Is Being Fat A Choice (If There Is No Underlying Medical Reason)

[cowslip]

Finally it seems that many of the posters here have either little or incorrect medical knowledge and have grasped at all sorts of fads and misconceptions about diet and how to lose and then maintain weight.

forget about "miracle' diets and "cures" or specific substances......what you need to do in the end is eat less.....forever.

Edited October 20, 2012 by cowslip

[laislica]

Just an update about me, it might help others too. I count my calories and watch my food intake. However i was hungry all the time, real annoying feeling and makes it hard to concentrate. Now i was eating 2000-2300 calories on a day. So no freak diets.

Anyway i was constantly thinking of food, i still had some reduce 15mg tablets here. Before i thought they did not work. But after taking them for a few days the hunger feeling is gone. I actually have to remind myself to eat. (much better).

Just one note, it could be that im sick because been feeling not that great the last couple of days headaches and such. But i will keep you guys informed. If this really helps it would be great for me. I keep my to diet, but this way it would be a bit more comfortable.

I hope that you feel better soon,

Do you actually get sunshine on unprotected skin?

It is important so that you make the necessary Vitamin D3 in your skin - plus a host of other good things that sunshine bring.

We have been brainwashed to avoid the sun - use sun blockers all the time.

This is wrong, we need the sunshine to survive.

Just don't get burned, that's what causes the problem.

BTW, vitamin D is not a vitamin, it was wrongly classified - it is an important hormone used by every cell in your body but because it is cheap to make, BigPharma doesn't want you to know about it because if you keep yous levels up, especially naturally - the sun - you will have less illness, no profit in that!

The vitamin D2 which they add by law in the UK to dairy products is actually bad for you.

Get D3 in liquid form, 1 drop = 1,000 units and doesn't taste bad.

They now recommend at least 5,000 units per day.

Have a little Google?

[laislica]

Finally it seems that many of the posters here have either little or incorrect medical knowledge and have grasped at all sorts of fads and misconceptions about diet and how to lose and then maintain weight.

forget about "miracle' diets and "cures" or specific substances......what you need to do in the end is eat less.....forever.

You are so right! It's a life style thing, just like Robblok said before.

However, the diet (I mean what you eat rather than restricting what you eat) should be a balanced one, avoiding GMO's and should include seeds, nuts, spices, cholesterol, animal protein, fruit, veggies - some cooked and most raw or lightly steamed. Organic if you possibly can.

Grains should me minimised along with any processed food, sugar and artificial anything..

Then add living your life to the full, keeping stress to the minimum and having fun - laughter is the best medicine!

[billd766]

Just an update about me, it might help others too. I count my calories and watch my food intake. However i was hungry all the time, real annoying feeling and makes it hard to concentrate. Now i was eating 2000-2300 calories on a day. So no freak diets.

Anyway i was constantly thinking of food, i still had some reduce 15mg tablets here. Before i thought they did not work. But after taking them for a few days the hunger feeling is gone. I actually have to remind myself to eat. (much better).

Just one note, it could be that im sick because been feeling not that great the last couple of days headaches and such. But i will keep you guys informed. If this really helps it would be great for me. I keep my to diet, but this way it would be a bit more comfortable.

I am still fat and happy just in case you thought I had forgotten you.

Are you not confusing me with Tropo ? Unless its not a negative comment.

It isn't a negative comment and I would never confuse you with Tropo. Trust me on that.

Anyway Tropo who? He is on my ignore list.

[robblok]

Finally it seems that many of the posters here have either little or incorrect medical knowledge and have grasped at all sorts of fads and misconceptions about diet and how to lose and then maintain weight.

forget about "miracle' diets and "cures" or specific substances......what you need to do in the end is eat less.....forever.

Substances can help, i know of a few that work. But they won't help much if you don't diet. It's mainly about what you eat and how much you burn.

Your 100% right about that some people think a diet will help. You have to change what and how much you eat permanent else you will gain it all back if you do what you did before.

[Tolley]

Finally it seems that many of the posters here have either little or incorrect medical knowledge and have grasped at all sorts of fads and misconceptions about diet and how to lose and then maintain weight.

forget about "miracle' diets and "cures" or specific substances......what you need to do in the end is eat less.....forever.

That is rather a silly statement and very simplistic. Sure eating less for overweight or fat people is probably prudent but there is much more to health that just weight.

Many many diseases are caused by lack of certain vitamins or minerals in the system or indeed certain weaknesses that need to be addressed to ensure optimal health.

I wouldnt depend on the established medical community to help you with this as most doctors know very little about nutrition and certainly not how to diagnose the status of different peoples nutritional needs.

For this you need to see a good naturopath or perhaps a Chinese doctor or the like who have extensive knowledge in this area.

Edited October 20, 2012 by Tolley

[cowslip]

I beg to differ about the metabolic rate, there is about a 20% difference between the upper and lower range. Seen enough studies pointing at that. I got some documentaries to support it if you are interested. But still, if you know you got a slower rate just eat less.

studies or trials?

[cowslip]

Finally it seems that many of the posters here have either little or incorrect medical knowledge and have grasped at all sorts of fads and misconceptions about diet and how to lose and then maintain weight.

forget about "miracle' diets and "cures" or specific substances......what you need to do in the end is eat less.....forever.

That is rather a silly statement and very simplistic. Sure eating less for overweight or fat people is probably prudent but there is much more to health that just weight.

Many many diseases are caused by lack of certain vitamins or minerals in the system or indeed certain weaknesses that need to be addressed to ensure optimal health.

I wouldnt depend on the established medical community to help you with this as most doctors know very little about nutrition and certainly not how to diagnose the status of different peoples nutritional needs.

For this you need to see a good naturopath or perhaps a Chinese doctor or the like who have extensive knowledge in this area.

I suspect quackery has influenced this answer.

[Tolley]

Finally it seems that many of the posters here have either little or incorrect medical knowledge and have grasped at all sorts of fads and misconceptions about diet and how to lose and then maintain weight.

forget about "miracle' diets and "cures" or specific substances......what you need to do in the end is eat less.....forever.

That is rather a silly statement and very simplistic. Sure eating less for overweight or fat people is probably prudent but there is much more to health that just weight.

Many many diseases are caused by lack of certain vitamins or minerals in the system or indeed certain weaknesses that need to be addressed to ensure optimal health.

I wouldnt depend on the established medical community to help you with this as most doctors know very little about nutrition and certainly not how to diagnose the status of different peoples nutritional needs.

For this you need to see a good naturopath or perhaps a Chinese doctor or the like who have extensive knowledge in this area.

I suspect quackery has influenced this answer.

I suggest you open your eyes.

[robblok]

I beg to differ about the metabolic rate, there is about a 20% difference between the upper and lower range. Seen enough studies pointing at that. I got some documentaries to support it if you are interested. But still, if you know you got a slower rate just eat less.

studies or trials?

Are you interested... if so ill send you some documentaries. I mean genuinely interested to broaden your perception. I can send them by dropbox, they are done by the BBC. Quite interesting.

Some people just have to work harder to get the same results. Does not mean its an excuse to do nothing.

[laislica]

Finally it seems that many of the posters here have either little or incorrect medical knowledge and have grasped at all sorts of fads and misconceptions about diet and how to lose and then maintain weight.

forget about "miracle' diets and "cures" or specific substances......what you need to do in the end is eat less.....forever.

That is rather a silly statement and very simplistic. Sure eating less for overweight or fat people is probably prudent but there is much more to health that just weight.

Many many diseases are caused by lack of certain vitamins or minerals in the system or indeed certain weaknesses that need to be addressed to ensure optimal health.

I wouldnt depend on the established medical community to help you with this as most doctors know very little about nutrition and certainly not how to diagnose the status of different peoples nutritional needs.

For this you need to see a good naturopath or perhaps a Chinese doctor or the like who have extensive knowledge in this area.

I suspect quackery has influenced this answer.

I suggest you open your eyes.

Not wishing to cause trouble but IMHO

Doctors are trained in the use of surgery and BigPharma drugs and know next to nothing about nutrition.

They have nutritionists for that skill.

Doctors try to alleviate discomfort, reduce/remove symptoms with the tools that BigPharma give them.

They do not seem to set out to cure the actual illness but it is not necessarily their fault.

On the other hand, Alternatives set out to find the root of the problem and fix that, then the problems go away naturally.

I can say this because I had a long term partner who was a certified nutritionist and certified in acupuncture and herbal remedies.

If she was unable to fix the cause, she would suggest a different specialist who may be able to help. Their system worked well but they did not get rich because, once cured, their patients had no reason to return!

This is just a personal observation and I saw many local people cured by her.

As a personal example. In my early 40's I was diagnosed with high BP and put on meds with no options.

Years later I changed life style and lost weight.

My BP returned to acceptable levels without meds.

The Doctor said "Well done"!

I queried this and he said that I had done the right thing to get cured and when I asked why he said that the original Dr should have explained that but that in the past, he had probably tried but failed to get the patient to make the necessary changes. So now they just hand out the pills because the public just want an easy fix.

There is a website called quackwatch and it tries very hard to discredit any "Alternative Cures".

If you look deeper the author is sponsored by BigPharma. It's all about money.

But I think I may have strayed off topic a bit.

Sorry.

[cowslip]

Many people are very confused as to what "Big Pharma" actually is and who those who expose both "quackery" AND "Big Pharma" actually are and do.

The first thing to note about overweight people who take up alternative "cures" for obesity is that in general they are still fat!

[laislica]

Many people are very confused as to what "Big Pharma" actually is and who those who expose both "quackery" AND "Big Pharma" actually are and do.

The first thing to note about overweight people who take up alternative "cures" for obesity is that in general they are still fat!

Yes, sorry, I rather drifted off topic.

I did not mean to support "treatment" to lose weight.

Assuming there are no medical reasons, proper nutrition exercise, rest and happiness is the "cure" for being overweight.

[laislica]

How Low Fat Labels seduce us.

1) You think it's healthy and eat more.

2) You lose guilt and eat more. Guilt can be good and stops you eating more.

3) You drop your guard re portion size and eat more.

[cowslip]

BTW - I am a nutritionist .........

[laislica]

BTW - I am a nutritionist .........

Well, what can I say - Nothing, from now on I'll try to have ten ears and one mouth.

Nah, I could never do that, being such an opinionated person Jack of all trades, master of none! I was an indentured apprentice though, started work on 15th April 1957, completed my apprenticeship before moving on with the ONC, HNC + endorsements. Oh and a radio amateurs exam. Oops forgot the City & Guilds Certification that proved I could read the 1957 IEE Regulations LOL.

What I am trying to say here is that although I have no formal qualifications in these specific subjects, I have done lots of reading, watching, observing over the years. You know, the university of life (hard knocks?)

So I don´t mind sticking my neck out now and again, I do hope you understand and are not offended.

It is actually very nice to have someone here who really does know what they are talking about though.

Robblok sent me a couple of very interesting BBC Horizon videos and I now know the answer!

Gastric bypass!

Wow, what an amazing documentary. It bursts through all our old misconceptions and uses science with Ghrelin and Leptin hormones, MRI brain scans, comparisons between obese and normal weight people etc.

Surprisingly, the By Pass surgery seems more to do with changing the brains response to food than reducing the efficiency of the stomach/gut to cause less calories to be ingested.

However, I guess you may already know this.

(I say that in jest cause my partner knew everything he he)

Having said that, she was brilliant at what she did.

[tropo]

I am still fat and happy just in case you thought I had forgotten you.

You keep telling yourself that often enough and you may just start believing it.

[tropo]

whatever the reason for eating, you can't get fat without actually putting food into your body; it doesn't come from nowhere. ....and in truth there is relatively VERY little variation in people's metabolic rates.

THey DO say that fat people are relatively less active than average though.

You should watch the BBC Horizon documentary, "Why are thin people not fat" and you may change your mind. In an experimental month where a group of thin people ate 35,000 calories per week there was a big difference in the amount of weight they gained. They weren't allowed to exercise.

The reality is there is a huge difference in people metabolic rate. My wife can attest to that - she never gets fat and her friends get fat eating less.

[tropo]

it has been suggested that over 80% of Americans are dehydrated to a greater or lesser degree, largely due to diet and eating habits, they then mistake this feeling for one of hunger and eat more as a result.

That suggestion is absurd. Who suggested it?

Edited October 20, 2012 by tropo

[tropo]

BTW - I am a nutritionist .........

OK, now explains everything.

[laislica]

BTW - I am a nutritionist .........

OK, now explains everything.

Having been with a nutritionist for more than ten years, I feel a little qualified to make comments about nutritionists.

What, pray, are your qualifications?

(Or you just moderating?)

Or is it your brand of humour?

[smokie36]

BTW - I am a nutritionist .........

OK, now explains everything.

Having been with a nutritionist for more than ten years, I feel a little qualified to make comments about nutritionists.

What, pray, are your qualifications?

(Or you just moderating?)

Or is it your brand of humour?

It is a bit much at times Tropo....

[laislica]

BTW - I am a nutritionist .........

OK, now explains everything.

Having been with a nutritionist for more than ten years, I feel a little qualified to make comments about nutritionists.

What, pray, are your qualifications?

(Or you just moderating?)

Or is it your brand of humour?

It is a bit much at times Tropo....

Hey, but we Love you anyway

[robblok]

Just an update about me, it might help others too. I count my calories and watch my food intake. However i was hungry all the time, real annoying feeling and makes it hard to concentrate. Now i was eating 2000-2300 calories on a day. So no freak diets.

Anyway i was constantly thinking of food, i still had some reduce 15mg tablets here. Before i thought they did not work. But after taking them for a few days the hunger{ feeling is gone. I actually have to remind myself to eat. (much better).

Just one note, it could be that im sick because been feeling not that great the last couple of days headaches and such. But i will keep you guys informed. If this really helps it would be great for me. I keep my to diet, but this way it would be a bit more comfortable.

Results a few days later, i found that there are side effects to this product. My heartrate went up around 5 higher then normal beats (when exercising). I do a lot of rowing and monitor my heartrate that is how i knew. Also it has a bit of impact on my sleeping, though i never sleep that good anyway.

It really did help against hunger and i will certainly use it when i go on my anual holliday in the south. I am constantly bombarded with food then and it would be nice to resist that. Here at home i decided that the hunger feeling and my subsequent craving for blue berries is not slowing my progress enough to warrant the tablets. (for now) They are a powerful tool. Later i read they are banned in the USA.

Just to let people know there are side effects to them. I always check if i can accept side effects of something i do. This time it affected my rowing too much and i like my nights rest in this busy period.

[robblok]

whatever the reason for eating, you can't get fat without actually putting food into your body; it doesn't come from nowhere. ....and in truth there is relatively VERY little variation in people's metabolic rates.

THey DO say that fat people are relatively less active than average though.

You should watch the BBC Horizon documentary, "Why are thin people not fat" and you may change your mind. In an experimental month where a group of thin people ate 35,000 calories per week there was a big difference in the amount of weight they gained. They weren't allowed to exercise.

The reality is there is a huge difference in people metabolic rate. My wife can attest to that - she never gets fat and her friends get fat eating less.

I am the one who gave you the documentary, i don't feel it should be used as an excuse to do nothing. But it certainly does mean that for some people its a lot harder to loose or gain weight then for others.

I did offer the user this documentary too however he / she did not seem to be interested in it.

[cowslip]

People's metabolic rates are basically the same. I think some people are confused by what they saw on the TV.

THe changes in ability to deal with fat are down to other factors that can affect our metabolic rates.

Overweight people can of course be sporty but there overall lifestyle can me relatively inactive.

There was a very interesting program on Horizon about our genetic propensity to lose weight, and they were proposing about 3 minutes intense exercise a day to achieve this.

What you also need to be aware of is the difference between a study and a trial.

[cowslip]

BTW - I am a nutritionist .........

OK, now explains everything.

Having been with a nutritionist for more than ten years, I feel a little qualified to make comments about nutritionists.

What, pray, are your qualifications?

(Or you just moderating?)

Or is it your brand of humour?

It is a bit much at times Tropo....

...10 years.....and are you still overweight?

[cowslip]

May I also suggest that rather than worry about my qualifications, some people should to a LONG HARD LOOK at the qualifications of the nutritionists that they are being treated or advised by.

[cowslip]

As a nutritionist I of course don't practice in THailand, I don't have or intend to apply for the correct visas, permits etc., however I can practice in the US or UK. If I return I may consider setting up a practice there.....

[tropo]

BTW - I am a nutritionist .........

OK, now explains everything.

Having been with a nutritionist for more than ten years, I feel a little qualified to make comments about nutritionists.

What, pray, are your qualifications?

(Or you just moderating?)

Or is it your brand of humour?

I'll judge you on what you have to add to the debate, not on what your qualifications are. It's a level playing field here - no need to tell us how qualified you think you are.

Your style of debate amounts to: "hey, I know what I'm talking about because I'm qualified - how qualified are you?".

Sorry, that doesn't cut it here.