My marriage is heading south. Dont know what to do.

[fredwiggy]

17 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

And yet ............

All your relationships still ended in failure, even God couldn't help you!

I only failed once, and didn't have God backing me.

I had three marriages that didn't work. Other girlfriends we parted company amicably, future plans weren't the same, as many do when things don't seem to be going in the same direction. You failed once, and you say your kids don't want to talk to you because your wife didn't allow this. We know different don't we? My children talk to me weekly, with the exception of one, who went to live with my first wife and has not done well in her relationships with men, and doesn't talk much to any of us because my ex is a very disturbed individual, and when you stay long enough with that kind, your thinking is skewed. When a relationship that isn't meant to last ends, it isn't a failure. It brings a chance for a better one the next time. Staying with the wrong person for any reason doesn't help anyone, including the children. Getting to know someone for many months is a lot better way of knowing if you're compatible. I didn't do that in a few relationships and it didn't work out because of that. You said you only failed once. Was your ex wife your only relationship with a woman? If not, how did the others end? And bringing God into this because in other posts I have told of my belief? God is always on your side, unless you turn your back on him. Then you have nothing, because most things in life end, and of course your life ends eventually. If you don't have God when that happens, you will see what happens, because we all talk to God eventually.

[thaibeachlovers]

15 hours ago, fredwiggy said:

I am good to my partners, and treat them as equals, and do more than my share of work raising the kids and household duties, along with looking at my partner as a partner, and not an object for my pleasure. And by the way, I initiated all three divorces, and the second and third didn't want them, and the third still wants to come back.

Seems we are similar, except you apparently kept going back for more.

I too treated my partner and wife as equals, shared the child raising with my western partner ( I had learned the folly of marrying a woman with kids so married a childless Thai woman ), did most of the housekeeping myself, and stuck out years of life without sex or even love with both, so hardly objects for my pleasure.

I left my western partner, much to her displeasure, and even my Thai wife had to agree it was time for a divorce. The Thai did try to get me back a couple years later, but I wasn't that barking to go there again.

 

Frankly, I think that one has to be incredibly lucky to find the right one and for her to still be the right one 5 years later. I just wasn't that lucky.

[thaibeachlovers]

14 hours ago, fredwiggy said:

I had three marriages that didn't work. Other girlfriends we parted company amicably, future plans weren't the same, as many do when things don't seem to be going in the same direction. You failed once, and you say your kids don't want to talk to you because your wife didn't allow this. We know different don't we?

No, we don't know different. Apart from the fact that you don't even know him, other than what he writes on here, it's a well known fact that some women turn the children against the husband in revenge.

 

I treated my western ex's children better than she did, but they never wrote to me after I left. My mother treated them better than she or her own mother did, yet they never even sent her a Christmas card.

 

Life isn't simple, and what applies to one person ( you ) does not necessarily apply to another person ( him ). We all have our own story to live.

[fredwiggy]

2 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Seems we are similar, except you apparently kept going back for more.

I too treated my partner and wife as equals, shared the child raising with my western partner ( I had learned the folly of marrying a woman with kids so married a childless Thai woman ), did most of the housekeeping myself, and stuck out years of life without sex or even love with both, so hardly objects for my pleasure.

I left my western partner, much to her displeasure, and even my Thai wife had to agree it was time for a divorce. The Thai did try to get me back a couple years later, but I wasn't that barking to go there again.

 

Frankly, I think that one has to be incredibly lucky to find the right one and for her to still be the right one 5 years later. I just wasn't that lucky.

I've been searching all of my adult life for the right one, and kept falling in love with the wrong ones. I have a nice, honest, faithful girlfriend now, who was hurt by family and her husband and she's taken quite awhile to realize I'm in this to stay. She stayed with a man that did almost nothing as far as being a husband, father or provider until he passed away.Trust doesn't come easy to those damaged by fools. My ex was very pretty and did the wife things, as far as intimacy, cooking, cleaning around the house and helping at her mom's farm, very well, but communication wasn't there well because of her lack of English understanding., her being a covert narcissist, coming from an abusive and neglectful childhood, and depression. It led to misunderstandings and her actually kidnapping our child 4 times before I'd had enough of the nonsense and filed, to get my daughter back home, where I now have joint custody (living with me now while mom works elsewhere),until it's time for us to leave back to my real home, where my daughter will do much better. She wants to come back, but I don't return to someone I don't trust. She has a boyfriend now that's a local that abuses her, so I guess karma hit.

[fredwiggy]

1 minute ago, thaibeachlovers said:

No, we don't know different. Apart from the fact that you don't even know him, other than what he writes on here, it's a well known fact that some women turn the children against the husband in revenge.

 

I treated my western ex's children better than she did, but they never wrote to me after I left. My mother treated them better than she or her own mother did, yet they never even sent her a Christmas card.

 

Life isn't simple, and what applies to one person ( you ) does not necessarily apply to another person ( him ). We all have our own story to live.

Kids can surely be brainwashed, as mine did for awhile, against the other parent by a vindictive, angry, inconsiderate jerk, but if the kids have contact, no matter how little, and when they get older, they can hear the other side, and more of the truth, and then realize they were duped, they can have a relationship with you, because that is what they want, unless they are so bitter by what they were told, they can't turn their thinking around and open their heart to what's real.

[2baht]

My marriage is heading south.

 

Head north!

[advancebooking]

23 hours ago, newnative said:

I think you said 'my child' or 'my kid' nine times if I counted correctly.  Shouldn't that be 'our child'? 

Perhaps its a case that you are 'thinking too much' about grammar. I wrote the narrative by myself not in the presence of my wife. Therefore I didnt use 'our' 

[thaibeachlovers]

18 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

I've been searching all of my adult life for the right one, and kept falling in love with the wrong ones.

I actually met the right ones a few times but they were always already married.

I ended up living with the wrong one out of desperation.

 

Far as the Thai was concerned, I actually thought Thai women were different- slap me!

[thaibeachlovers]

22 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

She has a boyfriend now that's a local that abuses her, so I guess karma hit.

I always used to wonder why women "fell in love" with bad men, but that was long ago when I didn't know anything about women.

I still don't know much about what makes women tick, but enough to know why they fall for bad men- as I understand the psychology, it's a genetic imperative for women to have children with alpha males, though they will hook a beta male to help raise the kids.

[BritManToo]

15 hours ago, fredwiggy said:

I had three marriages that didn't work. Other girlfriends we parted company amicably, future plans weren't the same, as many do when things don't seem to be going in the same direction. You failed once, and you say your kids don't want to talk to you because your wife didn't allow this. We know different don't we? My children talk to me weekly, with the exception of one, who went to live with my first wife and has not done well in her relationships with men

Once my kids move out of the house I'm living in, I can't say I have that much interest in them. If their mom wants them 100% of the time, I'm OK with that, I always avoid all and any confrontations. I refuse social phone conversations with everyone, no interest on talking on the phone.

 

My Thai step-daughter moved out a year or two back, after finishing her degree, I don't talk to her either, although she's come back to stay for a weekend a couple of times.

 

I guess that makes me a bad man.

[fredwiggy]

8 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I always used to wonder why women "fell in love" with bad men, but that was long ago when I didn't know anything about women.

I still don't know much about what makes women tick, but enough to know why they fall for bad men- as I understand the psychology, it's a genetic imperative for women to have children with alpha males, though they will hook a beta male to help raise the kids.

And arrogant, narcissistic alpha males are the reason our planet has been going south for generations. A woman can have a high IQ, be worldly intelligent, and still not understand men. They continue to pick these idiots, thinking that their genetics will make them superior children. I have seen too many times to count, may children born with disabilities coming from two "beautiful" people. I've read 65 books and countless articles, trying to understand the other side, children and how to raise them, mental illnesses and the damage they do to some, and still fall victim to attraction. This reading has made me understand more how a woman thinks, and what mental illnesses do to relationships, but when you're living it, your love and attraction to someone overcomes common sense, at least for awhile. Women sometimes want what they think is good, all the time knowing a "beta" male is a better pick for a partner and father for the children, yet after generations, they still fall into the same trap. Especially here, where men aren't held accountable for the children they make, you would think after being told by moms, dads and friends that bad men aren't a good choice, they would pick better partners. They don't. You see fatherless children by the thousands. Kids growing up without a dad's protection and guidance, and teaching them how to relate to men when they are older. The best example a child can see is how her dad treats her mom. This has been lost to many here and everywhere else.

[fredwiggy]

4 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Once my kids move out of the house I'm living in, I can't say I have that much interest in them. If their mom wants them 100% of the time, I'm OK with that, I always avoid all and any confrontations. I refuse social phone conversations with everyone, no interest on talking on the phone.

 

I guess that makes me a bad man.

With that thinking, it's better for the kids if you didn't have any, because children always need both sides. Why have kids if you really don't want them? There are many women out there that don't want nor have children. That would be a much better choice for you and them.

[fredwiggy]

24 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I actually met the right ones a few times but they were always already married.

I ended up living with the wrong one out of desperation.

 

Far as the Thai was concerned, I actually thought Thai women were different- slap me!

If she was married, she wasn't the right one. You saw something in them you liked, but they were off limits. And all women are the same, as far as basic traits, no matter where they were born. There are only a few different personality types, and that's worldwide.

[BritManToo]

1 minute ago, fredwiggy said:

With that thinking, it's better for the kids if you didn't have any, because children always need both sides. Why have kids if you really don't want them? There are many women out there that don't want nor have children. That would be a much better choice for you and them.

I never claimed I don't want children.

I want as many as I can produce, so no contraception ever.

But I only have interest in them when they live with me, in which case I will provide.

[fredwiggy]

1 minute ago, BritManToo said:

I never claimed I don't want children.

I want as many as I can produce, so no contraception ever.

But I only have interest in them when they live with me, in which case I will provide.

Well, at least you take care of them while they're there. They do need you after they've left sometimes. A father and son or daughter relationship should last forever. A lot of "men" don't do anything with the kids while they are living with them.

[BritManToo]

3 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

Well, at least you take care of them while they're there. They do need you after they've left sometimes. A father and son or daughter relationship should last forever. A lot of "men" don't do anything with the kids while they are living with them.

Took my 12yo to school this morning, does that count?

 

Back to the OP,

Just move on, take the kid if she doesn't want him, leave him if she does.

Don't send her any money after you've gone though, whichever way it turns out.

[fredwiggy]

1 minute ago, BritManToo said:

Took my 12yo to school this morning, does that count?

We all have to live with ourselves and our decisions. When children are involved, it's our duty as parents to do what's best for them. We make mistakes based on what we saw and heard growing up, and should correct them when we see it isn't working. Some people don't care and only live for themselves and their pleasure. When you get old, that pleasure isn't as important and we look back and wonder if we did the right things as far as others are concerned. Some live and die with no conscience, and others worry all the time about how we affect others. Even if you don't believe in God and an afterlife, what makes you a man is how you treat others around you. It's not a game of points. Taking your child to school is a good thing. It shows you care for their safety. I do it daily here now that I'm taking care of my daughter while her mom works elsewhere. I never miss a visitation when she's with her mom more of the time, because my daughter needs to see her dad loves her. That's the most important lesson she can see, besides her seeing me treat other women well, including my girlfriend.

[Yellowtail]

25 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

And arrogant, narcissistic alpha males are the reason our planet has been going south for generations. A woman can have a high IQ, be worldly intelligent, and still not understand men. They continue to pick these idiots, thinking that their genetics will make them superior children. I have seen too many times to count, may children born with disabilities coming from two "beautiful" people. I've read 65 books and countless articles, trying to understand the other side, children and how to raise them, mental illnesses and the damage they do to some, and still fall victim to attraction. This reading has made me understand more how a woman thinks, and what mental illnesses do to relationships, but when you're living it, your love and attraction to someone overcomes common sense, at least for awhile. Women sometimes want what they think is good, all the time knowing a "beta" male is a better pick for a partner and father for the children, yet after generations, they still fall into the same trap. Especially here, where men aren't held accountable for the children they make, you would think after being told by moms, dads and friends that bad men aren't a good choice, they would pick better partners. They don't. You see fatherless children by the thousands. Kids growing up without a dad's protection and guidance, and teaching them how to relate to men when they are older. The best example a child can see is how her dad treats her mom. This has been lost to many here and everywhere else.

While I would agree that people generally seem more narcissistic every year, I would hardly agree men have become more "alpha" like, or that the deterioration of western society is because of men being too masculine. What do you base that on?  

[fredwiggy]

Just now, Yellowtail said:

While I would agree that people generally seem more narcissistic every year, I would hardly agree men have become more "alpha" like, or that the deterioration of western society is because of men being too masculine. What do you base that on?  

Men haven't become more alpha like. They, some, have always been like this. Narcissism has been there since time began, and all those in power are narcissistic. Some politicians start out with the idea to help people, but soon see the power they have and change for the worse. Being masculine isn't being an alpha. Being a man means you protect others weaker around you, your family and children. That is what some call beta males. Beta males encompass the higher percentage of males and they are the ones who take care of the families, while the alphas use women and power to their advantage. Coach Corey Wayne, a full blown narcissist himself, has a book out, 3% man. He often talks about how weak beta males are, and some women are stupid enough to believe in him, mainly because he wrote a book, and is rich, which of course sells to a lot of women. This man doesn't realize there are millions of men capable of beating him down that are betas, and emotionally strong means you can cry as a male also. He sees it as a weakness. It shows you have empathy, that you have a conscience and care. His book has a section stolen from other books, many I have read, that tell how to treat a woman after you've won her over. That was included because if it wasn't, the book would only show how to win a girl for sex. He's been married once, unsuccessfully, and hasn't had any other successful relationships that lasted. His feeling is conquer, then leave, as his actions show. Most of us fail at relationships, but some of us are trying to have one that lasts, even though we either make mistakes that hurt it, or we pick the wrong person for us.

[thaibeachlovers]

5 hours ago, fredwiggy said:

A father and son or daughter relationship should last forever. A lot of "men" don't do anything with the kids while they are living with them.

In an ideal world.

My father got rid of me to boarding school as soon as possible. Never had a conversation with him like normal people do. Only left me something in the will when he died because he probably forgot he had one.

When I see fathers that actually like their children I wonder if I'd have been a better person had my father been a father to me, but I'll never know, of course.

[fredwiggy]

1 minute ago, thaibeachlovers said:

In an ideal world.

My father got rid of me to boarding school as soon as possible. Never had a conversation with him like normal people do. Only left me something in the will when he died because he probably forgot he had one.

When I see fathers that actually like their children I wonder if I'd have been a better person had my father been a father to me, but I'll never know, of course.

My dad was the main provider, wanted to teach me hunting, photography, ham radio, and magic, and I watched him cook all the time, but I wasn't interested until I left the house, then began Hunting, photography and cooking most of the meals when I was married in the states. He wasn't too affectionate but a good provider. My mom was very affectionate, both with me and my children, so I have that from her, and providing for my kids. You become your parents and act like them unless you change your thinking, and if they did things wrong or weren't there for you, you try your best to do things differently. My kids would complain when I asked them to do things, and had to repeat myself a lot. I didn't hit my kids, and they knew it, so sometimes it wasn't easy to enforce the rules. Now I hear my 37 year old daughter on the phone saying the same things to her two that I did to my kids when they were young. makes me laugh

[thaibeachlovers]

4 hours ago, fredwiggy said:

Men haven't become more alpha like. They, some, have always been like this. Narcissism has been there since time began, and all those in power are narcissistic. Some politicians start out with the idea to help people, but soon see the power they have and change for the worse. Being masculine isn't being an alpha. Being a man means you protect others weaker around you, your family and children. That is what some call beta males. Beta males encompass the higher percentage of males and they are the ones who take care of the families, while the alphas use women and power to their advantage. Coach Corey Wayne, a full blown narcissist himself, has a book out, 3% man. He often talks about how weak beta males are, and some women are stupid enough to believe in him, mainly because he wrote a book, and is rich, which of course sells to a lot of women. This man doesn't realize there are millions of men capable of beating him down that are betas, and emotionally strong means you can cry as a male also. He sees it as a weakness. It shows you have empathy, that you have a conscience and care. His book has a section stolen from other books, many I have read, that tell how to treat a woman after you've won her over. That was included because if it wasn't, the book would only show how to win a girl for sex. He's been married once, unsuccessfully, and hasn't had any other successful relationships that lasted. His feeling is conquer, then leave, as his actions show. Most of us fail at relationships, but some of us are trying to have one that lasts, even though we either make mistakes that hurt it, or we pick the wrong person for us.

I learned long ago that I would never understand women, so I stopped trying and accepted that they are the way they are and that's that, even though they are a strange breed IMO. They will fend off Joe Average even though he'd be a great friend and a considerate lover, but will throw themselves at scumbags because they play a guitar or have a lot of money, and then complain how all men are awful when they end up alone with a kid or two.

Worst thing IMO is that the laws in western countries encourage them to do so- have a kid because they couldn't say no, and then get taxpayer money to live on. I had a solo mum friend way back- had a nicer car than me, had a house when I couldn't afford one, had a great life while I had to work like a dog.

 

 

[thaibeachlovers]

1 minute ago, fredwiggy said:

My dad was the main provider, wanted to teach me hunting, photography, ham radio, and magic, and I watched him cook all the time, but I wasn't interested until I left the house, then began Hunting, photography and cooking most of the meals when I was married in the states. He wasn't too affectionate but a good provider. My mom was very affectionate, both with me and my children, so I have that from her, and providing for my kids. You become your parents and act like them unless you change your thinking, and if they did things wrong or weren't there for you, you try your best to do things differently. My kids would complain when I asked them to do things, and had to repeat myself a lot. I didn't hit my kids, and they knew it, so sometimes it wasn't easy to enforce the rules. Now I hear my 37 year old daughter on the phone saying the same things to her two that I did to my kids when they were young. makes me laugh

My father never hit me, just didn't show any affection at all. He could have been a stranger to me for all the time I spent with him- a bare minimum when I was a child.

I didn't take after him when I grew up. I learned to be what the schools made me, as I spent most of my childhood in boarding schools. When I joined the military it was just like school.

[petermik]

I have two sons (49&51 years) who stayed with me when my wife moved on looking for better opportunities (never happened LOL) they are my best mates and the pleasure I get from seeing what they have achieved in their lives is immeasurable ????

[asahib94]

You shouldn't get a divorce, otherwise you won't see your child anymore. You can leave without getting a divorce, then she will have money problems I'm dealing with the same problems. My wife wants money for her daughter to go to university and she wants to deprive my son who is now also attending university. She thinks gold is more important than my son's studies. She wanted to divorce me but the family doesn't want this because I bought a new car and my son is now going to an international university. My wife is very proud, every morning she washes the car for the neighbors to see. Very important, you should always be in charge of your money. My wife doesn't get money from me in her bank, because the money went to relatives. She can get almost anything, but I always want to see where my money goes. So my advice is to leave without a divorce, but make her dependent on your money.

[advancebooking]

On 7/7/2023 at 9:14 AM, fredwiggy said:

We all have to live with ourselves and our decisions. When children are involved, it's our duty as parents to do what's best for them. We make mistakes based on what we saw and heard growing up, and should correct them when we see it isn't working. Some people don't care and only live for themselves and their pleasure. When you get old, that pleasure isn't as important and we look back and wonder if we did the right things as far as others are concerned. Some live and die with no conscience, and others worry all the time about how we affect others. Even if you don't believe in God and an afterlife, what makes you a man is how you treat others around you. It's not a game of points. Taking your child to school is a good thing. It shows you care for their safety. I do it daily here now that I'm taking care of my daughter while her mom works elsewhere. I never miss a visitation when she's with her mom more of the time, because my daughter needs to see her dad loves her. That's the most important lesson she can see, besides her seeing me treat other women well, including my girlfriend.

I related to your words when I read it. I really care for my child a lot and agree with what you are saying. I do the school runs and take her to lessons etc. I will be her taxi for the next 10 yrs until she goes to uni. Its my job. I will feed her nice meals because its my job. I will make sure my wife doesnt push her too much bc its my job in life. 

[advancebooking]

9 hours ago, asahib94 said:

You shouldn't get a divorce, otherwise you won't see your child anymore. You can leave without getting a divorce, then she will have money problems I'm dealing with the same problems. My wife wants money for her daughter to go to university and she wants to deprive my son who is now also attending university. She thinks gold is more important than my son's studies. She wanted to divorce me but the family doesn't want this because I bought a new car and my son is now going to an international university. My wife is very proud, every morning she washes the car for the neighbors to see. Very important, you should always be in charge of your money. My wife doesn't get money from me in her bank, because the money went to relatives. She can get almost anything, but I always want to see where my money goes. So my advice is to leave without a divorce, but make her dependent on your money.

My wife is the main breadwinner so I cannot relate to your opinion. 

[advancebooking]

On 7/7/2023 at 8:50 AM, BritManToo said:

Once my kids move out of the house I'm living in, I can't say I have that much interest in them. If their mom wants them 100% of the time, I'm OK with that, I always avoid all and any confrontations. I refuse social phone conversations with everyone, no interest on talking on the phone.

 

My Thai step-daughter moved out a year or two back, after finishing her degree, I don't talk to her either, although she's come back to stay for a weekend a couple of times.

 

I guess that makes me a bad man.

quite strange comment. why are you like this?

 

have you ever thought about giving up your technology for a month ie lock away your phone and laptop. then see if your opinion changes. I noticed you are a member who makes multiple comments on multiple threads. maybe you should avoid technology for a while as its affecting you. not being critical of you. only a suggestion based on your bizzare comments above. 

[thaibeachlovers]

9 hours ago, advancebooking said:

quite strange comment. why are you like this?

 

have you ever thought about giving up your technology for a month ie lock away your phone and laptop. then see if your opinion changes. I noticed you are a member who makes multiple comments on multiple threads. maybe you should avoid technology for a while as its affecting you. not being critical of you. only a suggestion based on your bizzare comments above. 

IMO technology doesn't change anyone, it just allows people to say things they'd never say to someone they could say.

Eg I can say how I feel about women without being crucified, or burnt at the stake.

 

However some technology is really  bad like, IMO, social media, which allows the worst in people to influence the weak minded.

If I had children I'd never let them have a smart phone as they might get bullied on it and kill themselves ( worst scenario ), but seems an awful lot of kids get traumatised because their parents give them smart phones.

[thaibeachlovers]

9 hours ago, advancebooking said:

only a suggestion based on your bizzare comments above. 

I don't see anything "bizzare" with his comments. Just saying what is reality for some. In a way he is like my father- once I was working he took off to the other side of the world ( without me ). Can't get more uncaring than that, IMO.