Anutin says Thai - Laos - China railway will be great benefit to Thais and nation - but there are yet more delays

[BusyB]

20 hours ago, bangon04 said:

You are correct that national government incompetence and endemic corruption are major causes of the debt trap. Let us wait and see how the CCP exploits this weakness..... no ulterior motives, probably.......

No more or less than US/UK/French or Russian motives. The Chinese have at least treated African countries far far better than western countries ever did. They have also written off lots of debt as well.

[Burma Bill]

On 1/14/2022 at 10:32 AM, webfact said:

This large commitee agreed to set up another committee and work on something called a "Framework Agreement".

By the time the high speed section between Vientiane and Bangkok is completed, the existing Chinese rolling stock will be obsolete and donated to Thailand, like the recent Japanese Hokkaido trains, to operate the line!!!!

[Eric Loh]

21 hours ago, bangon04 said:

You are correct that national government incompetence and endemic corruption are major causes of the debt trap. Let us wait and see how the CCP exploits this weakness..... no ulterior motives, probably.......

The Chinese banks re-scheduled the debt. Sympathetic and non exploitative. 

 

 

 

[bangon04]

3 hours ago, BusyB said:

No more or less than US/UK/French or Russian motives. The Chinese have at least treated African countries far far better than western countries ever did. They have also written off lots of debt as well.

in exchange for..........

[bangon04]

2 hours ago, Eric Loh said:

The Chinese banks re-scheduled the debt. Sympathetic and non exploitative. 

 

 

 

Let us wait and see.......

[BusyB]

1 hour ago, bangon04 said:

in exchange for..........

I believe they have 1, in words one, military base on the Horn of Africa.

And yes, they get raw materials. That's normal trade.

The west paints a more ugly picture with its vulture funds - especially in Africa.

 

Edited January 15, 2022 by BusyB

[EricTh]

Thailand has been dilly-dallying this project for almost a decade now.

 

Imagine a lower income country like Laos getting ahead of Thailand now. 

 

I heard from some Lao people that the project have brought economic development to the people along the route. Laos never had any modern train until now.

 

Thailand's current trains is still backwards when compared to this train.

 

Edited January 15, 2022 by EricTh

[RubbaJohnny]

On 1/14/2022 at 6:21 PM, Conquerbrqvilok said:

You are right I agree , but Russia also will not take long to enter Europe oh are already there indeed

Perhaps as Chinese expand they may yet push self identifying ethnic Slavic, orthodox, white Russians towards the Atlantic?

 

EU Propagada and a NATO viewpoint ovelooks since UK exit about half Europeans do not live in EU, Ukraines Russia UK Swiss etc. A brief understanding that the Urals are the border and origins and half European territory is in former Soviet bits Baltics Russia Belarus, Ukraine, Georgia , Armenia Azerbaijan etc  beyond the narrow sway of Protestant and catholic orthodoxies and Anglo-French Imperialism, Hispano-Habsburg and German meddling.

 

Over 90% of Russians have always lived in the European "habitable part" Prior to the trans Siberian Railway and the port of Vladivostok/Nahodka routes probably nearer 99% more people live in Mexico City and always have than all of the Asian parts colonised in late 19th century with the advent of steam.

 

There are of course people of European decent both ethnic Russians, but also Volga Germans , dispersed stetls and remnants of inter alia the 113 races, second largest Group Ukranians, others whose numbers vary due to wars, border cahnges, massacres and deportations, Trans Pontine Greeks, Lezgians,  Crimeans, Ossetians, Armenian Circasssians, Sami, Vipuri Karelians , Ingushians,, Georgians, Tatars and Cossacks deported by Soviets and Czars to what was until recently a journey of no return. The fare East was very much Russia's equivalent of the Wild West, rape pillage total disrespect for nature and traditional indigenous knowledge and cultures.

 

 

Since end of communism most those who could get out did many Jews to USA, Germany and  Israel , "Volga Germans" mainly in Central Asia those in Kazakstan to Germany etc.Those Turkic diddidents who could escape obvioulsy went to Turkey in small numbers.

Of course many well healed Russians are temporary migrants in addition to famous billionaires like Abramovich, London, Paris,Cyprus, Biarritz, Monaco Dubai and much of the the Gulf, New York and of course Pattaya to such types

 

 

Tiny nomadic populations survived such as theh Finnic Mari (Cheramisa )as Finno-Ugric, Sami,  reindeer herders and other N Siberia  Altaic folks,

 

Further East life was so tough they took their kayak and heat it to "warmer " options of Alaska, what is now Canada and all the way down to Tierra del Fuego, as Paul Simon sang they all come to look for America , luckily  immigration regimes did not deter, nor much else until the Europeans brought sword, fire, Slavery, Christianity, STDs and added sugar to the  Coca.

 

These may help explain explains the fabric of very multi cultural Russia better than I can.

 

https://toinformistoinfluence.wordpress.com/2016/04/09/russian-soviet-forced-migrations-deportations-and-ethnic-cleansing/

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_groups_in_Russia

 

 

The Alien armies on the continent of Europe  Europe have been English, Carthaginian, American , Ottoman, Almohad , Mongols a wide selection of folks telling the natives what is good for them. N ew settlers are the poor and refugees from the South and economic migrants in London from former colonies like India USA and Pakistan

Edited January 16, 2022 by RubbaJohnny

[RubbaJohnny]

On 1/14/2022 at 10:44 AM, mtls2005 said:

is noodling around with trains?

I am not an engineer but I believe the are huge structural issues in creating an envelope large enough for all that gravy the train contracts will offer.

Many buffers old and new will indeed need to form highly paid and of course highly lucrative  committees, sub committees (sorry that's for the matelots) subsidiary committees etc.

 

I wouldn't be surprised if visits to USA to see Amtrak best practice! , Eurostar Harrods sorry London, Louis Vuitton Paris TGV, Milan Fashion week of course , Roman Pendolinos, Japanese Bullet trains esp if mere annoys want to do a bit of "shopping" be a shame to let all those first class seats go to waste as they are being subsidized anyway.

In meantime the tuktuk and trucks spew out fumes at the level crossing grades in Bangkok as commuter SRT trains snails its way right under a high speed track in many places liek Makkasan ad Ramkhamhaeng.

 

Rather like a Dutch Auction contracts are to highest "envelope" bidder, Uncle Choo Choo does what it says on a new tin.

[rudi49jr]

On 1/14/2022 at 4:32 AM, webfact said:

, the Thais have been criticized for dallying at every turn.

Probably too busy negotiating who gets how big a slice of all the kickbacks…..

[spidermike007]

Who cares what he thinks or says? If there was ever a perfect embodiment of an empty suit, it is Anutin. Everyone I speak with despises him and Prayuth like never before, and holds them responsibility for most of the problems plaguing the nation, at this time. 

 

He is a nobody, who thinks he is a diety. 

[thaibeachlovers]

On 1/14/2022 at 4:44 PM, mtls2005 said:

Wouldn't the minister of transport, chidchob lead this effort?

 

I'm struggling to understand why the minister of health, with all the challenges that post faces, is noodling around with trains?

 

 

 

 

Think about it! Why does anything happen in LOS?

[thaibeachlovers]

On 1/15/2022 at 4:51 PM, Sydebolle said:

People might want to keep in mind, that Anutin unofficially runs "Sino-Thai", an engineering and construction conglomerate of largest proportions which also built the original Suvannaphoum airport

If the railway is as bad as the airport, it's not going to be good for Thailand, IMO.

 

At a time when Changi showed how it should be done, they built that suppurating pile of <deleted> instead.

[HannahD]

With seventy million people in Thailand at one end of high speed rail and one and one half billion people in China at the other end what could possibly go wrong?

[rudi49jr]

7 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Think about it! Why does anything happen in LOS?

Money and power. And apparently Anutin doesn’t have enough of either one yet. God help Thailand, though, if he becomes the next PM.

[gearbox]

54 minutes ago, HannahD said:

With seventy million people in Thailand at one end of high speed rail and one and one half billion people in China at the other end what could possibly go wrong?

Not enough passenger capacity? That's a lot of people at both ends of a single railway track.

[gearbox]

On 1/16/2022 at 12:13 AM, EricTh said:

Thailand has been dilly-dallying this project for almost a decade now.

 

Imagine a lower income country like Laos getting ahead of Thailand now. 

 

I heard from some Lao people that the project have brought economic development to the people along the route. Laos never had any modern train until now.

 

Thailand's current trains is still backwards when compared to this train.

 

Thailand is not landlocked like Laos, so probably there is not enough urgency to link the rail systems.

 

Still there are opportunities for the exporters from the North East,  provided that Laos would not charge exorbitantly to use the rail,  the Thai agricultural goods may get more competitive than say Indonesia or Malaysia.

[Highend Expat]

Laos has already fallen into the debt trap. I recommend a YouTube channel that understands what is really happening in China and has Chinese speaking journalists. 

 

We cannot post videos, so below is a screenshot of the YouTube video if interested. 

 

 

I believe I also have to provide a link (but can't post the video), so not sure what exactly to do. 

 

Link: https://youtu.be/fh0ZZP9BibY

 

 

Edited January 16, 2022 by Highend Expat

[MrJ2U]

On 1/14/2022 at 10:40 AM, ThailandRyan said:

Why is the Minister of Health chairing a transportation meeting by the way.

His family owns the company that will eventually build the track and infrastructure.

 

He's the president.

 

https://th.linkedin.com/in/anutin-charnvirakul-b26233163

 

 

[Etaoin Shrdlu]

Haven't some of the sticking points been not just about loans, interest and repayment terms, but also things like using exclusively Chinese construction firms, engineers, labor, materials and so on? Perhaps I'm mistaken or maybe Anutin has already negotiated a solution.

 

Also, I think I read some time back that the Chinese wanted to own land along the right of way and develop it for their own use. If this is true, I can see how this would be slow-walked by the current nationalistic regime.

[shdmn]

Anyone know what is happening with the Bangkok-Pattaya high speed railway?  The status is still listed as planning when they were supposed to have started construction a long time ago.   I think one of the problems is they are still trying to establish right of way.

Edited January 16, 2022 by shdmn

[thaibeachlovers]

6 hours ago, shdmn said:

Anyone know what is happening with the Bangkok-Pattaya high speed railway?  The status is still listed as planning when they were supposed to have started construction a long time ago.   I think one of the problems is they are still trying to establish right of way.

OR, perhaps the "right" people haven't been able to buy up the land yet.

[RubbaJohnny]

15 hours ago, rudi49jr said:

God help Thailand, though, if he becomes the next PM

While I agree with the sentiment, the Buddhist peasants don't believe in God, Satan or the consequences, if you have many millions of future lives no need to rush eh? ,

On the other hand their largely Chaosan masters and associated usurers have a only one God it is money, as for PMs they come and go and while impressive the twirling marionettes with gorgeous gongs, braids and badges the unmentionable thread to a puppet master remains unspeakable.

 

It Always amazes me that a train ticket inspector has more badges , gold braid than a real war hero or navy seal, they even be described as non performing seals as their last victory was towing starving dying refugees out to to their death.

The Director of the new HI SPEED GRAVY train will need to a big strong fellow as the sheer number of broaches medals, sashes will be a train spotters dream, and the sheer size of the bungs a drain spotters bonanza, once one realizes its not the public service, the improved infrastructure, the long term effectiveness or profit but the size of the upfront bung that sets priorities.

From Rice scandal to Grice scandal in a decade, anyway no one can accuse them of coming too soon. By the time LOS has caught up with China, they'll be onto hydrogne or fusion powered Maglevs.

[mtls2005]

15 hours ago, MrJ2U said:

His family owns the company that will eventually build the track and infrastructure.

 

Yes, we all know that.

 

 

Which always begged the question, why wasn't he given transport?

 

Maybe he and chidchob will reshuffle?

 

My guess is that he chaired this meeting as Deputy PM, on some rotating basis.

 

15 hours ago, MrJ2U said:

He's the president.

Is he though?

 

http://www.stecon.co.th/page_a.php?cid=36&cname=Organization Chart

 

 

 

 

[RubbaJohnny]

When Will I be able to get on a train from Thailand to China please?

[djayz]

On 1/14/2022 at 10:32 AM, webfact said:

This large commitee agreed to set up another committee

The large committee can't resolve the problems, so they set up another committee to handle them?! 

Could this be the problem?