What qualifies someone as a real old-hand in Asia, particularly in Thailand? Years in-country, experience with visas and immigration, half a dozen failed romances, knowledge of local culture, language skills, or merely staying long enough without going home?

 

Personally, I’d say if you haven’t done at least 20 years here, you’re still a mid-level newbie. It’s only after the two-decade mark that you can claim true “old-hand” status. That's when you’ve seen governments change multiple times, witnessed street protests, department store fires, coups, tsunamis, currency crashes, floods, bar scenes rise and fall, and you’ve been through at least a couple cycles of Thailand reinventing itself.

 

And for those who hit 30 years? I don’t even know what category that is… ancient relic? Museum piece? Or maybe just “part of the woodwork.” Either way, at that point you've seen it all, and none of it surprises you anymore. Not even a soi full of ladyboys. 

Time is irrelevant. Know guys who have been here 25 30 years and can’t really relate to anything much outside of their local area and wife. Can’t even do an extension without an agent. Met one guy a few years back who lived in a condo with his local wife for 18 years in chang phueak, we were talking and as I was getting ready to split mentioned that I was heading to kad thannin in santitham and he said, “Santitham? Kad thannin? Where’s that?”

Chang phueak, where else and where have you been? A lot of hermit types here that stay in doors stare at the television all day and the only social activity is when the wife says “ok food ready”. 

Experienced all of the above, plus a couple more, incl. terrorism (young people being shot dead on a motorbike, just dozens of metres from where I lived), bombs exploding exactly where I was (but 24 hours, the second time 2-3 hours later), Thai people in crazy fights, pulling a homeless Thai guy out of the sea, etc., etc. (I pondered, whether I should write a book about it, but a movie might be more appropriate...) 😆 

The sun, it's brutal here, the skin of my hand is best described as reptilian now.

 

 

43 minutes ago, StayinThailand2much said:

pondered, whether I should write a book about it

Definitely should pen a book about it. You could title it "Wrong Place, Wrong Time". 

44 minutes ago, novacova said:

Time is irrelevant. Know guys who have been here 25 30 years and can’t really relate to anything much outside of their local area and wife. Can’t even do an extension without an agent. Met one guy a few years back who lived in a condo with his local wife for 18 years in chang phueak, we were talking and as I was getting ready to split mentioned that I was heading to kad thannin in santitham and he said, “Santitham? Kad thannin? Where’s that?”

Chang phueak, where else and where have you been? A lot of hermit types here that stay in doors stare at the television all day and the only social activity is when the wife says “ok food ready”. 

That's creepy. Guys actually come to Thailand and shut themselves in for 20 years? Most expats I've met have been the opposite. 

24 minutes ago, SoCal1990 said:

That's creepy. Guys actually come to Thailand and shut themselves in for 20 years? Most expats I've met have been the opposite. 

It happens all over the place on the planet, not only here. Personally could imagine why some folks live in a small bubble.

Ability to speak, understand, read and write Thai with fluency.

 

That would be a small percentage of foreigners living here.

First came here in the early 80s.

You have been a member less than a year but asking all the BS questions from the last 20 years, use the search function, or login to your previous socal account history & stop spamming

i use my hand

There are no "old hands". Most AN members were old when they arrived and after a few years were ready to die. If I look at the members listing from when I first started to read the forums, 80%+ are either dead or were forced to move back to their homelands. I can think of multiple members who are long dead. The CM forum had a nice in memoriam page. That's where you can find the old hands.

3 hours ago, SoCal1990 said:

What qualifies someone as a real old-hand in Asia, particularly in Thailand? Years in-country, experience with visas and immigration, half a dozen failed romances, knowledge of local culture, language skills, or merely staying long enough without going home?

 

Personally, I’d say if you haven’t done at least 20 years here, you’re still a mid-level newbie. It’s only after the two-decade mark that you can claim true “old-hand” status. That's when you’ve seen governments change multiple times, witnessed street protests, department store fires, coups, tsunamis, currency crashes, floods, bar scenes rise and fall, and you’ve been through at least a couple cycles of Thailand reinventing itself.

 

And for those who hit 30 years? I don’t even know what category that is… ancient relic? Museum piece? Or maybe just “part of the woodwork.” Either way, at that point you've seen it all, and none of it surprises you anymore. Not even a soi full of ladyboys. 

 

 Certainly longevity alone doesn’t equal insight....and what does "old hand" even mean - it's a sort of self congratualtory phrase to try and justify their embedded bigotry?
I know people who’ve lived here for decades and still don’t geddit.
That’s the Expat Paradox in action: years in Thailand, yet culturally tone-deaf, socially isolated, and clinging to outdated superiority complexes. 
Why are they here? Not for Thailand, that’s for sure.
They’re here for an “affordable” lifestyle:
•    A pension that stretches
•    Cheap beer and cheaper rentals
•    Casual sex well past their expiration date
•    And a wife who functions more like a live-in maid than a partner.
They never worked in Thailand.
They never engaged with Thai society beyond surface-level transactions.
They don’t speak the language, they don’t trust the locals, and often don’t even like them.
So what does 30 years here really mean… if you’ve spent it drunk, bitter, and surrounded only by other expats?
Being “part of the woodwork” isn’t a badge of honour —
It’s often just code for being stuck, irrelevant, and unaware that Thailand moved on without you.
 

 

2 hours ago, Lacessit said:

Ability to speak, understand, read and write Thai with fluency.

 

That would be a small percentage of foreigners living here.

After 20-30 years, you should at least be able to speak it with a 4th grade proficiency. No excuse not to. 

35 minutes ago, kwilco said:

 

 Certainly longevity alone doesn’t equal insight....and what does "old hand" even mean - it's a sort of self congratualtory phrase to try and justify their embedded bigotry?
I know people who’ve lived here for decades and still don’t geddit.
That’s the Expat Paradox in action: years in Thailand, yet culturally tone-deaf, socially isolated, and clinging to outdated superiority complexes. 
Why are they here? Not for Thailand, that’s for sure.
They’re here for an “affordable” lifestyle:
•    A pension that stretches
•    Cheap beer and cheaper rentals
•    Casual sex well past their expiration date
•    And a wife who functions more like a live-in maid than a partner.
They never worked in Thailand.
They never engaged with Thai society beyond surface-level transactions.
They don’t speak the language, they don’t trust the locals, and often don’t even like them.
So what does 30 years here really mean… if you’ve spent it drunk, bitter, and surrounded only by other expats?
Being “part of the woodwork” isn’t a badge of honour —
It’s often just code for being stuck, irrelevant, and unaware that Thailand moved on without you.
 

 

I think the term “old hand” was originally meant to describe someone who’s a seasoned veteran. Someone with real experience on the ground who actually gets it. But these days, plenty of people like to call themselves old hands without ever really reaching that level.

 

Like you said, many live in an isolated expat bubble, drink too much, never bother to learn the language, and never grasp how or why things work here. I see it constantly on this forum, people who’ve been here for years but clearly never figured it out. Most of the time, they just seem angry more than anything.

1 hour ago, Mark1969 said:

i use my hand

Just one?

1 hour ago, connda said:

First came here in the early 80s.

I think in the context of the OP one has to say "so what?"

If you have had screaming chili sh*ts in a roadside squat in Isaan, then gotten back on the bus, you are an old hand.

19 minutes ago, SoCal1990 said:

I think the term “old hand” was originally meant to describe someone who’s a seasoned veteran.

don't think you really need "veteran" - more  a person with a lot of experience in something. But many people think they have experience when in fact all they have is an accumulation of bad habits, cognitive biases, flawed judgments and perceptions

6 minutes ago, Yagoda said:

If you have had screaming chili sh*ts in a roadside squat in Isaan, then gotten back on the bus, you are an old hand.

that would indicate you are not used to the food and therefore not an "old hand".

10 minutes ago, kwilco said:

that would indicate you are not used to the food and therefore not an "old hand".

Or that you are and got a bad batch

3 hours ago, Lacessit said:

Ability to speak, understand, read and write Thai with fluency.

Ridiculous.

31 minutes ago, Yagoda said:

Or that you are and got a bad batch

so how does that qualify you as an "old hand"

1 hour ago, SoCal1990 said:

After 20-30 years, you should at least be able to speak it with a 4th grade proficiency. No excuse not to. 

Not everyone has good language acquisition skills. Much easier for those who already speak more than one language. Having said this some basic Thai should be able to be used. 1st thing I learnt was how to order a beer. Thai is a very difficult language because it's tonal but sure after 20 years not having even some basic Thai is only because someone doesn't want to or thinks they don't need to learn any. As for 4th grade proficiency this is at the fluent level.

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15 hours ago, SoCal1990 said:

I see it constantly on this forum, people who’ve been here for years but clearly never figured it out.

lol

can you cite some examples? 

Many have been here 20 years, been fleeced for money many times, and are still wanting to marry a scamming bagirl.  Stupid and insecure Simps.

10 hours ago, SoCal1990 said:

What qualifies someone as a real old-hand in Asia, particularly in Thailand?

Not having to ask a lot of questions.

Nam.

Don't feed the.