Help New refrig ground wire

[charleskerins]

New Samsung Refrig delivered today  -two prong receptacle    - ground wire in bottom of frig     closest receptacle   2 prong   

 

Help        are there any easy yet safe solutions?  

 

Thanks in Advance  

[sometimewoodworker]

Yes. Run a separate power supply that has an earth.

Alternatively run an earth cable from a stake in permanently damp ground to the refrigerator.

As a last resort do as most Thai’s do and ignore the pesky green cable as you can’t eat it. 

[johng]

I got the same  bit of green (earth) wire and instruction's booklet stating the appliance must be earthed when I bought my Mitsubishi freezer..I immediately thought "WTF" !!!  if it needs to be earthed why did you not put  an earth cable with 3 pin plug on it from the factory ?

 

There are adaptor plugs that have a little tab sticking out for and earth cable   I think I got mine from AMORN  electrical shop  or you could cut the 2 pin plug off and run the earth to a 3 pin plug and grounded socket.

 

 

[charleskerins]

7 minutes ago, sometimewoodworker said:

Yes. Run a separate power supply that has an earth.

Alternatively run an earth cable from a stake in permanently damp ground to the refrigerator.

As a last resort do as most Thai’s do and ignore the pesky green cable as you can’t eat it. 

Neither of the two top ones are feasible

[charleskerins]

2 minutes ago, johng said:

I got the same  bit of green (earth) wire and instruction's booklet stating the appliance must be earthed when I bought my Mitsubishi freezer..I immediately thought "WTF" !!!  if it needs to be earthed why did you not put  an earth cable with 3 pin plug on it from the factory ?

 

There are adaptor plugs that have a little tab sticking out for and earth cable   I think I got mine from AMORN  electrical shop  or you could cut the 2 pin plug off and run the earth to a 3 pin plug and grounded socket.

 

 

Understand  running it to a 3 prong outlet not feasible either      you are using the terminology earth cable that we Americans call  ground cable -correct?

[charleskerins]

4 minutes ago, johng said:

I got the same  bit of green (earth) wire and instruction's booklet stating the appliance must be earthed when I bought my Mitsubishi freezer..I immediately thought "WTF" !!!  if it needs to be earthed why did you not put  an earth cable with 3 pin plug on it from the factory ?

 

There are adaptor plugs that have a little tab sticking out for and earth cable   I think I got mine from AMORN  electrical shop  or you could cut the 2 pin plug off and run the earth to a 3 pin plug and grounded socket.

 

 

So can you connect the ground cable to the adaptor plug and then the 2 prong?  

[johng]

Just now, charleskerins said:

you are using the terminology earth cable that we Americans call  ground cable -correct?

 Yes indeed   earth and ground  tomato tomatoe  potato potahto 

[mikebike]

Defo best practices above. 

 

That said, my western size Panasonic has run perfectly for over a decade, Thai-style... as an ugly man once said, "We don't need no stinking green wire" 😅😅😅

[charleskerins]

2 minutes ago, mikebike said:

Defo best practices above. 

 

That said, my western size Panasonic has run perfectly for over a decade, Thai-style... as an ugly man once said, "We don't need no stinking green wire" 😅😅😅

Mike   my Thai friends  and one Aussie mate say  run it with out the ground     thoughts?

[sandyf]

13 minutes ago, charleskerins said:

Neither of the two top ones are feasible

Obviously it is your choice if you want to use the appliance without grounding the metal casing.

You are incorrect to say it is not feasible. I have seen many Thai houses where an earth cable has been added alongside the surface wiring, just needs a competant electrician.

If it is a matter of cost or landlord permission, that has nothing to do with feasability.

[johng]

5 minutes ago, charleskerins said:

run it with out the ground     thoughts?

It will wok fine without the ground wire and

you'll be ok if you always wear rubber boots and gloves when opening the fridge ( AKA the Narnia wardrobe)

in other words you'll be ok until there is a fault and the metal parts on the outside become live  which will happen suddenly and unexpectedly  that one time while you are not wearing rubber boots and gloves !

[NoDisplayName]

13 minutes ago, charleskerins said:

So can you connect the ground cable to the adaptor plug and then the 2 prong?  

 

We bought a new Hisense with a 3-prong plug, but only 2-blade outlets available in the kitchen.

 

We used a 3-prong to 2 blade travel adapter with surge protection.  You can find 'em in DIY or Tesco.  Looks something like this:

Ran fine for about a year, after which I ran an additional grounded power from the main board.

[johng]

21 minutes ago, charleskerins said:

So can you connect the ground cable to the adaptor plug and then the 2 prong?  

 

Yes on the adaptor I have/had but can't find at the moment to show you a photo.

 

[sandyf]

4 minutes ago, NoDisplayName said:

 

We bought a new Hisense with a 3-prong plug, but only 2-blade outlets available in the kitchen.

 

We used a 3-prong to 2 blade travel adapter with surge protection.  You can find 'em in DIY or Tesco.  Looks something like this:

Ran fine for about a year, after which I ran an additional grounded power from the main board.

Devices like that are designed to protect the load device, based on current going from live to neutral. Does nothing to protect your heart with current going from live to earth.

[NoDisplayName]

Just now, sandyf said:

Devices like that are designed to protect the load device, based on current going from live to neutral. Does nothing to protect your heart with current going from live to earth.

 

I was going to edit to add "not claiming this is safe and effective."

[Crossy]

22 minutes ago, charleskerins said:

Mike   my Thai friends  and one Aussie mate say  run it with out the ground     thoughts?

 

If you have an RCD/RCBO/Safe-T-Cut you probably won't die, running with no ground/earth isn't ideal of course but TiT.

[sandyf]

1 minute ago, NoDisplayName said:

 

I was going to edit to add "not claiming this is safe and effective."

From the OP  "Help        are there any easy yet safe solutions?  "

Bottom line is there is no easy solution if you want to be safe.

[sandyf]

9 minutes ago, Crossy said:

 

If you have an RCD/RCBO/Safe-T-Cut you probably won't die, running with no ground/earth isn't ideal of course but TiT.

No earth to the sockets, good chance there is no earth in the consumer unit. Probably just overload breakers.

[brianthainess]

18 minutes ago, Crossy said:

 

If you have an RCD/RCBO/Safe-T-Cut you probably won't die, running with no ground/earth isn't ideal of course but TiT.

You beat me to it, as with many things here 2 pin plugs are common, fridge compressors are normally rubber mounted IME, its things like rice cookers, and kettles I worry about more, but yes a good RCD should protect you. 

[mikebike]

3 hours ago, charleskerins said:

Mike   my Thai friends  and one Aussie mate say  run it with out the ground     thoughts?

Only subjective experience. The sparkies are correct about the "right" way to do it 😉

[connda]

Before you start, is you house wired with a ground?.  Most homes and apartments I've lived in here in Thailand are not.

I had an electrician rewire the outlets in my study in order to plug in a guitar amp as well as my computers and accessories.  Interestingly enough, the amp did not come with a grounded cable. It shipped that way. However, I'm not a fan of shocks. And I could feel current through the strings.  I wrote the company (I won't name them but they are a major music company) and they assured me that the amp didn't need a ground.  Right???  All I asked the company to do was to send me a compatible cable with a ground.  They refused!  <expletive>  Whatever.  So much for <expletive> customer service and future purchases of their equipment which is not cheap stuff.

They insisted I take the amp back to where I bought it and have it shipped for examination and repair. I dwelled on that for a few seconds before rejecting it outright - yeah, go to the store where they don't speak English and explain to them why that amp needs a grounded cable or else they need to ship the unit back to the manufacturer for inspection and repair.  How many weeks would that take.
I bought a three-prong, grounded computer power cable which works perfectly.  Thank you Lazada.  No more shocks.  Such a simple solution and yet the hubris of the un-named company seemed to Ok with losing my future business.

The rest of my house?  Pretty much un-grounded although we have had the main house and guest house completely rewired with the cabling placed in PVC conduit and attached to a new power distribution system (The original house had nothing but bare cable run though the roof and to a distribution box that had freaking fuses.  Scary, old, and dangerous).  That whole setup got replaced. 

 

Edited January 13 by connda

[charleskerins]

6 minutes ago, connda said:

Before you start, is you house wired with a ground?.  Most homes and apartments I've lived in here in Thailand are not.

I had an electrician rewire the outlets in my study in order to plug in a guitar amp as well as my computers and accessories.  Interestingly enough, the amp did not come with a grounded cable. It shipped that way. However, I'm not a fan of shocks. And I could feel current through the strings.  I wrote the company (I won't name them but they are a major music company) and they assured me that the amp didn't need a ground.  Right???  All I asked the company to do was to send me a compatible cable with a ground.  They refused!  <expletive>  Whatever.  So much for <expletive> customer service and future purchases of their equipment which is not cheap stuff.

They insisted I take the amp back to where I bought it and have it shipped for examination and repair. I dwelled on that for a few seconds before rejecting it outright - yeah, go to the store where they don't speak English and explain to them why that amp needs a grounded cable.
I bought a three-prong, grounded computer power cable which works perfectly.  Thank you Lazada.  No more shocks.  Such a simple solution and yet the hubris of the un-named company seemed to Ok with losing my future business.

The rest of my house?  Pretty much un-grounded although we have had the main house and guest house completely rewired with the cabling placed in PVC conduit and attached to a new power distribution system. How many appliances actually have a ground here in Thailand?  Not many.  Anyway, I don't get zapped by my refrigerator, treadmill, air filters or other electronic equipment. 

Personally I would not bother with the ground.  Caveat: I'm not an electrician and this is not professional advice.

it's a shop with a small bedroom . My guess is it is not grounded.  Next on the agenda will be a treadmill

[sometimewoodworker]

4 hours ago, charleskerins said:

Neither of the two top ones are feasible

They are both feasible. That you don’t want to actually do them is a rather different point.

4 hours ago, charleskerins said:

So can you connect the ground cable to the adaptor plug and then the 2 prong?  

There is no requirement that the earth neutral and line conductors are together. It is convenient and is the way that the vast majority of appliances are connected. The important point is that the potentially live metal case is earthed, how you achieve that is rather less important.

 

3 hours ago, NoDisplayName said:

We bought a new Hisense with a 3-prong plug, but only 2-blade outlets available in the kitchen.

 

We used a 3-prong to 2 blade travel adapter with surge protection.  You can find 'em in DIY or Tesco.  Looks something like this:

Ran fine for about a year, after which I ran an additional grounded power from the main board.

A surge protector has nothing to do with safe earthing.

 

Your appliances that require an earth will virtually always run fine without the earth connection.
They will be perfectly safe to use, until they are not.

They will not kill you, until they do

How long until they decide to kill you? How long before they are not safe?

if you can answer those questions please tell me the next winning lottery ticket number.

 

Recently in our village someone who had been using an appliance perfectly safely for years became the featured guest at the local celebration that is usually reserved for those with terminal cases of old age, disease, Drug addiction etc, she hadn’t been due to be the star for 20 or 30 years.

 

The problem is that it is a low risk case but has the chance of a really really bad outcome, I personally want to delay my introduction to the quite high temperature temple ceremony for as many years as possible.

 

[Fruit Trader]

3 hours ago, brianthainess said:

You beat me to it, as with many things here 2 pin plugs are common, fridge compressors are normally rubber mounted IME, its things like rice cookers, and kettles I worry about more, but yes a good RCD should protect you. 

 

The compressor has insulated noise isolation but what about refrigerant lines clamped to the case.

 

 

[xtrnuno41]

5 hours ago, Crossy said:

 

If you have an RCD/RCBO/Safe-T-Cut you probably won't die, running with no ground/earth isn't ideal of course but TiT.

Agree Crossy. If you dont have, just change the breaker on which the socket is to a breaker with 30 mA differential breaker.

SO breaker is the normal value, like 20 A but 30 mA is differential between L and N to break it for leakage.

Normally L and N are same in current (A) but if you touch a metal part and electricity is on that part, then it flows to ground and there will be a difference between L and N, causing the safety switch to break. 

That could happen if power goes to chassis of fridge and you touch it.

I have experienced such a shock, not voluntarily, you feel it, but wont kill you.

However that is all depending on your heart condition, your blood, which place it enters, sweat.

 

Mind the 30 mA, not higher ! Be aware it has the right fitting for your existing panel.

Of course if you do, you switch of the power on the main switch and measure volts before starting unscrewing.

Also check if meter is properly working. The 3 M measuring. Test meter measuring volts (in this case AC setting) then measure on working place and then measure again volts to test meter again.

Remind, electricity can kill you in jiffy time ! Be aware, what you do.

Use isolated screwdriver.

Something like this

 

This one is a C10, meaning breaker switch (shortcut)10 A with C-characteristic, most common in Thailand. IF you find one with a B, it is even better. NO other letter of alphabet !

Then you see 30 mA and that is the safety switch setting.  30, not 40 !

The green button is for testing, but it can vary from color and shape on those devices.

If you see one with a separate (testing) button, you see value 30 mA then it is an RCBO.

 

If you already have just one (1) device in panel , it says "safety T cut" . Then you and family are protected on each socket or fitting.

Mostly they have an adjustable setting, mind this is set on 30 mA.

All electric metal devices, which you can touch, should be grounded, but not always done. Like a metal lamp.

 

[Danderman123]

Never forget that Thai voltage is 220+, so yeah, even a quick jolt can kill you.

 

Lazada sells grounding equipment, you can install a ground outside your kitchen, and wire the fridge ground to that ground.

 

I wouldn't live in a place that doesn't have a ground.

[chickenslegs]

I apologise for my pedantism but "frig" is an act of sexual intercourse. The correct abbreviation of refrigerator is "FRIDGE".

[xtrnuno41]

30 minutes ago, Danderman123 said:

Never forget that Thai voltage is 220+, so yeah, even a quick jolt can kill you.

 

Lazada sells grounding equipment, you can install a ground outside your kitchen, and wire the fridge ground to that ground.

 

I wouldn't live in a place that doesn't have a ground.

If you dont make a proper installation of ground (measured resistance) then it is worthless.

If resistance is too high, then you will be electrocuted, despite ground.

Your body is a pile of water with many minerals, so a very good conductor.

 

[Danderman123]

30 minutes ago, xtrnuno41 said:

If you dont make a proper installation of ground (measured resistance) then it is worthless.

If resistance is too high, then you will be electrocuted, despite ground.

Your body is a pile of water with many minerals, so a very good conductor.

 

Please define "measured resistance ". I presume you are referring to the gauge of the ground wire.

[sometimewoodworker]

8 hours ago, Danderman123 said:

Never forget that Thai voltage is 220+, so yeah, even a quick jolt can kill you.

Never believe that 110+ volts can’t kill you.

 

5 hours ago, xtrnuno41 said:

If resistance is too high, then you will be electrocuted, despite ground.

That is incorrect, possible but wrong.  The vast majority of times you will receive an electric shock that falls far short of electrocution. The chance of electrocution is vastly reduced if you, like any competent electriction and keep one hand in your pocket. 
The reason is that the majority of accidental electrocutions require a path through the heart, so from hand to hand. Of course a shock that doesn’t travel hand to hand can electrocute but the risk is vastly lower.