Cash Advance/Counter Withdrawal: My Experience at Bangkok Bank

[djeetyet]

Here's my story for transferring funds from America to Thailand. Last week I went to a brick-and-mortar Bangkok Bank branch in Chanthaburi province where I've had an account for many years (though I don't believe this matters). Brought my brokerage account (Ameritrade) debit card and a piece of paper where I'd written down, in English, counter withdrawal / cash advance and that I did NOT want Dynamic Currency Conversion (DCC). They didn’t seem to understand “counter withdrawal”, but knew “cash advance”. They had NO idea what DCC meant, so I just went with it. I was asked for my passport, which they photocopied and I signed - I was not asked for my PIN number. A few minutes later I received a long narrow receipt, and did not see anything about DCC or VISA exchange rate. Then I received a BKK bank "Credit Note/Receipt Set" form where it stated “VISA cash advance” - again I didn’t see anything about DCC. I requested / received 30,000 Thai Baht cash in a manner of about 5 minutes. I asked what was Bangkok Bank's maximum allowable amount for a cash advance, and they didn't know. They simply suggested next time I get more. Smart! I was charged NO Bangkok Bank commission.
 
When I got home and checked the exchange rate from Yahoo and Reuters was 30.30 Baht to the U$ dollar. Two working days later - yes, as others have noted it takes a few days to clear - my brokerage account was debited $992 for an effective rate of 30.24 (30000/992). The transaction description was "Debit Cards (against Brokerage Account)". This method worked for me, was very quick and easy, and it seems I received a workable, though maybe not the highest, exchange rate. YMMV!

 

NOTE: As others have stressed in previous threads - if you use this method you MUST check to see what fees apply with your specific debit card. Many banks charge outrageous fees for this kind of transaction. Be forewarned. 
 

[JimGant]

5 hours ago, djeetyet said:

it seems I received a workable, though maybe not the highest, exchange rate. YMMV!

You should have received Visa's rate for the date the transaction was processed. Visa's rate last Friday (1/10) was 30.24. Looks like that's the date your transaction processed, as the Visa rate was 30.23 on Thursday. Anyway, it's a competitive rate -- normally several satang above the TT buying rate you'd get with a wire transfer.

[djeetyet]

Jim - Where do you find the Visa rate?

 

Thanks

[Pib]

It's a great way to get funds "immediately" if you have a no foreign transaction fee debit card.  I've been doing it for years at Bangkok Bank and Krungsri Bank....it's my primary way of getting cash from the US.  

 

Some Thai banks may charge approx a Bt200 fee for a cash advance....and some may attempt a DCC transaction...I think SCB is known for attempting a DCC transaction.  As long as your receipt for signature reflect only Thai baht it not a DCC transaction....if you see just your home country currency like USD or your home country currency and baht then it's a DCC transaction.  Just say no to DCC.  

 

And don't feel sorry for the Thai bank if not charging you a fee because they are still getting an "interchange" fee of  from your card-issuing bank.    For the OP's Bt30K withdrawal the Bangkok Bank branch earned approx a Bt152 interchange fee (that fee is purely between the two banks)....see the Visa manual cash disbursement fee for an international cash disbursement which is basically $1.75 plus 0.33% of amount disbursed.

 

But getting a cash advance is pretty much as simply as using your card to pay for something at Lotus/Big C....tell the bank teller how much you want (be sure to stay within the limit allowed per day/transaction by your card issuing bank)....sign the receipt....done.  And of course the teller will make a copy of your passport.

 

 

[Pib]

Visa Exchange Rate Webpage

https://usa.visa.com/support/consumer/travel-support/exchange-rate-calculator.html

 

Mastercard Exchange Rate Webpage

https://www.mastercard.us/en-us/consumers/get-support/convert-currency.html

[moontang]

capitalone360..samesame..no BS, no PIN...still many of them at least act like they dont know what you are talking about.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

9 hours ago, djeetyet said:

A few minutes later I received a long narrow receipt, and did not see anything about DCC or VISA exchange rate. Then I received a BKK bank "Credit Note/Receipt Set" form where it stated “VISA cash advance” - again I didn’t see anything about DCC.

 

The way you can know whether any bank or retailer is trying to do a DCC transaction with your card is EASY -- it's whether the receipt they give you to sign lists the amount of your withdrawal/purchase anywhere in USD, as Pib recounted above.  If you see an amount listed in USD, don't sign the slip and don't proceed with the transaction.

 

On the other hand, if the card slip ONLY shows your withdrawal/purchase amount in THB, then you can know it's a normal transaction and you're not being DCC'd.

 

Also, you can always tell the cashier/teller in advance, that you want the transaction done in Thai baht, and not in USD. And most of the time, they seem to understand that...even if they don't know DCC.

 

Edited January 14, 2020 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[OneZero]

Does anybody have experience/know if this can be done with a USAA debit card?

[Pib]

1 minute ago, OneZero said:

Does anybody have experience/know if this can be done with a USAA debit card?

Doesn't matter which bank your debit card is from....you just need to be sure not to exceed your bank's daily per day/transaction limit for the card.   On your USAA ibanking you can check your card's limit...or email/call them to ask.  It's probably going to be around $600/day/transaction.  And keep in mind the USAA debit card has a 1% foreign transaction fee.

[OneZero]

Thanks Pib

[moontang]

I believe there is a difference in the counter limit and the ATM limit...counter is going to be like making a debit card purchase...without the PIN.  It will vary by account, bank, and preferences.

[Pib]

OneZero,

 

In your USAA ibanking, go into Account Services, select Change Card Limits, and it will show you what your current limit is and what you can change it to.  Probably going to be around $600 for ATM withdrawal and $1000 for cash advance at a bank counter.  You can change to a higher amount (maybe much higher) BUT the change to a higher limit is temporary....like 48 hours I think....then it reverts back to USAA default amounts.

 

[djeetyet]

17 hours ago, Pib said:

Visa Exchange Rate Webpage

https://usa.visa.com/support/consumer/travel-support/exchange-rate-calculator.html

Thanks. For those slightly brain dead like I am here's a screen capture of how to calculate the rate:

 

[jack7106]

I utilised transferwise yesterday to transfer $1480 Australian into my Thailand bank account Krungsri - received approximately .20 more than the TT currency exchange rate????????????
Total cost $3.59 AUD = 75baht - happy days????????‍♂️????????????????????????cost for transfer was $3.59 Australian????

[Thailand J]

With a Schwab debit card, just goto an ATM,  daily and per withdrawal limits apply.

[Pib]

13 hours ago, jack7106 said:

I utilised transferwise yesterday to transfer $1480 Australian into my Thailand bank account Krungsri - received approximately .20 more than the TT currency exchange rate????????????
Total cost $3.59 AUD = 75baht - happy days????????‍♂️????????????????????????cost for transfer was $3.59 Australian????

 

Transferwise must be giving you some kind of special discount as their website shows the normal fee would be 12.70 AUD.  So, why are you getting the transfer for only 3.59 AUD? 

[jack7106]

Must have “ hansum man syndrome “ ????????‍♂️????????????????????????

[Pib]

7 minutes ago, jack7106 said:

Must have “ hansum man syndrome “ ????????‍♂️????????????????????????

Guess that means you don't know why you are getting a discount.  Maybe you are a new Transferwise customer...maybe getting X-discount for the X number of transfers.  Regardless, you are getting a good deal.

[rickudon]

I do counter withdrawal with my fee free credit card. I think the only limit is the available credit for your card. Since the Pound slid below 40 baht i can no longer get even 20,000 baht from an ATM (and have to pay a fee for using ATM). Mine is MasterCard and you get a very competitive rate - better than Transferwise even.  Yes, they always photocopy my passport AND the credit card for the transaction.

 

Not every branch will do a counter withdrawal - I once tried 4 banks at Central Plaza, 3 refused to do it and the fourth charged a 2% fee. I found branches away from where tourists go are more accommodating. Got a little branch near me well trained now - took 30 minutes the first time, now all done in 3 minutes! Obviously, your experience may be better - or worse....

[Pib]

3 minutes ago, rickudon said:

 Mine is MasterCard and you get a very competitive rate - better than Transferwise even.  Yes, they always photocopy my passport AND the credit card for the transaction.

You need to redo your math...no way does your MC give a better rate than Transferwise.  Transferwise uses the wholesale FX rate which only big banks/big currency traders/etc., get.  The MC (or Visa or any card logo network) rate is lower than the wholesale FX since they apply a small spread to make profit on card transaction.  

 

At the moment in time the Transferwise GBP /THB rate is 39.65....the MC rate is 39.29.

[jack7106]

43 minutes ago, Pib said:

Guess that means you don't know why you are getting a discount.  Maybe you are a new Transferwise customer...maybe getting X-discount for the X number of transfers.  Regardless, you are getting a good deal.

Your assumption is correct. This is my second transfer only and I seem to remember my first trial transfer was for $1000 Australian and the cost was just under $10????????‍♂️
I am unaware as to why I only paid $3.59 but I am more than happy with this charge as against costing me approximately $11 Australian for an ATM withdrawal using my Visa debit cards.

I have been told by my friends to utilise my Krungsri bank account to withdraw up to 200,000 Baht for a very nominal fee using one of my Visa debit cards????????‍♂️less than 200 Baht fee I am led to believe!!

[Pib]

9 minutes ago, jack7106 said:

Your assumption is correct. This is my second transfer only and I seem to remember my first trial transfer was for $1000 Australian and the cost was just under $10????????‍♂️
I am unaware as to why I only paid $3.59 but I am more than happy with this charge as against costing me approximately $11 Australian for an ATM withdrawal using my Visa debit cards.

I have been told by my friends to utilise my Krungsri bank account to withdraw up to 200,000 Baht for a very nominal fee using one of my Visa debit cards????????‍♂️less than 200 Baht fee I am led to believe!!

I use a Krungsri branch to withdraw up to Bt150K with one my US no foreign transaction fee cards..it's Mastercard....no Bt200 fee but Krungsri does charge a Bt200 fee for Visa counter withdrawals--or at least their fee schedule says that.  The branch would not allow more that Bt150K....I know as I tried to get a little more one time...I asked for Bt160K and the Krungsri rep immediately said B150K was their limit.  Ditto regarding the Bt150K limit at a Bangkok Bank branch I use sometimes for a counter withdrawal but they do not charge any Bt200 fee on Visa or Mastercard.

Edited January 16, 2020 by Pib

[WalkingOrders]

I am not using the same method but I will say that Bangkok bank gives me a great deal on my direct deposit funds from USA. Spot on the bank spot rate. I have been doing this for two years.

[jack7106]

13 minutes ago, Pib said:

I use a Krungsri branch to withdraw up to Bt150K with one my US no foreign transaction fee cards..it's Mastercard....no Bt200 fee but Krungsri does charge a Bt200 fee for Visa counter withdrawals--or at least their fee schedule says that.  The branch would not allow more that Bt150K....I know as I tried to get a little more one time...I asked for Bt160K and the Krungsri rep immediately said B150K was their limit.  Ditto regarding the Bt150K limit at a Bangkok Bank branch I use sometimes for a counter withdrawal but they do not charge any Bt200 fee on Visa or Mastercard.

Much appreciative of your relevant feedback. I will happily check out my Bangkok/Krungsri/Kasikorn bank accounts to ascertain maximum OTC withdrawal limits with the least costings????????????Thanks!!

upon delving into this, I will reply with relevant information.

[rickudon]

1 hour ago, Pib said:

You need to redo your math...no way does your MC give a better rate than Transferwise.  Transferwise uses the wholesale FX rate which only big banks/big currency traders/etc., get.  The MC (or Visa or any card logo network) rate is lower than the wholesale FX since they apply a small spread to make profit on card transaction.  

 

At the moment in time the Transferwise GBP /THB rate is 39.65....the MC rate is 39.29.

You are forgetting the transferwise fee - which is just under one percent (0.7 % for some transactions). That would reduce the REAL rate you get to 39.26. A fraction under the MC rate.

[djeetyet]

11 hours ago, Pib said:

Ditto regarding the Bt150K limit at a Bangkok Bank branch I use sometimes for a counter withdrawal....

I'd be happy if the BKK Bank limit was 150K Baht. I believe my debit card has a U$5,000 per day limit, anyway.

[Pib]

11 hours ago, rickudon said:

You are forgetting the transferwise fee - which is just under one percent (0.7 % for some transactions). That would reduce the REAL rate you get to 39.26. A fraction under the MC rate.

I'm not forgetting it...and glad to hear you now talking effective rate after all the exchange rate and fee dust settles.  I was only responding to where you said, "Mine is MasterCard and you get a very competitive rate - better than Transferwise even" which implied to me you were only talking the basic exchange rate; not the effective/real rate after your crank in all associated fees. 

 

I know very well when a person considers exchange rate "and" direct/indirect fees that if a person has a "no foreign transaction fee" debt card and does a counter withdrawal (a.k.a., known as cash advance at Thai banks), the person will be better off using their card in comparison to using money transfer service like Transferwise.  I've posted various charts/spreadsheets on ThaiVisa over the last year showing such. 

 

And here's another one comparing Transferwise to Mastercard and Visa for 16 Jan 2020....a USD-THB comparison.  The comparison assumes a person is using a no foreign transaction fee debit card.  I have several of such cards and I use them to do Thai bank counter withdrawals to get the bulk of the day-to-day living money I need to bring into Thailand.   

 

 

[stat]

 

@Pib

Thanks a lot for this great excel sheet! Do you have any additional data on a direct bank transferal i.e. homecountry bank to your account in a Thai bank?

 

Any of the german guys here can recommend a mastercard that allows cash withdrawal without using an atm. Some change prohibitive fees like 2% when using a cash advance inside a bank.

 

Any new developments in this very interesting field in 2021?

 

Thanks!

[stat]

Is the bank withdrawal method or atm withdrawal accepted by immigration as funds coming from outside of Thailand? Foreign Bank and foreign Visa/Mastercard.

 

Thanks!

[Peterw42]

26 minutes ago, stat said:

Is the bank withdrawal method or atm withdrawal accepted by immigration as funds coming from outside of Thailand? Foreign Bank and foreign Visa/Mastercard.

 

Thanks!

It would probably come down to the individual immigration office, So long as you had all the receipts etc, they may accept it

A roundabout way of doing it though as it would be split over several days due to daily limits etc

Edited February 21, 2021 by Peterw42