3 minutes ago, WDSmart said:

I was referring to the link I posted. That poll was taken in Dec of 2023.

Irrelevant to the one from the 10th March then..................jeez or is this a competition to see how many polls we can find from the last 5 months

34 minutes ago, Wobblybob said:

Hanging on to the words of terrorists and blaming Israel for a conflict that Hamas undeniably started.

 

The Zionists created Hamas as part of their plan, which was always to take over the entire land. Bolstering this terrorist group quells any chances of a Palestinian State and justifies retaliation and land grab.

 

A friendly reminder:

 

 

 

ISRAEL’S OCCUPATION: 50 YEARS OF DISPOSSESSION

Israel’s military rule disrupts every aspect of daily life in the Occupied Palestinian Territories. It continues to affect whether, when and how Palestinians can travel to work or school, go abroad, visit their relatives, earn a living, attend a protest, access their farmland, or even access electricity or a clean water supply. It means daily humiliation, fear and oppression.

https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/campaigns/2017/06/israel-occupation-50-years-of-dispossession/

1 hour ago, WDSmart said:

No, because that is exactly the goal of Netanyahu and his right-wing, nationalistic cronies (I can't use a certain word I normally use here anymore - I've been warned about that). They want total control of what they believe to be the "Promised Land." 

That's the entire argument. Both sides want full control of the land that used to be called "Palestine."

 

 

  It was never called Palestine, that's a untruth that you keep saying , you have said it so often, that you probably believe yourself

8 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Nonsense, this has been discussed numerous times in previous topics. Hamas was receiving the same money from Qatar years before the Israeli gov helped facilitate it along with the knowledge of the US and is still to this day receiving it from Qatar. Hamas has plenty of other streams of cash, there's whole topics on it right here. Its false to say Hamas would not have been around without Netanyahu although its true he bolstered their presence.

 

I did not say Hamas would not exist without Netanyahu, I said it would not exist without the Israeli establishment.

 

Brig. Gen. Yitzhak Segev, Israeli military governor in Gaza in the early 1980s, told the New York Times that he had helped finance the Palestinian Islamist movement as a “counterweight” to the secularists and leftists of the Palestine Liberation Organization and the Fatah party, led by Yasser Arafat (who himself referred to Hamas as “a creature of Israel.”).

1 minute ago, rattlesnake said:

 

I did not say Hamas would not exist without Netanyahu, I said it would not exist without the Israeli establishment.

 

Brig. Gen. Yitzhak Segev, Israeli military governor in Gaza in the early 1980s, told the New York Times that he had helped finance the Palestinian Islamist movement as a “counterweight” to the secularists and leftists of the Palestine Liberation Organization and the Fatah party, led by Yasser Arafat (who himself referred to Hamas as “a creature of Israel.”).

 

   Israel did help Hamas , but even if Israel didn't help . Hamas would still have existed from Arabs Countries help

1 minute ago, rattlesnake said:

 

I did not say Hamas would not exist without Netanyahu, I said it would not exist without the Israeli establishment.

 

Brig. Gen. Yitzhak Segev, Israeli military governor in Gaza in the early 1980s, told the New York Times that he had helped finance the Palestinian Islamist movement as a “counterweight” to the secularists and leftists of the Palestine Liberation Organization and the Fatah party, led by Yasser Arafat (who himself referred to Hamas as “a creature of Israel.”).

Hamas was created by the Muslim Brotherhood since 1987. Nothing to do with this war started on the 7th Oct

25 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Irrelevant to the one from the 10th March then..................jeez or is this a competition to see how many polls we can find from the last 5 months

If you actually think about it, a poll of the Palestinians shortly after Oct 7 shows you their actual support of Hamas. A more recent poll would show you their support now, which would have been affected a lot by the revenge bombings by Israel. They would now start to regret Oct 7. Before that, however, they were in solid support of Hamas and the Oct 7 attack. 

1 minute ago, WDSmart said:

If you actually think about it, a poll of the Palestinians shortly after Oct 7 shows you their actual support of Hamas. A more recent poll would show you their support now, which would have been affected a lot by the revenge bombings by Israel. They would now start to regret Oct 7. Before that, however, they were in solid support of Hamas and the Oct 7 attack. 

And

25 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

 

  It was never called Palestine, that's a untruth that you keep saying , you have said it so often, that you probably believe yourself

I guess the UN mistakenly called it "Palestine" then. You think? 😄 

United Nations Partition Plan for Palestine
United Nations Partition Plan for Palestine - Wikipedia

22 minutes ago, rattlesnake said:

 

I did not say Hamas would not exist without Netanyahu, I said it would not exist without the Israeli establishment.

 

Brig. Gen. Yitzhak Segev, Israeli military governor in Gaza in the early 1980s, told the New York Times that he had helped finance the Palestinian Islamist movement as a “counterweight” to the secularists and leftists of the Palestine Liberation Organization and the Fatah party, led by Yasser Arafat (who himself referred to Hamas as “a creature of Israel.”).

 

 

    Hamas were supposed to be a reasonable to be able to speak with, rather than the terror groups available at the time, then Hamas turned into a terror group as well 

21 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Hamas was created by the Muslim Brotherhood since 1987. Nothing to do with this war started on the 7th Oct

So, are you saying the Hamas that was created in 1987 has nothing to do with the Hamas that terrorized Israel on Oct 7?

Just now, WDSmart said:

So, are you saying the Hamas that was created in 1987 has nothing to do with the Hamas that terrorized Israel on Oct 7?

No you are making things up about what I said

1 hour ago, Wobblybob said:

Total garbled gibberish gobbledygook!

Nice alliteration, but otherwise, incorrect.

Just now, WDSmart said:

I guess the UN mistakenly called it "Palestine" then. You think? 😄 

United Nations Partition Plan for Palestine
United Nations Partition Plan for Palestine - Wikipedia

 

   Can you not see that we are just going around in circles ?

Small little circles with  no end product .

 

5 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

7 minutes ago, WDSmart said:

Hamas. A more recent poll would show you their support now, which would have been affected a lot by the revenge bombings by Israel. They would now start to regret Oct 7. Before that, however, they were in solid support of Hamas and the Oct 7 attack. 

And

And, that's interesting information to know. I myself have thought that Hamas did not represent the will of the majority of the Palestinians. That poll I posted would say that was incorrect.

6 minutes ago, WDSmart said:

If you actually think about it, a poll of the Palestinians shortly after Oct 7 shows you their actual support of Hamas. A more recent poll would show you their support now, which would have been affected a lot by the revenge bombings by Israel. They would now start to regret Oct 7. Before that, however, they were in solid support of Hamas and the Oct 7 attack. 

Stop being disingenuous, you love adding words meant to flame, Israel is not "revenge" bombing, they are after the terrorists that massacred Israelis and other nationalities and also trying to secure the release of the hostages!

3 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

4 minutes ago, WDSmart said:

So, are you saying the Hamas that was created in 1987 has nothing to do with the Hamas that terrorized Israel on Oct 7?

No you are making things up about what I said

What you said was, "Hamas was created by the Muslim Brotherhood since 1987. Nothing to do with this war started on the 7th Oct." Sounds like you were saying the original group had nothing to do with Oct 7 to me.

1 minute ago, WDSmart said:

And, that's interesting information to know. I myself have thought that Hamas did not represent the will of the majority of the Palestinians. That poll I posted would say that was incorrect.

Yes they were publishing polls for months even a few before Oct 7th. I'm surprised you've not come across all the links to them, but interesting for you to catch up agreed.

1 minute ago, WDSmart said:

What you said was, "Hamas was created by the Muslim Brotherhood since 1987. Nothing to do with this war started on the 7th Oct." Sounds like you were saying the original group had nothing to do with Oct 7 to me.

Correct and that's all I've got to say on it to you. 

6 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   Can you not see that we are just going around in circles ?

Small little circles with  no end product .

 

Yes, I see that all the time. But that seems to be the tone of this topic, unfortunately.

3 hours ago, Bkk Brian said:

Great news, Hamas #3 confirmed killed along with another commander!

 

Hamas confirms Marwan Issa killed - report

According to the sources, the number three in Hamas’s high command was killed in the IDF strike in Nusirat, in central Gaza, while he was hiding in one of Hamas's terror tunnels. 

Hamas stated behind closed doors that Marwan Issa, deputy to Hamas military chief Mohammed Deif, who was targeted in an Israeli strike last week, has been killed, according to a Sunday Kan News report, citing Palestinian sources. 

According to the sources, the number three in Hamas’s high command was killed in the IDF strike in Nusirat, in central Gaza, while he was hiding in one of Hamas's terror tunnels. 

https://www.jpost.com/breaking-news/article-792264

Reported death of Hamas leader Marwan Issa in IDF strike last week shows Israeli success in war 'This is a significant blow to Hamas if indeed Issa is out of the picture, but this won't dramatically change the reality on the ground,' says

 

44 minutes ago, WDSmart said:

Yes, I see that all the time. But that seems to be the tone of this topic, unfortunately.

 

   Like you are trying 99 different ways to try and prove that there was previously a Country called Palestine . You can try as many ways as you like , but there really wasn't a Country called Palestine before Israel was formed 

White colonists taking Arabs land 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

57 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   Like you are trying 99 different ways to try and prove that there was previously a Country called Palestine . You can try as many ways as you like , but there really wasn't a Country called Palestine before Israel was formed 

 

Balfour Declaration of November 2 1917, addressed to Lord Rothschild by Arthur James Balfour:

 

"His Majesty's Government view with favour the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people, and will use their best endeavors to facilitate the achievement of this object, it being clearly understood that nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine or the rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country.

 

I should be grateful if you would bring this declaration to the knowledge of the Zionist Federation."

 

https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/text-of-the-balfour-declaration

4 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

Why did you post that ?

 

To make it clear that the region and people of Palestine existed long before the 1948 Partition Plan and were recognised and referred to as such.

 

Zionists (or pro-Zionists) systematically use this angle to further the sophism that there was really no Palestinian people before 1948, and therefore imply there isn't really anything significant going on there in terms of ethnic cleansing.

6 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

History has revealed alliances and actions shaped by strategic interests rather than pure altruism. Prime example is the creation and support of Israel by Western white men, primarily driven by political motives.

It is a historical fact that the establishment of Israel in 1948 was orchestrated with significant backing from Western powers, notably the United States and the United Kingdom.

The narrative unfolds with the aftermath of World War II, where the horrors of the Holocaust spurred international sympathy towards the Jewish people and their quest for a homeland. However, it cannot be overlooked that the decision to carve out Israel from Palestinian land was not solely a humanitarian endeavor. Rather, it served the geopolitical interests of Western powers in the tumultuous Middle East region.

The strategic importance of having a staunch ally in the heart of the Arab world, especially during the Cold War era, played a pivotal role in the unwavering support extended to Israel by Western nations. This alliance, founded on shared political ideologies and strategic objectives, has persisted over the decades, despite the complexities and controversies surrounding the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.

Today, the United States and the United Kingdom continue to stand as staunch allies and supporters of Israel, both politically and militarily. This enduring alliance underscores the intricate interplay of power, politics, and interests that have shaped the modern geopolitical landscape. While the motivations behind the creation and support of Israel may vary, one cannot ignore the undeniable influence wielded by Western white men in shaping the course of history in the Middle East.

 

While this is partly true, Palestine had long been under various mandates and none of the Western powers were actually in favour of the Zionist plan. In fact, it was widely thought that it would greatly jeopardize Western interests in the region. The Western establishment was forced to comply with it through ruthless means of subversion and coercion. The Balfour Declaration was imposed in exchange for US entry into WWI (without which Germany would have won), UN delegates were pressured with threats such as suspension of economic aid to approve the 1948 partition. Even the Exodus episode, which was heavily covered by the media to gain public sympathy by showcasing a boat of Jewish refugees being refused entry in multiple countries, was orchestrated by Ben-Gurion and entirely fake.

 

If you are interested in this issue, I recommend reading Alison Weir's book Against our Better Judgment, the Hidden History of how the US was Used to Create Israel, which is very well documented and sourced.

11 hours ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   Like you are trying 99 different ways to try and prove that there was previously a Country called Palestine . You can try as many ways as you like , but there really wasn't a Country called Palestine before Israel was formed 

I don't think I ever said there was a COUNTRY called "Palestine." I said the LAND IN QUESTION was called Palestine, and it was before 1947 and even while the UN established the state of Israel. 

Quite a large operation ongoing right now at Shifa hospital

 

"IDF troops are currently conducting a precise operation in the area of Shifa hospital—based on intelligence information indicating the use of the hospital by senior Hamas terrorists to conduct and promote terrorist activity. Watch IDF Spokeperson RAdm. Daniel Hagari describe the importance of this operation, and the IDF’s efforts to minimize harm to noncombatants:"

 

 

 

Israel government continues to block aid response despite ICJ genocide court ruling, says Oxfam

https://www.oxfam.org/en/press-releases/israel-government-continues-block-aid-response-despite-icj-genocide-court-ruling

18 hours ago, WDSmart said:

What is the point of this story? Is it insinuating that the story about the Israeli terrorists beating and humiliating medics is false? Or is the concern just because the journalists writing the story seem to be pro-Hamas/anti-Israel? And if that's the case, will the BBC also consider it a problem if any of their journalists write stories condemning Hamas but later prove to be pro-Isreal/anti-Hamas? 

IMO it's all part of israeli propaganda, which tries to negate any story portraying the "heroes" of the IDF in a bad light, by deflecting away from the report about israeli atrocities and crimes, and making it about the reporters instead. Luckily such tactics are not working any more. We know the crimes carried out by the IDF from the reporting from Al Jazeera, which israel is powerless to control, and thank the deity for that, or the reality of IDF cruelty would never be exposed.