Wise demanding detailed banking and personal information

[TroubleandGrumpy]

I think it is a follow on from their recent data breach, but not only has Wise implemented upgraded login authentication processes, they are now demanding details personal and financial information for the last 3 months.  Below is the list of things they are asking for and I have confirmed with Wise directly that it is them and it is not a scam. 

Firstly, I am not going to comply and I will only be sending them basic written answers - not detailed statements and 'proof'.

Secondly, IMO this is a stupid thing to do because this will be copied by the scammers. 

My advice is to think carefully before responding to such a request.

Never has a bank or any financial institution ever demanded from me such information.

Is this related to the recent income tax changes introduced in Thailand? Maybe - who knows. 

I will be using another method to send money to Thailand from now on.

 

Could you please send over the following information?

Please include as much detail as possible.
 

Let us know how you earned the money to pay for your transfers

·         A detailed explanation of how you earned the money — this could be your salary, the sale of a property, company, or shares or from inheritance

 

Please send us your bank statements from the account ending in [XXXXX]

·         They must show transactions from the past 3 months

·         The latest date on the statement must be today or yesterday

 

Let us know why you’re making payments to xxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxx

·         A detailed description explaining what the money was used for or the reason for making these transfers

·         Let us know your relationship to the recipient

 

Upload all your documents here (Wise website).
 

[Upnotover]

Wise in which country?

[scubascuba3]

If you don't provide the details they will close your account, for some reason they consider you a money laundering risk

[connda]

Blame your government.  They are the ones who are pressuring Wise.

The government focuses on the little-people's transfers because the real serious money laundering happens between extremely wealthy people and the executives at major banks.  Look at a bank like HSBC and others who facilitate money laundering and then get a fine which is a small fraction of their profit margin and are written off as expenses - and nobody goes to jail. 

 

https://www.investopedia.com/stock-analysis/2013/investing-news-for-jan-29-hsbcs-money-laundering-scandal-hbc-scbff-ing-cs-rbs0129.aspx

"Although providing only a partial view of HSBC’s suspicious activity reports, the records show that between 2013 and 2017, HSBC’s U.S. compliance staff, who are charged with monitoring customer activity, filed reports lacking crucial customer information on 16 shell companies that had processed nearly $1.5 billion in more than 6,800 transactions through the bank’s Hong Kong operations alone. More than $900 million of that total involved shell companies linked to alleged criminal networks, according to an analysis by ICIJ and its media partners."

https://www.icij.org/investigations/fincen-files/hsbc-moved-vast-sums-of-dirty-money-after-paying-record-laundering-fine/

And the do it over and over again because it's lucrative and bank executives are not thrown into prison.
 

Hell of a deal, huh?  But we little-people are viewed under a microscope which ties up the rank-and-file regulators, that way they can ignore or overlook the big fish until some government accountant inadvertently catches them at it once more.

Just give Wise what they request, it's not that big of a deal and it's not their fault.  They are reacting to government audits.  They no doubt consider it a PITA as well.

 

 

Edited July 6 by connda

[billd766]

21 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

If you don't provide the details they will close your account, for some reason they consider you a money laundering risk

Really?

 

And do you have anything that proves what you say?

[connda]

49 minutes ago, TroubleandGrumpy said:

 

Let us know why you’re making payments to xxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxx

·         A detailed description explaining what the money was used for or the reason for making these transfers

·         Let us know your relationship to the recipient

 

Upload all your documents here (Wise website).
 

Interesting - the only accounts that I send my funds to is my own accounts at Thai banks which are clearly in my own name.

Are you sending the funds to a third-party?  That may be why this audit was triggered.  If not let us know.  And did you get this message via email or when you logged in? 

[billd766]

48 minutes ago, TroubleandGrumpy said:

I think it is a follow on from their recent data breach, but not only has Wise implemented upgraded login authentication processes, they are now demanding details personal and financial information for the last 3 months.  Below is the list of things they are asking for and I have confirmed with Wise directly that it is them and it is not a scam. 

Firstly, I am not going to comply and I will only be sending them basic written answers - not detailed statements and 'proof'.

Secondly, IMO this is a stupid thing to do because this will be copied by the scammers. 

My advice is to think carefully before responding to such a request.

Never has a bank or any financial institution ever demanded from me such information.

Is this related to the recent income tax changes introduced in Thailand? Maybe - who knows. 

I will be using another method to send money to Thailand from now on.

 

Could you please send over the following information?

Please include as much detail as possible.
 

Let us know how you earned the money to pay for your transfers

·         A detailed explanation of how you earned the money — this could be your salary, the sale of a property, company, or shares or from inheritance

 

Please send us your bank statements from the account ending in [XXXXX]

·         They must show transactions from the past 3 months

·         The latest date on the statement must be today or yesterday

 

Let us know why you’re making payments to xxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxx

·         A detailed description explaining what the money was used for or the reason for making these transfers

·         Let us know your relationship to the recipient

 

Upload all your documents here (Wise website).
 

I have been using Wise UK for over 5 years now and I have never seen anything like that.

 

Perhaps because all the money that I transfer through Wise to Thailand comes from my pensions and that shows up on the emails that Wise send to me. and also from my Wise bank statements that I download from Wise every month.

 

Maybe the ruling comes from the Bank of England and is simply passed on to Wise and perhaps to all the banks in the UK to try to cut back on money laundering.

[HappyExpat57]

I just went through this nonsense this morning. I had to upload a photo of my passport, then a selfie. The way the passport photo is framed made it look like it recorded ONLY the passport. I didn't realize it also took in the surrounding area. I took this photo with the passport lying on my desk in my birthday suit. I inadvertently sent them a dick pic. There was no option to try again.

 

I was just making a typical xfer the same as I've done for years. This new bullsh!t has me looking elsewhere now.

 

https://www.instarem.com/blog/best-alternatives-to-wise/

[CallumWK]

1 hour ago, TroubleandGrumpy said:

Please send us your bank statements from the account ending in [XXXXX]

·         They must show transactions from the past 3 months

·         The latest date on the statement must be today or yesterday

 

Sure it wasn't Thai immigration that sent that message?

Now how would anyone be able to comply with that? If I send money from my home country to Thailand, it is because I live here but my account is still in my home country, and there will be no statement from yesterday, because there are no other transactions than those wise transfers

[scubascuba3]

1 hour ago, billd766 said:

Really?

 

And do you have anything that proves what you say?

do you think they are asking just for fun?

[Mike Lister]

That's nothing to do with the data breach, those are are all AMLO and KYC style questions.  

[Liverpool Lou]

2 hours ago, TroubleandGrumpy said:

Wise ... are now demanding details personal and financial information for the last 3 months.

Just checked my Wise account...no such demands.

[Mike Lister]

4 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

Just checked my Wise account...no such demands.

If I was Wise I'd close his account on the basis his AN posts are too long. 🙂

[billd766]

28 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

do you think they are asking just for fun?

You are the only one who is saying that.

 

They have not asked me or anyone that I personally know.

 

If you cannot answer the question I asked, can you answer this one.

 

No details required, simply yes or no.

 

Has this happened to you?

 

Out of all the people who use Wise, only @Troubleand Grumpy plus @HappyExpat57 have mentioned it. 

 

There seems to be several threads lately knocking Wise for some reason.

 

Can you back up what you are saying?

[Digitalbanana]

20 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

Just checked my Wise account...no such demands.

Same here.

[JackGats]

Could this be phishing?

[Moonlover]

Scam or wind up, which is it?

 

I do not believe that Wise would have the authority to ask such searching questions. They're entitled to confirm your identity by whatever means they choose, but that's about it. If the O/P was under investigation for some reason it would be up to the appropriate authority to ask these questions, not Wise.

 

IMO this is B/S.

[Mike Lister]

18 minutes ago, JackGats said:

Could this be phishing?

I agree, it sounds like s phishing expedition.

[scubascuba3]

51 minutes ago, Mike Lister said:

I agree, it sounds like s phishing expedition.

Looks legit to me, but he should check the email is legit even call Wise if necessary 

[scubascuba3]

1 hour ago, Liverpool Lou said:

Just checked my Wise account...no such demands.

Proves nothing, they obviously choose specific people who for whatever reason have triggered additional AML checks

[TroubleandGrumpy]

3 hours ago, connda said:

Interesting - the only accounts that I send my funds to is my own accounts at Thai banks which are clearly in my own name.

Are you sending the funds to a third-party?  That may be why this audit was triggered.  If not let us know.  And did you get this message via email or when you logged in? 

To the Wife - but at the time I told them via phone call and sent them an email - I send 4 large transfers in the year.

It was an email and it has been confirmed through login answers and by calling them to confirm.

 

[TroubleandGrumpy]

59 minutes ago, Moonlover said:

Scam or wind up, which is it?

 

I do not believe that Wise would have the authority to ask such searching questions. They're entitled to confirm your identity by whatever means they choose, but that's about it. If the O/P was under investigation for some reason it would be up to the appropriate authority to ask these questions, not Wise.

 

IMO this is B/S.

My read too - if APRA, which is the regulations authority in Australia, is asking questions, they would be asking them from me.

Wise is stepping far over the mark - they are probably getting the info just in case they are asked.

But as I said, at the time of the first transfer I advised them who is was to and what is was for (call and email).

Wise are no longer my preferred option for exchange transfers.

 

[KhunBENQ]

Read this to learn that this is definitely no pishing or scam, like it or not.

As the OP stated he has done four bigger transfers to his wife.

Seem to have triggered some alarm.

 

https://wise.com/help/articles/2976418/what-documents-might-i-need-for-a-large-transfer

 

Looks to me like: don't use WISE for large transfers and particularly to third parties?

Edited July 6 by KhunBENQ

[CallumWK]

4 hours ago, TroubleandGrumpy said:

I will be using another method to send money to Thailand from now on.

 

Did you receive these questions after you initiated a transfer, and is your money still in your bank account or already with Wise?

[Presnock]

4 hours ago, TroubleandGrumpy said:

I think it is a follow on from their recent data breach, but not only has Wise implemented upgraded login authentication processes, they are now demanding details personal and financial information for the last 3 months.  Below is the list of things they are asking for and I have confirmed with Wise directly that it is them and it is not a scam. 

Firstly, I am not going to comply and I will only be sending them basic written answers - not detailed statements and 'proof'.

Secondly, IMO this is a stupid thing to do because this will be copied by the scammers. 

My advice is to think carefully before responding to such a request.

Never has a bank or any financial institution ever demanded from me such information.

Is this related to the recent income tax changes introduced in Thailand? Maybe - who knows. 

I will be using another method to send money to Thailand from now on.

 

Could you please send over the following information?

Please include as much detail as possible.
 

Let us know how you earned the money to pay for your transfers

·         A detailed explanation of how you earned the money — this could be your salary, the sale of a property, company, or shares or from inheritance

 

Please send us your bank statements from the account ending in [XXXXX]

·         They must show transactions from the past 3 months

·         The latest date on the statement must be today or yesterday

 

Let us know why you’re making payments to xxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxx

·         A detailed description explaining what the money was used for or the reason for making these transfers

·         Let us know your relationship to the recipient

 

Upload all your documents here (Wise website).
 

Actually sounds like your description of what WISE wants, is exactly like the Warning I got from my bank saying NEVER give this banking information to anyone especially if asked for this via email.  Only use encrypted comms set up between you and the bank to relay any information on your account.  goodluck

 

[Eudaimonia]

Wise has not asked me too much yet (as my transactions are so simple), but many banks certainly have. Financial institutions are required to know their customers and constantly evaluate the risks related to all transactions.

 

Sending money to Thailand is already a red flag: it's evaluated as a relatively risky country for money laundering and terrorist financing (Score 5.82 on the Basel AML index). https://index.baselgovernance.org/ranking

 

Compliance departments want to understand where money is coming from, where it's going, and, in extreme cases, whether the customer has accumulated their entire wealth legally. They're eager to close down accounts if they do not get all this information.

 

The most detailed reply I have sent was over 60 pages. It was a comprehensive request regarding the Source of Funds for specific transfers and the Sources of Wealth on a global scale.

 

There is no privacy in banking anymore.

[Chivas]

11 hours ago, TroubleandGrumpy said:

I think it is a follow on from their recent data breach, but not only has Wise implemented upgraded login authentication processes, they are now demanding details personal and financial information for the last 3 months.  Below is the list of things they are asking for and I have confirmed with Wise directly that it is them and it is not a scam. 

Firstly, I am not going to comply and I will only be sending them basic written answers - not detailed statements and 'proof'.

Secondly, IMO this is a stupid thing to do because this will be copied by the scammers. 

My advice is to think carefully before responding to such a request.

Never has a bank or any financial institution ever demanded from me such information.

Is this related to the recent income tax changes introduced in Thailand? Maybe - who knows. 

I will be using another method to send money to Thailand from now on.

 

Could you please send over the following information?

Please include as much detail as possible.
 

Let us know how you earned the money to pay for your transfers

·         A detailed explanation of how you earned the money — this could be your salary, the sale of a property, company, or shares or from inheritance

 

Please send us your bank statements from the account ending in [XXXXX]

·         They must show transactions from the past 3 months

·         The latest date on the statement must be today or yesterday

 

Let us know why you’re making payments to xxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxx

·         A detailed description explaining what the money was used for or the reason for making these transfers

·         Let us know your relationship to the recipient

 

Upload all your documents here (Wise website).
 

 

None of that bollacks required for me.........yet

[Chivas]

In fact normally when I use laptop it requires me to click on link via smartphone

Didnt even ask for that either a few minutes ago

[Mike Lister]

I continue to think those questions are banking related KYC and AMLO related, they are NOT typical questions a money transfer company should ask, in my experience. If me, I would check with WISE directly on this point to confirm or otherwise.

[TroubleandGrumpy]

20 hours ago, CallumWK said:

 

Did you receive these questions after you initiated a transfer, and is your money still in your bank account or already with Wise?

I did the transfers many months ago - 4 over a period of 3 months - last one was in April - they all went through no problems.

I move the money from my investment funds into a local Aust bank and same day transfer to Wise and then same or next day transfer to Thailand.