Guess who’s sorry now?

The UK govt suppressed this report on environmental collapse

George Monbiot

The Guardian: 27 January 2026

The most important document published by the UK government since the general election emerged last week only through a freedom of information request.

It provides a powerful vindication of certain messages that, when voiced by environmentalists, have been greeted with hatred, fury and denial. For example, it tells us that “food production is the most significant cause of terrestrial biodiversity loss”, that “animal farming at current levels is unsustainable without imports” and that “the UK does not have enough land to feed its population and rear livestock: a wholesale change in consumer diets would be required”.

But what was cut from the report is, according to The Times, even graver, including a warning that the shrinkage of glaciers in the Himalayas, causing declining river flow, would “almost certainly escalate tensions” between China, India and Pakistan, leading to the possibility of nuclear war. Again, some of us have been trying to persuade governments to focus on this threat with little success.

It’s almost reassuring to know we’re not alone in being stonewalled. If even the security services are gagged when they tell the government what it doesn’t want to hear, perhaps our communication style, or our modes of protest or our dress sense, are not, as we keep being told, the problem. The report, notably shorter than most of its kind, gives every appearance of having been hastily and crudely truncated.

I wonder whether the full assessment might also have named some other pressing security threats. One is the way in which fossil fuel, meat and livestock producers have been funding far-right movements, to stifle environmental protection measures that would reduce their profits. Such funding is a major driver of the fascistic politics that we now witness in the US.

The main factor driving environmental degradation, climate change and food security issues is the one rarely mentioned.

Population growth - there's just too many humans on this planet.

In my lifetime the global population has grown from 2.8 billion to over 8 billion.

Maybe we need WW3 to ensure the future survival of humans.

54 minutes ago, Kinnock said:

The main factor driving environmental degradation, climate change and food security issues is the one rarely mentioned.

Population growth - there's just too many humans on this planet.

Well, for much of the past 50 years, the people of the US and Western Europe have voted in the most fundamental way, declining birthrates, to control their population. Alas, their governments repeatedly tell them to go to hell, and go right ahead and stuff their countries with foreigners who continue the population surge. When I was in high school in the US, we were told our population would top out around 220 to 230 million by the middle of the 21st century. Earth Day 1970 publicized these projections. That would have been the case had not the floodgates of immigration been opened. And this relieved little of the pressure on the nations where the immigrants came from, as they continued to skyrocket population counts as well. Politicians purposely decided to create a global hellscape that destroyed all notions of true sustainability. Just look up Zero Population Growth, the Sierra Club, and the Rockefeller Commission's bipartisan Commission on Population Growth and the American Future that reported to the US Congress in 1972.

Politicians know diddly squat about the laws of thermodynamics. That's what's driving global warming and climate change.

We are not all doomed, the rich will survive quite easily.

16 hours ago, Lacessit said:

Politicians know diddly squat about the laws of thermodynamics. That's what's driving global warming and climate change.

We are not all doomed, the rich will survive quite easily.

No, the "rich" will still die like the poor if there is an infectious disease, and increases in cancer arising from environmental degradation. The deciding factor will be access to potable water and fertile lands. The EU is at risk of water insufficiency. As water access decreases the land goes barren, with an inability to produce the food needed. If India and Pakistan go to war it will be because of water. The countries best placed for survival are the countries with moderate to cooler climates. They typically have large clean water resources. Examples are Canada, Sweden, Norway A slight increase in temperature will extend their growing seasons.

19 hours ago, Kinnock said:

The main factor driving environmental degradation, climate change and food security issues is the one rarely mentioned.

Population growth - there's just too many humans on this planet.

In my lifetime the global population has grown from 2.8 billion to over 8 billion.

Maybe we need WW3 to ensure the future survival of humans.

Welcome to the forum Ms Thunberg ,

20 hours ago, unblocktheplanet said:

Guess who’s sorry now?

The UK govt suppressed this report on environmental collapse

George Monbiot

The Guardian: 27 January 2026

The most important document published by the UK government since the general election emerged last week only through a freedom of information request.

It provides a powerful vindication of certain messages that, when voiced by environmentalists, have been greeted with hatred, fury and denial. For example, it tells us that “food production is the most significant cause of terrestrial biodiversity loss”, that “animal farming at current levels is unsustainable without imports” and that “the UK does not have enough land to feed its population and rear livestock: a wholesale change in consumer diets would be required”.

But what was cut from the report is, according to The Times, even graver, including a warning that the shrinkage of glaciers in the Himalayas, causing declining river flow, would “almost certainly escalate tensions” between China, India and Pakistan, leading to the possibility of nuclear war. Again, some of us have been trying to persuade governments to focus on this threat with little success.

It’s almost reassuring to know we’re not alone in being stonewalled. If even the security services are gagged when they tell the government what it doesn’t want to hear, perhaps our communication style, or our modes of protest or our dress sense, are not, as we keep being told, the problem. The report, notably shorter than most of its kind, gives every appearance of having been hastily and crudely truncated.

I wonder whether the full assessment might also have named some other pressing security threats. One is the way in which fossil fuel, meat and livestock producers have been funding far-right movements, to stifle environmental protection measures that would reduce their profits. Such funding is a major driver of the fascistic politics that we now witness in the US.

Welcome to the forum Ms Thunberg, you have said your piece , point taken, you can go home now

19 hours ago, Kinnock said:

Maybe we need WW3 to ensure the future survival of humans.

It might work I suppose , It could however quite easily have the opposite effect, having said that so could a virus

But Why worry about the end of humans at all? , its no more "catastrophic" than the end of Wooly Mammoths or Sabre tooth Tigers it won't affect any of us, and there is absolutely nothing we can do about it

When it comes to environmental damage you got two people, those who don't believe, and those who see and understand!

And then of course you got politicians and Greta and everyone else,

45 minutes ago, Patong2021 said:

No, the "rich" will still die like the poor if there is an infectious disease, and increases in cancer arising from environmental degradation. The deciding factor will be access to potable water and fertile lands. The EU is at risk of water insufficiency. As water access decreases the land goes barren, with an inability to produce the food needed. If India and Pakistan go to war it will be because of water. The countries best placed for survival are the countries with moderate to cooler climates. They typically have large clean water resources. Examples are Canada, Sweden, Norway A slight increase in temperature will extend their growing seasons.

Infectious diseases which have a 90% mortality rate are fairly rare.

Cancer is not a disease affecting the majority of young people. The older you are, the higher the probability of getting it. It's usually occurring well past the breeding age.

Asia is actually most at risk from water insufficiency. Conservative models are saying by 2050, water flows from the Himalayan glaciers will be halved. That doesn't include the 2000 odd dams the Chinese have built, or are building.

If that happens, the Mekong, Ganges and Brahmaputra will be reduced to 50% of their current flow. About 1 billion people depend on those rivers for their livelihood.

Canadians have long been worried about 'water wars', principally from the US. Seizing Québec would give the Yanqs clean water for a long time. And we already know their govt is a pack of thieves & liars, always ready to grab what they can.

I honestly can't understand why people have this hate on for Greta. At least she's doing something and only a handful are. She's got the brand recognition to get the issues into the press. Is it because she's young, because she's female, because she's Aspergers? She's doing something. Why don't you!

1 hour ago, Lacessit said:

Infectious diseases which have a 90% mortality rate are fairly rare.

Cancer is not a disease affecting the majority of young people. The older you are, the higher the probability of getting it. It's usually occurring well past the breeding age.

Asia is actually most at risk from water insufficiency. Conservative models are saying by 2050, water flows from the Himalayan glaciers will be halved. That doesn't include the 2000 odd dams the Chinese have built, or are building.

If that happens, the Mekong, Ganges and Brahmaputra will be reduced to 50% of their current flow. About 1 billion people depend on those rivers for their livelihood.

One need not have a high fatality rate to be a debilitating disease. Malaria and other insect transmitted diseases illustrate this. With the warming of climates, we see the spread of malaria in the "developed" economies. West Nile and Zika were once rarities. Now there are outbreaks in areas that were once free of such diseases. Frosts once acted as a protective force against the onslaught of destructive insect pests. As those frosts retreat, the insects advance.These diseases inflict tremendous economic costs and reduce national GDP as is demonstrated by the experience in Africa.

As water impurities increase and there is more exposure to carcinogens, the carcinogen load increases and the impact upon rapidly reproducing cells becomes more pronounced. What were once slow moving cancers in older adults, e.g. Prostate are becoming more aggressive cancers of the vital organs like the pancreas, lungs and brain.

15 minutes ago, unblocktheplanet said:

Canadians have long been worried about 'water wars', principally from the US. Seizing Québec would give the Yanqs clean water for a long time. And we already know their govt is a pack of thieves & liars, always ready to grab what they can.

I honestly can't understand why people have this hate on for Greta. At least she's doing something and only a handful are. She's got the brand recognition to get the issues into the press. Is it because she's young, because she's female, because she's Aspergers? She's doing something. Why don't you!

Canadians are not worried about water wars. They can't even grasp the concept of water conservation. It is beyond stupid to even suggest that the US would seize Quebec to give themselves clean water. Do you even know what the water supply situation is in Quebec? There is no excess of potable water. For example, the St Lawrence river and Great Lakes were at their lowest levels in many years. The water shortages of the USA are in its southwest and are not going to be cured by spending trillions of $$ to pipe in small amounts of water from Quebec. Do you not realize that 3/4 of Canadian water flows to the north, into Hudson's Bay and the Arctic, and not to the south.

Greta is a pathological liar and this was exposed after her last political stunts. Her brand is not strong as her image was tarnished after she was caught in multiple lies and did not take responsibility for them or apologize. There are legitimate, honest environmental activists who have been working hard for decades. And then Greta comes along with her insincerity and she is the flavour of the month.

5 hours ago, Lacessit said:

Infectious diseases which have a 90% mortality rate are fairly rare.

No such thing as an 'infectious disease' Sir.

33 minutes ago, Stiddle Mump said:

No such thing as an 'infectious disease' Sir.

Isn't there a village in rural Thailand waiting to embrace you?

Well, Covid-19 was a 'good attempt' by China to reduce the world's population. Anyone for Covid-27?

On 1/31/2026 at 3:50 PM, John Drake said:

When I was in high school in the US, we were told our population would top out around 220 to 230 million by the middle of the 21st century. Earth Day 1970 publicized these projections. That would have been the case had not the floodgates of immigration been opened. And this relieved little of the pressure on the nations where the immigrants came from, as they continued to skyrocket population counts as well

The 800 pound gorilla though, is the ill-thought out finger pointing at migrants (who work for less - that's why they were allowed in, in the first place) and the off-shoring of manufacturing that happened in tandem, and later even service jobs (call centers etc.). If people (particluarly MAGA types) still really can't see who is the enemy within then they deserve what they have now. It was always about the pursuit of cheap labor to enrich the already-rich oligarchs and billionnaire owners of the United States, while the living standards of Americans (and those of other western countries) declines. The enemy is the oligarchs in the US and other countries and the politicians who enable their riches, while claiming to represent the working class. Hidden in plain sight, as the saying goes.

On 1/31/2026 at 2:40 PM, Kinnock said:

The main factor driving environmental degradation, climate change and food security issues is the one rarely mentioned.

Population growth - there's just too many humans on this planet.

In my lifetime the global population has grown from 2.8 billion to over 8 billion.

Maybe we need WW3 to ensure the future survival of humans.

The elephant in the room, the biggest taboo subject of our time.

Who would believe that Nigeria will leapfrog China in the next 75 years and become the 2nd most populous country on this planet?!

Europe will be inundated with Hausa-Fulani-, Yoruba- and Igbo people from Sub-Saharan Africa.

17 hours ago, Chuck443 said:

Europe will be inundated with Hausa-Fulani-, Yoruba- and Igbo people from Sub-Saharan Africa.

i thought it already was, it certainly felt that way when i was last in the uk

On 2/1/2026 at 7:43 PM, Chuck443 said:

The elephant in the room, the biggest taboo subject of our time.

Who would believe that Nigeria will leapfrog China in the next 75 years and become the 2nd most populous country on this planet?!

Europe will be inundated with Hausa-Fulani-, Yoruba- and Igbo people from Sub-Saharan Africa.

excellent premier league footballers, for sure..

9 hours ago, Bday Prang said:

i thought it already was, it certainly felt that way when i was last in the uk

hello, Nigel, not at all surprised to see you here, having abandoned your homeland.

On 2/1/2026 at 5:27 PM, simon43 said:

Well, Covid-19 was a 'good attempt' by China to reduce the world's population. Anyone for Covid-27?

Although I doubt China would release something that harmful on its own people when they are fighting a declining birth rate. We do need to be careful of our own military.

Similar biological warfare tests

Main article: United States biological weapons program

In the Senate subcommittee hearings in 1977, the Army revealed:

• Between 1949 and 1969, open-air tests of biological agents were conducted 239 times. In 80 of those experiments, the Army said it used live bacteria that its researchers at the time thought were harmless. In the others, it used inert chemicals to simulate bacteria.

• In the 1950s, army researchers dispersed Serratia on Panama City and Key West Florida with no known illnesses resulting.

• In the 1950s, army researchers dispersed zinc cadmium sulfide, a known cancer-causing agent, over Minnesota and other Midwestern states to see how far they would spread in the atmosphere. The particles were detected more than 1,000 miles (1,600 km) away in New York state.

• Bacillus globigii, never shown to be harmful to people, was released in San Francisco, New York, Washington, D.C., and along the Pennsylvania Turnpike, among other places.

• In New York, military researchers in 1966 spread Bacillus subtilis variant Niger, also believed to be harmless, in the subway system by dropping lightbulbs filled with the bacteria onto tracks in stations in midtown Manhattan. The bacteria were carried for miles throughout the subway system. Army officials concluded in a January 1968 report that: "Similar covert attacks with a pathogenic disease-causing agent during peak traffic periods could be expected to expose large numbers of people to infection and subsequent illness or death."^[17]

• In a May 1965 secret release of Bacillus globigii at Washington's National Airport and its Greyhound Lines bus terminal, more than 130 passengers were exposed to the bacteria and traveled to 39 cities in seven states in the two weeks following the mock attack.^[5]

Humans being humans, nothing will be done until it's too late, and we are forced to do it.

Mother nature will cull us. Let's hope not to the point of extinction.

On 1/31/2026 at 2:40 PM, Kinnock said:

The main factor driving environmental degradation, climate change and food security issues is the one rarely mentioned.

Population growth - there's just too many humans on this planet.

In my lifetime the global population has grown from 2.8 billion to over 8 billion.

Maybe we need WW3 to ensure the future survival of humans.

On 1/31/2026 at 2:40 PM, Kinnock said:

IMO "No" Reference Charles Darwin - survival of the fittest!

On 1/31/2026 at 1:57 PM, unblocktheplanet said:

Guess who’s sorry now?

The UK govt suppressed this report on environmental collapse

George Monbiot

The Guardian: 27 January 2026

The most important document published by the UK government since the general election emerged last week only through a freedom of information request.

It provides a powerful vindication of certain messages that, when voiced by environmentalists, have been greeted with hatred, fury and denial. For example, it tells us that “food production is the most significant cause of terrestrial biodiversity loss”, that “animal farming at current levels is unsustainable without imports” and that “the UK does not have enough land to feed its population and rear livestock: a wholesale change in consumer diets would be required”.

But what was cut from the report is, according to The Times, even graver, including a warning that the shrinkage of glaciers in the Himalayas, causing declining river flow, would “almost certainly escalate tensions” between China, India and Pakistan, leading to the possibility of nuclear war. Again, some of us have been trying to persuade governments to focus on this threat with little success.

It’s almost reassuring to know we’re not alone in being stonewalled. If even the security services are gagged when they tell the government what it doesn’t want to hear, perhaps our communication style, or our modes of protest or our dress sense, are not, as we keep being told, the problem. The report, notably shorter than most of its kind, gives every appearance of having been hastily and crudely truncated.

I wonder whether the full assessment might also have named some other pressing security threats. One is the way in which fossil fuel, meat and livestock producers have been funding far-right movements, to stifle environmental protection measures that would reduce their profits. Such funding is a major driver of the fascistic politics that we now witness in the US.

Of course you will suffer the loss of food. When you take all the land to build homes for illegal migrants where will you grow the food the country needs? You will be held to ransom by other more logical countries who don't put illegals as a higher priority than their own people.

42 minutes ago, John Drake said:

Well, for much of the past 50 years, the people of the US and Western Europe have voted in the most fundamental way, declining birthrates, to control their population. Alas, their governments repeatedly tell them to go to hell, and go right ahead and stuff their countries with foreigners who continue the population surge. When I was in high school in the US, we were told our population would top out around 220 to 230 million by the middle of the 21st century. Earth Day 1970 publicized these projections. That would have been the case had not the floodgates of immigration been opened. And this relieved little of the pressure on the nations where the immigrants came from, as they continued to skyrocket population counts as well. Politicians purposely decided to create a global hellscape that destroyed all notions of true sustainability. Just look up Zero Population Growth, the Sierra Club, and the Rockefeller Commission's bipartisan Commission on Population Growth and the American Future that reported to the US Congress in 1972.

Yes, were

2 hours ago, Burma Bill said:

On 1/31/2026 at 2:40 PM, Kinnock said:

The main factor driving environmental degradation, climate change and food security issues is the one rarely mentioned.

On 1/31/2026 at 2:40 PM, Kinnock said:

IMO "No" Reference Charles Darwin - survival of the fittest!

Although we currently have reverse evolution with the least fit and least developed breeding the most.

I read The Population Bomb when it was published. It did not make much impact until I went to Hong Kong. Then India. Then China.

Look at our Bangkok. We are rats in a box!

Developed countries are worrying over aging populations and no way to support them. The only way to change those demographics is through immigration.

Immigration may not change the quality of life but it does have an impact on the character of life and culture. Not to say we can't adapt to change.

There was a reason to have a lot of kids before industrialisation. More kids to sow and harvest. Now, it's only religions telling us to have more kids even though it is unlikely in the extreme those progeny will ever set foot in a church much less donate.

Even China's one-child policy didn't reduce their population sufficiently to make a difference. It did skew gender ratio. Need girls & boys to...make more kids.

4 hours ago, phetphet said:

Humans being humans, nothing will be done until it's too late, and we are forced to do it.

Mother nature will cull us. Let's hope not to the point of extinction.

If we don't cull ourselves! It's like Planet of the Apes. We were the greatest, at least in our own minds. But we have only scratched the surface of how other living creatures work. Darwin was right, of course, but he also could have been wrong. Trees may be far more evolved to integration and harmony than we.

If, say, 100k humans were left, would it take them 100k years to repeat our mistakes?

5 hours ago, bunnydrops said:

Although I doubt China would release something that harmful on its own people when they are fighting a declining birth rate. We do need to be careful of our own military.

Similar biological warfare tests

Main article: United States biological weapons program

In the Senate subcommittee hearings in 1977, the Army revealed:

• Between 1949 and 1969, open-air tests of biological agents were conducted 239 times.

Is anyone naive enough to think this is not still being done on an unwitting population, if not our own then others? I don't necessarily think these scientists are all Mengele or Strangelove but each creates a tiny piece of the puzzle and then...

2 hours ago, unblocktheplanet said:

If we don't cull ourselves! It's like Planet of the Apes. We were the greatest, at least in our own minds. But we have only scratched the surface of how other living creatures work. Darwin was right, of course, but he also could have been wrong. Trees may be far more evolved to integration and harmony than we.

If, say, 100k humans were left, would it take them 100k years to repeat our mistakes?

Looks like Coco the Gorilla had more intelligence than us:

2 hours ago, unblocktheplanet said:

If we don't cull ourselves! It's like Planet of the Apes. We were the greatest, at least in our own minds. But we have only scratched the surface of how other living creatures work. Darwin was right, of course, but he also could have been wrong. Trees may be far more evolved to integration and harmony than we.

If, say, 100k humans were left, would it take them 100k years to repeat our mistakes?

Seems like Coco the Gorilla understood the problem.