Report Thai submarine plans sink as Germany halts engine sale

[daveAustin]

16 minutes ago, mania said:

Wonder how many Thai citizens that money could have helped...how many kids it could have educated with schools built...how many helped with hospitals & dentists,,,how many provinces helped with redesign to stop yearly flooding...Instead 14,783 MILLION baht for three anchors

Totally get the sentiment—the military and war is waste etc—but d’you really think all those good deeds would be an option? As with India where a huge swathe of its populace really struggles and Britain continues to pile in the cash, yet it has nukes and a space programs. Wtf?! It’s the broke monetary system vs human nature for greed, power, face etc. We’re centuries away from awareness, doing the right thing by the people and foregoing conflict and weapons. 

[thesetat]

the Op is quite funny in a sad way. 

Thailand buys an aircraft carrier but it has yet to add any planes to it after many years already.  

They buy subs but China fails to uphold the sale of the engines needed to propel it. So they go to Germany to buy some from them. But because of Thailands affectionate status with China, Germany refuses to sell them to Thailand. 

Leaving Thailand with one useless Aircraft carrier and 2 useless Subs. 

Then, to top off the bad news and make you forget that Thailand wasted so much money for nothing, the Op goes on to make it seem a good thing Thailand and Germany hold such good relationships together for many years. 

It does not get any better than this haha... 

[realfunster]

2 hours ago, NoDisplayName said:

 

Are the two engines not identical, apart from the label?

 

the offered Chinese engine, CHD620 is actually a licenced-manufactured version of the German MTU396 engine.

 

https://www.defensemirror.com/news/35501/Chinese_Submarine_Engine_is_a_Licensed_produced_German_Powerplant__Thai_Navy_Chief

 

And the German engine is no longer in production.

 

Production of all MTU 396 diesel engines has been discontinued from 2020 as well that makes Chinese-style submarines equipped with diesel engine propulsion MTU16V396SE84 such as Type 039A/B/C/D (NATO) diesel-electric attack (SSK) submarines (class coded Yuan) built after this will have to be replaced with a CHD620V16H6 diesel engine.

 

https://defense-studies.blogspot.com/2023/08/china-completes-certification-for.html

 

 

Great, so the plan is to buy a Chinese knock-off of an technologically obsolete German engine 🙂 What could possibly go wrong ?

 

Any imaginary enemies in the Gulf of Thailand would be laughing their heads off.

 

I did a quick Google search for available 2nd hand engines, it seems like the Thai Navy have beaten me to it !

 

[Gobbler]

13 hours ago, webfact said:

 

In a notable development, Germany has officially confirmed it cannot proceed with the sale of submarine engines to Thailand. This decision stems from European Union restrictions on exporting military equipment to China, revealed Deputy Prime Minister and Defense Minister of Thailand, Phumtham Wechayachai.

 

No problem at all! Just have the submarine towed to Laem Chabang, hire some fake Chinese engineers, as they did with the just-collapsed building, and have at it.  

 

What could go wrong?

[Dogmatix]

Just like the attempt to purchase F-35s the Thai navy and government has known all along there was no possibility that the Germans could supply the engines for use in Chinese subs on anything military of that type to a country that is so close to the Chinese.  This has just been a charade.

[redwood1]

49 minutes ago, mania said:

Wonder how many Thai citizens that money could have helped...how many kids it could have educated with schools built...how many helped with hospitals & dentists,,,how many provinces helped with redesign to stop yearly flooding...Instead 14,783 MILLION baht for three anchors

 

Trust me large chucks of this money is sitting in the RIGHT people personal bank accounts......They most likely have been skimming for years now..

 

I doubt there is enough money left to even buy a sub...

[redwood1]

5 minutes ago, Dogmatix said:

Just like the attempt to purchase F-35s the Thai navy and government has known all along there was no possibility that the Germans could supply the engines for use in Chinese subs on anything military of that type to a country that is so close to the Chinese.  This has just been a charade.

 

Exactly like I said before its pretty clear it was their plan from day #1 for it to be a failure..

[Gknrd]

Hahaha, the whole world knows Thailand and China are pretty much in step. Deal with the sub was probably paid for by the Chinese under the table to get the latest and greatest tech from Germany.  Old news.

[Geoff914]

Are the diesel engines running on diesel or will they get some back street workshop to knock up a CNG kit.

[NoDisplayName]

2 hours ago, realfunster said:

Great, so the plan is to buy a Chinese knock-off of an technologically obsolete German engine 🙂 What could possibly go wrong ?

 

Not knock-offs.  The  CHD620 is identical to the MTU396, being a licensed copy.  The only difference is the label.....and the cost.

 

This is just the result of EU regulations on sales of military-related gear to China, probably coming into effect after the licensing contract had been signed.

 

China already has the tech, and is allegedly making improvements.

 

Since the engine offered to Thailand is referred to as "CHD620" not "TBD620" that means it's one of Hechai's improved variants. At least it should have high pressure common rail injection. Maybe sequential turbo-charging as well, not sure. Hechai's webpage on CHD620/622 is completely blank, so no specs sheet. Technologically it's certainly more advanced than MTU396, which is an ancient design by now (MTU is promoting MTU 4000 for new submarines).

 

from a post on Weibo, believed to be the submarine variant of HND’s CHD620 diesel engine designated the CHD620V16H6 passing certification. This variant of CHD620 is planned to be installed on Pakistan Navy’s Hangor Class (S20P) and Royal Thai Navy’s S26T class submarine currently under construction. The CHD620V16H6 will replaced the MTU16V396SE84 as the submarine’s main generator since Germary block the export of such engine to China.

 

https://www.sinodefenceforum.com/t/chinese-marine-propulsion.8400/page-9

[Bundooman]

That damned submarine must be way past it's 'sell-by' date by now.

It's not the Jules Verne Nautilus is it?

[TedG]

I'm unsure why Thailand needs a submarine.  

[safarimike11]

10 hours ago, Ralf001 said:

 

Less than 5 million each sounds cheap, is that because they do not have engines?

thousand million = billion - I believe.

[TheFishman1]

If the envelopes were already handed to the people it will be hard to call off the deal because those people already got paid TIT

[geisha]

Why doesn’t the Thai governments ask Putin to help them out ? They’re good friends aren’t they ?

[Ralf001]

8 hours ago, safarimike11 said:

thousand million = billion - I believe.

 

yeah I screwed up.... saw the word million and did not look too much at the actual number.

[Luuk Chaai]

officially confirmed it cannot proceed with the sale of submarine engines to Thailand. This decision stems from European Union restrictions on exporting military equipment to China,

 

 

Say's it all right there !

[EVENKEEL]

Throw in a couple ladyboys and shake hands.

[safarimike11]

18 hours ago, Ralf001 said:

 

yeah I screwed up.... saw the word million and did not look too much at the actual number.

We all live in a Yellow Submarine...