Mandatory health insurance for non-immigrant O-A retirement visa holders likely to take effect in July

[giddyup]

1 hour ago, johnny49r said:

Hospitals and clinics don't require identification or proof of insurance to be admitted. Upon being discharged, hospitals rely on the patients honesty for payment. Changing visa requirements won't change the fact that the medical industry doesn't enforce payment and payment abuses will likely continue because the officials aren't addressing the root problem.

 

They do require some money up front though. At least Bangkok/Pattaya hospital did prior to my gallbladder surgery, and the balance was paid before I was discharged.

[Gecko123]

1 hour ago, Estrada said:

O-A is not a tourist Visa and is issued outside of Thailand. You need this long stay visa if you intend to stay here on the basis of retirement. Non-O Retirement is the only visa issued in Country. 

If an O-A visa is a long stay retirement visa issued outside of Thailand and medical insurance is now required for this visa, what possible basis is there for hoping that the medical insurance requirement will not soon be required for all retirement (and possibly all long-stay) type visas? I can't see any cause for hope. Am I missing something?

[Peterw42]

5 minutes ago, monkfish said:

So when you get run over by drunk that insurance is going to cover the hospital bill right?

Sent from my ASUS_Z01BDB using Tapatalk
 

Yes it does, the vehicle carries compulsory insurance irrespective of license, drunk etc.

You will find its the same in your home country, 3rd party person insurance is compulsory and it doesnt matter if a drunk unlicensed driver steals your car and runs someone over, the insurance still pays out.

Edited May 16, 2019 by Peterw42

[garzhe]

12 hours ago, Pattaya46 said:

I struggle to understand all the figures given in this article ??

Mainly:

Surely that is fully incorrect. I would bet tens or hundreds thousands at max, no?

Cant be correct. If that's just OA visas, add to that figure the Non O, B and ED visas then there must be more foreigners here than Thais.

[theboogeyman]

“The requirement was introduced because foreign expats have piled up unpaid medical bills of more than Bt300 million since 2016.“ How is that possible?  I go to the hospital all the time and you can’t check out without first settling the bill one way or the other.

 

Both my wife and I were both in the hospital last night because it looks like we both have the flu or influenza.  It’s really bad so bad that we went through 6 days of Codepect (Codeine) in one night last night.  But we still have plenty of antibiotics and other medications left over.  They also put some Brown Mixture in there too which contains Opium personally I think Brown Mixture sucks and is useless you can get it over the counter.  Although that Codeine works like a charm but even that’s only temporary.  I guess just continue taking the antibiotics, drink a lot of water, and rest.  If we’re still feeling like crap tomorrow I might go back to the hospital and ask for more Codeine.  Honestly for me it takes more than just one 10 milligram codeine tablet to make a difference.  I have a tolerance to that stuff.  I don’t know it might be slowly getting better now because waking up this morning wasn’t as painful as yesterday morning.  

 

Anyway when you're in any Thai hospital you can’t even pick up your medication until after you’ve settled the bill so I truly don’t understand how this is possible.  

 

This is what I was talking about in another topic about foreigners paying their bills here.  As a foreigner here in Thailand if you’re a deadbeat foreigner who refuses to pay your bills this is what happens you can potentially screw it up for everyone else.  

 

Luckily though this doesn’t effect me because I’m retired here at 45 years old on a marriage visa extension for the last 5 years.  And since I’m retired military and a 100% disabled veteran I have free healthcare insurance so this will never effect me.  But those of you who refuse to pay your bills you’re just screwing it up for everyone else that’s why they are making rules like this and this is probably just the beginning.  Now I see why they started actually enforcing the income verification rules to get rid of as many of the deadbeat foreigners as they can.  

[Xonax]

If you didn´t know better, you could be led to believe that Thailand, with this mandatory health insurance, are now trying to pull the Biggest Scam ever on foreigners.

305 Million Baht in unpaid debt to private hospitals:

With 316 private and 1002 government hospitals in Thailand, this is a whopping loss of 231,411 Baht per hospital.

With foreigners making 3.3 Million visits to hospitals, that is less than a 100 Baht loss per foreigner per visit. I assume that is by far less, than what the hospitals already overcharge foreigners seeking medical care. Not to mention what they are making by selling us unnecessary scans, tests, treatments and medicine. 

If these losses are a huge problem for the hospitals, why not just implement a 100 Baht tax for all foreigners on each hospital visit, to cover the losses?  Instead the government are now forcing 80,950 expats over 50 to buy mandatory health insurance, which will probably cost at least 25,000 Baht per person per year, which will totally amount to 2,023,750,000 Baht (more than 2 Billion Baht) or 6.6 times the amount of the unpaid debt.

One could even start to wonder, who will benefit most from this insane idea. Who are the actual owners of the insurance companies, that will be approved to sell these insurances??

Edited May 16, 2019 by Xonax

[oneton]

Regarding the 38.3 Million misquote in the article, this is the total number of tourists who visited in 2018. I cannot believe they are all on OA visas !!!

 

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-01-28/thailand-expects-a-record-41-1-million-foreign-tourists-in-2019

 

Which leads me to assume that the hundreds of millions of Baht of losses quoted  are for all tourist and expat visitors. 

 

Edited May 16, 2019 by oneton
Added

[Grusa]

12 hours ago, Pattaya46 said:

I struggle to understand all the figures given in this article ??

Mainly:

Surely that is fully incorrect. I would bet tens or hundreds thousands at max, no?

That's enough to vote in a majority government!

[pmarlin]

1 hour ago, joevanwyck said:

I am also on Tricare. Which international hospitals are you referring too? Thanks, Joe.

http://www.tricare-overseas.com/beneficiaries/resources/provider-search/search-results?region=PAC&country=Thailand&location=TOP Remote - Bangkok%2C Thailand&radius=any&units=1&searchBy=location

[Uptooyoo]

41 minutes ago, redwhiteandblue said:

What is the source of these figures.  They are not in the original article.

The population of Thailand is 69 million. It seems half the people walking around Thailand are O-A Visa holders. Seems the numbers are BS.

[dick dasterdly]

20 minutes ago, userabcd said:

Certainly not a good deal if one is of a certain age and has several preconditions, it will be just paying an insurance company money for no benefit.

Exactly.

 

I have a few pre-existing conditions that whilst not life-threatening, can (and no doubt will....) be blamed for any and all future medical problems.  (Insulin resistant, under-active thyroid, osteoporosis, IBS etc.)

 

So buying health insurance would not only be very expensive, but also a waste of money ☹️.

 

 

[Kwasaki]

12 hours ago, snoop1130 said:

Foreigners in 2017 left Bt346 million in unpaid medical bills. If categorized by the number of medical visits, statistics show about one-fifth of foreign patients did not pay their bills. 

How do foreigners get away with not paying when they take all your details when entering the hospital or during the stay.

 

I doubt if they go about checking the hospitals records to see if they being falsified either. 

[Olmate]

5 minutes ago, theboogeyman said:

“The requirement was introduced because foreign expats have piled up unpaid medical bills of more than Bt300 million since 2016.“ How is that possible?  I go to the hospital all the time and you can’t check out without first settling the bill one way or the other.

 

Both my wife and I were both in the hospital last night because it looks like we both have the flu or influenza.  It’s really bad so bad that we went through 6 days of Codepect (Codeine) in one night last night.  But we still have plenty of antibiotics and other medications left over.  They also put some Brown Mixture in there too which contains Opium personally I think Brown Mixture sucks and is useless you can get it over the counter.  Although that Codeine works like a charm but even that’s only temporary.  I guess just continue taking the antibiotics, drink a lot of water, and rest.  If we’re still feeling like crap tomorrow I might go back to the hospital and ask for more Codeine.  Honestly for me it takes more than just one 10 milligram codeine tablet to make a difference.  I have a tolerance to that stuff.  I don’t know it might be slowly getting better now because waking up this morning wasn’t as painful as yesterday morning.  

 

Anyway when you're in any Thai hospital you can’t even pick up your medication until after you’ve settled the bill so I truly don’t understand how this is possible.  

 

This is what I was talking about in another topic about foreigners paying their bills here.  As a foreigner here in Thailand if you’re a deadbeat foreigner who refuses to pay your bills this is what happens you can potentially screw it up for everyone else.  

 

Luckily though this doesn’t effect me because I’m retired here at 45 years old on a marriage visa extension for the last 5 years.  And since I’m retired military and a 100% disabled veteran I have free healthcare insurance so this will never effect me.  But those of you who refuse to pay your bills you’re just screwing it up for everyone else that’s why they are making rules like this and this is probably just the beginning.  Now I see why they started actually enforcing the income verification rules to get rid of as many of the deadbeat foreigners as they can.  

Tell us how many dead beat foreigners you know? I don,t know one!

[Rockhopper]

All the figures in this article are FAKE NEWS. None of them add up.

[lamyai3]

1 hour ago, ivor bigun said:

They got Dianne Abbott to do the figures (uk guys will know what i mean) 

I was very tempted to write the same thing ????

[Odisan]

2 hours ago, pollyog said:

Why oh why can't they offer a sensible alternative to those of us who have self-funded in the past and would prefer to do so, by enforcing another bank account holding with 500,000 ThB per person - more than the stupid compulsory insurance level - that can only be used for medical treatment.  Since 400K insurance wouldn't cover much in the event of a really serious problem and we'd have to pay the rest ourselves anyway, this would make a lot of sense. 

Stupidly, I always thought this was what the 800k/400k in the account was for. You know, the 'You can retire in Thailand but don't get ill even once and dip into it or you'll then force us to kick you out-fund.'

[garzhe]

These figures are nonsensical. Government hospitals do not record that much information. I've registered at 3 hospitals one with just my pink ID card. As for 35 million on one Visa type does The Nation actually believe that without checking with the authorities.

[Peterw42]

2 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

How do foreigners get away with not paying when they take all your details when entering the hospital or during the stay.

 

I doubt if they go about checking the hospitals records to see if they being falsified either. 

I think a lot of the unpaid would probably be the results of disputes or ongoing legal fights etc. If you end up with a big hospital bill due to someone else's negligence, you will probably point the finger and tell the hospital to chase the other guy for payment etc. Your lawyer agrees to pay the hospital but only after he has sued the other guy etc.

[ChipButty]

Without reading all the post do these figures relate to the private hospitals or government hospitals? Would they know what age group do these bad debts relate to?

I have just spent the last 5 days going to Phuket International Hospital and there's a bill waiting for me everyday how does it happen people just do a runner?

[theboogeyman]

How do foreigners get away with not paying when they take all your details when entering the hospital or during the stay.
 
I doubt if they go about checking the hospitals records to see if they being falsified either. 

No actually the hospital copies your name and passport number. I have to show them a picture of my passport on my iPhone every time I go. They keep very good records so I truly don’t understand how people even leave the hospital without settling the bill. If you were to just walk out without paying the hospital bill they’ll call the cops on you. So I don’t get how it’s even possible to accumulate that much debt from deadbeats who refuse to pay their hospital bills thereby making harder for the rest of us who do pay our bills.


Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[Booboo101]

What a load of crap !

that means more than half of the population of Thailand are O/A visa holders .........I’d be surprised if there is even one million 0/A visa holders living here.

 

looks like the figures were provided by the same people who provide the ever expanding tourist numbers !

[randy723]

why not ALL people with a OA visa not just the ones over 50 because the young people are the ones who most need it because they leave their brain at home when they come here and are the one that have most of the accident and need the medical care.

[holy cow cm]

1 hour ago, smedly said:

very sensible and same as charging all visitors a nominal fee but it doesn't address the real issue 

 

Who is primarily behind these insurance companies and hospitals and is set to make a pile of money !!!!!!

 

When I see changes in Thailand especially when it involves foreigners there is only one common purpose - Money, someone with influence will be making a load of it

 

Money Number 1

Yeah, but sensible would have to be thrown in their faces and hit them on the noses to budge, then they will claim it is an attack against Thai institutions which is a matter of National Security.

 

I had posted a comment that is probably Generals behind it sitting as the CEO or on the BOD. Almost every large big company or corporation has a General or two or three on it it seems

 

 

[Eggerlegger]

https://www.ttrweekly.com/site/2019/05/hefty-insurance-hovers-over-thai-visa/

 

The new requirement will apply to foreigners, 50 years or more, who enter the country on a non-immigrant visa (O-A), which is valid for a year and can be renewed annually at cost or THB5,000. Employment is strictly prohibited on this visa. It should not be confused with the one-year visa extension offered to retirees already in the country. The non-immigrant O-A visa is only issued by Thai consulates or embassies overseas.

 

Foreigners in the 50 to 55 age bracket will pay a premium of around THB46,000 a year if they use a Thai insurance company recognised by the government.  Once the retiree reaches 70 the annual premium shoots up to as high as THB107,000 (quotes vary between the eight registered companies listed on longstay.tgia.org).

Foreigners over the age of 70 will find it difficult to secure adequate insurance cover, or it will be prohibitively expensive, which could result in fewer retiree traveller in that age group entering the country on this particular visa. One company quoted an annual premium of THB81,000 for 70-year olds, but for the 75 and over age bracket, the cover was only for customer renewing and not for new accounts.

Others may have health issues that make it prohibitively tricky or too expensive to secure insurance.  They may have to provide a much higher bank deposit that the standard THB800,000 required as a guarantee for the long-stay retiree visa application

 

 

 

 

[INV]

2 hours ago, Peterw42 said:

You can take Indonesia and Vietnam off the list as they both have compulsory insurance for expats.

Can you please show some government information where it says that? I talked with few friends live there and also checked in a forum, NO compulsory insurance in Vietnam but please share if you have more information about this

[khunbillmex]

13 hours ago, snoop1130 said:

2018

 

Non-immigrant (O-A) visa holders: 38 million 

Number of medical visits by them: 3.42 million

Number of unpaid medical bills: 680,000

Number of long-stay expats seeking medical services: 80,950

Outstanding debt: Bt305 million

Thailand Population (2019) - Worldometers
[Search domain www.worldometers.info/world-population/thailand-population/] www.worldometers.info/world-population/thailand-population/
The current population of Thailand is 69,287,199 as of Monday, May 6, 2019, based on the latest United Nations estimates.

 

So 55% of the population of Thailand is comprised of "Non-immigrant (O-A) visa holders: 38 million "?

The number of unpaid medical bills = 680,000 to the tune of THB 305,000,000 or THB 448 per bill ?   Certainly the hospitals can make that up through their extortionate pharmacy charges.

[mike787]

5 minutes ago, Eggerlegger said:

The new requirement

....YES!  The NEW requirement...wait for it...there will be another one soon that will effect ALL foreigners and Visas..foolish to think somehow this will not expand.  Come on....it started with the Visa, now this... 

[Peterw42]

2 minutes ago, INV said:

Can you please show some government information where it says that? I talked with few friends live there and also checked in a forum, NO compulsory insurance in Vietnam but please share if you have more information about this

Its a bit off topic but here is a statement copied from this page https://www.expatassure.com/vietnam/

 

Expatriates must contribute to the compulsory health insurance, but as will be explained in the following paragraph, this is often not enough and many expatriates choose to subscribe to a private medical insurance in Vietnam.

[totally thaied up]

36 minutes ago, oneton said:

Which leads me to assume that the hundreds of millions of Baht of losses quoted  are for all tourist and expat visitors.

I believe this to be so as well. I think everyone is lumped into this figure hence the reason I can see this requirement at a later date spilling over to all retirement visa/extensions/marriage. More so tourist losses than retirees.

Edited May 16, 2019 by totally thaied up

[micmichd]

27 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said:

Exactly.

 

I have a few pre-existing conditions that whilst not life-threatening, can (and no doubt will....) be blamed for any and all future medical problems.  (Insulin resistant, under-active thyroid, osteoporosis, IBS etc.)

 

So buying health insurance would not only be very expensive, but also a waste of money ☹️.

 

 

I have no pre-existing conditions at all. I was actually never really sick in my life except for some accidents. And I have an accident insurance. 

Why should I mess around with expensive private health insurances that will probably never pay anything voluntarily?