Kawasaki Ninja 250 - New Thread, 12/2008

[BigBikeBKK]

Glad to see you.

Stock they sound like a riding mower!!!

Funny how my stock 250cc "lawnmower" can piss all over your ugly as sin CB400.

[Bard]

Well today I managed to help out Simon fit up his Area-P standard carbon full system and it is way louder than my quiet core. I filmed a short clip of the two bikes sound to compare them and man the standard is loud. I will put in a link to the clip when I get it uploaded for comparison.

Welding jobby for Simon was 200 baht so no disaster but we went to the secret soi of Rayong and had some real manly fun while they finished up his exhaust, great day again man I love this country.

As for the tires there is none available until end of this month so everyone who is interested please PM me and we can all get a group rebate from the guy selling them.

As for Bira next trip is tomorrow testing out Simon's new system and have more fun under the sun, and probably more secret soi fun at the end of it. On Thursday me and Trent will have a day out at Yamaha dealer in Bangkok testing out the FZ-6 and well again having fun. Weekend we will head back to Bira for the 3rd run for anyone else interested, I can book you in secret soi for 600 baht including breakfast. That is good aircon rooms with hot/cold water and a bar with ehh friendly locals around you.

Cheers Bard

[BigBikeBKK]

Cheers Bard,

I'll definitely be interested in trying some BT090s, but thinking of getting a second set of wheels so that I can keep the BT090s for the track and another set of harder tires, like a BT050s for touring.

Still hoping to chop my stock can and make a glass pack 'shorty' when I get home too, so I'll give you a bell after my return and hopefully you'll still be around and we can hook up then.

Look forward to seeing your vids of the two Area P's and hope to see you later this month.

Is Yamaha now offering test rides of the FZ-6? Sounds dangerous for my pocketbook- I think if I ride one I may have to buy it. The FZ-6 is a seriously sexy bike!

Happy Trails and all the best!

Tony

Edited January 6, 2009 by BigBikeBKK

[Bard]

Cheers Bard,

I'll definitely be interested in trying some BT090s, but thinking of getting a second set of wheels so that I can keep the BT090s for the track and another set of harder tires, like a BT050s for touring.

Still hoping to chop my stock can and make a glass pack 'shorty' when I get home too, so I'll give you a bell after my return and hopefully you'll still be around and we can hook up then.

Look forward to seeing your vids of the two Area P's and hope to see you later this month.

Is Yamaha now offering test rides of the FZ-6? Sounds dangerous for my pocketbook- I think if I ride one I may have to buy it. The FZ-6 is a seriously sexy bike!

Happy Trails and all the best!

Tony

Sounds like a lot of work flipping tires Tony, the BT-090 has a lifetime of 7500 km or better so maybe running them is cheaper to run than flipping tire. I don't know.

Anyway here is the link http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rU5aXXWMMBA

You can use Simon's can for the shorty, I have pretty much decided to use the Ninjette as a track bike and go for something wilder as a tour bike.

Yes and No, GT-Rider buddies fixed up the let's have fun for a day with FZ-6 and FZ-1 so yes we did get the test rides and No you decided on a Kawa Er already so forget it hahaha, just joking.

I will post the fun test which we surely enjoy. For sure the test is a trap and I can see Khun Brad signing a purchase agreement at the end of it, but what is life without fun?

Cheers Bard

[Anthony17]

very wonderful sound AreaP has, I still don't know what to choose betwenn AreaP and the full yoshi rrrrrrr

[BigBikeBKK]

Sounds like a lot of work flipping tires Tony, the BT-090 has a lifetime of 7500 km or better so maybe running them is cheaper to run than flipping tire.

I have pretty much decided to use the Ninjette as a track bike and go for something wilder as a tour bike.

Well- that's an idea Bard- just keep my Ninja as a track bike and get an ER-6n or FZ6 for touring... You are just FULL of good ideas!

Yes and No, GT-Rider buddies fixed up the let's have fun for a day with FZ-6 and FZ-1 so yes we did get the test rides and No you decided on a Kawa Er already so forget it hahaha, just joking.

Yeah- while my first choice would be the ER-6n, if there's going to be a major delay I may go for the FZ6. Awesome bike the Yammie, but hard to swallow the ridiculous mark up...

[expatgaz]

That seems more like it.

EPG.

[dave_boo]

Yepp get me down for brake lines, the pads well more stopping power does not hurt at all so it's a good one if they're not to expensive.

Ok, firstly I'm a putz! As evidenced by the following picture, that carbon fibre Yoshi is a complete system (and extremely beautiful I must say)! So I'll just have to worry about getting a Lambda sensor bung welded in.

I'll go ahead and order some half a dozen sets of the brake lines, I know fo' shore I can offload two sets plus the set I'll put on my bike that means I'll just have 3 to worry about getting rid of.

As far as colours goes, here's the choices for the lines proper:

• Black
  
• Green
  
• Gold (transparent yellow?)
  
• Yellow
  
• Orange
  
• Deep Purple
  
• Light Purple
  
• Transparent Demin Blue (assuming blue anodised aluminium look)
  
• Blue
  
• Pink
  
• Transparent Red (assuming red anodised aluminium look)
  
• Red
  
• Silver
  
• White
  
• Clear
  
• Carbon Look
  
• Transparent Green (assuming ....)
  

And fitting colours:

• stainless
  
• black
  
• blue
  
• purple
  
• red
  
• gold
  
• green
  

For those who respond in this thread, I'll order the setup you want. Order is going in first week of February, so that it's not sitting around at my house and possibly evolving (i.e. growing legs and walking off!). Respond before then, because otherwise I'm going to order the ones that are unspoken for in black and stainless for lines and fittings respectively.

Galfer, which AFAIK is one of the best in the business, has the part number FD117 listed in their catalouge as what's needed front and rear. Fatbikez promises to get those in.

Haven't heard any interest expressed in the K&N oil filtre, but since it's only 7.50 USD I'm picking up a half dozen of those also.

I'm not doing this to make money, but rather to help the community out. If you ask me to include something in my order, I'll include it based on good faith. All invoices will be shown (to include any taxes levied by the Thai postal system) so that you know I'm not trying to screw anyone--although it would be nice if you bought me dinner for my troubles.

As stated earlier, I'm placing this order in the begininng of February and hopefully it's at my house by the time the wife goes down to Bangkok to pick me up from the airport. She'll have loaded up the parts in the truck, and I'll be able to deliver it to the unwashed masses that day. Everyone else, unless you're within 90-120 minutes of Nakhon Sawan on the North side and 45-75 on the South side will get their stuff EMS.

[Bard]

Dave,

Count me in for Green with gold fittings will fit my green machine well, and gold will make my wifey think it's smart and shiny

Galfer is a must have when I play with the brakes anyways, so I'm in on that for certain.

If you go for the Yoshi it's no big deal to fit in the bung, took us 3 beers and a BJ when they fitted it for us and cost 200 Baht. So no worries to get that done in Thailand. The Yoshi looks nice indeed but when I bought it was more expensive than Area-P and the sound on AP is brutal in comparison. So as a petrol head I wanted most bang and sound for the buck and did the AP.

It would be very nice if someone went for the Yoshi so we could compare it directly on the bike with sound and obviously dyno it vs AP, ithailian got the two bros and I hope we can get together soon and do a little sound test as well, plus do the dyno. Tony will try out the shorty conversion so there will be a nice line up and brilliant way to compare, so I hope we get a Yoshi in soon and then have even more to test out.

Cheers Bard

[dave_boo]

Dave,

Count me in for Green with gold fittings will fit my green machine well, and gold will make my wifey think it's smart and shiny

Galfer is a must have when I play with the brakes anyways, so I'm in on that for certain.

If you go for the Yoshi it's no big deal to fit in the bung, took us 3 beers and a BJ when they fitted it for us and cost 200 Baht. So no worries to get that done in Thailand. The Yoshi looks nice indeed but when I bought it was more expensive than Area-P and the sound on AP is brutal in comparison. So as a petrol head I wanted most bang and sound for the buck and did the AP.

It would be very nice if someone went for the Yoshi so we could compare it directly on the bike with sound and obviously dyno it vs AP, ithailian got the two bros and I hope we can get together soon and do a little sound test as well, plus do the dyno. Tony will try out the shorty conversion so there will be a nice line up and brilliant way to compare, so I hope we get a Yoshi in soon and then have even more to test out.

Cheers Bard

Ok, marked you down. I was actually going to go Black and Gold, mainly because I don't know how closely they'd be able to match the colour of the Ninja with green and I like the stealthy look.

I am a bit confused, on whom was the BJ performed and by who? Are you saying that was included in what you had to pay for the bung, or am I to read it as that's what you were able to enjoy whilst waiting on completion of the work?

The problem I have with the Area-P is that too many people in Thailand now have it. Also it seems that the Yoshi is within a reasonable price difference to make me not cringe too much about paying for the name (which I am doing! ). But yeah, we'll have to get all the bikes together and get a Youtube clip going. Problem sounds like we're going to have problems finding someone with a stock exhaust....

[dotcom]

Hi Dave Boo. You are right that is some beautiful exhaust system. Yoshi are some of the best you can get. You are onto a winner.

[Bard]

We can get bigguns bike for stock he keep it in that way so we have the stock one ready. I am really looking forward to seeing and hearing the Yoshi system Dave, will be a blast.

The BJ was in secret soi Rayong while we waited for the welder and fitter to get the system done for us, very good looking friendly local ladies did it in the bar while we chilled with ice cold beers. Recommended biker friendly area btw.

Just wished Akaropovic made a Ninja 250 system, but no so we have to do with what is available. The Yoshi, Two Bros and Area-P seems to be the big sellers overseas, and all I can say is the build quality on the AP is great can recommend it from my own experience, the Yoshi gets a lot of positive feedback as well so you cannot go wrong there.

Cheers Bard

[Ithailian]

Here are the promised pics..

My ride...

Two Bros Exhaust (close up)

[dave_boo]

Here are the promised pics..

My ride...

Two Bros Exhaust (close up)

[BigBikeBKK]

Looks awesome Ithailian!

Notice a nice increase in power?

I'm looking forward to modding my exhaust when I return to the LOS in a couple of weeks. If the custom job doesn't do the trick I think I'll go for the Yoshi pipe.

Happy Trails!

[Bard]

Already one in Thailand with Yoshi...

Very nice looking can there ithailian, guess you love the sound from it as well

Tony when the &^%&^ are you coming back, so much track days and trips, tuning and fun and you're hiding in ice cold Europe?

Cheers Bard

[dave_boo]

Already one in Thailand with Yoshi...

Very nice looking can there ithailian, guess you love the sound from it as well

Tony when the &^%&^ are you coming back, so much track days and trips, tuning and fun and you're hiding in ice cold Europe?

Cheers Bard

Darn, guess I won't be the first; I've already got four confirmed orders for the brake lines, which I assume are for both front and rear, but don't know what colours Tony wants.

I've also had PM's about the K&N filtre, K&N has a part number KA-2508 for their air filtre, fatbikez doesn't have it in stock-yet. The oil filtre listed on their site is the proper one for the '08 Ninja though.

[BigBikeBKK]

I've also had PM's about the K&N filtre, K&N has a part number KA-2508 for their air filtre, fatbikez doesn't have it in stock-yet. The oil filtre listed on their site is the proper one for the '08 Ninja though.

Pardon my ignorance Dave, but what's the difference between the K&N oil filter and stock?

Brake lines in black of course

Edited January 7, 2009 by BigBikeBKK

[BigBikeBKK]

Tony when the &^%&^ are you coming back, so much track days and trips, tuning and fun and you're hiding in ice cold Europe?

Man Bard, I tell you, this European "holiday" is getting LONG and I am getting homesick! Having fun here in the "old country" but looking forward to coming home in a couple more weeks.

Off to Chamonix tomorrow- that should be fun!

I'll be back in Thailand on the 19th and I'll give you a call then so that we can hook up for the custom exhaust work and special service at your "secret soi"!

[dave_boo]

I've also had PM's about the K&N filtre, K&N has a part number KA-2508 for their air filtre, fatbikez doesn't have it in stock-yet. The oil filtre listed on their site is the proper one for the '08 Ninja though.

Pardon my ignorance Dave, but what's the difference between the K&N oil filter and stock?

Brake lines in black of course

Performance wise I am making no claims; but K&N is made to a pretty high standard and they should last for a longer time than the stock ones. If there was the stainless steel models offered, that would be the one I would buy. If you don't know what I'm talking about there's a company, Pure Power, that offers 304 stainless steel oil filters that filtre down to 35 microns. Obviously rewashable, reusable, and much more durable than stock.

Is that black lines and fittings?

[Anthony17]

Yes KN makes a filter, I hope he will fit

I found the specication of this part number

KA-2508 Product Specifications

Filter Re-Oiling Amount: 0.34 oz (10 ml)

Height: 0.625 in (16 mm)

Outside Length: 8.25 in (210 mm)

Outside Width: 5.375 in (137 mm)

Product Box Length: 7.72 in (196 mm)

Product Box Width: 1.75 in (44 mm)

Product Box Height: 9.69 in (246 mm)

[kev_o]

To follow up from my misplaced post on the Yoshi, payment by credit card, no problems. I also ordered a K&N filter but when it arrived I realized it was for an old model, never got round to stripping the airbox to see if it fitted but in reading the other posts I doubt it will. When I was last in Bangkok I dropped in to TP motorcycle on the corner of Rama 1, got a Puig dark tinted wind shield, the guy there opened his laptop to show all the parts he could get, reckoned they were all available within half an hour of sending someone out to pick them up, he had a rear hugger, various carbon bits, braided lines, footrests and tail tidy to show, the prices he quoted were pretty steep though. Cheers.

[dave_boo]

To follow up from my misplaced post on the Yoshi, payment by credit card, no problems. I also ordered a K&N filter but when it arrived I realized it was for an old model, never got round to stripping the airbox to see if it fitted but in reading the other posts I doubt it will. When I was last in Bangkok I dropped in to TP motorcycle on the corner of Rama 1, got a Puig dark tinted wind shield, the guy there opened his laptop to show all the parts he could get, reckoned they were all available within half an hour of sending someone out to pick them up, he had a rear hugger, various carbon bits, braided lines, footrests and tail tidy to show, the prices he quoted were pretty steep though. Cheers.

Congrats on the Yoshi; almost makes me want to get a Nojima. This ebay seller has a dynograph up that indicates HUGE gains in power when revved out--not a great increase (only ~2.5 hp or +9%) where the stocker putts out, but it is at least on par with Bard's Area-P when you look to the max HP (~5 hp or +18%). That essentially negates drivetrain loss and would get your rearwheel horsepower to match the bike's rating.

(p.s. he also has the Ohlins rear shock for the Ninja 250).

**edit**

Here's Yoshi's graph:

and Area-P's:

And the Two Brothers which can't be directly compared since it is based on speed rather than RPM (but it looks like it peaks just shy of Nojima's).

So, yes, it looks like the Nojima has the greatest gains.

But price to performance is as follows (using carbon fibre-with the exception of the Nojima):

Two Brothers: 31.3 HP 449.99 USD (14.38 USD/HP)

Area-P: 30.72 HP 495.00 USD (16.11 USD/HP)

Nojima: 31.5 599.99 USD (19.05 USD/HP)

Yoshimura: 30.37 600.00 USD (19.76 USD/HP)

So Two Brothers is a fabulous buy and Yoshi is a sinkhole for your money, especially considering that it comes dead last in the HP race.

Edited January 8, 2009 by dave_boo

[Ithailian]

I' haven't noticed any increase in power to be honest, but maybe it's there. I guess a dyno will tell. The decibel factor is through the roof though. The factory claims a +4 HP increase with the slip on (I didn't get the full exhaust). Full system is +7 I think ... but, they didn't have a clue about the fuel injected models. I'm getting occasional 'pops' out the muffler when I back off the throttle. Kind of like backfire, but never on the power, only when I'm off it. I can still hear the high pitched spin up of the engine and that sounds perfectly normal (same as before), so the popping must be the result of the very limited back pressure. I'm dying to see if there are flames coming out the tail pipe. I've had crowds gather at stop lights to check out my ZX10R (not!). haha. sounds like one.

PS - Please count me in for the upgraded brake lines. Black with Green Fittings. Thanks!

Edited January 8, 2009 by Ithailian

[dave_boo]

I' haven't noticed any increase in power to be honest, but maybe it's there. I guess a dyno will tell. The decibel factor is through the roof though. The factory claims a +4 HP increase with the slip on (I didn't get the full exhaust). Full system is +7 I think ... but, they didn't have a clue about the fuel injected models. I'm getting occasional 'pops' out the muffler when I back off the throttle. Kind of like backfire, but never on the power, only when I'm off it. I can still hear the high pitched spin up of the engine and that sounds perfectly normal (same as before), so the popping must be the result of the very limited back pressure. I'm dying to see if there are flames coming out the tail pipe. I've had crowds gather at stop lights to check out my ZX10R (not!). haha. sounds like one.

PS - Please count me in for the upgraded brake lines. Black with Green Fittings. Thanks!

You sure are right about it looking great; and if the sound is inline with what I've heard other Yoshis roaring like I'm sure you're grinning like Dave Chepelle after hitting his steamroller everytime you fire it up. It was in the old Ninja thread that we talked about the 'backfire'.

Yeah, backfiring (although if we wanted to get technical it's actually afterfiring). Is more common than people realise. Usually it's an indication that the timing is wrong. That's what I would assume (maybe incorrectly!) was the cause of your cold start backfiring. If the timing gets retarded due to the temperature, it can fire after the exhaust valve opens and the flame can travel down your pipe until it burns all of the fuel.

Backfiring can be caused by the engine actually running rich. When you shut off the throttle the butterfly (I believe that's the style that the Ninja uses) valve shuts in the intake tract. However, it takes a wee bit of time for the injectors to stop dumping that load of fuel in. This dumps cool fuel into the chamber which is oxygen starved and not burnt until the oxygen level is increased (i.e. at the end of the exhaust tract). It isn't as big of a problem on engines that use a Throttle Positioning Sensor since the ECU should read the current and reduce the amount injected. I'd be surprised if Kawasaki didn't have one on the Ninja, but perhaps someone who's still in Thailand could trace their throttle cable to its termination and see if there's a sensor attached to there with wiring that comes out?

(Apologies for referencing myself)

And I've got your part of the order added to my list.

Edited January 8, 2009 by dave_boo

[Anthony17]

Nojima is very good looking.

For the dynograph, to compare these full exhaust, it would have been tested on the same dyno to reed the right dynocurv. I don't think the dyno are adjusted as another. Maybe on a dyno the yosh will give 30.1HP and with another 29.6HP so for me these curvs can't be compared.

[Bard]

Give me a bell when you get back Tony, and we can chop the can and have the "ss" trip while waiting.

Cheers Bard

[tuktukracer]

Big thanks to Bard who installed my area p full carbon system (shorty not quiet core). Top bloke!

The shorty is very, very loud, which Bard will attest to.

I kinda wish I got the quiet core. I think my neighbours do as well.

Other than the noise, which is the most notable difference, the torque has also been greatly improved. I can easily pass cars on the highway from 100-120 KMH staying in 6th gear, which before would have required me shifting down to 5th.

The machining place that transplanted the bung for my lambda sensor were extremely professional and who'd believe that it only cost 200BHT. I guess it was a little more expensive if you factor in the grown-up fun that we had in the secret soi that we hung out in whilst they carried out the job ;-)

Defo want to get rid of these stock tyres and into some Bridgestone BT90's. Had a couple of scarey moments with the stock tyres both on the road and track.

I love the little ninja but cruising on highways and doing any type of long distance is a bit of a bore lake, personally speaking. I really feel that I'm flogging the little thing to death doing 140KMH and if you get a gust of wind you do get blown around (not the stablest of bikes). Ok, my 92 kilo chassis (me not the bike) doesn't help but I'm inclined to do the same as Bard - keep the ninja for the track (where it really comes into it's own) and then possibly look at purchasing a larger bike such as the ER6 or FZ6 a little later on (finances & missus permitting).

Cheers,

Simon

[Bard]

Thanks Simon,

Like I said to my wife I'm glad I'm not married to me, but maybe there is something worth while makes me think so haha

Are you up for the BBQ tomorrow, please bring your misses and happy spirit plus hopefully you join us on the track on Sunday?

Cheers Bard

[Anthony17]

Is the Kn filter available in Thailande because in Europe we can't have it for the moment. It arrives on March not before.

I've made that for my ninja what do you think about it? [/img]

Edited January 11, 2009 by Anthony17