Our first traffic accident, just what is the law?

[Orton Rd]

Mrs is a careful driver indicating right into our soi heading to the village, nothing on coming, does not see anything behind, whack as the car turns into the other lane. Bike hit us square on and it was right over in the gutter, not in the middle of the road. I thought he was in the wrong, no according to the cop who turned up and later at the station a bike has the right to travel on the wrong side of the road! and speeding it looked like.

The bike driver said he was trying to overtake us but we cut him up. We were deemed guilty of careless driving, I objected and was told it was either that or court. We had to fork out for a 'mechanic' to turn up and access damage to car and bike, insurance man was not enough. That was 3k and took 10 minutes, only body work on the car. Never heard of this before, could that be a split with the cops?

There is still a fine to pay for the careless driving the amount seems to depend on the seriousness of the riders injuries, broken nose and jaw. Anyone know what the fine is likely to add up to and can we do anything if it's outrageous?

I did ask if they tested the rider for drink, no they only check the guilty party, why did they not test the Mrs then? Whole farce has taken all afternoon. I did point out if the rider was in the right to travel at speed down the wrong side of the road that this sort of dangerous right contributes to being the number one bike deaths in the world, water off a ducks back of course. I'm only surprised seeing the stupidity on the roads here daily that nobody has hit us before.

[champers]

Sounds like one look at falang and it's ...... kerrching time. Rules made up as they go along. Good luck.

[smutcakes]

In all my years reading Thai Visa i have never once ever seen an expat admit fault in any scenario, its always a scam, the Thais were always wrong etc etc.

 

Maybe the bike was on the main road with right of way. Small village roads dont really have left or right, car pulls out into the motorbike who has right of way.....

[Orton Rd]

Not a main road, how could he have right of way driving down the wrong lane? This road has two lanes and they drive on the left, not the right. Not a village road.

[Orton Rd]

7 minutes ago, champers said:

Sounds like one look at falang and it's ...... kerrching time. Rules made up as they go along. Good luck.

Local Thai friend got stung with the 3k inspection recently at the same Station, so nothing to do with me, I was not driving and it's not my car anyway.

[mike787]

Sadly, this is life in the LOS.  The cost of doing business (living) here.  I don't like it.  But it's "reality". Some who read my comment are shocked and surprised....that is called denial.  Get the brown envelope out, make sure it's a thick one.  Hope you have many more envelopes, you will need them.

Edited April 19, 2019 by mike787

[evadgib]

Front and rear dashcams plus 1st class insurance usually work out cheaper in the long run along with a body worn camera for when plod ties this lark on.

HTH

Edited April 19, 2019 by evadgib

[champers]

2 minutes ago, Orton Rd said:

Local Thai friend got stung with the 3k inspection recently at the same Station, so nothing to do with me, I was not driving and it's not my car anyway.

You said in your OP that you had never heard of a 3K charge before, 20 minutes later you have. I'm confused, so I'll leave it at that. 

[Orton Rd]

The Mrs just told me about it, she phoned her mate up who's a bit of a face around here, even he got done

[KiChakayan]

Sadly no one can expect a Thai to understand that he or she isn't allowed to overtake a vehicle that's slowing down while indicating right. Even with a rear cam you'd need a flight recorder to prove that you've indicated before turning. And with a farang opening his mouth all is lost anyhow. TIT

[CharlieH]

 Had exactly the same issue a few months back, father in law, stationary waiting to turn right, turns then bang, motorcycle hit the car right in the centre of the vehicle, the car was at right angle when hit, the mototrcycle was too fast and the skid marks showed he was on the wrong side of the road. Father in law paid ZERO and the guy who bike was totalled and had no plates or insurance etc, had to pay for his own hospital bill. 

[Orton Rd]

Same here right angles and hit the centre of the car.

[GinBoy2]

It's a bit of impossible question. There is no law!

 

Outside of Bangkok, which is crazy enough in itself, we all know Thai's drive on the left, except if driving on the right gets you somewhere quicker.

Stick on the hazard flashers, and you are good to go!

Every morning on my way to the gym driving by a few factories, the motorbikes, rather than go to the next U turn, went across the divider, and drove on the right(wrong) side of the road to get to work.

So you also have the hazard when you are on the left, having swarms of motorbikes, crossing over the lanes in front of you to get to the right hand lanes.

It's all lunacy

[Orton Rd]

Yes lunacy it is, we have been lucky to go 7 years without somebody hitting us. Local traffic lights at a junction give me the horrors. Constant u turn straight into the junction so one big mele, and when on red the same except those in the left lane can go straight on anyway. Lights are more for decoration.

[CharlieH]

 I think this scenario is generally from travelling too fast and cannot stop n time, therefore they go around rather than run up the back head-on so to speak.

 

Had a young lad killed a few days ago, ran up the back end, but it was a tractor with plough on the back, 8pm NO LIGHTS or markers on the tractor. Typical of rural Thailand, sadly.

 

 

[richard_smith237]

If I'm not mistaken, your Wife was turning right. 

A motorbike was either traveling in the wrong lane on the right right (against traffic), or was over taking. 

 

Either way - You are not in the wrong. 

 

The Policeman said 'or go to court' to pressure you into taking the blame, path of least resistance for all concerns. The Policeman is not privy to the traffic laws, the are nothing more than laymen in uniform and for some reason we believe their decisions. 

Your answer should have been "OK - Court is fine with me !"....

 

Exactly the same thing happened to me years ago, I was turning right, a van hit me. Police told me it was my fault. I refused and accepted the "lets go to court" I said I'd be happy to take this as far as it goes. Some fat guy comes in to the station gives the Police a Brown Envelope (the van that hit me is an illegal Minivan for city transport). I still refuse to accept blame - I stay Polite, but firm and unfaltering. The issue is pushed up to another police station (Traffic Police head office). They take a look at my Vehicle and the other Van and photos and deem it 50/50 because the other van doesn't have any insurance and its just easier for me that way. 

 

So... I didn't exactly win, but I didn't lose. 

 

In short - Stay calm, stay firm, stand your ground...  The Police will usually try the quickest and easiest solution to make the issue go away as quickly as possible - this has traditionally been 'blame the car driver' because the car driver is usually insured and has money whereas the motorcycle doesn't. BUT, if you stand firm the BiB have to get creative or accept reality that it's the bike who made the mistake and he'l have to pay for his own damage. 

 

[Orton Rd]

Just remembered bf of Mrs cousin killed on a bike not long ago. No light but that was OK he was using the light on his phone! no helmet and very likely drunk, hit by an overtaking lorry. Lorry probably did not see him but he got the blame.

[richard_smith237]

1 hour ago, Orton Rd said:

There is still a fine to pay for the careless driving the amount seems to depend on the seriousness of the riders injuries, broken nose and jaw. Anyone know what the fine is likely to add up to and can we do anything if it's outrageous?

 

Reject this.. They can't prove careless driving. Your missus was turning right and the Motorcycle was either driving the wrong way down the road or overtaking - The motorcycle was the careless driver. 

Tell them you are prepared to go to court and will get a lawyer involved - this charge will go away. 

(do this politely). 

[BritManToo]

1 hour ago, Orton Rd said:

I thought he was in the wrong, no according to the cop who turned up and later at the station a bike has the right to travel on the wrong side of the road! and speeding it looked like.

Straight ahead has right of way in Thailand, if turning you have to give way to everyone on either side of you.

Policeman was right, you were at fault as you were turning.

[manchega]

best thing to do is to feign ignorance/stupidity

do the wai do the big smiles and drive off with big smile

 

why not ? its what the locals would do, unless you think you should be here educating the cretins

[MeePeeMai]

Let your insurance company sort out the damages and injuries (assuming you have more than compulsory insurance on the vehicle).  They might not pay any "careless driving" fine but they will certainly pay for any damages and injuries.

 

A good Tier 1 policy is a must here in Thailand if you ask me.  Mine includes up to 200,000 baht for bail money if you are arrested for something and bail is required.

 

I also agree that it would be deemed your fault (here in Thailand) as you must make sure your actions do not impede anyone on a motorbike or otherwise (look over your shoulder and proceed only when safe to do so).  

 

If you were in the USA, it would be primarily the bikes fault (but the insurance companies would still haggle over a "percentage" of fault for both driver's and then split the bills between the two insurance companies).

[tifino]

13 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Straight ahead has right of way in Thailand, if turning you have to give way to everyorough' thing also goes for roundabouts!ne on either side of you.

Policeman was right, you were at fault as you were turning.

... and sad to say that the 'straight through' thing 'definitely' also goes for Roundabouts! how many times that one sees all thes vehicles sitting inside the roundabout to ,say, go Right - and the vehicles all coming from his left steam on through...  

i have been back to same ones, and checked to, and found all the painted lines are all there for stating priority... but all ignored.

Edited April 19, 2019 by tifino

[thequietman]

12 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Straight ahead has right of way in Thailand, if turning you have to give way to everyone on either side of you.

Policeman was right, you were at fault as you were turning.

OK, then explain please why vehicles coming out of side streets have right of way?

 

Surely, if straight ahead has the right of way, then the former rule is mute! .... or did you just make your rule up? ????

[GinBoy2]

26 minutes ago, CharlieH said:

 I think this scenario is generally travelling too fast and cannot stop, therefore they go around rather than run up the back head-on so to speak.

 

Had a young lad killed a few days ago, ran up the back end, but it was a tractor with plough on the back, 8pm NO LIGHTs or markers on the tractor. Typical of rural Thailand, sadly.

 

 

Lights have always been a mystery to me.

 

Thailand seems to have a special brand of motorbike rear light bulbs, since 50% of them seem to not work!

[BritManToo]

4 minutes ago, thequietman said:

OK, then explain please why vehicles coming out of side streets have right of way?

 

Surely, if straight ahead has the right of way, then the former rule is mute! .... or did you just make your rule up? ????

Left hand side is considered a bicycle/motorcycle lane, cars shouldn't be driving there.

So if a m/c pulls out into it and you are driving your car in it, again you are in the wrong.

 

Rules are perfectly understandable but different to the west (except France which has similar rules to Thailand).

I don't drive very fast and look around me before manoeuvring, I can understand & live with their rules.

Edited April 19, 2019 by BritManToo

[taninthai]

You mentioned there was a insurance guy there ,they normally sort it all out ,if that was your insurance guy I would be having serious words with the insurance company.

[fishtank]

1 hour ago, smutcakes said:

In all my years reading Thai Visa i have never once ever seen an expat admit fault in any scenario, its always a scam, the Thais were always wrong etc etc.

 

 

That is because the Thais usually are always wrong.

[MeePeeMai]

1 minute ago, fishtank said:

usually are always wrong.

Correct

[moe666]

Well it doesn't always go aganist the farang I know two farangs who have killed Thais in accident and both were found not at fault. And this was not in Bangkok, they both had car cams.

[Traubert]

2 hours ago, evadgib said:

Front and rear dashcams plus 1st class insurance usually work out cheaper in the long run along with a body worn camera for when plod ties this lark on.

HTH

All well and good but who are you going to show the footage to?