Several factors make Thais vulnerable to Omicron variant infection

[swm59nj]

All the vaccines drop in efficacy after a certain period of time.  But there is a difference.  Especially when you have a vaccine such as Sinovac which only starts off with 51% efficacy compared to one in the 90’s  or 80’s .

Edited December 29, 2021 by swm59nj

[wombat]

With all the fear and paranoia being generated by a succession of ?experts getting their 30 seconds of fame, why was this sent out?

3 days and it's done and dusted is less than a bad cold.

Edited December 29, 2021 by wombat

[canerandagio]

17 hours ago, JackGats said:

"A three-dose course of the Pfizer or Moderna mRNA vaccines is said to be 10 times more effective than a three-dose course of AstraZeneca."

 

"Is said to be", exactly. Says the media (and everybody else):

 

Chinese and Russian vaccines = worthless

European vaccine (Astra Zeneca) = average

US vaccines (Pfizer & Moderna) = very good

 

The Pfizer vaccine is so good that Israel will soon have administered 4 of it already.

Is this your personal ranking of geograohic preferences or there is a study behind?

[dave moir]

18 hours ago, Pouatchee said:

No siht... is he still on the sinocrap bandwagon or is he talking about the real vaccines he used to scoff at?

What real vaccines?

[itsari]

51 minutes ago, Millcx said:

Chinese and Russian vaccines is as effective as cats <deleted>… Wake up .. Flu is here to stay and we need to do what we did with all other viruses … This one made Anutin and the elite rich … time to allow all those millionaire Indians to land the tAT have up in that plane they mentioned 18 months ago 5555555

The shoe is on the other foot when it comes to waking up Millcx .

[itsari]

13 hours ago, mancub said:

Perhaps just a bit too subtle for you ? The last line more than a hint of sarcasm, maybe ?

What has being subtle got to do with your statements being worthless ? 

The last line could be considered sarcasm at your worthless comments about Chinese and Russian vaccines .

[vandeventer]

1 hour ago, hotchilli said:

Lack of personal hygiene, crowded public transport, large family gatherings, provincial festivals, crowded markets, lack of Covid procedures at work places, national holidays which encourage travel.

There's my seven factors.

There may be more, like wearing masts on their chin and using their hand to wipe their butt.

[Cake Monster]

One of the major factors that make Thais more susceptible to Omicron is not mentioned at all.

Its the burning need to sit around in large groups eating, drinking and talking, for hours on end.

All of which are activities  that render people mask less, and will spread the Omicron really fast

[Danderman123]

2 hours ago, MuuDaeng said:

Hardly any person under the age of 60 in normal condition has so far contracted a serious illness due to omicron. The risk has been small throughout the epidemic, and now so negligible that cannot understand this endless vaxxine scheisse, and people still living in deep fear after two years of..., in fact could ask after what.

More kids hospitalized with COVID-19 as Omicron spreads: "We need to get child vaccinations up"

[hotchilli]

18 hours ago, JackGats said:

Chinese and Russian vaccines = worthless

European vaccine (Astra Zeneca) = average

US vaccines (Pfizer & Moderna) = very good

 

The Pfizer vaccine is so good that Israel will soon have administered 4 of it already.

Didn't seem to help the Israeli guy who skipped the hotel in Bangkok to get some fun down in Samui?

[Grusa]

Everybody, please stop with the scaremongering!

[BE88]

Omicron is our small problem while the floods forecast for next year will be our biggest problem.

 

 

[steevjee]

2 hours ago, MuuDaeng said:

Hardly any person under the age of 60 in normal condition has so far contracted a serious illness due to omicron. The risk has been small throughout the epidemic, and now so negligible that cannot understand this endless vaxxine scheisse, and people still living in deep fear after two years of..., in fact could ask after what.

Anti vax dribble ????

[bkkcanuck8]

20 hours ago, ikke1959 said:

Thais are vulnerable to omicron because the first doses of Sinovac were not effective enough, later they started to give third/booster of Astra and Pfizer. Moderna has just entered the country. Indeed all the vaccines are less effective after a few months, but with the mix nobody knows exactly how long and how good you are protected... And we don't think about lesser doses they would give under the skin or jab as they wanted to do... It are dangerous times surely because the holiday celebrations are going to start and not being cancelled to control the outbreak.

The COVID vaccine half-life is closer to the Flu Vaccine half-life unfortunately...  Vaccinations will lose their ability to protect after maybe 5 or 6 months at best.  Anti-bodies die off over time, and the long term vaccine protection where your body 'remembers' [B lymphocytes; memory cells] do not seem to keep a 'blueprint' for rapidly recreating the antibodies necessary when needed.   This is not noticeable with the Flu vaccine because that one basically gets reformulated every year because there are lots and lots of Flu strains out there - and seasonly the flu strains tend to differ (there is only one COVID strain that we are concerned about at this time [multiple variants]).  For now, regular boosters will likely be needed (maybe every 6 months). This may change as the virus becomes a normal endemic virus that our body learns to deal with.

 

It will likely be another few weeks before we know for sure, but it seems that the Omicron variant is much more transmissible -- but also less severe (meaning that more people will get it - but the hospitalizations will be less likely to be needed if you do catch it).  If this is true, then our healthcare systems may not be as much at risk of being overwhelmed... which is really what lockdowns are suppose to help alleviate.

Edited December 29, 2021 by bkkcanuck8

[Tropposurfer]

20 hours ago, Bkk Brian said:

When I see a doctor recommending the following (from the linked article):

 

"Dr. Thiravat said the best way to administer a booster shot is via subcutaneous (under the skin) injection.

Medication to treat symptoms from the Omicron variant infection is as important as vaccination in reducing the risk of hospitalisation or death, he said, adding that such medications include the Fah Talai Jone Thai herbal medicine, Ivermectin, Fluoxetine or Fluvoxamine."

 

Then I know its time to ignore anything else he mentioned also.

Oh sweet mother of God! Dr T has been watching OANN or Dr Rogan me thinks hahahaha ????????????????

[bkkcanuck8]

2 hours ago, MuuDaeng said:

Hardly any person under the age of 60 in normal condition has so far contracted a serious illness due to omicron. The risk has been small throughout the epidemic, and now so negligible that cannot understand this endless vaxxine scheisse, and people still living in deep fear after two years of..., in fact could ask after what.

This risk of death in most countries is around 1%, the risk of 'long COVID' is significantly higher at maybe 5%.  COVID was first classified as a respiratory virus, but the medical community now thinks this may have been an incorrect classification that it should really be classified as a cardio-vascular virus (the reason why we have more varied symptoms).   I won't have anything to complain about if I die, but I really don't want to be stuck with 'long COVID'.   A vaccination lowers the risk of catching it (it does not prevent it, it readies your body to fight it once you get infected as with all vaccines -- basically it is an attempt to prevent a foothold situation).  If you do unfortunately 'catch it' it significantly reduces the severity and risk of hospitalization - and the 'long COVID' potential...  Vaccination (which I have received fully vaccinated as of 2.5 months ago, and I will get a booster in maybe March 31st next year) is one of many things that you can do to reduce your risks (wearing a mask reduces your chances of spreading it if you do catch it; and others wearing a mask will in turn reduce the chance of someone else spreading it to you -- is another)....

 

Vaccines are probably one of the major reasons why the average lifespan has nearly doubled over the last century...  no guarantees, but it raises the chances you will lead a longer life with less health issues... so I find this antivaxxer crowd to be .... silly.    

[SiSePuede419]

20 hours ago, ikke1959 said:

Moderna has just entered the country.

My wife signed up months ago because her rice farmer parents wanted American vaccines, same as their son in law. 

 

They're just getting the 2nd shot today.

 

Of course, the same hospital is providing free AZ and Pfizer shots now, but I told my wife Moderna is #1 and worth the wait. ????

[SiSePuede419]

12 minutes ago, Tropposurfer said:

Oh sweet mother of God! Dr T has been watching OANN or Dr Rogan me thinks

Why can't the great "Doctor" Rogan find a cure for baldness already? ????

[placeholder]

1 hour ago, vandeventer said:

There may be more, like wearing masts on their chin and using their hand to wipe their butt.

Actually, it's farangs who mostly use their hands to wipe the their butt. But, of course, their hands are protected by that impervious armor commonly called "toilet paper".

[placeholder]

1 hour ago, swm59nj said:

All the vaccines drop in efficacy after a certain period of time.  But there is a difference.  Especially when you have a vaccine such as Sinovac which only starts off with 51% efficacy compared to one in the 90’s  or 80’s .

You don't seem to understand that that efficacy (effectiveness actually) is not just one thing. There is effectiveness against transmission, effectiveness against serious illness, and effectiveness against death. In the last 2 categories coronavac has performed very effectively.

Edited December 29, 2021 by placeholder

[Sheryl]

2 hours ago, AMFWolfie said:

Not strictly true!! If Omicron was airborne the whole world would have it. The virus is transmitted on minute droplets of water from sneezing, coughing etc from an infectious host much the same as all types of these viruses are transmitted including the flue and common cold which on the scale of things which is why its such a small percentage of people being infected

It is almost certainly aerosolized. Even the earlier variants were, and given Omicron's higher infectivity and that it is obviously being spread by asymptomatic people, it has to be.

 

As to the whole world having it, seems to be well on the way to that happening, though in many people (the young, the vaccinated) it will be so mild they will never know it.

[khunPer]

19 hours ago, JackGats said:

"A three-dose course of the Pfizer or Moderna mRNA vaccines is said to be 10 times more effective than a three-dose course of AstraZeneca."

 

"Is said to be", exactly. Says the media (and everybody else):

 

Chinese and Russian vaccines = worthless

European vaccine (Astra Zeneca) = average

US vaccines (Pfizer & Moderna) = very good

 

The Pfizer vaccine is so good that Israel will soon have administered 4 of it already.

Apart from Pfizer's vaccine is European, developed by German BioNTech...????
Pfizer by the way, was established by two German migrants.

[bkkcanuck8]

21 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

It is almost certainly aerosolized. Even the earlier variants were, and given Omicron's higher infectivity and that it is obviously being spread by asymptomatic people, it has to be.

 

As to the whole world having it, seems to be well on the way to that happening, though in many people (the young, the vaccinated) it will be so mild they will never know it.

"aerosolized" = "minute droplets of water"

 

Surgical masks are not respirators, but they do reduce the spread of those aerosolized droplets.  And for those that say masks are useless, I hope you tell the doctor exactly that if you go under the knife for some reason.  
 

[bradiston]

20 hours ago, JackGats said:

"A three-dose course of the Pfizer or Moderna mRNA vaccines is said to be 10 times more effective than a three-dose course of AstraZeneca."

 

"Is said to be", exactly. Says the media (and everybody else):

 

Chinese and Russian vaccines = worthless

European vaccine (Astra Zeneca) = average

US vaccines (Pfizer & Moderna) = very good

 

The Pfizer vaccine is so good that Israel will soon have administered 4 of it already.

Pfizer is not a US vaccine. It's German.

[Khun Roberto]

4 hours ago, yogi yogi said:

in india some rub cow dung on the body. and find it might work against covid but not sure if its effective against omnicron

 

Edited: 
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/hpm.3257

Of course that's effective! It will ensure people keep distant from you. It could be marketed as social distancing cream. 

[Mayhem11]

This thread is blah blah. Armchair scientists talking about the relative effectiveness of types of vaccines based on the fear mongering speculation of the media. I rather doubt actual “scientists” are in a position to state the “real” position about the relative effectiveness of the vaccine. How would you theoretically determine this anyway? You would have to select a group or groups representing all of the vaccines or mixes and then conduct blood tests over the life “cycle” of the vaccine. Have you heard of this armchair scientists. I doubt it. As I said blah blah.

[Sheryl]

41 minutes ago, bkkcanuck8 said:

"aerosolized" = "minute droplets of water"

 

 Actually it means more than that. It means particles less than 50 micrometers in diameter which  can stay airborne for an extended period of time.

 

Aerosolized transmission is same as what is referred to as airborne transmission.

 

Droplets refer to particles that are heavier than air so do nto remain in the air long *but can be picked up from touching contaminated surfaces).

 

In terms of masks, cloth mask would likely suffice for droplet spread but not for aerosolized (though still better than nothing).

 

I'm flying back to Thailand Sunday and planning to double or triple mask (surgical masks) at the airport(s), on the flight (it is short flight from Cambodia so heavy masking should be possible without fainting!) and on check-in/check out at the T&G hotel.  Once out I will stay home until after the day 5-6 PCR -- easily done. 

 

Not because I fear Omicron in terms of my health - I am quadruple vaxxed (2 AZ in Thailand, 2 Pfizer in US, and last dose just 3 months ago) but because I really, really do not want to end up forcibly hospitalized so worry about test results.

 

 

[Stoker58]

“One factor, he said, is the drop in efficacy of the vaccines three months after inoculation…..”.

.

Three months is being generous, and they don’t stop you catching or transmitting covid at all, so they’re basically useless.

[VocalNeal]

Just now, Stoker58 said:

so they’re basically useless.

Don't they all reduce the symptoms an thus reduce the risk of hospitalization? That is there primary effect. 

[rabas]

36 minutes ago, Mayhem11 said:

I rather doubt actual “scientists” are in a position to state the “real” position about the relative effectiveness of the vaccine. How would you theoretically determine this anyway? You would have to select a group or groups representing all of the vaccines or mixes and then conduct blood tests over the life “cycle” of the vaccine. Have you heard of this armchair scientists. I doubt it. As I said blah blah.

Actual scientists already have. It's easy to do.

 

You almost got it right. However, it's not necessary to wait over the vaccine's life cycle. Just sample people vaccinated at given times in the past using given vaccine combinations. Then see how well their serum neutralizes Omicron. Bingo.

 

Edited December 29, 2021 by rabas