No increase for Thai based UK Pensioners: vote here to get this changed

[Sparktrader]

Dont save

 

Marry rich or inherit

[Will B Good]

2 minutes ago, KarenBravo said:

I followed a plan that turned out well.

Up to the age of 25 I spent everything I earned; after all, you're only young once.

From 25 to 30 I saved something, it didn't matter how small, it was to instill the habit of saving.

After 30, I saved as much as I can.

 

I'm now invested in high dividend companies within ETFs. Each year I'm making between 5% to 8%.

 

The lesson here, is that you have to start saving early. Starting at 50 isn't really good enough, though every bit helps.

Got all my kids doing something similar.......I didn't have a clue at their age, but share trading and the like was nothing like it is now.

 

They are stuffing everything into shares ISA's and if full their SIPP's.

[Will B Good]

6 minutes ago, bradiston said:

I worked out that over the next 10 years, a frozen pension would lose me about £10k at 2.5% annual increase. And I'm not even on a full one. But maybe my spreadsheeting skills are awry.

Compound interest is the 8th wonder of the world....Albert Einstein 

[bradiston]

2 hours ago, Neeranam said:

Do you think British expats in Thailand should pay tax in both counties? 

Well now you've dragged Thailand into the equation. No, I dont. And they aren't required to. But there again I don't know many Thais that actually pay income tax, and if they do it's probably a fraction of what they actually are liable for. But so what? It's the same everywhere. But your tax payments in Thailand aren't contributing to the UK economy, that was my point. And as for relieving the UK government of the burden of paying your dole money by moving abroad, well you may have a point. In more ways than one!

[bradiston]

4 minutes ago, Will B Good said:

Compound interest is the 8th wonder of the world....Albert Einstein 

Quite agree

[Neeranam]

37 minutes ago, bradiston said:

Excuse my ignorance, I'm intrigued, but none of this makes any sense to me at all. If you're not fully paid up I don't see how you will get a fully paid up pension. I mean, I've figured you're what, 57? You started work while at school in the UK, aged 15, ie ~42 years ago, for 2 years, continued on through 5 years of uni, but left the country sometime in your early to mid 20s? You returned maybe 15 years ago, aged ~42 maybe, but decided not to voluntarily pay class 3, but 5 years later, presumably aged about 47, you returned and found you were eligible to pay class 2. You backpaid 10 years, to age 37 maybe, but you seem to have only paid a fraction of the stamps required, if you started payment only 10 years ago, by your estimate.

Excused, but not the rude assumptions ???? 

 

41 years ago started contributions started, aged 15. 

 

left around 27.

 

12 years paid, due to being at school and two unis and work/unemployed. 

 

10 years paid contributions 9 years ago = 21 years.

 

9 years paid since then = 30 years

 

The next 10 years will pay =  40 years -  full pension. 

 

 

As for the BTC reference  -  it makes no sense, if one has funds elsewhere, why would they not claim a pension? I saw it as a good investment -  pay 6,000 baht a year for 20 years to get back 30,000 baht  a month for hopefully 10 years+  

 

[Neeranam]

4 minutes ago, bradiston said:

But there again I don't know many Thais that actually pay income tax, and if they do it's probably a fraction of what they actually are liable for.

Well that says more than you realize ????  

 

All Thais I know pay tax, I've no idea why you don't know any who do. Do you live in Thailand?

 

 

[KarenBravo]

21 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Excused, but not the rude assumptions ???? 

 

41 years ago started contributions started, aged 15. 

 

left around 27.

 

12 years paid, due to being at school and two unis and work/unemployed. 

 

10 years paid contributions 9 years ago = 21 years.

 

9 years paid since then = 30 years

 

The next 10 years will pay =  40 years -  full pension. 

 

 

As for the BTC reference  -  it makes no sense, if one has funds elsewhere, why would they not claim a pension? I saw it as a good investment -  pay 6,000 baht a year for 20 years to get back 30,000 baht  a month for hopefully 10 years+  

 

You have to pay 12% per month of your monthly income.

If you contributed 6000 Bt, this means you were only making 50k per month. A little over 100 pounds per month. Right?

[billd766]

3 hours ago, Tofer said:

It's not now calculated against how much you paid, it's simply the number of years you contributed. Now the pension is called a basic pension, i.e. levelled for everyone, so any serps you may have earned from an above average earned income have been discounted entirely, much to my annoyance.

I paid in for 44 years. later it was changed to somewhere between 30 and 36 years I believe and they would get the same rate as someone like me who had paid in for 44 years.

 

Whichever way you look at it the people who are on frozen pensions still won't get their pensions unfrozen

4 hours ago, Neeranam said:

Nope, I just signed into the Govt site and this is my forecast.

 

Are you not a naturalised Thai Now? AFAIR you fiercely defend Thailand against everything. If you are a naturalised Thai then why are you going to claim a UK pension? Did you not have to give up UK citizenship when you became a Naturalised Thai?

[bradiston]

19 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Well that says more than you realize ????  

 

All Thais I know pay tax, I've no idea why you don't know any who do. Do you live in Thailand?

 

 

I'll take the 5th on that last one. But yes, I have lived in Thailand and I got married there in 1986. I've moved to the Philippines in order to hopefully reap the benefits of the UK agreement not to freeze pensions here. It seems totally arbitrary but no doubt there are reasons.

 

I've always found tax to be a subject giving rise to great mirth amongst my Thai friends. Not to be taken too seriously in other words, which is a great characteristic of Thai people I know. Laugh at it, or cry over it. Take your pick.

 

[IvorBiggun2]

On 3/25/2022 at 5:59 AM, Gottfrid said:

However, they neither inject their money in the country that gives it to them. So, there we have the reason.

I pay UK tax on my pensions.

[bradiston]

42 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Excused, but not the rude assumptions ???? 

 

41 years ago started contributions started, aged 15. 

 

left around 27.

 

12 years paid, due to being at school and two unis and work/unemployed. 

 

10 years paid contributions 9 years ago = 21 years.

 

9 years paid since then = 30 years

 

The next 10 years will pay =  40 years -  full pension. 

 

 

As for the BTC reference  -  it makes no sense, if one has funds elsewhere, why would they not claim a pension? I saw it as a good investment -  pay 6,000 baht a year for 20 years to get back 30,000 baht  a month for hopefully 10 years+  

 

Did you voluntarily pay stamps while at school and uni, or were you working throughout? I'm just trying to fill in the gaps in the information you've given out, not quizzing you!

 

[Will B Good]

Just now, bradiston said:

Did you voluntarily pay stamps while at school and uni, or were you working throughout? I'm just trying to fill in the gaps in the information you've given out, not quizzing you!

 

Just thought.......are you from the DWP?.....555

[IvorBiggun2]

On 3/25/2022 at 12:17 PM, Gottfrid said:

But, then you would have to pay tax in the country you chose to reside instead.

Not necessarily true. Depends how much you can earn before you are liable for tax payments.

[bradiston]

1 minute ago, Will B Good said:

Just thought.......are you from the DWP?.....555

Yeah, I realised it was starting to look like that. There are just so many missing bits in @Neeranam 's story. Not that there's anything funny about it, it's just to make any sense of it I find myself continually having to say "But wait... I don't understand", and ask another set of questions. Time to quit I guess.

[Will B Good]

1 minute ago, bradiston said:

Yeah, I realised it was starting to look like that. There are just so many missing bits in @Neeranam 's story. Not that there's anything funny about it, it's just to make any sense of it I find myself continually having to say "But wait... I don't understand", and ask another set of questions. Time to quit I guess.

A riddle wrapped up in an enigma...555

[bradiston]

12 minutes ago, IvorBiggun2 said:

On 3/25/2022 at 6:59 AM, Gottfrid said:

However, they neither inject their money in the country that gives it to them. So, there we have the reason.

But nowhere does it say this money has to be spent in the UK. What an absurd notion. And in any case, the contributions made came from UK earnings, tax paid. I dare anybody to come up with a justification for this outrageous ruling. The government just say it would cost too much to change, but they were the ones that introduced it in the first place.

[KarenBravo]

41 minutes ago, KarenBravo said:

You have to pay 12% per month of your monthly income.

If you contributed 6000 Bt, this means you were only making 50k per month. A little over 100 pounds per month. Right?

 

@ Neeranam

A sad face doesn't contribute anything.

Are my sums correct, or not?

Edited March 28, 2022 by KarenBravo

[Will B Good]

4 minutes ago, bradiston said:

But nowhere does it say this money has to be spent in the UK. What an absurd notion. And in any case, the contributions made came from UK earnings, tax paid. I dare anybody to come up with a justification for this outrageous ruling. The government just say it would cost too much to change, but they were the ones that introduced it in the first place.

Plus you get your pension increase in some countries but not others........where is the logic in that?

Edited March 28, 2022 by Will B Good

[Neeranam]

30 minutes ago, bradiston said:

I've moved to the Philippines in order to hopefully reap the benefits of the UK agreement not to freeze pensions here. It seems totally arbitrary but no doubt there are reasons.

I'm sure there are other reasons, fair enough. 

[Neeranam]

4 minutes ago, KarenBravo said:

 

@ Neeranam

A sad face doesn't contribute anything.

Are my sums correct, or not?

It's a confused face.

[Neeranam]

46 minutes ago, KarenBravo said:

You have to pay 12% per month of your monthly income.

If you contributed 6000 Bt, this means you were only making 50k per month. A little over 100 pounds per month. Right?

No, this is not right, I've no idea what you are talking about. 

[bradiston]

3 minutes ago, Will B Good said:

Plus....why some countries but not others........where is the logic in that?

Agree, it's just bizarre.

 

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/state-pensions-annual-increases-if-you-live-abroad/countries-where-we-pay-an-annual-increase-in-the-state-pension

 

Below is an abbreviated list excluding the EEA and Switzerland:

 

If you live in one of the following countries and receive a UK State Pension, you will usually get an increase in your pension every year:

 

Barbados

Bermuda

Bosnia-Herzegovina

Gibraltar

Guernsey

the Isle of Man

Israel

Jamaica

Jersey

Kosovo

Mauritius

Montenegro

North Macedonia

the Philippines

Serbia

Turkey

USA

 

So quite a choice.

[Neeranam]

26 minutes ago, bradiston said:

Did you voluntarily pay stamps while at school and uni, or were you working throughout? I'm just trying to fill in the gaps in the information you've given out, not quizzing you!

 

I was working throughout part-time, so those years qualify. Actually, it doesn't matter if I was working or not. 

In Education or unemployed, the govt pay the contributions.

Edited March 28, 2022 by Neeranam

[BritManToo]

49 minutes ago, KarenBravo said:

You have to pay 12% per month of your monthly income.

If you contributed 6000 Bt, this means you were only making 50k per month. A little over 100 pounds per month. Right?

Minimum payment for a full years NI when working in the UK was around 400 GBP/year earned in monthly chunks of 50 quid or over (so 400 quid from you, 400 quid from employer). Which almost exactly matches the class 3 voluntary contributions.

 

I retired at age 45, then just worked enough to get a full years NI payments, and my yearly income topped up to 15,000 pounds by child tax credit between 2001 and 2009. Money for nothing!

[Neeranam]

3 minutes ago, bradiston said:

Agree, it's just bizarre.

 

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/state-pensions-annual-increases-if-you-live-abroad/countries-where-we-pay-an-annual-increase-in-the-state-pension

 

Below is an abbreviated list excluding the EEA and Switzerland:

 

If you live in one of the following countries and receive a UK State Pension, you will usually get an increase in your pension every year:

 

Barbados

Bermuda

Bosnia-Herzegovina

Gibraltar

Guernsey

the Isle of Man

Israel

Jamaica

Jersey

Kosovo

Mauritius

Montenegro

North Macedonia

the Philippines

Serbia

Turkey

USA

 

So quite a choice.

I quite fancy Mauritius or Barbados, or Cayman Islands. 

[Neeranam]

43 minutes ago, billd766 said:

I paid in for 44 years. later it was changed to somewhere between 30 and 36 years I believe and they would get the same rate as someone like me who had paid in for 44 years.

 

Whichever way you look at it the people who are on frozen pensions still won't get their pensions unfrozen

Are you not a naturalised Thai Now? AFAIR you fiercely defend Thailand against everything. If you are a naturalised Thai then why are you going to claim a UK pension? Did you not have to give up UK citizenship when you became a Naturalised Thai?

Doesn't seem fair for those who paid over 40 years. 

But the whole thing is a gamble -  my Uncle Hamish paid over 40 years and died 3 months after getting his pension. 

Both UK and Thai allow dual citizenship. 

[Gottfrid]

32 minutes ago, IvorBiggun2 said:

Not necessarily true. Depends how much you can earn before you are liable for tax payments.

Eeeh??? I was referring to income tax and not savings. Thought all would understand that. Obviously I was wrong. Sorry for that.

Edited March 28, 2022 by Gottfrid

[Gottfrid]

39 minutes ago, IvorBiggun2 said:

I pay UK tax on my pensions.

I was talking about were you are using your money after tax. If that is in a foreign country, your are not contributing to the circulation of money in the country that payed it out. Therefore, they will not give you a raise. Quite understandable. 

Let´s say like this. If you work as a software developer for Evolution Gaming, they will sack you if you work for Vivo Gaming at the same time.

[Gottfrid]

2 hours ago, Sparktrader said:

5 pounds is couple of beers

Ooh, thank you for letting me know. Are they by any chance calling you The Beer SET of Thailand?