's life force per se, but I don't really believe that as I believe a soul is an individual thing.

If not for our soul, IMO we'd just be a hairless ape looking for berries to eat.

Don't apes have souls?

 

If you are interested in discovering what the soul is and how to have soul consciousness, the following is the best organisation I have found. 

https://www.brahmakumaris.org/

[Hummin]

5 minutes ago, mauGR1 said:

Amen to that, but then one can also say that natural science is restricted to physical, measurable phenomena. 

Thus, saying that something which is not measurable, and unprovable by physical means doesn't exist, is a bit of a stretch imho.

We can not see internet but we can measure it ???? Thats way Im positive science will find the right approach one day.

 

Funny we had human made internet before we found natures own universal www that might be part of  UUW

[Hummin]

31 minutes ago, Tippaporn said:

 

 

Science's completely inane approach thus leads to the insane theories of what causes heart troubles as shown in the tweet I posted.  "Solar storms may cause up to 5500 heart-related deaths in a given year."  Come on, Hummin!!!  Do you seriously claim to believe that?  And if you don't then doesn't it at least force the question in your head as to how science could be so completely off the rails to even have such a preposterous theory published?  And if that inanity is subscribed to by at least a portion of scientists then what other inanities have they been convincing you of?   Like, masks work!!  LOL

 

I am suspect you read with same care science as most do when getting presented Seth's theory's

 

Without really trying to see the message. 

 

Most science is created with the  best intentions, but in many cases abused for other reasons same as religion. I thought seriously we where past those obstacles by now. At least from us who have been here since the start of this thread.

[Tippaporn]

28 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Don't apes have souls?

 

If you are interested in discovering what the soul is and how to have soul consciousness, the following is the best organisation I have found. 

https://www.brahmakumaris.org/

If you want to get really deep take it from somebody who has been here and has moved on and now has an expansive awareness to the degree that few humans have.

Seth.  Free downloads here.

 

[Tippaporn]

1 minute ago, Hummin said:

I am suspect you read with same care science as most do when getting presented Seth's theory's

 

Without really trying to see the message. 

 

Most science is created with the  best intentions, but in many cases abused for other reasons same as religion. I thought seriously we where past those obstacles by now. At least from us who have been here since the start of this thread.

Yes.

Wrong.

You seem to not have understood anything I've written.  If you had understood then you wouldn't have written what you did.

[thaibeachlovers]

34 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Don't apes have souls?

 

If you are interested in discovering what the soul is and how to have soul consciousness, the following is the best organisation I have found. 

https://www.brahmakumaris.org/

Do apes have imagination, determination, ambition, a desire to educate themselves, or are they content to live in trees and eat berries?

 

IMO they have life force, but not as humans do.

 

You could have asked if an ant has a soul- it's is a living organism- so do you believe that ants, cockroaches, flies etc have souls?

[Hummin]

7 minutes ago, Tippaporn said:

If you want to get really deep take it from somebody who has been here and has moved on and now has an expansive awareness to the degree that few humans have.

Seth.  Free downloads here.

 

You obviously jumping on the defence before you read my lines. 

 

Do you have any idea, or can you think of reasons why solar storms theory can stop a hearth? 

[Neeranam]

3 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

You could have asked if an ant has a soul- it's is a living organism- so do you believe that ants, cockroaches, flies etc have souls?

No, they don't, but apes do. 

[Neeranam]

14 minutes ago, Tippaporn said:

If you want to get really deep take it from somebody who has been here and has moved on and now has an expansive awareness to the degree that few humans have.

Seth.  Free downloads here.

 

What do you mean, is he dead? 

Never heard of him, but am open to new teachings. 

[Hummin]

This is not just about music, it is a life experience 

 

I love the energy in his statement and can relate to other things in life

 

https://www.facebook.com/reel/5928685993916935?s=yWDuG2&fs=e

[Tippaporn]

1 hour ago, Neeranam said:

No, they don't, but apes do. 

Why wouldn't an insect have a soul?  What precludes them from having a soul?  What rationale do use base that conclusion on?  What assumptions are being made?  Which forms of life then get souls and which do not?  Given by whom?  Based on what criteria?  Criteria created by whom?  Are those criteria written down anywhere?  Or are they available in some other form or medium?  Ants are a consciousness, are they not?  What differentiates their consciousness from that of an ape?  Or a human?  Or any other life form?  What about plants?  Microbes?  Viruses?  Elephants?  Dogs?  Cats?  Which ones do or don't have a soul?

I'm not trying to embarrass you with these questions, Neeranam.  But if you do not have answers to them then you are merely expressing an unexamined belief.  My questions are geared towards examining that belief, putting it under a microscope so as to discern it's validity or not.

 

My answer is thus:  Ants are just another form which consciousness takes.  Like the form of an ape.  Or a man or woman.  Again, I wouldn't frame the question in terms of possession as possession implies something that is either to be had or outright owned and is also apart from one's self.  You are a soul.  I could copy and paste from some of my recent posts but it would be easier to ask you to read them.

[Woof999]

2 hours ago, Tippaporn said:

Science has created an enormous quandary for itself when it made the decision to ignore a good portion of reality.

Here you have made a personal belief and stated it as fact. Let me for now term that as a personal fact.

 

 

2 hours ago, Tippaporn said:

You come across as an ardent supporter of science in their dismissal of subjective reality

...and here you use that personal fact to help shape your opinion on someone who might not hold the same beliefs as you.

 

Science does not ignore anything. It seeks to find answers, but it seeks to find them within a framework that can be measured, tested, peer reviewed and found to provide consistent results. Right now it struggles (to say the least) to do that in areas that you might call spiritual, but there again perhaps it has not discovered the tools it needs to do that work. The atom was first hypothesised more than 2000 years ago and then proved around 200 years ago. Since then, through science, we've discovered the building blocks of the atom and then the building blocks of those building blocks.

 

It is thought that homo sapiens have existed for around 200,000 years. The idea of continental drift which led to the discovery of tectonic plates only cropped up around 100 years ago. So for 99.95% of the existence of man, we had no idea of the cause of one of nature's most destructive forces. For much of that time it was widely believe that it was (a) god's display of anger.

 

Science has led us to amazing new discoveries. it has changed our lives for the better (arguably) immeasurably just in the last 20 years, even in the last 5 years. It has led us down some false paths too, but it cannot tell lies for eternity because the very foundation of its framework would make that nigh on impossible. Sure some people in a position of power have used the discoveries of science for evil, but that does not make science wrong, or evil itself.

 

I honestly believe that many people who deem themselves to be spiritual have a total fear of science, lest one day science proves their whole belief system wrong. It might also prove it right, perhaps spot on.

 

TLDR; Embrace science as it might well deliver you the proof needed to convince the non-believers. If that's not something you feel you would ever need/want to do, then why discuss at all?

 

[Negita43]

On 4/14/2019 at 3:25 PM, ivor bigun said:

Do you really believe in him or any of the other Gods ?

If you do or don't the other question is:

Do you really believe in the institutions that claim to represent that entity (entity because I don't want to start a debate about the gender of a God).

I think religion has caused so much pain and sorrow and wars in the history of the world that we could well do without it.

But as Karl Marx once said it is "the opium of the people."

[Tippaporn]

1 hour ago, Neeranam said:

What do you mean, is he dead? 

Never heard of him, but am open to new teachings. 

To say that the dead are communicating to us earthlings is a bridge too far for some. 

But yes, it is as I stated it.  For those who do not believe that life continues on after our earthly demise, or that we were alive before we entered this world, then there would be no acceptance of Seth in that group.  For the belief that death is the end-all would make the existence of a Seth an impossibility.  In wish case Seth is only rubbish.  And perhaps rubbish of the worst kind as it would lead away from true answers, which can only be had using the scientific method.  Why, it may even lead to self delusion!

Now if one believes in life after death / before birth then it would only be logical that, well, if the deceased is no longer here then they must be elsewhere.  If they must be elsewhere then it would logically follow that here, then, is not the only here of existence.  And also, if continued existence is to be believed then again it would logically follow that consciousness is not dependent on form.  And if existence continues and that continued existence is not here then, again, speaking logically, there must exist a pathway for the dear departed to move themselves (not their physical possession, we know ) from here to wherever there is.  And if this move is not a physical one (again, all your money stays here . . . with your relatives - love 'em or not) then it is only logical that we are in truth formless creatures.  And if a pathway exists for us to move from here to there then what prevents someone from there coming to here?  Or communication from there to here?  And vice versa?

If pathways exist between our reality and another reality then that would open up questions regarding information.  Does information only exist in physical reality?  Or does it also exist in other realities?  And if it does exist in other realities then is there a flow of information unbeknownst to us that occurs regularly between realities?

Okay, so here is something to ponder then.  If the above is true - we survive death, other realities therefore exist, pathways therefore exist, and information naturally flows between realities, then it begs the question, regarding Seth, that if someone were to communicate back to us then what might they have to say?

These were questions I dealt with before I began reading what this someone, who calls himself Seth, might have to say.  And since I have a fondness of logical thought the possibility then occurred to me that if this someone, Seth, had a perspective borne out of a much greater awareness then the information he was passing on to those who would read his words would be a literal gold mine.  Especially for those seeking answers to the nature of ourselves and the nature of our reality.  Since there was no fear on my part of getting misled by a bunch of nonsense I thought, given the potential involved, it would certainly be worth the while to check it out.  Cost to me . . . the price of a book.  If it was all a bunch of nonsense then I wouldn't feel too bad about losing a few dollar investment.

Now far be it from me to try to twist anyone's mental arm to do or think anything other than what they want to do or think.  I am, though, aware that there are always those kindred souls out there who might be grateful for the suggestion.  Perhaps you.  Perhaps not.  But certainly only up to you.  In the meanwhile, all of my posts on this thread are based on the information Seth conveys.  If my posts come across to you as the incomprehensible ramblings of an idiotus stultus then stay away from Seth.  If my posts seem intriguing, or even sensible, then you might want to give Seth a read.

[Neeranam]

Interesting. 

 

This is what I believe happens when we leave out body -  we go to a 'soul world' then come back again in a different body. 

 

https://www.google.com/search?q=BKWSU+VOYAGERS&rlz=1C1UEAD_enTH934TH934&oq=BKWSU+VOYAGERS&aqs=chrome..69i57j33i160.4830j0j4&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8#fpstate=ive&vld=cid:25db7acd,vid:6yalpsBtOrQ

[Neeranam]

1 hour ago, Tippaporn said:

I'm not trying to embarrass you with these questions, Neeranam. 

huh?

[Sunmaster]

4 hours ago, Hummin said:

I can always trust you as my wing man even we agree or not.

No problem ????

 

I used to take things personal in the past, which resulted in pretty heated debates. Nowadays, I feel I'm not so emotionally attached to the ideas presented here. I simply enjoy the exchange of ideas for the sake of learning. 

If someone tries to troll though, they can do so but without me. I will not engage. Makes my life much more peaceful. 

[Hummin]

10 minutes ago, Sunmaster said:

No problem ????

 

I used to take things personal in the past, which resulted in pretty heated debates. Nowadays, I feel I'm not so emotionally attached to the ideas presented here. I simply enjoy the exchange of ideas for the sake of learning. 

If someone tries to troll though, they can do so but without me. I will not engage. Makes my life much more peaceful. 

It is not a competition, it is and should be an exchanged in experience, knownledge, felt truth as known truths. 

 

After all we are each and one of just passengers in our own life with multiple options of new directions you/we want to take. 

 

Passengers nothing more nothing less 

[Tippaporn]

3 hours ago, Hummin said:

You obviously jumping on the defence before you read my lines. 

 

Do you have any idea, or can you think of reasons why solar storms theory can stop a hearth? 

Wrong.

From that tweet we can see that almost anything can stop a heart.  I'd love to see a study on how many hearts are stopped every year due to breakups in relationships.  What's the ultimate point, though?  If it's to protect against heart attacks during solar flares/storms should we institute public solar flare or solar storm health warnings?  Warning:  Remain inside for the duration of this solar event.  Only go out with proper protection?  I guess more than a mask would be required?

And what about masks?  Do they really protect against Covid?  Science speaks out of both sides of it's mouth on that one.  Which is the real science?

As you say, too, it's only a "solar storms theory."  Is it theory or fact?  How was the study designed?   Were there human trials?  Are there any deaths which are positively confirmed to be caused by a solar storm?  I'd ask a whole lot more questions than you seem to be asking.  Are you asking any questions or is it that there's a modicum of rationale to the theory and since it's Scientific (capital "S") then sure, you've gotta believe it.  Makes perfect sense, right?

Now I could say that nobody dies unless they're ready and every death could technically be considered a suicide since death is always chosen and never forced unto anyone by any other power.  I could even go into great detail using rationale and logic in my explanations of why those statements are true.  But I don't get a sense that we could ever get to be on the same page with those types of ideas.

What can I say, Hummin?  If that's what you want to believe then you don't need my blessings nor approvals.  Believe it.

[Hummin]

Just now, Tippaporn said:

Wrong.

From that tweet we can see that almost anything can stop a heart.  I'd love to see a study on how many hearts are stopped every year due to breakups in relationships.  What's the ultimate point, though?  If it's to protect against heart attacks during solar flares/storms should we institute public solar flare or solar storm health warnings?  Warning:  Remain inside for the duration of this solar event.  Only go out with proper protection?  I guess more than a mask would be required?

And what about masks?  Do they really protect against Covid?  Science speaks out of both sides of it's mouth on that one.  Which is the real science?

As you say, too, it's only a "solar storms theory."  Is it theory or fact?  How was the study designed?   Were there human trials?  Are there any deaths which are positively confirmed to be caused by a solar storm?  I'd ask a whole lot more questions than you seem to be asking.  Are you asking any questions or is it that there's a modicum of rationale to the theory and since it's Scientific (capital "S") then sure, you've gotta believe it.  Makes perfect sense, right?

Now I could say that nobody dies unless they're ready and every death could technically be considered a suicide since death is always chosen and never forced unto anyone by any other power.  I could even go into great detail using rationale and logic in my explanations of why those statements are true.  But I don't get a sense that we could ever get to be on the same page with those types of ideas.

What can I say, Hummin?  If that's what you want to believe then you don't need my blessings nor approvals.  Believe it.

You are really blowing this out of proportion, and it is new to me. But just immediately I could reason why it is a theoretical possibility, as well when I read the science behind it, I still see it as an possibility, but needs further proves. 

 

Im  not sure what you reading or how you understand the real project behind the evidences, but I read only there is a possible connection, not any absolute science proof. Popular science magazines or tabloid newspapers, might word their headings and introduction to sound like solid evidences found in connection to hearth attacks.

 

I do not see any controversy by keep an open mind, after all it is electricity impulses. After all reckon everything you want us to believe, this is the least magical incidence I can think of, that can influence our lives here on earth in more ways than we want to believe.

[Tippaporn]

35 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

huh?

People will make statements as fact here.  I tend to ask a lot of questions if I don't agree with someone's statement of fact.  The questions are meant to bring out the logical flaws in the statement as I see them.  Some take that questioning as an attempt to make them look stupid and to deliberately embarrass them.  Not knowing you other than seeing you around this site I didn't want my questioning to be misinterpreted in that way by you.  So I flat out stated it to preempt any misinterpretation on your part.

I guess my intention didn't work out as planned.  I admit I had reservations when I worded it but concluded it was worded well enough.  Utter fail, huh?     

No offense meant, Neeranam. 

[Hummin]

32 minutes ago, Tippaporn said:

People will make statements as fact here.  I tend to ask a lot of questions if I don't agree with someone's statement of fact.  The questions are meant to bring out the logical flaws in the statement as I see them.  Some take that questioning as an attempt to make them look stupid and to deliberately embarrass them.  Not knowing you other than seeing you around this site I didn't want my questioning to be misinterpreted in that way by you.  So I flat out stated it to preempt any misinterpretation on your part.

I guess my intention didn't work out as planned.  I admit I had reservations when I worded it but concluded it was worded well enough.  Utter fail, huh?     

No offense meant, Neeranam. 

????

Edited March 2, 2023 by Hummin