Pardon For Thaksin: Thai Govt Takes Dangerous Path

[TAWP]

What happens if the pardon is not agreed to by Royal decree?

Some of the very red groups will use it as a pretext to call for a French or Tibetian solution. Again.

[Old Man River]

Tulsathit (The Nation) had an interesting take on the amnesty issue last night on The Nation's daily show on "You Tube" (Meet The Editors). He said if Thaksin were to accept amnesty, that would mean he would be admitting he is guilty and this may lead to a legal issue for him in getting back the rest of his money. Interesting.

But that wouldn't apply to him because he's Thaksin Shinawatra and he's Thaksin Shinawatra so that wouldn't apply to him - and if you think even Thaksin wouldn't try a line as lame as that, well you probably don't remember the absolutely craven denial he put up about breaking his promise not to accept the prime ministership if he got less votes in the Democrat-boycotted election than the previous one (which is indeed what happened) by claiming that - percentage-wise - he got more. I don't recall ever seen a bigger shit-eating grin on a human being: Even the hack journalist-cum-quizshow host interviewing him was looking at Thaksin like he was something he stepped in stuck to the bottom of his shoe.

Tulsie's comments related to the courts.

[Old Man River]

What happens if the pardon is not agreed to by Royal decree?

Some of the very red groups will use it as a pretext to call for a French or Tibetian solution. Again.

And that would probably bring out the military and round and round we go.

[ThaiOats]

The winners make the rules. Yingluck/Thaksin won, Abhisit lost. The Thai people? They spoke at a free and fair election and have made their choice. Everyone knew that if Puea Thai won, Thaksin would come back. Seems that the majority of voters want Thaksin back.

It's Thailand, not Farangland. It's unbelievable how many Farangs can't seem to accept the choices that Thai people make in their own land.

And you think all the Thai people want him back? There are MANY Thais who don't want him back so it doesn't matter if you're a farang or not. Those who thinks foreigners should have no opinion in Thailand are just plain st*pid. Social communities such as this one or Facebook is there for discussions, people can take it or leave it.

My family and relatives are Thai and we're not supporters of this government at all. We watch the news everyday and have had it up to here with how much BS this government is putting out. We're just as aggravated as the foreigners here and glad that there are people who have sense and can see things for what they are. I show my support for Abhisit on his FB page too, whether he reads it or not it's up to him, but the message is there.

[Lite Beer]

A post breaking a multitude of forum rules has been deleted.

[cdnski12]

Yingluck Shinawatra, Thaksin Shinawatra; Barrack Obama ... all same, same!!

[MILT]

I rather let all others murderers and rapist in Thailand walk free than to see this man return to Thailand.

After all those money he stole from us Thais.

OK, I understand, BUT... maybe you will enlighten us which former PM or other politican hasnt steel any money from Thaipeople?

What hast changed in the years with Khun Abhisit? are there free shools? Free health care for Thais? (visit an Emergency room at 2 o clock in the morning, where 1 24year old woman doc is playing with her telephone instead taking care for the 30 (Phuket) older and younger patients waiting for a doc )

We all know Khun Thaksin is not the best solution for Thailand but he is by far not the worst!

Your personal opinion, and it is not an informed one. I have met the man, and been wronged by him. All politicians are corrupt, but I have never met any other government official as malevolent as Thaksin, nor anyone who is so impossible to negotiate with. Words and people mean nothing to him. He will tell you whatever you want to hear, and then commit whatever scandalous, hideous atrocity benefits him the most completely disregarding anything he said and even denying he said it. His public persona is simply an extension of who he really is. Nobody can effectively work with him except those who venerate him and defer to him completely. He is a dictator by virtue of his character because he defers to nobody. I am not a psychiatrist, but I would not be surprised if someone told me he was a sociopath.

Yes, he is absolutely the worst solution for Thailand. Give him time and he will become Hitler. He is a demagogue and extremely dangerous. He must be resisted at all costs.

Most on this forum know it's no secret where I stand when it comes to Thaskin. I am just curious how you were wronged by Thaskin.

You give Thaskin way to much credit. At best Thaskin can be described as no one special. People are essentially (no matter who they really are inside) what other people make them out to be. One min I am a great guy and the next I am a complete assh*le Doesn't mean bloody squat.

I have met Thaskin face to face and spoke with the guy. He is nobody special really. A star of his own show one my say and that in itself is not entirely a goo/ bad thing.

And by the way if you really want to be honest with your own self we all are sociopaths to some degree, and have adapted the art of concealing it quite well.

The last time I checked we all get up and take a sh*t and put our pants on the same way. Thaskin is a nobody!

Edited November 17, 2011 by MILT

[BigJohnnyBKK]

My mind boggles at how many farang posting here are incredibly naive, dreaming of a Thailand without corruption.

Such a thing is absolutely inconceivable and impossible, at least within the lifetime of anyone alive today.

I would estimate that only completely brainwashed and intellectually subnormal Thai citizens would imagine such a far-fetched fantasy, and reckon most of them don't even see it that desirable even if it were possible.

Same with the concept that politicians should be expected to give anything but lip service to the idea of serving the people, such ideas are recognized being even more of a fantasy here than they are in other so-called democracies.

I think it would be much more constructive if these discussion took place closer to actual reality as it presents itself rather than abstract ideals.

IMO the greatest potential damage to Thailand from Thaksin being allowed to return is the reaction of those opposed to him and any resulting conflicts. If he were able to actually exercise more control over his puppets by physically being here, then perhaps he would be able to rake off a percentage point or two more of the GDP, but this would be a small price to pay if overall prosperity could back on an upward track. Continuing public crisis and confrontations will have much worse impact on the overall welfare of the country.

There isn't any chance of Thailand getting a government that actually wants to look after the needs of the country as a whole, so let's stop pretending there is. Whoever's in charge will always be getting their piece of the pie, Thaksin just has to learn to let it get spread about a bit more fairly and all will be right in the LOS. Maybe that's the message behind Abhisit's current conciliatory stance.

The best chance of the common people being able to improve their lot in life will come from continued organic economic growth, which will only get back on track if things can be allowed to stabilise over time and the risk of major political upheavals goes away. To the Yellows - you lost, he won, suck it up and face it, let's all get back to the business of making money.

[BCP]

It is a pity that little sister and her big brother's cronies have not been spending as much time and energy in using the current plight of Thailand and all the flooding to unite the people, instead of using it as a smoke screen to to try and sneak Thaksin back in. If you'll excuse the pun, there is nothing better than a national disaster, the likes of which Thailand has been going through over the last couple of months with the floods, to build bridges between a divided nation. It is a missed opportunity to use a bad situation to the benefit of Thailand and of all Thai's.

There are still many Thai's who believe Thaksin is God's gift, despite all the evidence to the contrary. Most of the people I talk to where I live, in the poor north, have no clue about politics but he obviously came across to them as someone good. They are rice planters, concerned about where their next meal comes from and no more. After the last election, some didn't even know what party they had just voted for, they had cast their vote for number 1 or 2 or whoever purely because of how much each candidate paid them. I was amused at some of the conversations on how much they had been paid. It appears that in areas where there was a very clear favourite, they got paid much less than where it was closely contested. Any election result in these circumstances has got to have no meaning at all. Nearly all Thai's accept corruption as a way of life, so what did Thaskin do wrong in their eyes? They still can't see how he robbed them, it is way beyond their level of understanding. At least Bernie Madoff robbed the wealthy and not the poor.

It doesn't matter how much we all rant and rave on Thai Visa nothing at all will change until Somsak, out planting rice in the fields in Phetchabun, Phitsanulok or Khon Kaen has some degree of political awareness, a better education and has much less tendancy to accept corruption as a way of life. Better education might bring with it, over a generation or so, some political awareness but getting rid of corruption is one huge cultural change that none of us will ever see in our lifetimes so you'd better get used to it.

[hammered]

What happens if the pardon is not agreed to by Royal decree?

Some of the very red groups will use it as a pretext to call for a French or Tibetian solution. Again.

And that would probably bring out the military and round and round we go.

OMR the military may well be to divided to even do anything. They struggled to pull off May last year and the reds are a lot more powerful since that

Edited to add: i think we are close to what we talked about a while ago involving the long march if anyone wants to try it

Edited November 17, 2011 by hammered

[rubl]

OMR the military may well be to divided to even do anything. They struggled to pull off May last year and the reds are a lot more powerful since that

Edited to add: i think we are close to what we talked about a while ago involving the long march if anyone wants to try it

The army struggled to pull off the clean-up May 2010? Against 'peaceful protesters, not terrorists'? And now the reds are more powerful?

Time to watch out for grenade attacks on non-reds ?

[nurofiend]

OMR the military may well be to divided to even do anything. They struggled to pull off May last year and the reds are a lot more powerful since that

Edited to add: i think we are close to what we talked about a while ago involving the long march if anyone wants to try it

The army struggled to pull off the clean-up May 2010? Against 'peaceful protesters, not terrorists'? And now the reds are more powerful?

Time to watch out for grenade attacks on non-reds ?

rubl, show me one regular on this forum who would argue that every red shirt at the protest in 2010 was a peaceful protester...show me just one...

or else stop with the 'peaceful protesters' baloney, please

[roamer]

anyone who supports Man city can,t be all bad??

he doesn't any more and he never did , but you're not bad in my eyes because i do.

he does he was at the last derby game i saw him???

So its true then, people who are banned from entering UK are arriving on private jets and not being checked by immigration

[djlest]

in my opinion the whole deal has been planned from the day yingluck stepped in.

ironic how the worst flood in thailands history happens just 4 weeks after yingluck steps in? or is it ironic that all northern reservoirs and sluice gates were manipulated to flood the country. either way i would say its quite a suspicious event, considering thailands rainfall was not particulary brutal the last 12 months, and probably manipulated by now to look as if it was along the deltas but not elsewhere.

Now isn't it ironic that just a few weeks after the flood, Mr Taksin comes to the table with a grand cure for thailands worst flooding, with a 400 billion project that he wants to put in place to fix the issue. this was before the worst of the flooding had even taken place, it was almost premeditated - that was the last we heard of him by the way - until yesterday ofcourse.

Now after the worst has passed, thai people have been shocked into forgetting all about politics and are more focussed on survival, helping one another get over their differences perhaps. But just barely one week after the worst has passed, a new strategy to bring THE CURE back home has being put into motion. Again almost as if it has all been pre meditated from the start, and a helicopter that forgot to install lights? its become rather a comedy now as to how transparent the reality really is.

As for those commenters that say, i prefered when Taksin was in power to nowdays, dont forget that the minute taksin was kicked out of power, the damage to the country was caused directly or indirectly by him trying to get back in.

Was it not Taksin that really chose to leave his beloved Thailand?

Did nelson Mandella run away from his country when the chips were down?

What true man of dignity and honour would run away if they were so innocent?

Tourism and Business has been down since Taksin left because

a) hijacked airports

A global recession that affects the entire world not just Thailands little tourist hub

c) Red shirt mayhem, cities burning, riots, killings,

d) Man made floods all executed with precise timing, or was it just mother nature being cruel?

Whether al of the above is a conspiracy theory or not, whether only selfish, greedy, poor, uneducated, or desperate people have always backed the man because they have similar ways of thinking or really do believe the man can be compared with the buddha of business himself.

The truth is Thailand will never be free - for as long as one man wants to own it, rape it, pillage it and turn it into a business that will better his own empire, the more money his empire has the more he can control the weather so to speak.

A truly inspirational leader for Thailand would give up ALL businesses before entering into politics

Would never manipulate laws to better their own business empire and grow their own wealth

would never try and step back in now, after Thailand is on its knees.

would never have ran away from his beloved country if he was innocent

A true leader would never have paid the poor to hijack the city for 2 months and ordered it to be burned down in the name of 'a peaceful democracy' that was plastered all over sharpened bamboo poles that did nothing but provoke fear and discust into those of us that endured it from basecamp.

A true leader would never push his little sister in to manipulate his agendas.

One has to ask if the true reason Yingluck cries is really sympathy for the people or guilt in knowing what the true nature of the beast that caused the events were.

Ofcourse ignorance is bliss to those that cannot comprehend anything but their own selfish desires.

My heart goes out to those people that have suffered so much at the hands of such selfish desires.

[ThaiOats]

in my opinion the whole deal has been planned from the day yingluck stepped in.

ironic how the worst flood in thailands history happens just 4 weeks after yingluck steps in? or is it ironic that all northern reservoirs and sluice gates were manipulated to flood the country. either way i would say its quite a suspicious event, considering thailands rainfall was not particulary brutal the last 12 months, and probably manipulated by now to look as if it was along the deltas but not elsewhere.

Now isn't it ironic that just a few weeks after the flood, Mr Taksin comes to the table with a grand cure for thailands worst flooding, with a 400 billion project that he wants to put in place to fix the issue. this was before the worst of the flooding had even taken place, it was almost premeditated - that was the last we heard of him by the way - until yesterday ofcourse.

Now after the worst has passed, thai people have been shocked into forgetting all about politics and are more focussed on survival, helping one another get over their differences perhaps. But just barely one week after the worst has passed, a new strategy to bring THE CURE back home has being put into motion. Again almost as if it has all been pre meditated from the start, and a helicopter that forgot to install lights? its become rather a comedy now as to how transparent the reality really is.

As for those commenters that say, i prefered when Taksin was in power to nowdays, dont forget that the minute taksin was kicked out of power, the damage to the country was caused directly or indirectly by him trying to get back in.

Was it not Taksin that really chose to leave his beloved Thailand?

Did nelson Mandella run away from his country when the chips were down?

What true man of dignity and honour would run away if they were so innocent?

Tourism and Business has been down since Taksin left because

a) hijacked airports

A global recession that affects the entire world not just Thailands little tourist hub

c) Red shirt mayhem, cities burning, riots, killings,

d) Man made floods all executed with precise timing, or was it just mother nature being cruel?

Whether al of the above is a conspiracy theory or not, whether only selfish, greedy, poor, uneducated, or desperate people have always backed the man because they have similar ways of thinking or really do believe the man can be compared with the buddha of business himself.

The truth is Thailand will never be free - for as long as one man wants to own it, rape it, pillage it and turn it into a business that will better his own empire, the more money his empire has the more he can control the weather so to speak.

A truly inspirational leader for Thailand would give up ALL businesses before entering into politics

Would never manipulate laws to better their own business empire and grow their own wealth

would never try and step back in now, after Thailand is on its knees.

would never have ran away from his beloved country if he was innocent

A true leader would never have paid the poor to hijack the city for 2 months and ordered it to be burned down in the name of 'a peaceful democracy' that was plastered all over sharpened bamboo poles that did nothing but provoke fear and discust into those of us that endured it from basecamp.

A true leader would never push his little sister in to manipulate his agendas.

One has to ask if the true reason Yingluck cries is really sympathy for the people or guilt in knowing what the true nature of the beast that caused the events were.

Ofcourse ignorance is bliss to those that cannot comprehend anything but their own selfish desires.

My heart goes out to those people that have suffered so much at the hands of such selfish desires.

Great post but only those with good moral values and reasoning would be able to understand it. Somehow, someone here is going to bring Abhisit and compare him to the points you've made... or bring up the coup or something absurd that has nothing to do with the issues in front of them.

[Alboy666]

There will be blood on the streets before this is finished... mark my words!

blether, blether, blether. which one are you waldorf or statler?

[whybother]

rubl, show me one regular on this forum who would argue that every red shirt at the protest in 2010 was a peaceful protester...show me just one...

or else stop with the 'peaceful protesters' baloney, please

"Peaceful Protesters. Not Terrorists".

It was a red shirt sign. Go and talk to them about it.

[sparebox2]

The Red shirts burn Bangkok down. They deserve it. really.

[MikeyIdea]

OMR the military may well be to divided to even do anything. They struggled to pull off May last year and the reds are a lot more powerful since that

Edited to add: i think we are close to what we talked about a while ago involving the long march if anyone wants to try it

The army struggled to pull off the clean-up May 2010? Against 'peaceful protesters, not terrorists'? And now the reds are more powerful?

Time to watch out for grenade attacks on non-reds ?

rubl, show me one regular on this forum who would argue that every red shirt at the protest in 2010 was a peaceful protester...show me just one...

or else stop with the 'peaceful protesters' baloney, please

Good, then we all agree that what the army cleaned up was rioters, right? Maybe that's why the soldiers got flowers by the public for doing it...

Edited November 18, 2011 by MikeyIdea

[BinDhumm]

in my opinion the whole deal has been planned from the day yingluck stepped in.

ironic how the worst flood in thailands history happens just 4 weeks after yingluck steps in? or is it ironic that all northern reservoirs and sluice gates were manipulated to flood the country. either way i would say its quite a suspicious event, considering thailands rainfall was not particulary brutal the last 12 months, and probably manipulated by now to look as if it was along the deltas but not elsewhere.

Now isn't it ironic that just a few weeks after the flood, Mr Taksin comes to the table with a grand cure for thailands worst flooding, with a 400 billion project that he wants to put in place to fix the issue. this was before the worst of the flooding had even taken place, it was almost premeditated - that was the last we heard of him by the way - until yesterday ofcourse.

Now after the worst has passed, thai people have been shocked into forgetting all about politics and are more focussed on survival, helping one another get over their differences perhaps. But just barely one week after the worst has passed, a new strategy to bring THE CURE back home has being put into motion. Again almost as if it has all been pre meditated from the start, and a helicopter that forgot to install lights? its become rather a comedy now as to how transparent the reality really is.

As for those commenters that say, i prefered when Taksin was in power to nowdays, dont forget that the minute taksin was kicked out of power, the damage to the country was caused directly or indirectly by him trying to get back in.

Was it not Taksin that really chose to leave his beloved Thailand?

Did nelson Mandella run away from his country when the chips were down?

What true man of dignity and honour would run away if they were so innocent?

Tourism and Business has been down since Taksin left because

a) hijacked airports

A global recession that affects the entire world not just Thailands little tourist hub

c) Red shirt mayhem, cities burning, riots, killings,

d) Man made floods all executed with precise timing, or was it just mother nature being cruel?

Whether al of the above is a conspiracy theory or not, whether only selfish, greedy, poor, uneducated, or desperate people have always backed the man because they have similar ways of thinking or really do believe the man can be compared with the buddha of business himself.

The truth is Thailand will never be free - for as long as one man wants to own it, rape it, pillage it and turn it into a business that will better his own empire, the more money his empire has the more he can control the weather so to speak.

A truly inspirational leader for Thailand would give up ALL businesses before entering into politics

Would never manipulate laws to better their own business empire and grow their own wealth

would never try and step back in now, after Thailand is on its knees.

would never have ran away from his beloved country if he was innocent

A true leader would never have paid the poor to hijack the city for 2 months and ordered it to be burned down in the name of 'a peaceful democracy' that was plastered all over sharpened bamboo poles that did nothing but provoke fear and discust into those of us that endured it from basecamp.

A true leader would never push his little sister in to manipulate his agendas.

One has to ask if the true reason Yingluck cries is really sympathy for the people or guilt in knowing what the true nature of the beast that caused the events were.

Ofcourse ignorance is bliss to those that cannot comprehend anything but their own selfish desires.

My heart goes out to those people that have suffered so much at the hands of such selfish desires.

+10 nothing to add to this

[sirchai]

I rather let all others murderers and rapist in Thailand walk free than to see this man return to Thailand.

After all those money he stole from us Thais.

It's really very sad that they didn't set an example for others. Most "Isan" farmers still think Thaksin's a good man. He a kind of "raped' them all.

You let a convicted criminal back in without any jail sentence? It's just unbelievable..............

Thailand the hub of World Class Standard BS?:jap:

Edited November 18, 2011 by sirchai

[wxyz]

the 'not so secret' secret is out

[geezer553]

how convinent that yingluck was stranded_thailand is so corrupt amnesty for drug dealers as well....................may as well empty the jails with murders/rapists!!!

if thailand continue to show contempt_nobody will want to come to thailand,. i am so angry that the thai goverment held a secret meeting behind closed doors,.

i suppose the normal thai dont count-amnesty for the kings birthday december 5th--------------------------------sanook 555.................quai/buffalo!!!-/midea goverment!!!

[JohnAllan]

A pardon for those who have been convicted but are yet to be jailed due, for example, to pending appeal, is markedly different to those who have skipped the country to evade a sentence. Let's not play with words here.

And Chalerm is just the one to be in charge. After all, didn't his son skip the country and ultimately avoid a prison sentence?

[billd766]

The danger is that citizens killing generals and royalists do not respect the wish of a government that represents more than 2/3 of the Thai electorate. Anymore comprehensive cannot be possible.

Please excuse me for being somewhat slow but it is probably due to may age.

When I went to school over 50 years ago I was taught in Mathematics that 48% is smaller than 2/3 which is 66.6%

Maybe you did Maths differently to me but IIRC only 48% of the electorate voted for the PTP and not necessarily all of them voted for Thaksin.

Can you explain in simple terms how you have arrived at 2/3ds of the Thai electorate are in favour of this?

Thank you for your enlightenment.

[saintofsilence]

I really can't see the review body allowing him to come if anything it may have prolonged his return thanks to their plot being uncovered.

[razer]

Ah ... Thai politics are so predictable ....

[nurofiend]

rubl, show me one regular on this forum who would argue that every red shirt at the protest in 2010 was a peaceful protester...show me just one...

or else stop with the 'peaceful protesters' baloney, please

"Peaceful Protesters. Not Terrorists".

It was a red shirt sign. Go and talk to them about it.

how about this, i'll go talk to them about it when you decide to butt out and let others speak for themselves when they're in discussion.... deal?

i thought not.

rubl blatantly put 'peaceful protesters, not terrorists' in quotations to suggest that people who had a problem with the crackdown are of the opinion that they were all peaceful protesters...so show me one regular on here who claims such a thing!

some of ye are all so black and white about things it's verging on the rrrrrrridiculous

i'm interested in what rubl has to say, since that's who i was asking... thanks

Edited November 18, 2011 by nurofiend

[nurofiend]

OMR the military may well be to divided to even do anything. They struggled to pull off May last year and the reds are a lot more powerful since that

Edited to add: i think we are close to what we talked about a while ago involving the long march if anyone wants to try it

The army struggled to pull off the clean-up May 2010? Against 'peaceful protesters, not terrorists'? And now the reds are more powerful?

Time to watch out for grenade attacks on non-reds ?

rubl, show me one regular on this forum who would argue that every red shirt at the protest in 2010 was a peaceful protester...show me just one...

or else stop with the 'peaceful protesters' baloney, please

Good, then we all agree that what the army cleaned up was rioters, right? Maybe that's why the soldiers got flowers by the public for doing it...

yeah, well done....very smart stuff there mate

hopefully you patted yourself on the shoulder and laid back in your seat after posting that comment, if not... you should have done, amazing.

it was an A+ retort to what i said.

[whybother]

how about this, i'll go talk to them about it when you decide to butt out and let others speak for themselves when they're in discussion.... deal?

i thought not.

rubl blatantly put 'peaceful protesters, not terrorists' in quotations to suggest that people who had a problem with the crackdown are of the opinion that they were all peaceful protesters...so show me one regular on here who claims such a thing!

some of ye are all so black and white about things it's verging on the rrrrrrridiculous

i'm interested in what rubl has to say, since that's who i was asking... thanks

Rubl regularly (blatantly) uses the reference to the "Peaceful protesters. Not terrorists" sign when red shirts suggest just that.

It's not the "regular"s on here who are claiming such things. It's the red shirts themselves.

If you can point me to one place where one of the red shirt leaders has accepted that they (or even some of them) were violent and/or armed, that sign will lose some of it's relevance.

Until then, the "Peaceful protesters. Not terrorists" sign will continue to be referred to by many people, including rubl.