We Must Get MOVING, Now, or… We might as well just hang it up. Too much fear around here, in this world. No More Fear!

[Fat is a type of crazy]

I am the king of lockdown. Living alone in the most locked down city in the world - Melbourne Australia. To this day I cannot go more than 5 km from home, no gym, etc, and that's been pretty much the case since May 2020 with some short breaks. 

The best part has been working from home. As I have said before no office politics, transport, just do your job and sign off. The worst part is being separated from my Thai girlfriend. OK in the first six months but now a bit tough. Could look for a nice Australian girl but couldn't be bothered.

Run in a nearby forest with an outlook over the city. Saw a kangaroo for the second time yesterday. Keep in touch with friends and family by phone. Have full access to entertainment. Not ideal but worse things happen at sea. 

[starky]

21 minutes ago, GammaGlobulin said:

Wow!

This seems like a huge recipe for disaster.

I am not saying that I am smarter than most Americans.

Still, this type of get-together cannot bode well for the nurses and doctors who must risk their lives caring for these fools, when they fall ill.

 

Thank you for posting this very interesting video.

Seems rather incredible.

 

(Are those actually FANS?  Or, are they red ants?  Whatever they are, they are packed together like insects.)

I thought you wanted to get back to rowing lol ....tbh I'm not anti lockdown and in no way am I suggesting that Thailand is ready to fully open up. The mindset however must change from "covid zero" to a new strategy. 

   I know people will mention Israel here but once populations hit certain vaccination targets it's time to open up we won't eradicate this. There will be breakthrough cases there will be other variants and just like before we must move forward. 

Im an Aussie we have some of the lowest death rates in the world yet every morning we concentrate on this 70 year old died or this 40 year old died from covid. It is naturally shocking as so many fear death but if they wish to do that then the government should be realising the figures of EVERY 70 year old that died EVERY 40 year old that died not just from covid. If we wish to focus on death let's focus on all deaths. 

 If the thought of that football match scares you that is your choice it looks amazing to me. Stay inside don't go out. Not much of a life though is it?

Edited September 6, 2021 by starky

[starky]

18 minutes ago, Fat is a type of crazy said:

I am the king of lockdown. Living alone in the most locked down city in the world - Melbourne Australia. To this day I cannot go more than 5 km from home, no gym, etc, and that's been pretty much the case since May 2020 with some short breaks. 

The best part has been working from home. As I have said before no office politics, transport, just do your job and sign off. The worst part is being separated from my Thai girlfriend. OK in the first six months but now a bit tough. Could look for a nice Australian girl but couldn't be bothered.

Run in a nearby forest with an outlook over the city. Saw a kangaroo for the second time yesterday. Keep in touch with friends and family by phone. Have full access to entertainment. Not ideal but worse things happen at sea. 

Yep Melbourne copped it the worst for sure. I've done 8 rounds of hotel quarantine multiple self isos and coincidentally I work at sea lol. I was lucky I got back to Thailand but had to come back to Oz for work. Thankfully for Sydney and Melbourne there is a light at the end of the tunnel same probably can't be said for Qld or WA however McGowan will never open up .... Pretty hard to look for a nice Australian girl from your loungeroom in lockdown I would imagine .....

Edited September 6, 2021 by starky

[GammaGlobulin]

12 minutes ago, starky said:

I thought you wanted to get back to rowing lol ....tbh I'm not anti lockdown and in no way am I suggesting that Thailand is ready to fully open up. The mindset however must change from "covid zero" to a new strategy. 

   I know people will mention Israel here but once populations hit certain vaccination targets it's time to open up we won't eradicate this. There will be breakthrough cases there will be other variants and just like before we must move forward. 

Im an Aussie we have some of the lowest death rates in the world yet every morning we concentrate on this 70 year old died or this 40 year old died from covid. It is naturally shocking as so many fear death but if they wish to do that then the government should be realising the figures of EVERY 70 year old that died EVERY 40 year old that died not just from covid. If we wish to focus on death let's focus on all deaths. 

 If the thought of that football match scares you that is your choice it looks amazing to me. Stay inside don't go out. Not much of a life though is it?

Perhaps, you should begin to think in terms of "life expectancy".  For example, the life expectancy in the state of Florida had been about 78.9 years, pre-virus.  And, present-day, due to the virus, life expectancy will decrease by some number of years, or just a fraction of a year.  We do not yet have the data.

 

We can assume the same for places in SE Asia.

 

Therefore, if the calculated life expectancy decreases by only a tolerable number of years, then why not just go rowing, and do the other things that we need to do, in order to get back to normal?

 

Sure, some will die.  Yet, death is not something that we should not expect.

 

Instead of looking at the number of deaths, why not just average everything out and pay more heed to life expectancy?

 

If we were to look back in history, and consider the drop in life expectancy due to the 1918 influenza epidemic in the US, then, during one single year, the life expectancy only dropped by 12 years. And, in that case, the virus was far more virulent than Covid is, today.

 

Fortunately, the Delta strain is far less lethal than the 1918 influenza virus.

 

So far, we seem blessed.

 

I really doubt that our life expectancy in SE Asia will drop less than a fraction of a year, even if we were to open up the economy FULL TILT.  But, if we do not open up soon, then the consequences of the resulting economic downturn could be far more serious.

 

Certainly, it is conceivable that the blessed virus could mutate into a much more virulent and pathogenic strain.  However, opening up the economy, or not, will not affect this in any way. Why?  We know that there are a few billion people on this planet who will not be vaccinated during the next two years.  And so, closing down our economy, during a time when there are billions of people who cannot be vaccinated in the near term, seems unreasonable. Unvaccinated people will be a potential reservoir for breeding new variants.  This cannot be helped, since we do not have the resources to provide vaccines sufficient for 7 billion people, this year.

 

In the end:

 

My best advice is to always do what is best for the economy.  Doing so will help people most, both the people on the bottom rung, as well as the people on the top rung. Too many people need to get back to work.

 

Sure, it is only reasonable that, while completely opening up the local economy, still, reasonable precautions should be followed.  But, everybody must get back to rowing ahead, ASAP.

 

We must begin, soon, to row, row, row our boats!!!!!  NOW!

 

NOTE:  In my next posting, I will deal with the inequities and inequality in our world.

[Farmerslife]

Yesterday you were getting all amorous about a rock climber, today it's a rower. 

Are you a bit fickle with your affections or are you just an adrenaline  junkie? 

We deserve to know! ????????

[Will B Good]

My biggest fear is that you keep on posting....only joshing.

[Moonlover]

7 hours ago, Maha Sarakham said:

Life is normal here in the US, who is still locked down at this point?  Make a move if it's weighing on you that heavily.

Life's been normal for us throughout this whole pandemic period. Nothing has changed much in rural Issan, so I've able to go about my normal daily activities of walking in the countryside (without a mask) and getting plenty of outdoor exercise.

 

We are receiving vaccinations, but I have no fear of this virus anyway. We are very unlikely to come into contact with it and I'm sure this holds true for many country dwellers worldwide.

 

As F.D.R. said, 'There's nothing to fear but fear itself'.

 

 

[amexpat]

5 hours ago, Rampant Rabbit said:

Looking at the size  of Americans that I see  Im not  surprised, they are so overweight its  almost  unbelievable

According to the World Health Organisation (2016), there are around 2 billion adults overweight, 

I had no idea there were that many Americans, did you?

[GammaGlobulin]

11 minutes ago, Moonlover said:

Life's been normal for us throughout this whole pandemic period. Nothing has changed much in rural Issan, so I've able to go about my normal daily activities of walking in the countryside (without a mask) and getting plenty of outdoor exercise.

 

We are receiving vaccinations, but I have no fear of this virus anyway. We are very unlikely to come into contact with it and I'm sure this holds true for many country dwellers worldwide.

 

As F.D.R. said, 'There's nothing to fear but fear itself'.

 

 

While I agree with your FDR quote, I must disagree with your suggestion that this virus will not reach every nook and cranny of our world. 

 

For example, the 1918 virus reached Inuit populations in extremely remote areas, even before transportation was as well developed as is the case today. 

 

Therefore, as has been clearly stated recently, we will ALL meet the virus, sooner or later. 

 

The only recourse in order to avoid severe consequences for the vulnerable, is vaccination. 

 

For sure, all of us will meet the virus. 

[GammaGlobulin]

31 minutes ago, amexpat said:

According to the World Health Organisation (2016), there are around 2 billion adults overweight, 

I had no idea there were that many Americans, did you?

I am becoming fatter by the day. 

 

But, I don't need to be so pear-shaped, if only I would eat less rice and begin lifting weights. 

 

NOTE:  As "amexpat" correctly cautions us...  We need to LOSE WEIGHT, Lift Weights, and walk/run in order to become more physically fit. The alternative, just possibly, might not be a pretty picture.  The virus loves fat people.

Edited September 6, 2021 by GammaGlobulin

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

5 hours ago, starky said:

some of us want to get back to living.

 Or getting sick, hospitalized and/or dying for those who fail to follow well-known and understood COVID precautions like getting vaccinated, wearing face masks and observing social distancing....

 

[GammaGlobulin]

10 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 Or getting sick, hospitalized and/or dying for those who fail to follow well-known and understood COVID precautions like getting vaccinated, wearing face masks and observing social distancing....

 

You are so right! 

[starky]

3 hours ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 Or getting sick, hospitalized and/or dying for those who fail to follow well-known and understood COVID precautions like getting vaccinated, wearing face masks and observing social distancing....

 

2 year old protocols regarding lockdowns even many experts are distancing themselves from now . If you going to cherry pick my quotes at least try and be accurate. Never once did I show any  disdain toward the use of masks, getting vaccinated or social distancing quite the opposite in fact. Go and try and score your points off another poster. Your inaccurate representation of my post tries to paint me as something I most definitely am not.

  We are all going to get sick and and old and die if not from covid from something else. In Australia suicide, self harming, domestic abuse numbers are through the roof. Children no longer are able to socialise, congregrate, play, go to school. If there is no hope and no future for our children whats the point?

 

https://www.aihw.gov.au/suicide-self-harm-monitoring/data/populations-age-groups/intentional-self-harm-hospitalisations-among-young

 

We are a social animal we didn't develop through millions of years to live in isolation 

https://www.psycom.net/covid-19-suicide-rates

Edited September 6, 2021 by starky

[GammaGlobulin]

23 minutes ago, starky said:

2 year old protocols regarding lockdowns even many experts are distancing themselves from now . If you going to cherry pick my quotes at least try and be accurate. Never once did I show any  disdain toward the use of masks, getting vaccinated or social distancing quite the opposite in fact. Go and try and score your points off another poster. Your inaccurate representation of my post tries to paint me as something I most definitely am not.

  We are all going to get sick and and old and die if not from covid from something else. In Australia suicide, self harming, domestic abuse numbers are through the roof. Children no longer are able to socialise, congregrate, play, go to school. If there is no hope and no future for our children whats the point?

 

https://www.aihw.gov.au/suicide-self-harm-monitoring/data/populations-age-groups/intentional-self-harm-hospitalisations-among-young

 

We are a social animal we didn't develop through millions of years to live in isolation 

https://www.psycom.net/covid-19-suicide-rates

You are very correct.  The damage done from isolation can be far worse than what it is intended to cure.

There must be a strategy that weighs costs and benefits. I think that most people recognize that your point is understood by most people.

As you say, there comes a time when we must move forward.

To do anything less would cause great harm, as you say. 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

1 hour ago, starky said:

2 year old protocols regarding lockdowns even many experts are distancing themselves from now . If you going to cherry pick my quotes at least try and be accurate. Never once did I show any  disdain toward the use of masks, getting vaccinated or social distancing quite the opposite in fact. Go and try and score your points off another poster. Your inaccurate representation of my post tries to paint me as something I most definitely am not.

  We are all going to get sick and and old and die if not from covid from something else. In Australia suicide, self harming, domestic abuse numbers are through the roof. Children no longer are able to socialise, congregrate, play, go to school. If there is no hope and no future for our children whats the point?

 

https://www.aihw.gov.au/suicide-self-harm-monitoring/data/populations-age-groups/intentional-self-harm-hospitalisations-among-young

 

We are a social animal we didn't develop through millions of years to live in isolation 

https://www.psycom.net/covid-19-suicide-rates

 

How does getting vaccinated, wearing face mask and engaging in social distancing involve your dreaded lockdowns or isolation?  The simple fact is, none of those do.  And I don't know of any legitimate "experts" who are distancing themselves from those fundamental precepts. Just the opposite, they're doubling down on them when far to many people are beginning to ignore them.

 

But it's the people who want to act like nothing is different and just carry on with no precautions that are the cause of the virus resurging and cases and deaths rising at various places around the world.

[thaibeachlovers]

7 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

How does getting vaccinated, wearing face mask and engaging in social distancing involve your dreaded lockdowns or isolation?  The simple fact is, none of those do.  And I don't know of any legitimate "experts" who are distancing themselves from those fundamental precepts. Just the opposite, they're doubling down on them when far to many people are beginning to ignore them.

 

But it's the people who want to act like nothing is different and just carry on with no precautions that are the cause of the virus resurging and cases and deaths rising at various places around the world.

Oh, how awful that humans are behaving like humans and not some species more amenable to the dictat from on high.

If only people would just do what they are told, how perfect the world would be.

[GammaGlobulin]

Obviously, if only we would follow the science, then we could still accomplish most of what we wish to accomplish, and we could get on with our happy lives.

 

The sooner we follow the science, then the sooner we will overcome this disgusting virus.

 

We all need to move forward, and no one wants to prolong the agony.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

34 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Oh, how awful that humans are behaving like humans and not some species more amenable to the dictat from on high.

If only people would just do what they are told, how perfect the world would be.

 

I don't need anyone to TELL me what to do. Given there's a highly contagious virus circulating around the world and including here, just following common sense precautions would seem to be a pretty simple thing... At least, for those who are capable of exercising some common sense.

 

On the other hand, some folks never do figure it out:

 

Conservative radio host who called himself "Mr. Anti-Vax" dies of COVID-19

 

"Yet another right-wing radio host who spent months railing against public health and vaccination efforts succumbed to COVID-19 this weekend after a protracted battle with the virus. 

 

Marc Bernier, who called himself "Mr. Anti-Vax" at one point, died Saturday night after spending three weeks in the hospital. The news was announced by Florida's WNDB-AM/FM on Facebook. He was 65.

 

Consistent until the end, Bernier's last tweet compared vaccination outreach efforts to Nazi Germany."

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/conservative-radio-host-who-called-himself-mr-anti-vax-dies-of-covid-19/

 

Or some do figure it out, but only after it's too late:

 

Florida radio and Newsmax host who opposed Covid vaccine dies of Covid complications

 

Dick Farrel "texted me and told me to 'Get it!' He told me this virus is no joke and he said, 'I wish I had gotten it!'" a friend wrote on Facebook.

 

Dick Farrel, a former right-wing radio host in Florida and anchor on Newsmax TV, died Wednesday of complications from Covid-19, NBC affiliate WPTV of West Palm Beach reported.
 

"He was known as the other Rush Limbaugh. With a heavy heart, I can only say this was so unexpected. He will be missed,” Farrel's partner, Kit Farley, wrote on Facebook, according to WPTV.

...

Farrel was a vocal and staunch advocate against the coronavirus vaccines, which he posted about on social media, once calling them "bogus." He also railed against figures like Dr. Anthony Fauci, whom he called a "lying freak."
 

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/florida-radio-newsmax-host-who-opposed-covid-vaccine-dies-covid-n1276304

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

And some others are simply lost causes, leaving behind a pregnant wife and three children in the cause of his personal "freedom," but totally mindless of his personal "responsibilities."

 

Texas anti-mask organizer, 30, dies of COVID

 

Caleb Wallace, a Texas anti-mask organizer who allegedly treated himself with the horse dewormer ivermectin, has died after contracting COVID-19. He was 30 and is survived by his pregnant wife and three children.

 

Wallace founded the anti-mandate group "The San Angelo Freedom Defenders." Its Facebook page says its goal is to "encourage [citizens] to actively participate in their duty to secure God-given and constitutionally protected rights." On the Fourth of July, Wallace organized a so-called "Freedom Rally" for people "sick of the government being in control of our lives."

...

By late July, Wallace was infected with the coronavirus. According to the San Angelo Standard-Times, he tried to treat himself with ivermectin. Ivermectin is widely available as a deworming agent for livestock, but over the last year has become increasingly popular among fringe groups who distrust doctors and vaccines.

 

https://www.sfgate.com/coronavirus/article/caleb-wallace-anti-mask-rally-death-covid-16419641.php

Edited September 6, 2021 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[starky]

1 hour ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

How does getting vaccinated, wearing face mask and engaging in social distancing involve your dreaded lockdowns or isolation?  The simple fact is, none of those do.  And I don't know of any legitimate "experts" who are distancing themselves from those fundamental precepts. Just the opposite, they're doubling down on them when far to many people are beginning to ignore them.

 

But it's the people who want to act like nothing is different and just carry on with no precautions that are the cause of the virus resurging and cases and deaths rising at various places around the world.

It's you misquoting me that's the issue mate. As is again trying to state im not in favour of social distancing, mask wearing or vaccination. Is English comprehension an issue for you?

  Maybe you could also list for us all the experts you personally know and liase with so we could more broadly understand your position. The issue is you assuming you have a perfect understanding of all epidemiological aspects of covid and no one else's opinion is of merit . 

 Your singularly huge ego is affecting your perception. 

Edited September 6, 2021 by starky

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

7 minutes ago, starky said:

It's you misquoting me that's the issue mate.

 

Strange. When you reply to my comments about vaccinations, face mask wearing and social distancing with the following comment, it pretty much sounds like you're taking issue with those precautions:

 

"2 year old protocols regarding lockdowns even many experts are distancing themselves from now."  Which, of course, they're actually NOT doing...

 

[GammaGlobulin]

Fine. 

But, can we just keep in mind that:

 

aa.  Science is not a democracy.

bb. There is only one coxswain at a time.

cc.  The helmsman must be guided by science, and so should we all.

dd.  There are always uncertain cost/benefit judgements to be made.

ee.  Rarely is it possible to determine what is right or wrong without hindsight.

 

We are alive at the moment; don't complain too much.

 

I have very little to complain about, other than not having anyone to complain to.

 

Soon, this will all be over, too soon.

[The Hammer2021]

It's not your choice. Government regulations have dictated what we can or can not do. I know of nobody who has lives in quarantine fear. Since April 2020 most people have gone about business as normal as they have been allowed to or can get away with.

[Sudarut]

17 hours ago, GammaGlobulin said:

Most girls don't have the power nor the stamina to row like men.

This is why male rowers only tolerate female rowers, very good-naturedly.

 

I have never taken female rowers seriously, simply because their boats are slow. 

A trained female rower will easily beat an untrained male rower no matter how fit and strong the male is.  I know this first hand. 

[pomchop]

"I am sick of this giving in to the virus. I do not want to just continue waiting around for some miracle cure. And now, we know that this miracle cure will never happen, and that it is an impossibility."

 

 

There is no cure but we do have fantastic vaccines that are more than 90% effective at protecting you and preventing massive spread.  If only we could get people to get over "playing doctor or scientists" and celebrating that they have found some obscure web source pretending to know more than the experts. 

 

In doubt, just take a look at the stats on how many hospitalized people are no vac compared to vaccinated people.  How many deaths from no vac compared to vaccinated. You don't need to be a scientist to see that the risk /reward of taking a simple shot or two is your best bet to protect yourself and others from getting really sick. 

 

Yet millions continue to refuse citing all kinds of conspiracy theories to defend not getting shots....don't believe in science etc until they get sick then run to local hospital to get treated by methods created by the very science they deny.  Doctors/nurses all over USA are burnt out from having to work night and day. putting themselves and their family at risk to treat no vac people of self inflicted wounds.  Watch for more of them to quit as many say " i did not sign up for this"....try and imagine what their lives have been for past couple of years.

 

  IF IF IF in USA the 40% of unvac people would go get the FREE shots covid would no longer continue to destroy "normal life" and the whole thing would mostly peter out within a couple of months.

Edited September 6, 2021 by onthedarkside
BOLD formatting removed

[starky]

4 hours ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

And some others are simply lost causes, leaving behind a pregnant wife and three children in the cause of his personal "freedom," but totally mindless of his personal "responsibilities."

 

Texas anti-mask organizer, 30, dies of COVID

 

Caleb Wallace, a Texas anti-mask organizer who allegedly treated himself with the horse dewormer ivermectin, has died after contracting COVID-19. He was 30 and is survived by his pregnant wife and three children.

 

Wallace founded the anti-mandate group "The San Angelo Freedom Defenders." Its Facebook page says its goal is to "encourage [citizens] to actively participate in their duty to secure God-given and constitutionally protected rights." On the Fourth of July, Wallace organized a so-called "Freedom Rally" for people "sick of the government being in control of our lives."

...

By late July, Wallace was infected with the coronavirus. According to the San Angelo Standard-Times, he tried to treat himself with ivermectin. Ivermectin is widely available as a deworming agent for livestock, but over the last year has become increasingly popular among fringe groups who distrust doctors and vaccines.

 

https://www.sfgate.com/coronavirus/article/caleb-wallace-anti-mask-rally-death-covid-16419641.php

Further and further off topic and further and further down the rabbit hole.... This is a discussion about how and when the world may be open up no one is discrediting doctors or being anti vaxx or anti mask or anti social distancing.

Edited September 6, 2021 by onthedarkside
flame comments removed

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

4 hours ago, pomchop said:

 

  IF IF IF in USA the 40% of unvac people would go get the FREE shots covid would no longer continue to destroy "normal life" and the whole thing would mostly peter out within a couple of months.

 

At this point, a pandemic/epidemic of the unvaccinated for the most part, in terms of serious illness and deaths.

 

 

[thaibeachlovers]

9 hours ago, pomchop said:

Yet millions continue to refuse citing all kinds of conspiracy theories to defend not getting shots....don't believe in science etc until they get sick then run to local hospital to get treated by methods created by the very science they deny.

If millions are sceptical, blame the pro side for not being able to present a compelling case that satisfies the doubters. IMO not helped by the governments stuffing up so frequently eg not abiding by their own rules, and changing their minds too often.

 

IMO IF this really is as bad as is claimed, they should have gone to a war footing, ceased politics as usual and formed coalition governments to work out a united strategy.

Trying to carry on politics as usual and not presenting a united front is IMO why many just don't believe the official dictat.

Some even oppose the official line as it appears the "leaders" are using the situation to impose an unwanted agenda under the guise of "saving us", and using fear to compel, and not persuasion to convince.

Using fear is never a good political tactic and eventually backfires IMO.

[thaibeachlovers]

9 hours ago, Sudarut said:

A trained female rower will easily beat an untrained male rower no matter how fit and strong the male is.  I know this first hand. 

IMO in such comparisons we should use like for like.

[thaibeachlovers]

10 hours ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

And some others are simply lost causes, leaving behind a pregnant wife and three children in the cause of his personal "freedom," but totally mindless of his personal "responsibilities."

 

Texas anti-mask organizer, 30, dies of COVID

 

Caleb Wallace, a Texas anti-mask organizer who allegedly treated himself with the horse dewormer ivermectin, has died after contracting COVID-19. He was 30 and is survived by his pregnant wife and three children.

 

Wallace founded the anti-mandate group "The San Angelo Freedom Defenders." Its Facebook page says its goal is to "encourage [citizens] to actively participate in their duty to secure God-given and constitutionally protected rights." On the Fourth of July, Wallace organized a so-called "Freedom Rally" for people "sick of the government being in control of our lives."

...

By late July, Wallace was infected with the coronavirus. According to the San Angelo Standard-Times, he tried to treat himself with ivermectin. Ivermectin is widely available as a deworming agent for livestock, but over the last year has become increasingly popular among fringe groups who distrust doctors and vaccines.

 

https://www.sfgate.com/coronavirus/article/caleb-wallace-anti-mask-rally-death-covid-16419641.php

Sad story, but we can't use the example of an extremely tiny minority to dictate policy for all.