Story Of My Thai Citizenship Application

[yooper]

4 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

All she should have to do is go to the Amphoe where the she is/was registered in a house book. If she still is registered in a house book it should not be that complicated for her to get a new ID and then a Thai passport.

It is not a problem for her to have two nationalities. There is nothing written that states she cannot have it.

If she has a expired passport she can use it to enter the country. But she would have to get a new one prior to leaving the country.

 

My question was for big guns about getting his Thai passport but your comment about the expired Thai passport is questionable.... if she can use it to enter the country why did we pay $200 for the 1 yr visa after showing the expired passports? Two of them.  Do you think if she shows her expired passport at immigration when we arrive they will just waive her through?  Maybe get a refund?

 

[Big Guns]

I'll try to answer the various questions. It hasn't really sunk in yet that I've achieved Thai citizenship and I haven't celebrated yet, but I'll rectify that on Friday. It's been a lot of hassle but yes it's worth it. One thing that troubled me in the past was that Thailand is my home but if I was dismissed from my position I'd have to leave the country immediately. For me the single biggest problem was not living in Bangkok. This meant a lot of additional expense and travel time and the council (ampoe/kate) made my life hell because I was registered in a house in Bangkok which I obviously didn't live in. Other than that it was relatively plain sailing all be it with many photocopies and signatures. 

[ubonjoe]

5 minutes ago, yooper said:

My question was for big guns about getting his Thai passport but your comment about the expired Thai passport is questionable.... if she can use it to enter the country why did we pay $200 for the 1 yr visa after showing the expired passports? Two of them.  Do you think if she shows her expired passport at immigration when we arrive they will just waive her through?  Maybe get a refund?

You wife is already a Thai national.  Which is not the same as big guns who was getting his first ID card after going through the process of getting Thai nationality. There are many topics about Thais getting their house book registry and ID card sorted out after being out of the country for many years.

Was the embassy aware she had a expired Thai passport? It could be they were more interested in issuing a multiple entry non-o visa instead of telling her she could enter on her expired passport. They could of also told her she could get a single entry non-o visa or a tourist visa and then applied for a one year extension of stay at immigration based upon her being a Thai national from birth for a fee of 1900 baht. She could also enter with no visa and get a 30 day visa exempt entry and then apply for the one year extension of stay.

She would not exactly be waived through with the expired passport but she would be certainly be allowed to enter the country.

[Arkady]

On 10/28/2017 at 4:01 PM, khongaeng said:

Very true.  I will certainly be very grateful when my application is countersigned, and it will be an honor regardless of when.  Do you know if letters are still issued?  Do you know why you are not given the original?

I am sure the letters are still issued, since the Act requires the countersignature.  The original has to remain in the file, as evidence that your naturalisation was conducted legally.  The evidence is for verification by officials and there is no requirement for SB to let you see it or give you a copy.  In fact they said they weare not supposed to give copies.  I got on well with my case officer and asked for a copy which I received several months later with an original bound copy of the issue of the RG with my announcement in it.   Practice at SB varies, depending on whom you deal with and who is in charge at the time and it could be that no one is being given these documents these days  but it does no harm to ask when the time comes, if you are interested.  They can only say no.  

[Arkady]

3 hours ago, yooper said:

My question was for big guns about getting his Thai passport but your comment about the expired Thai passport is questionable.... if she can use it to enter the country why did we pay $200 for the 1 yr visa after showing the expired passports? Two of them.  Do you think if she shows her expired passport at immigration when we arrive they will just waive her through?  Maybe get a refund?

 

There have been cases mentioned in TV where someone was able to enter the Kingdom using an expired Thai passport but I don't think they were just waived through.  Anyone who decides to try this should probably be prepared for a delay at Immigration, not including the lengthy queue for a manned counter, while a supervisor is called and the traveller is interviewed about their circumstances that led to them presenting an expired passport to Immigration.  They are also likely to be pressured to enter the Kingdom on whatever passport they used to board the aircraft at the other end, as well as subjected to the usual threats and lectures on Immigration's spurious ideas that dual nationality is illegal and that the Thai nationality has been automatically cancelled etc, etc.

 

I have never heard of anyone choosing to enter the Kingdom on an expired Thai passport a second time.  Anyway getting a new passport is a relatively simple and inexpensive process, as if getting a new ID card and tabien baan (for someone who left Thailand as an adult).  So why would anyone not want to get a new Thai passport while they are back in the country and have the opportunity?  The only reasonable answer would be that they are quite sure that they never want to return to Thailand again in their lifetime.     

[MrPatrickThai]

7 hours ago, Big Guns said:

I'll try to answer the various questions. It hasn't really sunk in yet that I've achieved Thai citizenship and I haven't celebrated yet, but I'll rectify that on Friday. It's been a lot of hassle but yes it's worth it. One thing that troubled me in the past was that Thailand is my home but if I was dismissed from my position I'd have to leave the country immediately. For me the single biggest problem was not living in Bangkok. This meant a lot of additional expense and travel time and the council (ampoe/kate) made my life hell because I was registered in a house in Bangkok which I obviously didn't live in. Other than that it was relatively plain sailing all be it with many photocopies and signatures. 

I've changed my address to an amphur in Bangkok. Everything went very smoothly. 

Edited October 31, 2017 by MrPatrickThai

[MrPatrickThai]

Can anyone tell me the best way to get to the MOFA from central Bangkok?

 

Also, can I get translations done there in the morning, or would I be best getting them done the day before?

[samran]

On 10/30/2017 at 7:49 AM, Big Guns said:

I've finally finished now and received my Thai ID card and passport last week 

congrats! My wife sorted hers two years ago this week, as FB reminds me.

 

Did you go to immigration to get your current visa cancelled? I don't know if everyone does here, my wife did. It was a nearly all day experience!

[Big Guns]

1 minute ago, samran said:

congrats! My wife sorted hers two years ago this week, as FB reminds me.

 

Did you go to immigration to get your current visa cancelled? I don't know if everyone does here, my wife did. It was a nearly all day experience!

I've left it to a member of staff that deals with immigration to take back my work permit & cancel my visa.

[yooper]

4 hours ago, Arkady said:

There have been cases mentioned in TV where someone was able to enter the Kingdom using an expired Thai passport but I don't think they were just waived through.  Anyone who decides to try this should probably be prepared for a delay at Immigration, not including the lengthy queue for a manned counter, while a supervisor is called and the traveller is interviewed about their circumstances that led to them presenting an expired passport to Immigration.  They are also likely to be pressured to enter the Kingdom on whatever passport they used to board the aircraft at the other end, as well as subjected to the usual threats and lectures on Immigration's spurious ideas that dual nationality is illegal and that the Thai nationality has been automatically cancelled etc, etc.

 

I have never heard of anyone choosing to enter the Kingdom on an expired Thai passport a second time.  Anyway getting a new passport is a relatively simple and inexpensive process, as if getting a new ID card and tabien baan (for someone who left Thailand as an adult).  So why would anyone not want to get a new Thai passport while they are back in the country and have the opportunity?  The only reasonable answer would be that they are quite sure that they never want to return to Thailand again in their lifetime.     

Thanks for your reply... she will certainly use her US passport/visa rather than test the system, lol. Being out $200 for the visa is ok, cheap insurance that she would have plenty of time to complete whatever paperwork for her ID card and passport. I would not have been comfortable with the 30 day visa anyway and the 1-yr visa was only $120 more than the other options  .... I am relieved to read that getting the new passport is a simple process.

 

I was hoping that the process would also be straightforward to get and ID and passport for myself as her husband, but apparently not....?   We can both have our address registered at her sister's house until we find more permanent housingc , the registration document she has is at an address from the 1970's that possibly no longer exists, probably demolished in the name of progress as it was an extremely poor neighborhood. We visited the area last year and she could not find/recognize the exact location where her family used to live, right along a riverbank now lined with markets, cafe's, and better housing. 

[greenchair]

2 hours ago, samran said:

congrats! My wife sorted hers two years ago this week, as FB reminds me.

 

Did you go to immigration to get your current visa cancelled? I don't know if everyone does here, my wife did. It was a nearly all day experience!

Oh my goodness, do we have to cancel our visa. 

Because I did not. 

What will happen? 

[greenchair]

2 hours ago, Big Guns said:

I've left it to a member of staff that deals with immigration to take back my work permit & cancel my visa.

When you applied for thai passport, what documents did you need? ?

[Big Guns]

34 minutes ago, greenchair said:

When you applied for thai passport, what documents did you need? ?

For the Thai passport i showed the naturalisation document, ID card & british passport. They didnt ask but Id take house blue book just in case. The lady from work said I should cancel visa & return work permit & she's taking care of it.

[greenchair]

2 minutes ago, Big Guns said:

For the Thai passport i showed the naturalisation document, ID card & british passport. They didnt ask but Id take house blue book just in case. The lady from work said I should cancel visa & return work permit & she's taking care of it.

Thanks. 

But what if my visa already expired, will I be in trouble? ?

[Big Guns]

Im not an expert but I would expect it to be an issue. Maybe one of the more knowledgeable chaps could comment

[greenchair]

1 hour ago, Big Guns said:

Im not an expert but I would expect it to be an issue. Maybe one of the more knowledgeable chaps could comment

Thank you. 

 

Anyone feel free to jump in here. ☺

[Big Guns]

I meant not an issue. Sorry stupid phone ?

[GarryP]

3 minutes ago, greenchair said:

Thank you. 

 

Anyone feel free to jump in here. ☺

You are a Thai now so they are not going to kick you out for overstaying your visa. 

 

I had my visa cancelled at the one stop service center. I had to do it there as my previous extension was obtained there. I went to Chaengwattana waited half a day and then was told that I had to go to the place where I got my last extension. Wasted a day all told. I would just go to the place where you got your latest extension. Apologize and tell them that you only just learned that you had to cancel your extension of stay. It should not be a problem.

[Arkady]

4 hours ago, Big Guns said:

For the Thai passport i showed the naturalisation document, ID card & british passport. They didnt ask but Id take house blue book just in case. The lady from work said I should cancel visa & return work permit & she's taking care of it.

 

There is no need to cancel your work permit but if you have staff, who have nothing else to do, available to do it for you, no harm done .  I was able to convince my HR dept there was no need for them to go to the trouble.   

[Arkady]

4 hours ago, greenchair said:

Thanks. 

But what if my visa already expired, will I be in trouble? ?

 

Some people who were dual nationals due being look krung have reported in TV being forced to pay overstay fines because they entered on a foreign passport and then sorted out their Thai passports in the country and tried to use them to leave.  Immigration picked up the fact they had entered on foreign passports and overstayed.  Immigration argued that even though they were Thai, since they chose to enter on foreign passports they can be fined and Immigration needs to close the loop on their foreigner entries.  They could perhaps have challenged this legally but wanted to get on their flights and it was not worth a case in the Administrative Court to try to recover the fines.  

 

It is possible that those who have just been naturalised might be treated more leniently since they are not supposed to close the loop by exiting on their foreign passports.  I would say that, if you have already left on your Thai passport and there was no problem, you can probably get away without cancelling the visa.  Anyway the fine maxes out at B20,000 at B200 a day which is 100 days of overstay and you can't be blacklisted or jailed for it.  If you have not yet left the country, it would probably be worth cancelling the visa which would avoid the risk of being fined. 

 

As a PR I had to hand back my alien and residence books and thought it might cause a problem, if I didn't do it, as I would still be registered as an alien at the police station, subject to renewal every 5 years.  So I did it on the way to the CW passport office and it took only about 20 minutes with no queue in the PR section.  But cancelling any other type of visa at CW involves queuing up with all the hordes which takes a long time.    

[skippybangkok]

Oh my goodness, do we have to cancel our visa. 

Because I did not. 

What will happen? 

 

 

Never cancelled - just left it. It will lapse anyway I think. :)

 

 

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[Arkady]

28 minutes ago, skippybangkok said:

 

 

Never cancelled - just left it. It will lapse anyway I think. :)

 

 

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

 

I think it is quite possible that the electronic gates don't have the ability to match Thai passports with the same details on a foreign passport that entered the country, as has been done by manual checks in some cases in the past and this might not be possible manually in every case anyway. If you don't mind your foreign persona being listed as a permanent overstayer, it is probably OK to do this.  If I were in this situation today and didn't have to return PR documents, after mature reflection, I now think would take the risk of not cancelling the visa. 

 

You are balancing a low risk of being hassled and fined at the airport against the absolute certainty of a tedious long wait at Immigration at CW.   I would just recommend allowing extra time at the airport for the first overseas trip.  If you have got through once, you are probably in the clear and there is no clear instruction given by SB in writing that you have to cancel your visa, although I was told verbally to return my PR docs which are like ID docs.  I am sure they don't normally talk to Immigration either.      

[MrPatrickThai]

If I go to MOFA, can I get translations there before certification? 

[Arkady]

33 minutes ago, MrPatrickThai said:

If I go to MOFA, can I get translations there before certification? 

 

I guess you would want MoFA to verify the vice-consul's signature on the certifications as well as the accuracy of the translations.

[GabbaGabbaHey]

On 10/31/2017 at 3:14 PM, MrPatrickThai said:

Can anyone tell me the best way to get to the MOFA from central Bangkok?

The Consular office for document legalization, right?  One economic way is to use BTS until Mo Chit, take exit 3, walk 200 meters to the north and ask the minivans parked there which one is going to the Government office (Consular office is very near on the main road). they charge only 25 bahts including air con and express way. On the way back you can do the same, cross the footbridge in front of the Consular Office and wait for those minivans with "BTS/MRT" on it. 

[greenchair]

5 hours ago, skippybangkok said:

 

 

Never cancelled - just left it. It will lapse anyway I think. :)

 

 

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

Thanks 

[MrPatrickThai]

2 hours ago, Arkady said:

 

I guess you would want MoFA to verify the vice-consul's signature on the certifications as well as the accuracy of the translations.

I'm confused. The Special Branch have my translated degrees, just done in a shop, didn't go to the MOFA. They said I needed them verified at the UK embassy.  

 

The British embassy have photocopied them and on the back written, "This is a true copy made by me............" and signed by the Pro Consul(Thai name).

Am I correct in thinking the MOFA will not verify the English letter of true copy, so I need it translated, as well as the name, Mananya Thongnual into Thai script. 

I guess I need to get the degree translated again too?

 

If I go to the MOFA, I assume they have a translation shop than can translate in an hour or so. Would you recommend I get them translated before going to save time?

[MrPatrickThai]

On 10/5/2017 at 1:46 PM, khongaeng said:

For other's reference my experience at NIA was a a simple review of my history.  I brought all of my original documents.  They wanted to see as many forms of ID that I had (PR (I didn't have because applying with Thai wife), Thai Driver's license, Passport, Marriage license, tax return (copy), salary letter from company, marriage license, birth certificates for children, name change (copy), thabian ban for me and family, and wife Thai ID card).  My wife also had to come along.  We met in the cafeteria of the Ministry of Education (not air conditioned).  Apparently their offices at SB are under construction until middle of 2018.  The interviewer just asked my wife and I to review our history together, etc.  The same type of questions that have been asked by SB when application was submitted.  Not stressful at all.  They only meet with people on Wednesdays, and seem to complete 1 person every 20 minutes.  There were 3 interviewers interview with 3 different applicants at the time.  

So for the NIA interview you needed to get another salary letter from your work? Or did you use the one that you gave to the SB on application?

Before teh NI interview, did they give you a lost of rewired documents?

 

Which makes me wonder if any of the original documents that I gave the SB can be photocopied and used in any  further process.

[Arkady]

1 hour ago, MrPatrickThai said:

So for the NIA interview you needed to get another salary letter from your work? Or did you use the one that you gave to the SB on application?

Before teh NI interview, did they give you a lost of rewired documents?

 

Which makes me wonder if any of the original documents that I gave the SB can be photocopied and used in any  further process.

 

The NIA interview is supposed to be within 30 days of you completing your application.  So they will be satisfied with copies of everything you submitted to SB with your application.  In my case, the NIA officer just called me on my mobile to make the appointment and didn't ask me to bring any particular documents.  However, he did surprisingly ask to see a copy of the title deed of our house at the interview which I did, in fact, have with me.  Just take as many relevant documents as you can think of but they probably won't insist if you don't have odd things that could not have been anticipated. 

[greenchair]

2 hours ago, MrPatrickThai said:

So for the NIA interview you needed to get another salary letter from your work? Or did you use the one that you gave to the SB on application?

Before teh NI interview, did they give you a lost of rewired documents?

 

Which makes me wonder if any of the original documents that I gave the SB can be photocopied and used in any  further process.

Copy absolutely everything 3 times. Everytime I got something translated I got 2 just for the hell of it. Most of the time, I needed it. 

Remember that golden id card. 

You almost have to start the entire process to get that.