QCon Wall Panels vs blocks

[FireMedic]

https://qcon.co.th/en//products/qcon-wall-panel

 

Has anyone used these yet for residential housing walls? Supposed to be faster, more efficient, no cracks etc ........... 

[bankruatsteve]

59 minutes ago, FireMedic said:

Has anyone used these yet

Maybe your first time to DIY?  Yah - AAC blocks have been the favorite material for maybe 20-30 years now.  The builders love them and they are excellent insulation.  Most of us who have built homes with them have gone with a double wall (of 7.5cm) leaving a cavity for running PVC for water and electric.  Cheers.

[Sophon]

8 minutes ago, bankruatsteve said:

Maybe your first time to DIY?  Yah - AAC blocks have been the favorite material for maybe 20-30 years now.  The builders love them and they are excellent insulation.  Most of us who have built homes with them have gone with a double wall (of 7.5cm) leaving a cavity for running PVC for water and electric.  Cheers.

He is not talking about AAC blocks, what he is asking about is AAC panels (60 cm x 300 cm). I have not heard about anyone building with these in a domestic setting.

[bankruatsteve]

Oh, right.  I don't see where there's much difference though.

[Kwasaki]

Use what you want as long as you have an air cavities all down to labour cost really stud wall goes up quick and there's little or as much finishing work as you specify. 

[Crossy]

Since they can be up to 3m long and 60cm wide they could be pretty much instant wall.

 

Be interesting to see if anyone uses them @FireMedic fancy being the guinea pig?

 

[Big Joke]

https://forum.thaivisa.com/topic/1116869-alc-blocks/

[sagra]

13 hours ago, Kwasaki said:

Use what you want as long as you have an air cavities all down to labour cost really stud wall goes up quick and there's little or as much finishing work as you specify. 

I've seen posts that say never have a wall cavities, citing problems with vermin, etc. I hope I can get a definitive on that, since I plan to build this year. Thanks.

[bankruatsteve]

Hopefully construction will not leave holes or gaps where the larger critters can get in.  Ants will invade the smallest of cracks and not much can do except laying down the dust and spraying when they get too personal.  Cavities make a convenient space to run water and electric without having to grind out the races.  And they can hide the columns.  With AAC block, there is no insulation advantage to the cavity.

[Laza 45]

39 minutes ago, sagra said:

I've seen posts that say never have a wall cavities, citing problems with vermin, etc. I hope I can get a definitive on that, since I plan to build this year. Thanks.

That is nonsense.. I had people tell me the same thing when I was building..  7 years later no problem with vermin or moisture.. A cavity wall creates a room with very stable temperature ... cheap to air con.. & quiet. I used the insulating block for outside skin.. normal concrete blocks inside.. rendered inside and out with cement render.. You need good footings and foundation to prevent cracking.. 

[kurtcap]

We use the panels in more commecial buildings due to the size. Useful for quick construction for large areas, i wouldnt see you gettimg the same advantage on a domestic build.

[sometimewoodworker]

3 hours ago, sagra said:

I've seen posts that say never have a wall cavities, citing problems with vermin, etc. I hope I can get a definitive on that, since I plan to build this year. Thanks.

It is impossible to get a definitive answer. Do it correctly and there are no problems, (most do, we did, we don’t have problems) do it badly and have all the problems of dead corpses or active infestations.

Edited July 28, 2020 by sometimewoodworker

[kamalabob2]

The OP might want to look at the video and then look at his local labor force. The wall panels make sense for a major contractor who is doing many walls with no windows. If the contractor is willing to invest in the tools and training. Normal AAC blocks seem within the scope of local home construction crews. The weight on the wall panels, might be a deal breaker for most local crews. There are other walls panels on offer at the Architect Expo, and for condo builders or office builders certainly a strong contender. 

[khunPer]

21 hours ago, FireMedic said:

Has anyone used these yet for residential housing walls? Supposed to be faster, more efficient, no cracks etc ........... 

They are very used in my Scandinavian home country – aerated concrete blocks and panels originates from Sweden, and have been used for generations since the 1930s, the method was patented in 1924 – and yes, they are both fast, efficient, and if build right they are without cracks. You can actually build a whole house from aerated concrete bricks only, with no posts, and no heavy stone walls...????

 

I've used aerated blocks and panels in my home country, and aerated block in my house here; the panels were not yet (widely?) available in Thailand, and the Q-con blocks a fairly new products 12 years ago, when I began my Thai house construction..????

[khunPer]

13 minutes ago, kamalabob2 said:

The wall panels make sense for a major contractor who is doing many walls with no windows.

It's very easy to cut, or saw, out holes for openings like doors, portals and windows after the wall is build. Same for cutting rails for hidden electric pipes and cables...

[khunPer]

For you info I found some images from Danish constructions using aerated panels, and combination of panels with blocks by door and window openings, for villa houses. Normally there will come a 10 cm wide mineral wool insulation layer, and an outer one stone wide burned brick wall for visual impression, but outer aerated wall with plaster can also be used...

 

 

 

[Sametboy2019]

2 hours ago, kurtcap said:

We use the panels in more commecial buildings due to the size. Useful for quick construction for large areas, i wouldnt see you gettimg the same advantage on a domestic build.

I think you would but i would lay them down rather than upright as shown in the video. You would be laying 3 courses in one go(standard block is 20cm high) and at 3m long you would be covering huge distances. You could build a wall in less than a hour.

[Kwasaki]

7 hours ago, sagra said:

I've seen posts that say never have a wall cavities, citing problems with vermin, etc. I hope I can get a definitive on that, since I plan to build this year. Thanks.

Treatable. 

[kuma]

On 7/27/2020 at 3:25 PM, bankruatsteve said:

Maybe your first time to DIY?  Yah - AAC blocks have been the favorite material for maybe 20-30 years now.  The builders love them and they are excellent insulation.  Most of us who have built homes with them have gone with a double wall (of 7.5cm) leaving a cavity for running PVC for water and electric.  Cheers.

I am relatively new to the DIY section, and have a question about AAC blocks please. I have a builder quoting me on a small one story home, using a single wall of 75mm q-con. Is that enough for outdoor walls in the opinion of this forum (using a concrete frame and floor). I have visited a few projects he has done and they look god, but I am not an expert on these materials and unsure if 75mm is enough for external walls. Metal roof on top so not heavy

Thanks in advance for any input, cheers

[bankruatsteve]

3 hours ago, kuma said:

using a single wall of 75mm q-con

From insulation perspective, that is a lot better than the normal block.  As mentioned, a double wall with cavity is what many of us have done for maximum insulation and convenient space to hide plumbing and electrics.

[Matzzon]

On 7/27/2020 at 10:46 AM, bankruatsteve said:

Oh, right.  I don't see where there's much difference though.

That is probably because your expertise is electric and not building blocks.

[sometimewoodworker]

1 hour ago, Matzzon said:

On 7/27/2020 at 3:46 PM, bankruatsteve said:

Oh, right.  I don't see where there's much difference though.

That is probably because your expertise is electric and not building blocks.

While @bankruatsteve may well be an electrical expert he is clearly more knowledgeable on building than you.

There is not much difference between the 2 in terms of building, insulation from sound, and insulation from heat.
 

The difference is that the panels need more machinery, the blocks are easy put up by a couple of workers. So in Thailand the panels are more difficult to get, transport, store, use & expensive in rental equipment. OK if you are doing a big construction, poor Idea for most houses.

 

6 hours ago, kuma said:

I am relatively new to the DIY section, and have a question about AAC blocks please. I have a builder quoting me on a small one story home, using a single wall of 75mm q-con. Is that enough for outdoor walls in the opinion of this forum (using a concrete frame and floor). I have visited a few projects he has done and they look god, but I am not an expert on these materials and unsure if 75mm is enough for external walls. Metal roof on top so not heavy

Thanks in advance for any input, cheers

Thai building uses the blocks to fill the gaps between pillars not for load bearing, also resistance to racking forces, so from a structural point of view the single wall is easily enough. But for sound, heat, cleanness of look @bankruatsteve is absolutely correct double is better. I have about a 24db drop in sound in my house. 
 

My house walls start around this point

[Matzzon]

3 hours ago, sometimewoodworker said:

While @bankruatsteve may well be an electrical expert he is clearly more knowledgeable on building than you.

If you say so Mr. Woodworker. ????

 

I know the level of my knowledge. That´s enough for me.

[kuma]

10 hours ago, bankruatsteve said:

From insulation perspective, that is a lot better than the normal block.  As mentioned, a double wall with cavity is what many of us have done for maximum insulation and convenient space to hide plumbing and electrics.

Cheers Steve thanks for the reply. I am getting feedback that 75mm is fine, in particular because the load is borne by the pillars. Insulation @ 75mm I think will work well for us in this case, as we are in a quite cool, rainy area - so I have more info now to ponder.

BTW, like the handle - see you are in Udon now, but perhaps once in Ban Kruat? It was a haunt of mine 15 os so years ago as well - good ol BK.

Have a great day

[kuma]

7 hours ago, sometimewoodworker said:

While @bankruatsteve may well be an electrical expert he is clearly more knowledgeable on building than you.

There is not much difference between the 2 in terms of building, insulation from sound, and insulation from heat.
 

The difference is that the panels need more machinery, the blocks are easy put up by a couple of workers. So in Thailand the panels are more difficult to get, transport, store, use & expensive in rental equipment. OK if you are doing a big construction, poor Idea for most houses.

 

Thai building uses the blocks to fill the gaps between pillars not for load bearing, also resistance to racking forces, so from a structural point of view the single wall is easily enough. But for sound, heat, cleanness of look @bankruatsteve is absolutely correct double is better. I have about a 24db drop in sound in my house. 
 

My house walls start around this point

Sometime, thanks for the input. Agree on the enhanced properties of double wall but think in our case we will likely go with single wall, 75 or 100mm. We are in a quiet and cool zone - thought agreed the quiet could change in a heartbeat, but the 17+ years I have been here has acclimated me to most of what the atmosphere here throws at you, heat, rain, noise, etc

Builder is not as keen on 100mm or up, but I might go that way anyway. It appears lintels are not available at 75mm, and he does not use them but rather encases the windows and doors in reinforced concrete that extends to the support pillars. The rep at q-con tells us that this is a common technique here given no lintels at 75mm. It has occurred to me thou to ask if a 100mm lintel can be placed with 75mm walls...and the overhang I would just consider as an accent piece over the frames - it could overhang to the interior or exterior really...not sure this can work but inquiring to see.

Cheers

[kuma]

7 hours ago, sometimewoodworker said:

While @bankruatsteve may well be an electrical expert he is clearly more knowledgeable on building than you.

There is not much difference between the 2 in terms of building, insulation from sound, and insulation from heat.
 

The difference is that the panels need more machinery, the blocks are easy put up by a couple of workers. So in Thailand the panels are more difficult to get, transport, store, use & expensive in rental equipment. OK if you are doing a big construction, poor Idea for most houses.

 

Thai building uses the blocks to fill the gaps between pillars not for load bearing, also resistance to racking forces, so from a structural point of view the single wall is easily enough. But for sound, heat, cleanness of look @bankruatsteve is absolutely correct double is better. I have about a 24db drop in sound in my house. 
 

My house walls start around this point

BTW thx for links to pics, going to explore further there.

[sometimewoodworker]

24 minutes ago, kuma said:

Sometime, thanks for the input. Agree on the enhanced properties of double wall but think in our case we will likely go with single wall, 75 or 100mm. We are in a quiet and cool zone - thought agreed the quiet could change in a heartbeat, but the 17+ years I have been here has acclimated me to most of what the atmosphere here throws at you, heat, rain, noise, etc

Builder is not as keen on 100mm or up, but I might go that way anyway. It appears lintels are not available at 75mm, and he does not use them but rather encases the windows and doors in reinforced concrete that extends to the support pillars. The rep at q-con tells us that this is a common technique here given no lintels at 75mm. It has occurred to me thou to ask if a 100mm lintel can be placed with 75mm walls...and the overhang I would just consider as an accent piece over the frames - it could overhang to the interior or exterior really...not sure this can work but inquiring to see.

Cheers

The 100mm lintel can certainly be put on a 75mm wall. The only difficulty would be on the rendering but that’s reasonably easy for competent workers. 
 

The 100mm blocks are relatively expensive as the standard Is 75mm also you may have a bit of difficulty getting supplies quickly.

 

The advantage of concrete around openings is that is easy to fix to. If fixing to AAC you need the sawtooth metal plugs and to make the holes tight enough that they need to be tapped in with a hammer.

[bankruatsteve]

 

2 hours ago, kuma said:

but perhaps once in Ban Kruat? It was a haunt of mine 15 os so years ago as well - good ol BK.

That's when i was there.  From 1995-2010.  Well, part time at first as I was working in Bangkok until 2003.  ????

[kuma]

3 hours ago, sometimewoodworker said:

The 100mm lintel can certainly be put on a 75mm wall. The only difficulty would be on the rendering but that’s reasonably easy for competent workers. 
 

The 100mm blocks are relatively expensive as the standard Is 75mm also you may have a bit of difficulty getting supplies quickly.

 

The advantage of concrete around openings is that is easy to fix to. If fixing to AAC you need the sawtooth metal plugs and to make the holes tight enough that they need to be tapped in with a hammer.

Cheers Sometime. Did not think about the fastening and the concrete v aac, good point. Yes also see that easily available widths in this area are 70mm and 75mm, all else is by order only - but we are months away from a potential start so that is less of an issue.

Now that the walls are more or less settled in my mind, focus has turned to the roof - the design is a modern front to back slope for run off, in steel. Pondering that vs a traditional gable roof, which is obviously more $$$

Cheers

[sometimewoodworker]

10 hours ago, kuma said:

Now that the walls are more or less settled in my mind, focus has turned to the roof - the design is a modern front to back slope for run off, in steel. Pondering that vs a traditional gable roof, which is obviously more $$$

The roof is purely an aesthetic choice, do consider rainwater harvest or disposal.

 

10 hours ago, kuma said:

easily available widths in this area are 70mm and 75mm,

70mm is not standard.