1 minute ago, MIke B Bad said:

I'm not arguing as my knowledge is very sketchy on this topic, more looking to be educated...........but I thought as UK citizen you could only 'avoid' UK tax on foreign earnings by claiming to be non-resident for tax purposes.....and you could 'never' avoid UK tax on UK earnings.

Income/Gains from investing in (Non Property) UK Assets are tax free for non-UK Tax Residents, this is to encourage overseas investment in the UK but works for us Expats as well.

Should add that you cannot just say you're Tax/Non-Tax resident, it's all based on your time in & connections to the UK. E.g. Spend < 16 days in a Tax year there & you are automatically not Tax Resident, spend > 182 days there and you are automatically a UK Tax Resident.

The SRT (Statutory Residence Test) -

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/rdr3-statutory-residence-test-srt/guidance-note-for-statutory-residence-test-srt-rdr3

Will help you work out your own UK Tax Residency status.

The NT Code for avoiding withheld PAYE tax on your pension/salary does exist (I had one when I was working overseas, being paid in the UK) but it's proving to be a lot more difficult to get being retired in Thailand that it was working in Singapore, even though that was the last Tax Code they had for me (I ended up on a Emergency tax code when my pension started in Feb but should get excess tax back when my accountant files my UK tax return).

1 hour ago, Kyoto Kyle said:

You’re stabbing in the dark and making false assumptions without a clue what’s actually possible. Just rolled over one of my brokered CDs on Interactive Brokers yesterday. I always go for CDs with around six months left on the duration. Picked up a couple from Morgan Stanley Private Bank yielding 3.9% for the next six months, which works out to tax-free money for me. Both mature in September with an interest payment later this month and a second one in September. Longer durations are available of course, but I’m keeping everything short term for now.

What agent do you use, and how much do you pay them?

9 hours ago, FlorC said:

Yes loss of earnings on the 800k is the true cost of being allowed to stay in Thailand.

I've could have quadrupled that money like I have with gold.

It is hostage money and for medical imergencies , but I've saved money by

not having to pay ridiculous high health insurance .

We bit of contradiction going on. It's not hostage money, it's savings for an oops, med or whatever. So wasn't available to quadruple anyway.

And mines the same, oops fund, over 25+ years has saved more insurance premium costs than any 800k in savings.

800k over 25 years = 32k a year or 2,666 a month on average. Try getting coverage for that price. And I'm 71 now

Can anyone tell me what agents charge people that do not satisfy the financial requirements at Chiang Wattana?

5 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

Can anyone tell me what agents charge people that do not satisfy the financial requirements at Chiang Wattana?

20 - 25K?

Just a guess. I don't know.

39 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

What agent do you use, and how much do you pay them?

I buy and trade these brokered CDs on the Interactive Brokers trading platform. They charge about $10 to $15 per transaction when purchasing bank CDs on the secondary market, depending on how many CDs you buy in a single purchase. There are no fees when the CDs mature. You would only pay another fee if you decide to resell them before maturity.

Each CD has a face value of $1,000. For example, if you want to invest $50,000 you would purchase 50 CDs, and the fee would probably be around $15. The quantity available for each CD varies. Some listings only have a few available, while others may offer more than 100. Since these are all resales on the secondary market, availability depends on what each seller is offering, and it can change from day to day and even throughout the day.

There are also many US banks whose CDs are traded on the platform. I usually stick with the largest ones available, such as Morgan Stanley and Goldman Sachs, which are large US banks with FDIC coverage. Yesterday I ended up buying two different Morgan Stanley CDs because the first seller did not have enough available to fill my entire order, so I had to place two separate purchases and pay two transaction fees.

If you are asking about visa agents in Thailand, I know nothing about them.

2 minutes ago, Kyoto Kyle said:

I buy and trade these brokered CDs on the Interactive Brokers trading platform. They charge about $10 to $15 per transaction when purchasing bank CDs on the secondary market, depending on how many CDs you buy in a single purchase. There are no fees when the CDs mature. You would only pay another fee if you decide to resell them before maturity.

Each CD has a face value of $1,000. For example, if you want to invest $50,000 you would purchase 50 CDs, and the fee would probably be around $15. The quantity available for each CD varies. Some listings only have a few available, while others may offer more than 100. Since these are all resales on the secondary market, availability depends on what each seller is offering, and it can change from day to day and even throughout the day.

There are also many US banks whose CDs are traded on the platform. I usually stick with the largest ones available, such as Morgan Stanley and Goldman Sachs, which are large US banks with FDIC coverage. Yesterday I ended up buying two different Morgan Stanley CDs because the first seller did not have enough available to fill my entire order, so I had to place two separate purchases and pay two transaction fees.

If you are asking about visa agents in Thailand, I know nothing about them.

I get brokered CDs with no fee through Fidelity, and no fee to open CDs when I use my bank.

If you do not know how much people have to pay an agent to avoid the financial requirement, how can you imply people lose money by satisfying the financial requirement with the B800K deposit?

17 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

I get brokered CDs with no fee through Fidelity, and no fee to open CDs when I use my bank.

If you do not know how much people have to pay an agent to avoid the financial requirement, how can you imply people lose money by satisfying the financial requirement with the B800K deposit?

The brokered CDs offered through Fidelity are different. They come directly from the issuing bank, so there are no fees. When you buy CDs on the secondary market there is always a trading fee. Another difference is timing. With the Fidelity CDs the settlement date is usually about a week after the purchase, which means the funds sit idle tied up in an open order and earn no interest during that period. With CDs purchased on the secondary market, interest begins accruing immediately. Yes, I can also get CDs directly from Chase Bank without any fees too, but their interest rates are about half of what they are on the brokered CDs.

The point of my original post was not to compare the cost of using an agent with the opportunity cost of the investment. The point was simply that tying up money in a Thai bank account creates an opportunity cost, which means the visa is effectively a lot more expensive than it appears on the surface.

If someone wants to run the numbers and compare the lost income with the cost of using an agent, they are free to do that. That was never the focus of my post, and it is not something I am interested in debating.

3 minutes ago, Kyoto Kyle said:

The brokered CDs offered through Fidelity are different. They come directly from the issuing bank, so there are no fees. When you buy CDs on the secondary market there is always a trading fee. Another difference is timing. With the Fidelity CDs the settlement date is usually about a week after the purchase, which means the funds sit idle tied up in an open order and earn no interest during that period. With CDs purchased on the secondary market, interest begins accruing immediately. Yes, I can also get CDs directly from Chase Bank without any fees too, but their interest rates are about half of what they are on the brokered CDs.

The point of my original post was not to compare the cost of using an agent with the opportunity cost of the investment. The point was simply that tying up money in a Thai bank account creates an opportunity cost, which means the visa is effectively a lot more expensive than it appears on the surface.

If someone wants to run the numbers and compare the lost income with the cost of using an agent, they are free to do that. That was never the focus of my post, and it is not something I am interested in debating.

How does one compare the cost, if one does not know what the cost is?

2 hours ago, FlorC said:

And that's why I keep only 800k for the required 5 months and withdraw 400k for 7 months, so they can't profit

too much from my money. I very much hate banks.

Life is too short for me to be having sleepless nights wondering if I have got the 5 month/7 month periods correct. One error, and the Immigration people will be all over you like a cheap suit. IMO not worth the risk.

3 hours ago, JAG said:

If you consider the sheer scale of the "informal cash flows" associated with that route, it is unlikely that the boat will be rocked!

Probably right but if the change was forced by government officials outside of immigration that might change things. It is big money for corrupt immigration employees in Pattaya but tiny money in the grand scheme of things. Only about 130,000 retirees on Non-Immigrant O / O-A visas and if one in 10 use agents, that is only ~13,000 agent visas a year.

1 hour ago, Yellowtail said:

Can anyone tell me what agents charge people that do not satisfy the financial requirements at Chiang Wattana?

Google "Thai Visa center" or "Grace Thai Visa" in Bangkok, I would guess you're looking at approx 15K but they can tell you.

Pattaya is (I believe) currently 13.5K at place like Maneerat.

28 minutes ago, SamSpade said:

Google "Thai Visa center" or "Grace Thai Visa" in Bangkok, I would guess you're looking at approx 15K but they can tell you.

Pattaya is (I believe) currently 13.5K at place like Maneerat.

I do not need it, I was just wondering, thanks.

2 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

I do not need it, I was just wondering, thanks.

No worries, as I said I would guess it would be 15K with Thai Visa in Bangkok, 13.5K in Pattaya.

Thai Visa are the only agency I'm aware of that will help with the "Finances". The agent I used to use in Soi 24 (I want to say Asia Visa, they mainly dealt with Japanese visa extensions & had an office in Ideo Verve On Nut pre-covid where I was living) wouldn't talk to you unless you had the 800K in your account.

I've always use an agent to do the "Hand Holding" (why not) & in Bangkok it was 7,900 (Included transport to CW), in Pattaya it's 8K.

13 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

The reality isn't the same, try it and report back what you actually did make, not theoretically

It's not quite the end of the financial year yet so not 100% accurate, but approx 10% returns so 80,000 THB equivalent on 800,000 in my portfolio, and the way it's structured another 20% of that in tax benefits so total of 96,000 THB, enough to pay an agent for > 6 years. Even the worst year in my records has been more than half of that.

Of course it's not guaranteed to be like this every year but if it ever got down to the break even point there'd be bigger problems than renewing an extension of stay for all of us wherever our funds are.

Lots of other things enter one's plans and there's no universal right or wrong way, just right for each individual at the time, but discarding it as you appear to be doing seems a bit strange to me.

9 hours ago, Kyoto Kyle said:

Do what you like, but let’s be clear: you’re changing the subject. I responded directly to your own words (below), reported back exactly what I actually make in practice rather than in theory, and now that the real numbers are on the table you’ve suddenly decided to pivot. If you were comfortable with the answer, you wouldn’t need to.

Real numbers once you've done it i.e. the future, I don't care what you've done in the past or now

Another option for low-risk steady income, if you’re worried about bank CD interest rates in the US falling in the future, would be to put the money into a long-term corporate bond ETF. Something like the Vanguard VCLT, which yields around 5.5%. You could park the money there and forget about it, collecting 5.5% a year indefinitely. Non-US citizens residing in Thailand would be subject to a 15% withholding tax on the income, bringing the net yield to just over 4.5%.

13 hours ago, KhunLA said:

We bit of contradiction going on. It's not hostage money, it's savings for an oops, med or whatever. So wasn't available to quadruple anyway.

And mines the same, oops fund, over 25+ years has saved more insurance premium costs than any 800k in savings.

800k over 25 years = 32k a year or 2,666 a month on average. Try getting coverage for that price. And I'm 71 now

If it wasn't forced on an account for all those years , it would have quadrupled

through gold and silver. I don't want to hold fiat "money".

An "oops" just would force me to sell some and transfer it to Thailand.

So far an "oops" has not happened.

1 hour ago, FlorC said:

If it wasn't forced on an account for all those years , it would have quadrupled

through gold and silver. I don't want to hold fiat "money".

An "oops" just would force me to sell some and transfer it to Thailand.

So far an "oops" has not happened.

Also haven't had an oops that pocket money hasn't covered. One took a little bit deeper pocket to cover. Wife invests in land here, TH, when a wee bit too much in her retirement account. Really can't get any safer investment than that.

If she only averages 10% a year, then it keeps up with inflation, better than sitting in any account, or rolling the dice in a bear market. I'm too lazy to trade, and she doesn't need it.

Reading most posts here, and many seem to be living month to month. Unless using an agent, then rules (400 & 800k in bank) should keep most people out of 'go fund me' territory.

When I lived in Udon, a lot Brits seemed to keep their residency in UK, JIC, if having to pop over and use NHS, along with better pension. Smart move, just for the pension.

On 3/4/2026 at 1:03 AM, Kyoto Kyle said:

I’m posting this in The Pub because it’s not really a visa question, more of an observation.

I’ve been thinking about the retirement visa and the requirement to keep ฿800,000 in a Thai bank account, assuming you don’t have an overseas monthly pension to show. Simple enough if you don’t need to touch that money and can afford to have it tied up. But then I started thinking about the opportunity cost.

The visa fee itself is extremely reasonable, no complaints there. But if that money were sitting overseas right now rather than being brought into Thailand, you could have it in a stable fixed income investment earning close to 4%. That works out to roughly $1,000 to $1,200 a year in income, depending on exchange rate fluctuations. Since it’s parked in a Thai bank account earning essentially nothing, that lost income has to be factored in as part of the real cost of the visa.

So it’s not 1,900 Baht a year anymore. When you account for the foregone income on your money, it’s more than 15x that. Still manageable, but a meaningfully different number than it first appears.

Curious if anyone else has done similar math.

As you cannot use an overseas account, the fund deposit needs to be in a Thai bank account. So. whatever interest you can earn overseas has no meaning here, if you need a 12-mothn extension of stay based on retirement with with the money-in-the-bank methoed. I've been using a 12-months fioxed bank account for now 15+ years, which gives up to around 1.5% interest, of which 15% tax is withheld; I cash the interest out once a year, so I have a clean 800,000 baht balance.

2 minutes ago, khunPer said:

As you cannot use an overseas account, the fund deposit needs to be in a Thai bank account. So. whatever interest you can earn overseas has no meaning here, if you need a 12-mothn extension of stay based on retirement with with the money-in-the-bank methoed.

I may be mistaken here, but I thought to have read in the past that if you get your O-A visa in an embassy abroad, you can use money in the bank in your home country.
Does that change when you extend that visa?

23 hours ago, Hummin said:

And paying tax for the interest, I just found out

Go to your local tax office each year and claim the witholding tax back. Simples

17 minutes ago, CallumWK said:

I may be mistaken here, but I thought to have read in the past that if you get your O-A visa in an embassy abroad, you can use money in the bank in your home country.

I did.

17 minutes ago, CallumWK said:

Does that change when you extend that visa?

It did for me

3 minutes ago, CFCol said:

Go to your local tax office each year and claim the witholding tax back. Simples

I'm going for my tin number now, so, but honestly I wasn't aware of it when I opened the new deposit account last year. And I just got my app this year, and haven't really looked at it before now. 5-6 months with interest paid already

16 hours ago, SamSpade said:

Income/Gains from investing in (Non Property) UK Assets are tax free for non-UK Tax Residents, this is to encourage overseas investment in the UK but works for us Expats as well.

Should add that you cannot just say you're Tax/Non-Tax resident, it's all based on your time in & connections to the UK. E.g. Spend < 16 days in a Tax year there & you are automatically not Tax Resident, spend > 182 days there and you are automatically a UK Tax Resident.

The SRT (Statutory Residence Test) -

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/rdr3-statutory-residence-test-srt/guidance-note-for-statutory-residence-test-srt-rdr3

Will help you work out your own UK Tax Residency status.

The NT Code for avoiding withheld PAYE tax on your pension/salary does exist (I had one when I was working overseas, being paid in the UK) but it's proving to be a lot more difficult to get being retired in Thailand that it was working in Singapore, even though that was the last Tax Code they had for me (I ended up on a Emergency tax code when my pension started in Feb but should get excess tax back when my accountant files my UK tax return).

This was my understanding.....

The SRT is about residency status for worldwide taxation, not a loophole to escape tax on UK earnings. If money arises from UK sources, it falls under UK tax jurisdiction no matter what.

I had NT for my landlords income for a few years in the 90's, but all that did was avoid being taxed at source......i still had to pay UK tax on it through my self return????

57 minutes ago, MIke B Bad said:

This was my understanding.....

The SRT is about residency status for worldwide taxation, not a loophole to escape tax on UK earnings. If money arises from UK sources, it falls under UK tax jurisdiction no matter what.

I had NT for my landlords income for a few years in the 90's, but all that did was avoid being taxed at source......i still had to pay UK tax on it through my self return????

NT is for Salary/Pensions, NRL (Non-Resident Landlord) is for Rental Income and as you say just stops it being withheld at source, you still need to report this on your Tax Return and pay tax where appropriate on it.

General overview is covered here https://www.gov.uk/tax-uk-income-live-abroad &

You usually have to pay tax on your UK income even if you’re not a UK resident. Income includes things like:

• pension

• rental income

• savings interest

• wages

[Getting an NT Tax Code would mean not paying tax on Pension or Wages in the UK, but you would be expected to pay Tax on the income in the country you are Tax Resident which is why I'm having problems getting one in Thailand].

More details on Non Tax Resident income is covered in the FOTRA (Free of Tax for Residents Abroad) manual https://www.gov.uk/hmrc-internal-manuals/savings-and-investment-manual/saim1180

CGT is covered here https://www.taxadvisorypartnership.com/uk-private-clients/international-private-clients/capital-gains-tax-for-non-uk-residents

Dividend Income (AKA Disregared Income) is covered here https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/non-residents-and-investment-income-hs300-self-assessment-helpsheet/hs300-non-residents-and-investment-income-2025

UK Gilts are covered here https://www.gov.uk/hmrc-internal-manuals/inheritance-tax-manual/ihtm04291

Edit: For info, the ISA rules about not adding to your ISA if you're not UK Tax Resident are covered here https://www.gov.uk/individual-savings-accounts/if-you-move-abroad

2 minutes ago, SamSpade said:

NT is for Salary/Pensions, NRL (Non-Resident Landlord) is for Rental Income and as you say just stops it being withheld at source, you still need to report this on your Tax Return and pay tax where appropriate on it.

General overview is covered here https://www.gov.uk/tax-uk-income-live-abroad &

You usually have to pay tax on your UK income even if you’re not a UK resident. Income includes things like:

• pension

• rental income

• savings interest

• wages

[Getting an NT Tax Code would mean not paying tax on Pension or Wages in the UK, but you would be expected to pay Tax on the income in the country you are Tax Resident which is why I'm having problems getting on in Thailand].

More details on Non Tax Resident income is covered in the FOTRA (Free of Tax for Residents Abroad) manual https://www.gov.uk/hmrc-internal-manuals/savings-and-investment-manual/saim1180

CGT is covered here https://www.taxadvisorypartnership.com/uk-private-clients/international-private-clients/capital-gains-tax-for-non-uk-residents

Dividend Income (AKA Disregared Income) is covered here https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/non-residents-and-investment-income-hs300-self-assessment-helpsheet/hs300-non-residents-and-investment-income-2025

UK Gilts are covered here https://www.gov.uk/hmrc-internal-manuals/inheritance-tax-manual/ihtm04291

Cheers....think I'm getting there....thanks for your patience and help.

2 hours ago, CFCol said:

Go to your local tax office each year and claim the witholding tax back. Simples

Just be aware that when you do that you are basically making a tax return which may come back to bite you in the longer term if the new tax rules are enforced and you were to become liable for any such taxes in the future.

I've parked the 800k and don't give it a thought but once a year when I do my renewal.

7 hours ago, CallumWK said:

I may be mistaken here, but I thought to have read in the past that if you get your O-A visa in an embassy abroad, you can use money in the bank in your home country.
Does that change when you extend that visa?

Yes, when you extend your stay it is almost same conditions as when you have a normal non-immigrant O-type visa – "almost", the difference is a that you also needs a proven health insurance when extending an O-A stay, just like when you obtained the original visa – financial requirements are however the same as nor non-O.

The benefit with an O-A visa is when you are not planning a very long stay in Thailand and wish to keep fund in your home country – you might be snowbird, as some of my friends that use an O-A to around half a year's stay – and if not extending the stay the visa expires one year after issue. You can obtain a new O-A and continue that way, but you need to leave Thailand, apply for a new visa and re-enter.