How Thailand went from a tourist paradise to a crypto tech-giant!

[billd766]

14 hours ago, Caldera said:

Easy, sell 0.001 BTC and withdraw 1400 THB to your bank account. Or whatever amount you need.

So in reality Bitcoin is useless on it own because you actually need real world money and facilities to buy or sell it.

 

[billd766]

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-60310783

 

Record-high seizure of $5bn in stolen Bitcoin.

 

If you Google the BBC news link alongside the main story there are more stories about theft of Bitcoins going back many years.

 

Something that the Bitcoin investors don't tell anybody.

 

 

[Caldera]

1 hour ago, billd766 said:

So in reality Bitcoin is useless on it own because you actually need real world money and facilities to buy or sell it.

I wouldn't say that. But you asked how to get THB when having BTC, and I answered that question. No matter if you consider BTC another currency or an asset, it's not "useless", it just isn't legal tender in Thailand. A traveler arriving in Thailand with USD might also find that "useless" at a local market - that's what exchanges are for!

[1FinickyOne]

On 2/8/2022 at 2:34 PM, Neeranam said:

because you missed the boat. 

There was a boat? 

[lkn]

2 hours ago, billd766 said:

Something that the Bitcoin investors don't tell anybody.

The interesting thing to take from this arrest is that because of the public ledger, it will always be possible to trace, if any of your coins are from some old heist or hack.

 

For this reasons, many exchanges, and other operators in the space, will not touch “tainted” coins.

 

An attempt of a solution has been mixers, i.e. trying to conceal the origin of funds by mixing with a lot of other transactions.

 

The counter-step from the “AML-compliant” exchanges has simply been to then ban any coins that have (indirectly) been mixed. And if Coinbase won’t take your coins, soon nobody in the ecosystem will.

 

So true story here: A person needed to borrow $300,000 (mortgage). They turned to BlockFi, here they can borrow the amount by putting up 2x collateral in bitcoin and at an 10% interest rate + 2% initial fees. This person thinks bitcoin will go up > 10% p.a. so they take the loan, i.e. transfer $600,000 worth of bitcoins to BlockFi, pay a $6,000 fee to get the loan, and receive $300,000 from BlockFi.

 

At this time, 1 BTC ≈ 65,000 USDT. But this was 4 or so months ago, and price of BTC was going down.

 

So BlockFi tells them they need to provide more collateral, if they want to keep their loan, which happens a few times.

 

Two months have passed, so our lender have paid 2 × $2,500 in interests so far.

 

Now BlockFi tells them: Some of the bitcoins you provided us with are tainted, i.e. indirectly from mixing service or similar.

 

You have two options: 1. Pay back the loan in full ($300,000) and receive your bitcoins, or 2. We sell some of your bitcoins to cover the loan.

 

Unfortunately, at this time, our lender did not have $300,000 and 1 BTC ≈ 34,000 USDT.

 

BlockFi sells enough of the bitcoins to cover the loan and this means capital gains tax on $300,000 for our lender…

 

Really makes these DeFi lending services look like a great alternative to banks, right? ????

 

Of course our lender did not know their coins were tainted. Any maybe they weren’t when the loan was created, could have been Chainalysis that pushed an update to their list of tainted addresses that triggered it, or it could have been the added collateral that was tainted.

Edited February 9, 2022 by lkn

[GrandPapillon]

16 minutes ago, lkn said:

So true story here: A person needed to borrow $300,000 (mortgage). They turned to BlockFi, here they can borrow the amount by putting up 2x collateral in bitcoin and at an 10% interest rate + 2% initial fees. This person thinks bitcoin will go up > 10% p.a. so they take the loan, i.e. transfer $600,000 worth of bitcoins to BlockFi, pay a $6,000 fee to get the loan, and receive $300,000 from BlockFi.

 

At this time, 1 BTC ≈ 65,000 USDT. But this was 4 or so months ago, and price of BTC was going down.

 

So BlockFi tells them they need to provide more collateral, if they want to keep their loan, which happens a few times.

 

Two months have passed, so our lender have paid 2 × $2,500 in interests so far.

 

Now BlockFi tells them: Some of the bitcoins you provided us with are tainted, i.e. indirectly from mixing service or similar.

 

You have two options: 1. Pay back the loan in full ($300,000) and receive your bitcoins, or 2. We sell some of your bitcoins to cover the loan.

 

Unfortunately, at this time, our lender did not have $300,000 and 1 BTC ≈ 34,000 USDT.

 

BlockFi sells enough of the bitcoins to cover the loan and this means capital gains tax on $300,000 for our lender…

brilliant, these bitcoins enthusiasts aren't really smart at the end, hence why governments should protect them from themselves and just take away their dangerous toys

 

Cryptos are the equivalent of selling "guns" to children in school ????

[Neeranam]

5 hours ago, billd766 said:

He also is not stupid. He invests in real things and over the decades he has become a billionaire which is something that very few people in the world can claim to be.

 

There are many Billionaires that are into crypto too. 

[Neeranam]

4 hours ago, billd766 said:

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-60310783

 

Record-high seizure of $5bn in stolen Bitcoin.

 

If you Google the BBC news link alongside the main story there are more stories about theft of Bitcoins going back many years.

 

Something that the Bitcoin investors don't tell anybody.

 

 

I don't know why you post this kind of thing Bill. 

It's like saying after the great train robbery, don't put your money in the Post Office.

Or, last year $30 million was stolen in gold in Brazil, so don't invest in gold.  

I understand you are older and maybe not up-to-date with modern technology, but crypto is being adopted and all young people know about it and accept its adoption. 

[Neeranam]

2 hours ago, lkn said:

Really makes these DeFi lending services look like a great alternative to banks, right? ????

 Has anyone ever defaulted on their bank loan? 

I know many people that borrow from DeFi exchanges and none has been liquidated. 

I wouldn't do it but it is better than banks.

[Neeranam]

5 hours ago, billd766 said:

He also is not stupid. He invests in real things and over the decades he has become a billionaire which is something that very few people in the world can claim to be.

 

Did you know the richest man in the world invests in cryptocurrencies?

[billd766]

4 hours ago, Caldera said:

I wouldn't say that. But you asked how to get THB when having BTC, and I answered that question. No matter if you consider BTC another currency or an asset, it's not "useless", it just isn't legal tender in Thailand. A traveler arriving in Thailand with USD might also find that "useless" at a local market - that's what exchanges are for!

But for people living in Thailand where Bitcoin is not legal it cannot be used unless it can be exchanged at a bitcoin market somewhere. It is probably good for those who have money to invest but not much use for normal day to day living which is what most of expats do.

 

If you know of expats in Thailand who trade in bitcoin you could probably buy or sell through them and use the baht without going through any official sources. As an example I could ask you if you want to buy some bitcoin or part then you could pay me in cash and at a bitcoin exchange we could swap at the agreed value and both parties would be legal in the deal.

 

As for the example you give of a tourist arriving in Thailand with only USD, those USD can be exchanged at any bank or money changer across the whole of Thailand in every city, large town etc more or less instantly providing the tourist with local currency.

 

IMHO whilst the bitcoin is an investment vehicle it seems to me a bit like stocks and shares rather than real money. 

[GeorgeCross]

8 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Did you know the richest man in the world invests in cryptocurrencies?

well he would, he's the only man in the world with a bigger greater fool scam to keep pumping

 

[Neeranam]

19 hours ago, Sametboy2019 said:

Warren Buffet is old and set in his ways. I bet his grandchildren are invested in it and probably his companies.

I doubt he knows how to use a modern smartphone. 

[Neeranam]

1 minute ago, GeorgeCross said:

well he would, he's the only man in the world with a bigger greater fool scam to keep pumping

 

What are you trying to say, please elaborate.  Are you saying he's a fool?

[Farmerslife]

5 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

I doubt he knows how to use a modern smartphone. 

He's had two years to get to grips with it, I would guess he's pretty much au fait with it by now.????

https://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/2020/02/25/warren-buffett-finally-replaces-flip-phone-iphone/4866187002/

[Neeranam]

14 minutes ago, billd766 said:

But for people living in Thailand where Bitcoin is not legal it cannot be used unless it can be exchanged at a bitcoin market somewhere. It is probably good for those who have money to invest but not much use for normal day to day living which is what most of expats do.

Did you watch the video?

 

Bitcoin is legal here.  1 hour ago,  I paid for a full tank of E20 with CRO( a crypto coin kinda similar to bitcoin). Yesterday I paid 4 DTAC phone bills in crypto, and last week I paid for my daughters apartment. 

 

 

[Neeranam]

19 minutes ago, billd766 said:

MHO whilst the bitcoin is an investment vehicle it seems to me a bit like stocks and shares rather than real money. 

 

[Adumbration]

On 2/8/2022 at 2:34 PM, Neeranam said:

Why not apply for a job as moderator, then you can ban all crypto-related posts because you missed the boat. 

I do not have a dog in this fight.  But is this post not a frank admission that there are no worthwhile future gains to be had in crypto?

[Caldera]

1 hour ago, billd766 said:

But for people living in Thailand where Bitcoin is not legal it cannot be used unless it can be exchanged at a bitcoin market somewhere.

Bitcoin IS legal in Thailand. It just isn't Thailand's currency - THB is.

 

Funnily enough, this thread is about a documentary that features BitKub, a regulated (!) Thai (!) exchange. Living in Thailand, you don't need to go "somewhere" else. But you can, if that's your preference.

 

I'm a BitKub user, as I've mentioned earlier. I can use that platform to sell BTC for THB, which I can then withdraw to my Thai bank account instantly. There's nothing sinister, complicated or illegal about that process.

Edited February 9, 2022 by Caldera

[Neeranam]

13 minutes ago, Adumbration said:

I do not have a dog in this fight.  But is this post not a frank admission that there are no worthwhile future gains to be had in crypto?

There is no fight, the video shows how Thailand is adopting cryptos, which attracts the bitcoin haters. I don't like Bitcoin and don't own any but I understand how it has a use case. 

Crypto now is like the internet was in 2000, it's early days and there is a very bright future for this new asset class. 

[Neeranam]

8 minutes ago, Caldera said:

Bitcoin IS legal in Thailand. It just isn't Thailand's currency - THB is.

Bitcoin IS now the national currency of El Salvador, with 2 other American countries following soon. Yet, some still refuse to acknowledge that it is a real currency.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/El_Salvador

 

Edited February 9, 2022 by Neeranam

[peter zwart]

Ah well. If we on the Crypto tour........

[billd766]

1 hour ago, peter zwart said:

Ah well. If we on the Crypto tour........

Neeraam looks sad at the thoughts of rules, regulations and taxes.

[dj230]

Every Thai person I've spoken to who has bought crypto has told me they got scammed in some way with crypto 

[Sametboy2019]

2 hours ago, Neeranam said:

Bitcoin IS now the national currency of El Salvador, with 2 other American countries following soon. Yet, some still refuse to acknowledge that it is a real currency.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/El_Salvador

 

It's actually bitcoin wrapped running on Algorand

[Sametboy2019]

4 minutes ago, dj230 said:

Every Thai person I've spoken to who has bought crypto has told me they got scammed in some way with crypto 

Scammed in what way? They lost money? That's part of investing if you don't know what your doing...or if you invested in a pump and dump meme coin .

Do your research and invest utility coins

[Meat Pie 47]

3 hours ago, Neeranam said:

I doubt he knows how to use a modern smartphone. 

Thats why he is a billionaire and you are just pretending to know about the market

[Meat Pie 47]

2 hours ago, Neeranam said:

Bitcoin IS now the national currency of El Salvador, with 2 other American countries following soon. Yet, some still refuse to acknowledge that it is a real currency.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/El_Salvador

 

welll why don't you move to El Salvador we are in Thailand

[Neeranam]

2 hours ago, billd766 said:

Neeraam looks sad at the thoughts of rules, regulations and taxes.

I welcome regulation and tax.  India just made crypto gains taxable at 30% and 80% of those asked are going to buy, that's a lot of people. Much better than banning it, as they know they can't. 

 

Regarding your question about currency, Russia is getting in on the action. 

 

The haters here were saying a couple of weeks ago that Russia had banned crypto. 

 

https://www.cnbctv18.com/cryptocurrency/russia-likely-to-recognise-regulate-cryptocurrency-as-form-of-currency-in-2022-report-12421582.htm

[Neeranam]

2 hours ago, dj230 said:

Every Thai person I've spoken to who has bought crypto has told me they got scammed in some way with crypto 

Ridiculous hate post and I don't believe you.

 I am Thai and know not one person who has been scammed.  I know a few who have been scammed with stock and share get rich schemes.