Harris calls for 'assault weapons ban' in wake of mass shootings; Biden arrives in Uvalde

[Chomper Higgot]

14 hours ago, BangkokReady said:

 

How does that even come into it?

 

Nah, it's perfectly natural for people to like guns.  If you can't understand that, I doubt there's much more we can discuss.

“How does that even come into it?”, via democratically elected representation.

 

One party represents the majority on gun control, the other is bought by and represents the gun lobby.

[Chomper Higgot]

24 minutes ago, digger70 said:

That's Not the argument here ,People can use whatever tool to kill,

It's the People who kill not the tool.

Everyone is saying the gun kills ,It doesn't .

I have Never seen a gun that kills a person. 

It's always the people using the tool that does the killing .

And a particular type of gun is the weapon of choice for mass murderers.

 

But you don’t see that.

[ozimoron]

14 hours ago, BangkokReady said:

 

How does that even come into it?

 

Nah, it's perfectly natural for people to like guns.  If you can't understand that, I doubt there's much more we can discuss.

I disagree. I think people who like guns are a little bit psycho. Guns have no particular use beyond killing. To like killing is not normal. And before you go off on what about target shooting, even that's a proxy for killing.

 

I used to teach kids to shoot on ranges in the navy cadets. There was no doubt it was training to kill.

[digger70]

28 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

The argument... or rather the thread is... ‘Harris calls for ‘assault weapons ban’... 

 

You have taken a tangent that ‘people kill people’ which is of course true, but you are ignoring the primary issue that they do so more easily with ready access to automatic assault weapons than they would / could if they did not have access to those automatic weapons.

 

Ergo, the issue is access to automatic weapons.

 

 

The fact that people have ready access to automatic weapons and use them to kill people cannot be ignored... when people do not have ready access to automatic weapons far fewer people die in mass shootings....  

 

There will still be acts of road aggression with people killing people, there will still be stabbings, there will still be cases of Maxwell smashing Joan’s head in with a hammer...  

 

BUT, if the public do not have access to Automatic weapons we don’t have nut cases going into schools and killing loads of kids, we don’t have people going into shopping malls and killing random shoppers....  We will still have nut cases, but they won’t have the tools to commit mass murder so easily.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

There you go  You said it You said it yourself now , you made the point it's the nutcases not the Tools .

[digger70]

28 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

And a particular type of gun is the weapon of choice for mass murderers.

 

But you don’t see that.

That's Not the point .Stick to the Facts.

You people say that the gun kills people. 

I never seen a gun that kills by itself, It Always are the People that use the Tools may that be Whatever they holding . 

People kill people.

[richard_smith237]

9 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

I disagree. I think people who like guns are a little bit psycho. Guns have no particular use beyond killing. To like killing is not normal. And before you go off on what about target shooting, even that's a proxy for killing.

 

I used to teach kids to shoot on ranges in the navy cadets. There was no doubt it was training to kill.

I don’t know about that.... I enjoyed firing guns....  particularly enjoyable is firing a bottles at a range.

I enjoyed using my Brother In Laws sniper rifle... I enjoyed the pump-action shot gun....    It is an enjoyable process, just like driving a fast car... I get that, I understand it. 

Just like playing golf, just like Archery, there is a skill attached to it.... there is something agreeable about aiming for a target and I’m not so sure its a proxy to killing someone, it doesn’t seem so with Archery and certainly not so with golf... shooting? I accept that for some it could be.  

 

But that by no means justifies the need for any automatic weapon. 

IF people want to use hand-guns at a range, leave the gun locked up at the range. 

IF a incensed member of public likes hunting and is fully licensed, its fair enough that they have a (single shot) rifle.. but there is no need for a handgun or any automatic weapon. 

 

There are justifiable reasons for some licensed people to have rifles... just no justifiable reason for the public to have assault rifles or to keep hand-guns which are to be used at the range at home. 

 

 

As enjoyable as guns can be... I just see no reason for them in public... there are too many deaths. 

I’d go as far to ban all guns outright with the except of rifles for licensed hunters and only to be used / carried in, to and from specific hunting areas within season as per the held licence. 

 

 

 

 

 

[Chomper Higgot]

4 minutes ago, digger70 said:

That's Not the point .Stick to the Facts.

You people say that the gun kills people. 

I never seen a gun that kills by itself, It Always are the People that use the Tools may that be Whatever they holding . 

People kill people.

Go back to the top of this thread and read the OP, it’ll give you a clue what the topic of discussion is.

 

 

[richard_smith237]

10 minutes ago, digger70 said:

There you go  You said it You said it yourself now , you made the point it's the nutcases not the Tools .

No... Thats not what I said / wrote...  

 

....  Paraphrasing for simplicity.... It is the ‘nut cases WITH the tools’....

 

And when we give the nutcases easy access to automatic weapons there in exists the problem. 

 

We can’t remove the nutcases from society before they do anything wrong, in many cases we don’t know who the nutcases are before they prove they are nutcases... But, we do know what Automatic weapons can do and we can remove those. 

 

It’s not a difficult concept really....  except for the most obtuse of mind. 

 

 

[digger70]

2 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Go back to the top of this thread and read the OP, it’ll give you a clue what the topic of discussion is.

 

 

I am not talking about the Topic .

I am just saying that guns don't kill people because that's what most people say  just read the Answers on the topic.

I said people kill people Not the tools.

[Lacessit]

5 minutes ago, digger70 said:

There you go  You said it You said it yourself now , you made the point it's the nutcases not the Tools .

 

5 minutes ago, digger70 said:

There you go  You said it You said it yourself now , you made the point it's the nutcases not the Tools .

As a series of posts that miss the point entirely, yours take some beating.

If I go into a school armed with a baseball bat, I might knock over a couple of people. The rest either flee, or disarm me with numbers.

Same with a knife, I might get a couple more before someone hits me with a chair. It's all work at close quarters.

If I go into a school armed with an AR-15 and a couple of MagPul 60 bullet magazines, no-one can get near me, and the only person that can take me out is another person with a firearm, probably responding after I have slaughtered a dozen or two. Way too late for the kids or the parents, as Uvalde just demonstrated.

Take away the firearms that can kill so rapidly, as Australia has proved over the last quarter century, and you don't have mass murders of people. Is that too complex for you to understand?

 

[Bkk Brian]

12 minutes ago, digger70 said:

I am not talking about the Topic .

I am just saying that guns don't kill people because that's what most people say  just read the Answers on the topic.

I said people kill people Not the tools.

Then stay on topic or scoot, your talking nonsense on this thread

Edited June 1, 2022 by Bkk Brian

[ozimoron]

1 minute ago, Lacessit said:

 

As a series of posts that miss the point entirely, yours take some beating.

If I go into a school armed with a baseball bat, I might knock over a couple of people. The rest either flee, or disarm me with numbers.

Same with a knife, I might get a couple more before someone hits me with a chair. It's all work at close quarters.

If I go into a school armed with an AR-15 and a couple of MagPul 60 bullet magazines, no-one can get near me, and the only person that can take me out is another person with a firearm, probably responding after I have slaughtered a dozen or two. Way too late for the kids or the parents, as Uvalde just demonstrated.

Take away the firearms that can kill so rapidly, as Australia has proved over the last quarter century, and you don't have mass murders of people. Is that too complex for you to understand?

 

It's really kind of hard to understand why even minimally educated people don't understand the difference. Maybe it's just regurgitating talking points but that argument that they could use anything to kill people instead of the single most lethal weapon available is mind boggling.

[Lacessit]

5 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

The stay on topic or scoot, your talking nonsense on this tread

Not the only one, unfortunately. It's the same as anti-vaxxers and climate deniers, beliefs vs. facts and data.

Edited June 1, 2022 by Lacessit

[richard_smith237]

41 minutes ago, digger70 said:

I am not talking about the Topic .

I am just saying that guns don't kill people because that's what most people say  just read the Answers on the topic.

I said people kill people Not the tools.

 

Well, in that case, a person with a Rubik’s cube can kill someone if they smash someone in the head with it enough times.....     But so what... people ‘can be killers’...   so, why give people access to automatic weapons ???

 

.....or don’t you want to handle that discussion and instead make the blinding obviously claim that an inanimate object can’t hurt someone. 

 

Now... if we’re going to get really pathetic it could be argued that if a loaded gun falls over etc it could misfire...  a person is not a killer in that scenario... But, going down that road would be utterly ridiculous, but perhaps not as pointless as suggesting ‘people are the killers not the tools’ !!!... 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Chomper Higgot]

1 hour ago, digger70 said:

I am not talking about the Topic .

I am just saying that guns don't kill people because that's what most people say  just read the Answers on the topic.

I said people kill people Not the tools.

People use guns to kill people, banning people isn’t a thing.

 

People who use guns to commit mass murder use a particular type of gun.

[EVENKEEL]

2 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

The argument... or rather the thread is... ‘Harris calls for ‘assault weapons ban’... 

 

You have taken a tangent that ‘people kill people’ which is of course true, but you are ignoring the primary issue that they do so more easily with ready access to automatic assault weapons than they would / could if they did not have access to those automatic weapons.

 

Ergo, the issue is access to automatic weapons.

 

 

The fact that people have ready access to automatic weapons and use them to kill people cannot be ignored... when people do not have ready access to automatic weapons far fewer people die in mass shootings....  

 

There will still be acts of road aggression with people killing people, there will still be stabbings, there will still be cases of Maxwell smashing Joan’s head in with a hammer...  

 

BUT, if the public do not have access to Automatic weapons we don’t have nut cases going into schools and killing loads of kids, we don’t have people going into shopping malls and killing random shoppers....  We will still have nut cases, but they won’t have the tools to commit mass murder so easily.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Name an instance where an Auto weapon was used in a school shooting? Semi auto, yes.

[Chomper Higgot]

11 minutes ago, EVENKEEL said:

Name an instance where an Auto weapon was used in a school shooting? Semi auto, yes.

Semantics

[Lacessit]

10 minutes ago, EVENKEEL said:

Name an instance where an Auto weapon was used in a school shooting? Semi auto, yes.

I am developing a new hypothesis to explain this type of thinking, as I doubt victims can differentiate between the firing rate of a fully automatic weapon vs. a semi-automatic.

It is a fact 98% of US cities rely on recycled water to function. Effectively, most citizens are drinking someone else's purified pee and poo.

My hypothesis speculates the water actually has treatment chemicals in it, that result in a reduction of intelligence to the lowest common denominator.

 

It's just as plausible as any anti-vaxxer or climate denier conspiracy theory, and goes a long way to explain the post I am quoting.

[Rimmer]

Off topic troll deflection post and replies removed

[EVENKEEL]

https://chicago.suntimes.com/crime/2022/5/29/23146412/chicago-shootings-memorial-day-weekend

 

https://www.kron4.com/news/bay-area/oakland-police-kept-busy-with-another-crime-filled-weekend/

 

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/memorial-day-weekend-marked-dozen-mass-shootings-us-rcna31179

 

Just gang bangers keeping it real. And you want to know why law abiding citizens need guns. God Bless America....

 

[digger70]

3 hours ago, Lacessit said:

As a series of posts that miss the point entirely, yours take some beating.

Why? Is it because you are Wrong? Fact,Tools don't kill .

People using tools kill.

That Means Peoples are the Killers  

Have you seen a hammer kill?

No It needs the people to use it that goes for Any Tool. 

[digger70]

3 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

Well, in that case, a person with a Rubik’s cube can kill someone if they smash someone in the head with it enough times.....     But so what... people ‘can be killers’...   so, why give people access to automatic weapons ???

 

.....or don’t you want to handle that discussion and instead make the blinding obviously claim that an inanimate object can’t hurt someone. 

 

Now... if we’re going to get really pathetic it could be argued that if a loaded gun falls over etc it could misfire...  a person is not a killer in that scenario... But, going down that road would be utterly ridiculous, but perhaps not as pointless as suggesting ‘people are the killers not the tools’ !!!... 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Just stick to the Facts .

No tool can Kill by itself .

It's the people that use tools that Kill.

[Lacessit]

2 minutes ago, digger70 said:

Why? Is it because you are Wrong? Fact,Tools don't kill .

People using tools kill.

That Means Peoples are the Killers  

Have you seen a hammer kill?

No It needs the people to use it that goes for Any Tool. 

I am regretting the ten seconds I wasted reading the repetitive drivel you posted, goodbye.

[Bkk Brian]

21 minutes ago, EVENKEEL said:

https://chicago.suntimes.com/crime/2022/5/29/23146412/chicago-shootings-memorial-day-weekend

 

https://www.kron4.com/news/bay-area/oakland-police-kept-busy-with-another-crime-filled-weekend/

 

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/memorial-day-weekend-marked-dozen-mass-shootings-us-rcna31179

 

Just gang bangers keeping it real. And you want to know why law abiding citizens need guns. God Bless America....

 

Yes the US previously known as the wild west and with gun deaths keeping to its true roots. The leading cause of death for children below the age of 18.

 

With an average of 110 all age gun related deaths each day, just keeping it real..................

 

Meanwhile the rest of the developed world has moved on and introduced gun restrictions and laws that have avoided the unnecessary deaths of its population.

Edited June 1, 2022 by Bkk Brian

[digger70]

4 hours ago, Bkk Brian said:

Then stay on topic or scoot, your talking nonsense on this thread

Why ,You people started this Nonsense that guns Kill ,Not me 

You all know that tools can't kill .

It's only because people decide to use them that you people say that the tool they use is the Killer .

 Guess what, It's People who Kill people not the tool.

Just let it be . 

[candide]

5 hours ago, digger70 said:

That's Not the argument here ,People can use whatever tool to kill,

It's the People who kill not the tool.

Everyone is saying the gun kills ,It doesn't .

I have Never seen a gun that kills a person. 

It's always the people using the tool that does the killing .

However, tools provide opportunities. If someone gets enraged or depressed and only has a toothpick at hand,  he is less likely to kill someone (or himself) than if he has a gun in his pocket.

[moogradod]

14 minutes ago, digger70 said:

Just stick to the Facts .

No tool can Kill by itself .

It's the people that use tools that Kill.

What causes the confusion here is that there are 3 conditions that need to be met together before it is becoming nasty and many of you argue on these different layers independently. It is:

 

1. Intention (cause, discussion about social themes)

2. Availability of Tool (That is the discussion about the gun laws)

3. Actual pulling of the trigger while aiming at victims

 

If one of these is missing there is no nasty action. And that is why 2. Availability of tool is part of it but not alone.

Edited June 1, 2022 by moogradod

[digger70]

1 minute ago, candide said:

However, tools provide opportunities. If someone gets enraged or depressed and only has a toothpick at hand,  he is less likely to kill someone (or himself) than if he has a gun in his pocket.

I am not talking about that ,stick to the Facts.

The fact is that tools don't kill ,People Do.

[ozimoron]

1 minute ago, digger70 said:

I am not talking about that ,stick to the Facts.

The fact is that tools don't kill ,People Do.

Do you not understand their point or you just want to shill the party line on guns? Why are nations afraid Russia will use nuclear weapons in Ukraine? It's still the same enemy? It's because those weapons kill more people more easily and more effectively and that's precisely the argument presented by posters trying to convince you that there's a difference between an AR 15 and a BB gun but you refuse to even acknowledge the point.

[Bkk Brian]

12 minutes ago, digger70 said:

Why ,You people started this Nonsense that guns Kill ,Not me 

You all know that tools can't kill .

It's only because people decide to use them that you people say that the tool they use is the Killer .

 Guess what, It's People who Kill people not the tool.

Just let it be . 

I beg to differ on who started this nonsense, your post from yesterday and today the same off topic nonsense derailed the thread completely:

 

 

 

Edited June 1, 2022 by Bkk Brian