Israeli Soldier Videos from Gaza Raise International Law Concerns

[Morch]

2 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

 

 

Why is it so difficult for some people to acknowledge that what Hamas does was wrong and what Israel does is also wrong.

The big differences are that Israel is doing it on a much bigger scale for months and with the money and support from the USA.

 

Why is it so difficult for some people to acknowledge that what was said wasn't condoning the actions described in the OP.

The point made was about the level of criticism, the amount of, and the one-sided nature of it.

 

Your same same argument is weak, ignores the point made, and even the immediate context.

[Morch]

1 minute ago, Brickleberry said:

 

Name of the topic: Israeli soldier videos from Gaza raise international law concerns

 

My post: Commenting that Israel has been breaking international laws for decades.

 

How is this not on topic?

 

@Brickleberry

 

By your logic, if the word 'video' is included, one could go on about video software editing as well.

Lame deflection.

 

You do not address the OP, but rather offer a standard issue one-sided Israel Bad rant.

 

Same hijacking attempts on pretty much all related topics you're commenting on.

[Brickleberry]

8 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

@Brickleberry

 

By your logic, if the word 'video' is included, one could go on about video software editing as well.

Lame deflection.

 

You do not address the OP, but rather offer a standard issue one-sided Israel Bad rant.

 

Same hijacking attempts on pretty much all related topics you're commenting on.

 

Well, when someone is breaking the law and has been doing so for over 56 years.... what else do you expect me to say?

 

If you break the law consistently and show such disregard for it, you can't then complain when the victims rise up and punch you in the nose.

[Bkk Brian]

1 minute ago, Brickleberry said:

 

Well, when someone is breaking the law and has been doing so for over 56 years.... what else do you expect me to say?

 

If you break the law consistently and show such disregard for it, you can't then complain when the victims rise up and punch you in the nose.

How long has Hamas been breaking international law?

[Brickleberry]

6 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

How long has Hamas been breaking international law?

 

That's a great question!

 

Hamas were not even around when Israel starting breaking the law. Hamas (formed in 1987) have only been around for 35 years or so. Israel has been breaking the law since 1967.

 

Lets not even talk about the forced displacement of the indigenous Palestinian people in 1947 + 48. Poisoning their drinking water, killing them, raping them, burning their villages to the ground - This was illegal. Israel has been breaking the law since its inception. 

[Bkk Brian]

Just now, Brickleberry said:

 

That's a great question!

 

Hamas were not even around when Israel starting breaking the law. Hamas (formed in 1987) have only been around for 35 years or so. Israel has been breaking the law since 1967.

 

Lets not even talk about the forced displacement of the indigenous Palestinian people in 1947 + 48. Poisoning their drinking water, killing them, raping them, burning their villages to the ground - This was illegal. Israel has been breaking the law since its inception. 

Yes a great question, Hamas have been lobbing rockets indiscriminately over the border into Israel for years attempting to kill civilians

[Morch]

25 minutes ago, Brickleberry said:

 

Well, when someone is breaking the law and has been doing so for over 56 years.... what else do you expect me to say?

 

If you break the law consistently and show such disregard for it, you can't then complain when the victims rise up and punch you in the nose.

 

@Brickleberry

 

I don't have much expectations from you, by now.

 

Staying on topic doesn't seem to be too hard, though.

And, obviously, this is not about the entire conflict, or even solely about Israel.

 

Go on justifying Hamas actions.

Then whine when Hamas and the Palestinians get punched in the face.

 

Read the headlines, read the OP.

You're not on topic. Not complicated.

 

 

Edited February 11 by Morch

[Morch]

13 minutes ago, Brickleberry said:

 

That's a great question!

 

Hamas were not even around when Israel starting breaking the law. Hamas (formed in 1987) have only been around for 35 years or so. Israel has been breaking the law since 1967.

 

Lets not even talk about the forced displacement of the indigenous Palestinian people in 1947 + 48. Poisoning their drinking water, killing them, raping them, burning their villages to the ground - This was illegal. Israel has been breaking the law since its inception. 

 

@Brickleberry

 

More Israel Bad rants.

More bogus one-sided history lessons.

More nothing on offer regarding the OP.

[transam]

54 minutes ago, Brickleberry said:

 

I'm glad to hear that! It would be a bit strange if you did, because you were not directly affected by these events.

 

Is it not sad that we are talking about who hates each other more? It is pathetic tbh. Israel must start to live up to it's 'democratic, law abiding' status. It is willfully breaking over 26 international laws, is committing war crimes in real time - we can all watch them on social media and the news. We know that the West Bank and other Palestinian lands are under occupation and they live under the control of Israelis. This is just insane! We know this is wrong, the world courts have judged that what Israel has been doing over 5 decades is wrong. Yet still, we blame Hamas.

The Germans DID indirectly affect my life, if my mum & dad were still here you could ask them.......

 

As for the thread, Israel is doing what it thinks it should do to clear away a continuous threat, after all, there were not many questions on how the west dealt with Germany or Japan to do the same, were there. 😉

[Brickleberry]

21 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Yes a great question, Hamas have been lobbing rockets indiscriminately over the border into Israel for years attempting to kill civilians

 

Israel has been steadily building more and more settlements in land that is legally recognized as belonging to Palestinians. Since 1967.

 

If you want people to follow laws and decorum, you must first make sure you are following laws and decorum.

 

You can't blame the people responding to your cruelty with cruelty.

[Bkk Brian]

7 minutes ago, Brickleberry said:

 

Israel has been steadily building more and more settlements in land that is legally recognized as belonging to Palestinians. Since 1967.

 

If you want people to follow laws and decorum, you must first make sure you are following laws and decorum.

 

You can't blame the people responding to your cruelty with cruelty.

The rockets were coming from Gaza by Hamas not the West Bank

[Brickleberry]

Just now, Bkk Brian said:

The rockets were coming from Gaza by Hamas not the West Bank

 

Gaza and the West Bank are Palestinian lands. They are not separate. They are not separate countries. They are the same people. Stop trying to justify Israels actions by dividing their areas into smaller and smaller pockets of land.

 

Until Israel obeys international law and defines its borders according to the 1948 partition plan - which Hamas has agreed to do since 2018. Hamas changed its charter and said it would accept a permanent ceasefire based on the legal borders. The Palestinian people have said they would accept this. The Arab league has said they will accept this and will immediately recognize Israel, trade with Israel etc. The whole world is waiting for Israel to follow the law, and give back the lands they have seized by force illegally.

 

[Morch]

3 minutes ago, Brickleberry said:

 

Gaza and the West Bank are Palestinian lands. They are not separate. They are not separate countries. They are the same people. Stop trying to justify Israels actions by dividing their areas into smaller and smaller pockets of land.

 

Until Israel obeys international law and defines its borders according to the 1948 partition plan - which Hamas has agreed to do since 2018. Hamas changed its charter and said it would accept a permanent ceasefire based on the legal borders. The Palestinian people have said they would accept this. The Arab league has said they will accept this and will immediately recognize Israel, trade with Israel etc. The whole world is waiting for Israel to follow the law, and give back the lands they have seized by force illegally.

 

 

@Brickleberry

 

That's a Palestinian propaganda meme. It misrepresents facts.

 

There was no Palestine in 1946. Not as a Palestinian State. And not all of the land painted green was owned by 'Palestinians'.

 

The 1947 Partition Plan map glosses over the fact that the 'Palestinians' rejected it.

 

Same goes for the 1967 map - The 'Palestinian' land depicted was actually controlled by Egypt and Jordan (the latter annexing the West Bank, even). Palestinians were not into talking peace or a two-state solution back then. There was no 'Palestine' then either.

 

The 'Now' map actually shows the opposite of what's intended. It's the first instance in which Palestinian have a measure of control over their lands.

 

This bogus meme was posted, discussed and taken down numerous times over my years on this forum.

 

You either have no idea what you're talking about, or you do - and push lies anyway.

 

 

[Brickleberry]

1 minute ago, Morch said:

 

@Brickleberry

 

That's a Palestinian propaganda meme. It misrepresents facts.

 

There was no Palestine in 1946. Not as a Palestinian State. And not all of the land painted green was owned by 'Palestinians'.

 

The 1947 Partition Plan map glosses over the fact that the 'Palestinians' rejected it.

 

Same goes for the 1967 map - The 'Palestinian' land depicted was actually controlled by Egypt and Jordan (the latter annexing the West Bank, even). Palestinians were not into talking peace or a two-state solution back then. There was no 'Palestine' then either.

 

The 'Now' map actually shows the opposite of what's intended. It's the first instance in which Palestinian have a measure of control over their lands.

 

This bogus meme was posted, discussed and taken down numerous times over my years on this forum.

 

You either have no idea what you're talking about, or you do - and push lies anyway.

 

 

Lies, lies, lies.

 

Maps do not lie. You can look at them on the UN if you care to.

 

It was called Palestine. The British mandate for Palestine.

 

Yes, they rejected it. That does not mean that Israel is entitled to more land. It means the Palestinians rejected the Israelis taking over 54% of the land, even though they represented less than 20% of the population.

 

You are misrepresenting facts. The 1967 map is a true, proper map. Your talking about Egypt and Transjordan occupying palestinian lands during the war up to 1949 - the armistice lines.

 

The now map represents what has been stolen. They have control over their lands? Is that why IDF soldiers can freely arrest and snatch people out of their beds in the West Bank... I think not.

 

Until Israel follows the law, they cannot expect others to.

[Morch]

3 minutes ago, Brickleberry said:

Lies, lies, lies.

 

Maps do not lie. You can look at them on the UN if you care to.

 

It was called Palestine. The British mandate for Palestine.

 

Yes, they rejected it. That does not mean that Israel is entitled to more land. It means the Palestinians rejected the Israelis taking over 54% of the land, even though they represented less than 20% of the population.

 

You are misrepresenting facts. The 1967 map is a true, proper map. Your talking about Egypt and Transjordan occupying palestinian lands during the war up to 1949 - the armistice lines.

 

The now map represents what has been stolen. They have control over their lands? Is that why IDF soldiers can freely arrest and snatch people out of their beds in the West Bank... I think not.

 

Until Israel follows the law, they cannot expect others to.

 

@Brickleberry

 

Some maps do, some maps don't. What an odd statement.

 

The ones you posted are obviously misleading, as addressed above.

 

It doesn't matter what it was called, it wasn't 'Palestine' in the sense of a Palestinian State. An 'honest' map would have made that clear by using a different color scheme.

 

The Arabs (not Palestinians yet, back then) rejected the UN resolution. You want to argue against the UN resolution? Go ahead, it would also imply no basis for a Palestinian State, though. Can't have it both ways.

 

I am not 'misrepresenting' anything. The map keeps using the same color for 'Palestine' in order to create the impression that there was such a state, or an area controlled by Palestinians. This was not so.

 

No, Palestinians do not have complete control over their lands. But what control they have now is the most they ever had. That's a fact.

 

You have nothing to say on topic. You just offer one-sided anti-Israeli rants and Palestinian propaganda talking points.

 

Useless.

[Bkk Brian]

32 minutes ago, Brickleberry said:

 

Gaza and the West Bank are Palestinian lands. They are not separate. They are not separate countries. They are the same people. Stop trying to justify Israels actions by dividing their areas into smaller and smaller pockets of land.

 

Until Israel obeys international law and defines its borders according to the 1948 partition plan - which Hamas has agreed to do since 2018. Hamas changed its charter and said it would accept a permanent ceasefire based on the legal borders. The Palestinian people have said they would accept this. The Arab league has said they will accept this and will immediately recognize Israel, trade with Israel etc. The whole world is waiting for Israel to follow the law, and give back the lands they have seized by force illegally.

 

How does that change the rockets that are coming from Gaza and not the West Bank?

[Wobblybob]

1 hour ago, OneMoreFarang said:

 

 

Why is it so difficult for some people to acknowledge that what Hamas does was wrong and what Israel does is also wrong.

The big differences are that Israel is doing it on a much bigger scale for months and with the money and support from the USA.

It is not wrong to defend yourself against these dysfunctional murderous monsters, which incidentally have promised more of these moronic murderous incursions into Israel. Israel must be the only country in the world that has to defend itself for defending itself.

[bannork]

2 hours ago, Morch said:

 

What you do is what many of your ilk go for: a short one liner bit 'condemning' Hamas, then going on about Israel. Often comes with some false equivalency disregarding facts or even immediate context.

Look, Israel has been bombing Gaza since October, killing thousands of innocent civilians. 

I'm sorry to 'go on' about the murder of so many children, etc. 

Hamas are evil, but my god, Netanyahu and his butchers are creating another Hamas right now by this wholesale murder. 

 

[Brickleberry]

9 minutes ago, Wobblybob said:

It is not wrong to defend yourself against these dysfunctional murderous monsters, which incidentally have promised more of these moronic murderous incursions into Israel. Israel must be the only country in the world that has to defend itself for defending itself.

 

Replace 'Israel' with Palestine. The same is true. Israels incursions into Gaza and the West Bank over the last few decades have been monstrous. Steadily eating away at their lands whilst saying to the world "they don't want peace". Tell us all, please. How are they supposed to agree to peace when Israel keeps on stealing more and more of their land?

[Wobblybob]

14 minutes ago, Brickleberry said:

 

Replace 'Israel' with Palestine. The same is true. Israels incursions into Gaza and the West Bank over the last few decades have been monstrous. Steadily eating away at their lands whilst saying to the world "they don't want peace". Tell us all, please. How are they supposed to agree to peace when Israel keeps on stealing more and more of their land?

Please don't even try and compare these evil Palestian psychopathic terrorists with Israelis. 

Replace Palestian terrorists with Israelis and if Hamas were beating Israel I suspect many anti-Semitic posters on here would be doing cart wheels down Soi Buakhao. 

[OneMoreFarang]

2 hours ago, Bkk Brian said:

So you don't know the difference between a sadistic terrorist attack, one of the largest in modern history and the atrocities carried out with intent within that attack and Israels response?

I understand the difference.

One attack was done by a terror group for one day. It was bad and it was rightly condemned all over the world. 

The other one is done by the military of the democratic country instructed by the Israeli PM. It goes on already for more than 3 months.

In the attack by the terrorist group roughly 1000 innocent people were killed.

In the attacks by Israel at least 10 times the amount of innocent people were killed and huge amount of houses and infrastructure destroyed and food and medication blocked. The list goes on.

Yes, one was bad for a day. And the other one is worse and lasted already more than 3 months.

And the world is watching and doing little. In fact America supported and still supports Israel will billions of USD of weapons. They call it development support. Sad. 

[OneMoreFarang]

2 hours ago, Morch said:

 

Why is it so difficult for some people to acknowledge that what was said wasn't condoning the actions described in the OP.

The point made was about the level of criticism, the amount of, and the one-sided nature of it.

 

Your same same argument is weak, ignores the point made, and even the immediate context.

I still wait that you condemn even one time the actions of Israel.

As long as you don't do this I assume you are ignorant or paid for your comments.

There is no point arguing with a PR agency.

[OneMoreFarang]

46 minutes ago, Wobblybob said:

It is not wrong to defend yourself against these dysfunctional murderous monsters, which incidentally have promised more of these moronic murderous incursions into Israel. Israel must be the only country in the world that has to defend itself for defending itself.

Israel occupies and suppresses people since decades. Now why is it that those people rise up again the suppressor? 

What would you do when someone would take your home and land away from you and then tell you to go away?

[Brickleberry]

10 minutes ago, Wobblybob said:

Please don't even try and compare these evil Palestian psychopathic terrorists with Israelis. 

Replace Palestian terrorists with Israelis and if Hamas were beating Israel I suspect many anti-Semitic posters on here would be doing cart wheels down Soi Buakhao. 

 

Matthew 7:3-5

Quote

“Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother’s eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? ⁴ How can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? ⁵ You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye.

 

If Israel wants peace, it needs to follow international law. Sadly, Israel does not want peace. It wants control of all of the land, from the river to the sea.

[Wobblybob]

Just now, OneMoreFarang said:

Israel occupies and suppresses people since decades. Now why is it that those people rise up again the suppressor? 

What would you do when someone would take your home and land away from you and then tell you to go away?

Miles off topic, been addressed on a numerous occasions, your twisted posts are just that. 

[Wobblybob]

Just now, Brickleberry said:

 

Matthew 7:3-5

 

If Israel wants peace, it needs to follow international law. Sadly, Israel does not want peace. It wants control of all of the land, from the river to the sea.

Are you stupidly suggesting that Hamas wants peace. 

[Bkk Brian]

2 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

I understand the difference.

One attack was done by a terror group for one day. It was bad and it was rightly condemned all over the world. 

The other one is done by the military of the democratic country instructed by the Israeli PM. It goes on already for more than 3 months.

In the attack by the terrorist group roughly 1000 innocent people were killed.

In the attacks by Israel at least 10 times the amount of innocent people were killed and huge amount of houses and infrastructure destroyed and food and medication blocked. The list goes on.

Yes, one was bad for a day. And the other one is worse and lasted already more than 3 months.

And the world is watching and doing little. In fact America supported and still supports Israel will billions of USD of weapons. They call it development support. Sad. 

No not for one day, they took hostages, a lot of them, some still being held in horrific conditions others released or dead, many sexually abused. The 7th Oct was just the start for Hamas there were more coming. Hamas are the ones who planned to deaths of so many civilians in Gaza already as Martyrs.

 

"We will do this again and again the Al Aqsa Flood is just the first time and there will be a second, third and forth. We are ready to pay the price. We are called a nation of Martyrs and we are proud to sacrifice Martyrs."

 

 

 

[OneMoreFarang]

3 minutes ago, Wobblybob said:

Miles off topic, been addressed on a numerous occasions, your twisted posts are just that. 

It's the root cause and therefore the center topic. 

[Bkk Brian]

1 minute ago, OneMoreFarang said:

It's the root cause and therefore the center topic. 

If that's what you think then create a topic for it, this is not the one

[Morch]

45 minutes ago, bannork said:

Look, Israel has been bombing Gaza since October, killing thousands of innocent civilians. 

I'm sorry to 'go on' about the murder of so many children, etc. 

Hamas are evil, but my god, Netanyahu and his butchers are creating another Hamas right now by this wholesale murder. 

 

 

It's not about 'going on'. It's about quantity and quality. Your sort do the one-liner Hamas Bad thing to get it out of the way, then a whole post about how Israel is the worst thing ever, or 'the same' (but pouring more words into it). Similarly, the rhetoric used is often different. More heated when it comes to criticism of Israel, more subdued when it relates to Hamas. So no, not buying into it much.

 

Most do not argue that the death toll isn't high. Or that a whole lot of the casualties are innocents.

But then again - what do you think Israel should have done differently? How was Israel to address things after the 7/10 attack?

And also, where is Hamas's responsibility in this? These people are their people, under their rule - not accountability demanded?

 

Creating another Hamas? Like the original Hamas was about to disappear or something? This isn't about winning hearts and minds.