Buying used bike in Thailand....odometer

[Kenny202]

Looking for a scooter for the wife...just a run around. Seen some good ones many with unusually low km's which is what I want. Some even from dealers. Say 2016-18 with under 12000ks for 22-25k. Obviously will look for other wear and tear indicating the bike has travelled further than what ODO shows without jumping in. One dealer in particular I was looking at looks like all their bikes under or around 12000k's. Pretty sure digital odometers can't be altered unless another instrument panel added but what about the analogue style odo's where the wheels rotate around?

[Moonlover]

These machines don't tend to do a lot of mileage as they tend to be used in the urban environment. We have an 8 year old Click that's only done 31,000kms and I know it's genuine 'cause we've had it from new. 

 

A simple answer to your perceived dilemma is to buy one with an electronic odo. Like you say it's very unlikely that it will have been tampered with. What you need to be alert for is any signs of floodwater damage. Other than that, these bikes are just about bomb proof.

[BarraMarra]

Most bikes second hand or used are bought from Auctions by dealers where they have been Re-Possed usually people who stopped paying the monthly payments plus most only use them for buzzing around the towns or cities so there not putting miles on the Engines, Eay way to alter a digi Odometer is to disconnect the electrical cable to the front wheel but i doubt they do that.

[Kwasaki]

If you wanted to buy my scooter there's a service book with kilos and service history.

 

[Kenny202]

16 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

If you wanted to buy my scooter there's a service book with kilos and service history.

 

I'm in Khon Kaen bro, no where near Sukhothai but thanks

[Kenny202]

42 minutes ago, Moonlover said:

These machines don't tend to do a lot of mileage as they tend to be used in the urban environment. We have an 8 year old Click that's only done 31,000kms and I know it's genuine 'cause we've had it from new. 

 

A simple answer to your perceived dilemma is to buy one with an electronic odo. Like you say it's very unlikely that it will have been tampered with. What you need to be alert for is any signs of floodwater damage. Other than that, these bikes are just about bomb proof.

I would consider 30000 k's too many kms for me anyway. Looking for something at least half that. Not sure if true or not but my understand the Honda Wave type bikes are pretty much bulletproof and in any case easy and cheap to fix. The Click / Scoopy / Filano style bikes different engine, drive train (Auto) and set up and the life of these bikes much less. As for most of these bikes only around town and low clicks....seeing many where I live up country 2016-2018 with 50-70k kms on them. And great they are still going but have to be near or at the end of their life. We racked up 30000 km's on the Wave we just sold in 3 years and that was with Mrs just going to work and pottering around town.  

[Agusts]

I think they can also change digital odo using a computer connected to ECU... 

 

So always need to check for signs of high mileage and not entirely rely on odo... 

 

But for small bikes and scooters, in 30k-50k baht range, I don't think they can be bothered, now for say 200k-300k baht range, changing odo could make a big difference in price ...! 

[JeffersLos]

56 minutes ago, Moonlover said:

urban environment.

start stop start stop start stop accelerate brake

 

Also account for the Thai concept of maintenance, don't waste money on fresh oil and other fluids until it's almost broken, then sell it.

 

non urban environment vehicles with more km on the odo will often have less wear and tear. ????

[Moonlover]

44 minutes ago, Kenny202 said:

I would consider 30000 k's too many kms for me anyway. Looking for something at least half that. Not sure if true or not but my understand the Honda Wave type bikes are pretty much bulletproof and in any case easy and cheap to fix. The Click / Scoopy / Filano style bikes different engine, drive train (Auto) and set up and the life of these bikes much less. As for most of these bikes only around town and low clicks....seeing many where I live up country 2016-2018 with 50-70k kms on them. And great they are still going but have to be near or at the end of their life. We racked up 30000 km's on the Wave we just sold in 3 years and that was with Mrs just going to work and pottering around town.  

I'm not offering my Click for sale, I'm merely giving this info as an example.

 

The bottom line really is that if you have any doubts about what to do, go buy a new one. They're cheap enough after all.

[ExpatOilWorker]

If I were you, I would be looking for a bike where the tire date stamp match the year of the bike ????. 

If the bike still have original tires, it can't have done more than 10k km.

[VocalNeal]

Just because a bike has low Kms it doesn't mean it has been well maintained. Oil change is recommended at 4000kms. If it has more than that did they change the oil?

I have one i bought for 12,000 and it has 72,000 on it. I don't care. If it quits I push it into the ditch and walk home.

[Kwasaki]

2 hours ago, Kenny202 said:

I'm in Khon Kaen bro, no where near Sukhothai but thanks

???? i don't want sell my scoot what i say is ask to esee book and service book.

That say I was motorbike engineer the scoots these are bullet proof and cost next to nothing to return the engine to new specs.

[brianthainess]

I think a real giveaway is the condition of the brake Disks, but that's just my opinion. 

[Kenny202]

Well it looks like I got onto a 6 month old Scoopy for a song...2000km on the clock. Farang guy leaving Thailand and wants a quick sale. Perfect for the missus...Thanks for the help

[Rhys]

...Just get a low end new bike.. better off in the long run, you start the riding and service history...

 

[Kenny202]

8 hours ago, Rhys said:

...Just get a low end new bike.. better off in the long run, you start the riding and service history...

 

Well looks like I got a practically new bike under warranty but I have had 5 bikes here all low k's and used. Always checked the obvious signs for trouble, made sure the bike was serviced regularly and never had one problem, even a small problem. 

[transam]

12 hours ago, Kenny202 said:

Well it looks like I got onto a 6 month old Scoopy for a song...2000km on the clock. Farang guy leaving Thailand and wants a quick sale. Perfect for the missus...Thanks for the help

Not that farang bloke who got deported for being a Grab delivery on a 6 month old Scoopy, was it.....?                   ????             ????

 

Joking aside, just think of the new trend Grab, Panda, Pizza etc delivery blokes, many, many thousands of scooters being thrashed to death then sold on....????

In LOS new bikes are cheap-ish, think that is the way to go, unless a scoot is being near given away...... ????

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Irish star]

Only buy from a farang owner , you know it has undergone maintenance 

[Irish star]

On 8/11/2023 at 10:14 AM, Kenny202 said:

Well looks like I got a practically new bike under warranty but I have had 5 bikes here all low k's and used. Always checked the obvious signs for trouble, made sure the bike was serviced regularly and never had one problem, even a small problem. 

I think they are ugly looking bikes I don’t get the attraction maybe price is cheap 

[MangoKorat]

On 8/10/2023 at 7:09 AM, Kenny202 said:

Pretty sure digital odometers can't be altered unless another instrument panel

I'm not sure about bikes but car digital speedometers can very much be altered using readily available software and a laptop.  That software used to be marketed in the UK as 'Mileage Correction'.????

[NoshowJones]

On 8/10/2023 at 3:27 PM, ExpatOilWorker said:

If I were you, I would be looking for a bike where the tire date stamp match the year of the bike ????. 

If the bike still have original tires, it can't have done more than 10k km.

My Forza had over 30,000 ks on the clock before I had to change the original tyres.

[Eaglekott]

IMHO. maintenance and service of any vehicle is more important than the KM. I know a guy who bought a car and drove it for 100,000 km with 0 maintenance just refill oil when oil pressure warning lamp started to blink. He topped up coolant also occasionally.   
 

Another friend bought a second hand car where the service book was missing. He took it to a self service garage and wanted to change oil. When he took away the oil plug the oil come out was more like tar than oil. Probably also never serviced. 

[Kenny202]

9 hours ago, Eaglekott said:

IMHO. maintenance and service of any vehicle is more important than the KM. I know a guy who bought a car and drove it for 100,000 km with 0 maintenance just refill oil when oil pressure warning lamp started to blink. He topped up coolant also occasionally.   
 

Another friend bought a second hand car where the service book was missing. He took it to a self service garage and wanted to change oil. When he took away the oil plug the oil come out was more like tar than oil. Probably also never serviced. 

Bit of an oxymoron in my case as I consider low km 1000-5000km or close......and that's exactly why. At this sort of low mileage lack of maintenance isn't that big an issue. What I am mainly looking for in this scenario is signs that the bike has been mistreated, left outside, prior accidents etc or evidence of higher mileage than stated.....and of course proof vehicle is not encumbered and owner genuine. If everything looks ok pretty hard to go wrong. Reason my question on the mileage / odometer....most of the used bikes on FB either old clappers or ridiculous price. There are quite a few smaller dealers around sell decent / low mileage used / close to new bikes for decent prices. I assume they get their stock from repo auctions etc. If anyone would be able to alter mileage these guys would know how to do it. Have bought 2 bikes off dealerships like this and both were good bikes at a good price. Not as easy as you would think to buy a decent used bike here privately. I guess because people buy them, use them every day and have no reason to get rid of them unless they are clapped or going to buy a new one. Most I see advertised privately around 2010-2016 with 60000km plus. Mrs did actually check on new bike prices and the interest rates are abhorrent but no deposit needed...only ID card (so they say) and 2-4 year payment plans of around 2000-4000 a month for say a 60k new bike. I guess it means anyone here can buy a bike but calculated over 4 years a 60k bike would cost you 100k+ 

[Kwasaki]

10 hours ago, Eaglekott said:

IMHO. maintenance and service of any vehicle is more important than the KM. I know a guy who bought a car and drove it for 100,000 km with 0 maintenance just refill oil when oil pressure warning lamp started to blink. He topped up coolant also occasionally.   
 

Another friend bought a second hand car where the service book was missing. He took it to a self service garage and wanted to change oil. When he took away the oil plug the oil come out was more like tar than oil. Probably also never serviced. 

Use synthetic oil. ????

[LS24]

On 8/11/2023 at 10:28 AM, transam said:

 

 

Joking aside, just think of the new trend Grab, Panda, Pizza etc delivery blokes, many, many thousands of scooters being thrashed to death then sold on....????

 

Serious question here. How exactly do you thrash to death an engine of this type? It can't be overrevved because it doesn't have the torque to overcome wind resistance and hit the redline in top gear. The gears in the non manual bikes change automatically based on centrifugal forces so you can't over rev that way. geared bike are rare to be used by delivery riders.

 

The only real thing a rider can do is cook the brakes, overload the already poorly damped suspension or physically damage the cosmetics or frame of the bike. All of which would be immediately noticeable.

[Kenny202]

31 minutes ago, LS24 said:

Serious question here. How exactly do you thrash to death an engine of this type? It can't be overrevved because it doesn't have the torque to overcome wind resistance and hit the redline in top gear. The gears in the non manual bikes change automatically based on centrifugal forces so you can't over rev that way. geared bike are rare to be used by delivery riders.

 

The only real thing a rider can do is cook the brakes, overload the already poorly damped suspension or physically damage the cosmetics or frame of the bike. All of which would be immediately noticeable.

You have obviously never ridden a village bike lol ???? Dirty / unchanged oil would be the worst culprit....particularly in the first 10-20,000ks of the bikes life. When the bike is new and running in. Oil gets full of tiny metal particles from the pistons / cylinders settling in and makes the oil abrasive on all components including crank bearings. None of these things including brakes are expensive to fix mind you...but thrashed can mean just general wear and tear...ripped seats...faded paint / plastic. Missing mirrors...damage here and there. All makes for an unenjoyable and unsafe ride. Oh and as for can't rev fast enough, guess again. Not sure what they do to them to make them hotter but have had 110-125 Waves, Scooters whizz past me on motorways doing 120km +

 

[transam]

36 minutes ago, LS24 said:

Serious question here. How exactly do you thrash to death an engine of this type? It can't be overrevved because it doesn't have the torque to overcome wind resistance and hit the redline in top gear. The gears in the non manual bikes change automatically based on centrifugal forces so you can't over rev that way. geared bike are rare to be used by delivery riders.

 

The only real thing a rider can do is cook the brakes, overload the already poorly damped suspension or physically damage the cosmetics or frame of the bike. All of which would be immediately noticeable.

Oil changes..............????

[Kwasaki]

36 minutes ago, transam said:

Oil changes..............????

Having been a bike mechanic in my time, yeah service is a good thing.

Coming Thailand I started my experiments with my Honda Airblade by not changing the Castrol power 1 semi synthetic oil filled last time for 4 years, and 4 years changes previously and never changed the brake fluid for 17 years.

Drain oil the other day and put it back, these little engines are bullet proof if you ask me.

Hasn't done a lot of kilos mind in 17 years but still runs sweet.

Be interesting to see how long it will go before a problem starts.

[Kenny202]

I usually like to change my oil every 5000 as 5000kms for us could be 1-2 years. Often have to insist they change the oil and watch themdo it. They always say oil still ok lol

[LS24]

But my question stands, how does not changing oil "thrash" an engine? Thrashing an engine is generally accepted in western cultures to be over revving and having no consideration for the engine's normal operating range, not lack of maintenance. That was my point. People seem to struggle with comprehension on this forum.

 

And besides, seen these engines with basically goop for lubricant still running after multiple 10s of thousand km.

 

And besides, it would take seconds to diagnose lack of oil change.