Penang: Tourist Visa Rejected If Have 3 Tvisas Already...

[mrbp]

A lot of countries work hard to build a tourist industry. Thailand seems to be the opposite working extreemly hard to destroy thiers.

Cmon....! The people affected by this issue are NOT real tourists... they're long stay people who cost the country money and pay no taxes... they cost Thailand money... hey, you can't live on back to back tourist visas in most developed countries and Thailand is trying hard to develop. Time to stop complaining about our generous host country... get a real visa or move on. Easy.

How is it they cost Thailand money? Using the free healthcare system? Food stamps? Using up all the government housing? Or possibly making sooo much money that they're transferring it to a off-shore account? Maybe running big crime syndicates or an illegal lottery? No, sorry, that's the Thai people....

Well said Titan, I earn my money here and it goes straight to my landlord with the rest spent in the local market, local street food stalls and my monthly gym fee. After that I'm skint.

I take absolutely nothing out of the Thai economy I only put back in.

When I'm earning enough to open a Swiss bank account I'll buy that exclusive flat in central London and I'll be out of Thailand's hair except as a tourist.

Until I hit the jackpot I'm struggling on in wonderful Thailand and giving my my ample time and limited funds to Thailand's poor.

I am in no way a drain on the Thai economy.

Apart from that lucrative side line I have in Thai Antiques and as a middle man for the local Mafia.

[Jingthing]

There is no option for a foreigner, under 50 years old, who don't want marry or not want to work. So there should be a visa category for this kind of foreigners. But there isn't.

ED visa would work nicely and if you are going to stay a long time, learning Thai is a fine idea. However, as another poster pointed out, certified schools only exist in some cities here.

[mrbp]

Think you should know by now that they do not want people on a budget.

Well they need teachers for the government schools and they pay peanuts so some of us are bound to be on a budget unless they think that rich folk are going to come to Thailand to work in their underfunded education system?

[ab1594]

My friend went to Khota Baru last month and he got the dreaded "last tourist visa" stamp in his passport as he already has more than 3 so its not just Penang, they also gave him a letter stating it was government policy and not of their doing!

[tropo]

Perhaps Penang just cannot handle the volume of visas they would have to process if they didn't impose restrictions. Do they make more money per application or a flat rate from the Thai government? $$$$$

Until March next year tourist visas are free. Perhaps this was the main catalyst for the sudden change of policy in Penang back to what it was a year or so ago.

We saw a sudden change of policy in Phnom Penh earlier this year when the the free tourist visa period started circa March. They were issuing double entry tourist visas but suddenly stopped doing that when tourist visas were made free.

[Jingthing]

Until March next year tourist visas are free. Perhaps this was the main catalyst for the sudden change of policy in Penang back to what it was a year or so ago.

AHA!

[manuchaomk]

Some consulates don't like people traveling to Thailand a lot on tourist visa and can give a stamp in your passport saying that they will not further isue a tourist visa to you. That is the policy of the consul, not of the Thai government.

But maybe the consuls should remember who they are ultimately working for (Thai Government). Penang has always been a law unto itself.

funny: Thailand is crying because of downturn of tourist income...but in the other side they reject reissues of visas..through a ridiculous policy of consulates....hahahaha....really funny (it's INCONCEIVABLE)

[tropo]

My friend went to Khota Baru last month and he got the dreaded "last tourist visa" stamp in his passport as he already has more than 3 so its not just Penang, they also gave him a letter stating it was government policy and not of their doing!

Government policy, misinterpretation of government policy or just a lie?

[likewise]

so how about what I said earlier, do your 3 TR visas then do 4 x 15 border runs and start again.

[Mario2008]

Some consulates don't like people traveling to Thailand a lot on tourist visa and can give a stamp in your passport saying that they will not further isue a tourist visa to you. That is the policy of the consul, not of the Thai government.

But maybe the consuls should remember who they are ultimately working for (Thai Government). Penang has always been a law unto itself.

funny: Thailand is crying because of downturn of tourist income...but in the other side they reject reissues of visas..through a ridiculous policy of consulates....hahahaha....really funny (it's INCONCEIVABLE)

This is not government policy, only of the consul in Penang.

[Mario2008]

My friend went to Khota Baru last month and he got the dreaded "last tourist visa" stamp in his passport as he already has more than 3 so its not just Penang, they also gave him a letter stating it was government policy and not of their doing!

Some consulates have aways been unfriendly. The fact that other consulates don't have a problem with issueing tourist visas suggests that this is just the policy of the consul, not the Thai government.

There has been no announcement from the Foreign Ministry or immigration department.

[fxe1200]

and when I think about the trouble Thai people have to go throught to get a visa for Germany: personal Invitation, return ticket, health insurance, declaration of cost transfer by the one who issues the invitation, proof of funds, ability to communicate either in German or English...

good point fxe, BUT what the foreigners in Germany and the other Schengencountries get in return? how many of them are on social welfare, free healthcare, and unemployment benefits etc. etc......what Thailand do for us here? never heard of unemployment or social welfare offices for farangs.

If you can not pay cash, they even let you die in front of a hospital...so WE have to take care ourselfs here. I dont need 400k on my account or an income of 40,000 up for a month living in Thailand.....i am absolutely fine with 20k a month

You are right, a lot of people, and not only travellers from the "Third World", who came with a regular visa, are abusing the social systems in Germany.

And you are right about the Hospitals here in Thailand. Their physicians took an oath on Mammon, not on Hippokrates, sanja!

But this might be a bit off topic leo.

[CRUNCHER]

I don't understand why people wouldn't get a class 'O' Non immigrant visa from your home country before coming here, it means that you can stay here for 15 months, you just have to leave the country every 90 days. It costs £100 which is about 5600 Baht very quick and easy to apply for.

Going home every year and a quarter is no huge problem, maybe going back every now and then is actually a good idea as it will make you grateful for the life you have here. however I'm sure there are one or two people out there who are running from various things at home

Thousands of teachers are living on Thai wages and can't afford a flight home plus expenses. You don't have to be running away from home or living some scummy drunken sex tourist lifestyle to find flights and living expenses in the West too expensive.

I know some very respectable hard working primary school teachers who don't have degrees so they are working illegally and they don't earn enough money for flights to Singapore let alone London or New York.

The sad thing is is some of the decidedly slimy time share operators are given their work permits and visas easily. No questions asked.

Those of you who think that being skint and working under the radar makes you scum and a drain on Thailand who should be sent home (with a short stay in the monkeyhouse) should think again.

If you think that those with bags of money living in gated communities and eating in high end establishments are all upstanding members of the community who should be welcomed with open arms you are wrong once again.

Some people who are living here illegally on a budget are contributing to the community and some rich farangs don't have any contact with the Thai population unless they are cleaning their condo or sex workers.

It works both ways and economic status says nothing about whether your a good person or not.

I certainly do not think these people are scum - I know one or two and they are great people. The point is though, these people are breaking the laws of Thailand. If you go to a foreign country you should follow the laws and customs of that country. If they get caught they they must accept the consequences.

You did not make this claim, but many others have and that is they are pouring in money and supporting the Thai economy. In reality they contribute little. Their income is from Thailnad ( so they are to some extent taking and pay no tax), they live just above the poverty line and without degrees or good teaching qualifications they are not exactly top drawer teachers.

Do you believe that such people are an asset to Thailand. I do not think so and if I am right why should Thailand make it easy for them to stay here?

[Mario2008]

1 off topic comment deleted.

[tropo]

As far as I know, only the "one entry" tourist visas are free of charge. So, why not ask for adouble entry and pay for it?

Penang has not issued double entry tourist visas for 3 years. Double entry tourist visas are free in Vientiane.

[MUYTHAI]

apparently tourism is down drastically in the south, hard to understand why??????, this will help??????

I can't believe that you are that ignorant not to know why tourism in the South is down.

For myself I will never travel to the South also, as I like to avoid Muslims, one of the reasons I left my home country. I lived 25 years amongst them and that's more than enough for me.

You can call me an racist if you like, I really don't mind it at all.

Muslims are not a race, so you are not a racist. Islam is a religion not a race. Same with jews. There is not a jewish race. There are Caucasian jews and Negroid jews. People from the following three races are muslim...Caucasian (Anglo, East Indian, Persian, Arab), Mongoloid (different Asian groups, Polynesian, Melanesian), and Negroid (San, Bantu, Pygmy, Melanesians). I have never heard of Australoid muslims but there might be some in Australia.

Stay away from Penang!

[OzMick]

Penang - old guy at Love Lane Inn, Love Lane off Chulia tops for visas, knows everything going on and charges next to nothing.

Khota Bharu - if you want a beer take it with you, but rot-gut whisky available in some restaurants. Visa run bus gets there opening time, visas back that afternoon. Go on your own, not a chance, have to stay a night. Big advantage is I can ride down, stay a night in nice hotel very cheap (B350?) and leave the bike in security carpark Laos - do they still put a full page stamp in your passport? Remember thinking laos visa fee a rip-off. Dusty dump, but nice sandwiches.

[CRUNCHER]

It is not up to a consulate to stop illegals from working here this matter should be handled by the authorities IN the country and I wish they would.

They should crack down on illegal working teachers, divers and the like..... That way people who are here as long term tourists might have less hassle obtaining a TR visa even consecutive ones.

As some have already stated but no one gives a clear answer since there isn't any, some of us are indeed financially set for life without having the right age to retire, willing to marry or operate a business.

Well for those of us there isn't an option except getting consecutive TR visas.

Personally I'll be getting married next month so will be out of the line of fire yet I have sympathies for sincere money spending long term tourists.

Do me a favour. Immigration control is most certainly one way of controlling illegal working.

Good luck with your marriage. It is the married (to Thai) men I have most sympathy for. This is one area where I certainly think Thai immigration policy could be relaxed some. (For the record my wife is not Thai.)

[tropo]

so how about what I said earlier, do your 3 TR visas then do 4 x 15 border runs and start again.

It would be a waste of time and money. They will count the tourist visas in your passport issued from anywhere over any time period. This is exactly what they did back in 2007.

[likewise]

It is not up to a consulate to stop illegals from working here this matter should be handled by the authorities IN the country and I wish they would.

They should crack down on illegal working teachers, divers and the like..... That way people who are here as long term tourists might have less hassle obtaining a TR visa even consecutive ones.

As some have already stated but no one gives a clear answer since there isn't any, some of us are indeed financially set for life without having the right age to retire, willing to marry or operate a business.

Well for those of us there isn't an option except getting consecutive TR visas.

Personally I'll be getting married next month so will be out of the line of fire yet I have sympathies for sincere money spending long term tourists.

Do me a favour. Immigration control is most certainly one way of controlling illegal working.

Good luck with your marriage. It is the married (to Thai) men I have most sympathy for. This is one area where I certainly think Thai immigration policy could be relaxed some. (For the record my wife is not Thai.)

It's the labour dept who should check up on illegal working as the Imm dept.

Thanks, I am being forced into marriage for the sake of being able to stay (kidding)

[slipperx]

I certainly do not think these people are scum - I know one or two and they are great people. The point is though, these people are breaking the laws of Thailand. If you go to a foreign country you should follow the laws and customs of that country. If they get caught they they must accept the consequences.

You did not make this claim, but many others have and that is they are pouring in money and supporting the Thai economy. In reality they contribute little. Their income is from Thailnad ( so they are to some extent taking and pay no tax), they live just above the poverty line and without degrees or good teaching qualifications they are not exactly top drawer teachers.

Do you believe that such people are an asset to Thailand. I do not think so and if I am right why should Thailand make it easy for them to stay here?

Well Cruncher if you are getting your money from the Thai economy it won't be much unless you are very lucky and if you are spending it here what is the problem. You might not be putting much into the economy but you sure as hel_l won't be taking anything out because as a foreigner you get nothing here that you don't pay for. If you are working in a school for instance teaching to any level of ability then you are putting something back into the system - quite a lot actually comparatively speaking given the appalling pay and standard of many Thai teachers. Notwithstanding that if you are staying here long term you have no excuse not to comply with the rules - whether or not they change on a daily basis without explanation or warning.

It is well to remember Western countries have social welfare systems that simply do not exist here so naturally there should be some care taken as to who enters the country and is entitled to those benefits - a Thai going to live in a Western country gets a whole lot more than a foreginer living here so it follows the rules should be different. Also Thais are entitled to residency after a period of living in a Western country which does not happen to a Westerner. That said I am sure if the Thai government simplified the visa rules and had some sort of consistency it would be a benefit to everyone wanting to stay here and a benefit to the country from funds spent in the local economy (as opposed to the high end foreign run business most 'quality' tourists spend there money in). The fact that you get treated differently on a whim wherever you apply is a nonsense and a discredit to Thailand inviting derision.

[thaimiller]

A lot of countries work hard to build a tourist industry. Thailand seems to be the opposite working extreemly hard to destroy thiers.

Cmon....! The people affected by this issue are NOT real tourists... they're long stay people who cost the country money and pay no taxes... they cost Thailand money... hey, you can't live on back to back tourist visas in most developed countries and Thailand is trying hard to develop. Time to stop complaining about our generous host country... get a real visa or move on. Easy.

Once again someone who has cash and qualifications (or both) saying it's easy.

How do you get legal when your on a budget and you don't have a degree?

Being on a budget cancels out starting a company and not having a degree means you can't teach legally or get the kind of job which comes with a permit. (Unless you fancy time share that is)

Although I agree with you that Thailand is very accommodating and that disgracefully most Thais wouldn't even get into countries like America or Britain without vast amounts in the bank and a native spouse or well to do sponsor.

I'm not one of these guys who thinks the Thai authorities are out to get us (they could make getting a work permit easier though) I'm just exasperated with all you obviously financially secure degree carrying folks who keep saying "Get legal, it's easy"

It's not unless you are financially set or well qualified.

There are plenty good people who want to be legal and pay tax but the system doesn't allow for folks on a budget or without a university education to get a permit.

Will you all please stop saying it's easy and get off your high horses.

Its not a question of being on an high horse, its a fact. I have a non-b visa which I renew every 15 months, Im not a very rich man, I am only 35 years old and I used my head and got legal using the services of a lawyer. I am a silent partner with a business in the UK and I live off that money, im not going to top end bars each night and live to my means, usually around thousand pounds a month. But i still manage to keep up to date with visas etc, I border ran for the first 2 years of being here, then they tightened the requirments, so i got off my arse and sorted a visa out and have been doing this now for 3 years. Use a lawyer, get sorted and stop blaming other people for your inability to get a visa. It is easy with a bit of EFFORT. If you look on Air Asia etc you can get a flight to KL or Singapore for around 3000thb return if you book early enough, get your visa from there. But plan ahead. Book 6 months in advance if thats what it takes, do it rather than moaning about other people who have got a visa.

[likewise]

so how about what I said earlier, do your 3 TR visas then do 4 x 15 border runs and start again.

It would be a waste of time and money. They will count the tourist visas in your passport issued from anywhere over any time period. This is exactly what they did back in 2007.

When they came out with the 90 day in 180 rule you could do 3 border runs and then get TR visas, I've done that without ever getting any hassles or questions asked.

I must have an honest face

[mrbp]

I don't understand why people wouldn't get a class 'O' Non immigrant visa from your home country before coming here, it means that you can stay here for 15 months, you just have to leave the country every 90 days. It costs £100 which is about 5600 Baht very quick and easy to apply for.

Going home every year and a quarter is no huge problem, maybe going back every now and then is actually a good idea as it will make you grateful for the life you have here. however I'm sure there are one or two people out there who are running from various things at home

Thousands of teachers are living on Thai wages and can't afford a flight home plus expenses. You don't have to be running away from home or living some scummy drunken sex tourist lifestyle to find flights and living expenses in the West too expensive.

I know some very respectable hard working primary school teachers who don't have degrees so they are working illegally and they don't earn enough money for flights to Singapore let alone London or New York.

The sad thing is is some of the decidedly slimy time share operators are given their work permits and visas easily. No questions asked.

Those of you who think that being skint and working under the radar makes you scum and a drain on Thailand who should be sent home (with a short stay in the monkeyhouse) should think again.

If you think that those with bags of money living in gated communities and eating in high end establishments are all upstanding members of the community who should be welcomed with open arms you are wrong once again.

Some people who are living here illegally on a budget are contributing to the community and some rich farangs don't have any contact with the Thai population unless they are cleaning their condo or sex workers.

It works both ways and economic status says nothing about whether your a good person or not.

I certainly do not think these people are scum - I know one or two and they are great people. The point is though, these people are breaking the laws of Thailand. If you go to a foreign country you should follow the laws and customs of that country. If they get caught they they must accept the consequences.

You did not make this claim, but many others have and that is they are pouring in money and supporting the Thai economy. In reality they contribute little. Their income is from Thailnad ( so they are to some extent taking and pay no tax), they live just above the poverty line and without degrees or good teaching qualifications they are not exactly top drawer teachers.

Do you believe that such people are an asset to Thailand. I do not think so and if I am right why should Thailand make it easy for them to stay here?

Well I know plenty of kids with degrees who aren't up to teaching and plenty of us long in the tooth worldly wise buggers with no degree who are naturals. So in answer to your question, some teachers are an asset to Thailand some are not and that applies equally to those with degrees as to those without.

The thing is the Thai authorities know that most government school teachers only have TESOL qualifications and no degree because the government sector doesn't pay the kind of wages that most graduates expect. So the Thai authorities are aware of the situation.

They have three choices.

1.crack down on the law breakers imprison and fine us then deport us and have a paucity of native English speaking teachers in gov schools. (which a lot of the financially sorted expats posting here seem to to be rubbing their hands with glee at the idea of seeing us budget wanke_rs in a cage with thirty Burmese illegals)

2.Up the wages to attract university graduates.

3.Start issuing work permits to people with TESOL certification.

or of course carry on as we are and turn a blind eye to us criminalising us in the process.

I would completely respect their wishes if they told me that I couldn't work in Thailand because I needed a teaching degree plus a TESOL. (Although I would be a tad peeved if I was hauled off to the monkey house considering the Thai authorities, the TESOL schools and the teaching agencies all unofficially know, allow and encourage TESOL graduates to work in the public sector)

So having a degree says nothing about your ability as a teacher and even though we might not be contributing financially we are not a drain on the economy and we are involved in Thai communities in a way that many of the wealthy yacht owning gated community dwelling VIP visa crew are not.

My gripe is not with the Thai authorities who are actually very accommodating, it's with the wealthy expats posting on here saying.

"Oi budget scum get legal it's easy or piss off if you can't afford it"

[Jingthing]

Muslims are not a race, so you are not a racist. Islam is a religion not a race. Same with jews. There is not a jewish race.

Race is a loaded word of course. It is true for example that Jews are not a race and people of different backgrounds are Jews. However within Judaism there are different groups of people that share genetic similarities. For example Ashkenazi Jews (a subset of all Jews) are the major risk group for tays sachs disease which is determined by genetics. So it is not always a simple yes or no answer with such things.

Edited July 23, 2009 by Jingthing

[NanLaew]

I am also here on a tourist Visa atm. I am married but dont have the 400k on my bankaccount anymore....AM I STUPID?? how many Thaipeople do you know with more than 100k on a Bank, specially in times like that.

No, you are not stupid but you mustn't read the local press much or you wouldn't have missed the record sellout of government savings bonds a few weeks back. These were only for those older than 60 and they were snapped up within minutes by Thai senior citizens buying in tranches of 100,000 baht to 1,000,000 baht. This was a NATIONWIDE virtually instantaneous sellout, not just your Bangkok rich but the great unwashed as well.

The only real poor in Thailand are these perpetual "Tourists". I reckon the Thai Consulates should also task these punters with mandatory multiple visits to 5 or 6 famous cultural or historical places EACH & EVERY time they get a Tourist Visa which needs to be endorsed in their passport during their 60/90-day tenure. If they miss one stop, "Sorry, no new visa as you obviously aren't Tourist!" Off to Cambodia with you now (and don't let the door bang your arse as you pass through Poipet)!

Keep it up Thailand and get all these borderline illegal riff raff without a pot to piss in or criminal absconders off the Thai streets and back home where they belong.

[likewise]

I am also here on a tourist Visa atm. I am married but dont have the 400k on my bankaccount anymore....AM I STUPID?? how many Thaipeople do you know with more than 100k on a Bank, specially in times like that.

No, you are not stupid but you mustn't read the local press much or you wouldn't have missed the record sellout of government savings bonds a few weeks back. These were only for those older than 60 and they were snapped up within minutes by Thai senior citizens buying in tranches of 100,000 baht to 1,000,000 baht. This was a NATIONWIDE virtually instantaneous sellout, not just your Bangkok rich but the great unwashed as well.

The only real poor in Thailand are these perpetual "Tourists". I reckon the Thai Consulates should also task these punters with mandatory multiple visits to 5 or 6 famous cultural or historical places EACH & EVERY time they get a Tourist Visa which needs to be endorsed in their passport during their 60/90-day tenure. If they miss one stop, "Sorry, no new visa as you obviously aren't Tourist!" Off to Cambodia with you now (and don't let the door bang your arse as you pass through Poipet)!

Keep it up Thailand and get all these borderline illegal riff raff without a pot to piss in or criminal absconders off the Thai streets and back home where they belong.

Bit of a narrowminded retard are ya?

[Gonzo the Face]

nobody is saying there isn't alot of thought going into these decisions.

we just get the feeling that these decisions are based only on short term analysis. band-aid solutions if you will. eg, Financial Crisis, wave visa fees: if you drive your mercedez over the boarder from malaysia and stay at the orientel, only 15 days...

wave to waive

mercedez to mercedes

boarder to border

orientel to oriental

...

Having just read about 6 or 7 pages of this thread, I see confusion coming from many sides of this issue. I think that most of those whinging and bichin, sic. are those who would not be happy with anything other than Thailand letting them stay here without any visa and no runs or restrictions at all.

They can then tell us about how they are supporting the Thai economy by spending their 20,000 baht on the streets. You know in the social arena [read bars] maybe even getting lucky once in a while. 20,000 baht that they couldn't even get off the streets back home.

Maybe take one or two beers less per month and maybe give up one chippy per month, and save the money so you can get the correct visa.

Reading the past 6 or 7 pages one thing still leaves me confused.

Are some of the posters writing in some language other than English??

Someone wrote about English Teachers and working. TV should be able to employ about 20 - 25 of these teachers to teach English to many of those posting.

[rch1023]

Some consulates don't like people traveling to Thailand a lot on tourist visa and can give a stamp in your passport saying that they will not further isue a tourist visa to you. That is the policy of the consul, not of the Thai government.

yes thats my whole point about this particular consulate,and when travelling to thailand what else do you travel with if not a tourist visa,oh forgot they dont like tourists,what a dump that consulate is.could always go to kota baru,not that far from penang.

Sorry. Kota Bahru is doing it too. My son caught this, as I reported a month ago - http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Tourist-Visa...25&start=25 - seems as if the Malay consulates are getting their act together.

- Roger -

[LivinLOS]

When they took away the visa running they said 'simply go get a tourist visa' they will not be restricted, its only so we can do checks on people.. Etc etc..

Again they have shown to be simply lieing.. You cannot blame the people caught up when this is the instructions from immigration chiefs right on down to the desk officer (I have had them tell me to overstay, or land border visa run myself in the past)..

While they have no formal visa for wealthy under 50's people, yet at the same time market the country as a ideal destination for those same people to come, buy a condo, and set up shop.. This will continue.. Its a problem of their own making.