Ceiling Fan Installation On "gipsum Ceiling"

[nullx8]

I asked the same question in the general forum, but got the usual non-productive responses.

I was told its better to give it a try here.

So here iam

I bought a ceiling fan. But my misstake was to to check the ceiling before doing this,

It turns out that there is about 60cm distance between the gipsum ceiling and the concrete plate.

Mounting on the ceiling is not an option, since i dont have installed the ceiling myself and iam not willing to get any suprises left by some thai-engineers

Also i dont want the vibration generate noise.

So the idea is to mount somethings on the concrete plate, reaching to the ceiling to mountthe fan there.

The gipsum is "one piece style" and i do not own the house, so i want to destoy as little as possible of the original ceiling.

Does anyone have an idea on how to do this or (even better) can do it for me, or know someone can do it ?

(In southeast bkk)

Cheers mario

Attached some photos

[kamalabob2]

There is an EXCELLENT fan manufacturing company, based in Taiwan, that has a factory in Thailand, and at least three brands sold in every province of Thailand. They have a three story showroom in Bangkok, and do offer professional installation and repairs. They came all the way to Buriram province to correct the botched initial installation done by a Buriram cowboy electrician. It was worth the money to have this team re-install the fans correctly at what I considered a fair price. None of the fans have failed or gone off the reservation since the team of "CEI" did the repairs and re-installation. This same company has been an OEM manufacturer of many US and European brands including Hunter Fans. Hence we have some Hunter fans in our home.

http://www.ceifan.com/index.php?langtype=en&pageid=en_11 or www.ceifan.com

[Ackybang]

Hello nullx8,

Probably not the most professional of approaches, but nevertheless a 'fix' that will last a long time, with your current predicament, and save you a lot of p**sing about. Usually there should be a suspended, levelled framework of aluminium that the gypsum will be screwed to. If you stick your head through the hole, and look - you should see it - it will be laid out in a grid system.

What you might consider doing is getting a piece of wood, or plywood - perhaps 1/2 to 3/4 inch thick, and forming it, then laying it ontop of the grid of aluminium, centered just above where you want to place your fan - cut it long and wide enough so it is amply supported, and has it's own weight, and will bear the weight of the fan spread out evenly over the grid - (if the gridwork is 60 x 60 cm, you might want your wood supported by 2 - 4 crossmembers). Drill a hole in the wood for your existing wires, and pull them through, then replace the gypsum. Depending on the fan fixture, perhaps drill small pilot holes through the gypsum, into the wood for the fitting, to facilitate screwing into it easier - once the screws bite, you're laughing - use decent woodscrews, and secure them tightly. I guarantee, no vibration / noise above the ordinary, and a solid fit that will last for Years. Perhaps treat the wood, if you're worried about termites.

Good luck !

Edited December 2, 2012 by Ackybang

[Crossy]

The original thread is here http://www.thaivisa....39#entry5895739

The ideal solution is to use an extension tube on the fan mount and bolt the mount to the concrete structure, but if that's not possible there is really no reason you can't mount on the suspended ceiling itself, provided you take precautions to spread the load.

The Thai 'gypsum' ceilings are much stronger than they at first appear and the option of placing wood supports across the grid to spread the load is actually a good one. Do ensure they are fixed to the grid so your fan doesn't vibrate the wood off the aluminium. Dropping a plywood insert in to one of the squares is also a viable option, just be sure it is resting on the aluminium T section and won't move off.

Be sure to balance your fan using the supplied weights, this will significantly reduce vibration and hence reduce the load on the supports. We used Wifeys kitchen scale and some small coins after the original workers 'lost' the self adhesive weights.

[David48]

...Hence we have some Hunter fans in our home.

http://www.ceifan.co...&pageid=en_11 or www.ceifan.com

They look like they have some interesting products.

[nullx8]

Actually the "wood idea" is pretty good and simple as well.

I think i will just try that for a start since its simple to accomplish.

The hole is still very small, i wont get the head inside, but you can see the structure materials on one of the photos,

I just have to figute how far is the next one, thats simple to do.

Just afraid then about the noise.

In the secound floor is the same ceiling, opening harsch the bedroom door makes a scary noise from the pressured air builds up. (The ownside of having quality windows haha)

Ill give the wood idea a try and test the noise.

The fan company website looks really interesting as well. Maybe they have some universal extentions or somethings.

[nullx8]

David48 was right, much better response here.

Does this borad have some iq filter to access it ?

[linno2]

One other option if it turns out that there are problems with the ceiling support could be to use high rating building adhesive to stick a mounting bracket or wood block to the concrete ceiling that reached down to the height of the ceiling - you could hold it in place until it sets by using a pole from the floor to the base of the mounting. I have seen the capacity of these adhesives in a demolition - the block of wood had a chunk of concrete still attached - in other words the bond between the wood and concrete was stronger than the bond within the structure of the concrete. Some high performance exotic cars are also 'glued' together in some places these days as well (as per doco on Discovery channel). Good luck and let us know the outcome.

[bbradsby]

One other option if it turns out that there are problems with the ceiling support could be to use high rating building adhesive to stick a mounting bracket or wood block to the concrete ceiling that reached down to the height of the ceiling [snip]

DANGER, DANGER WILL ROGERS!!!

much concrete construction uses a form-release chemical that is left on the concrete if it is intended to be concealed, no finish applied later. It will impede the bond of many chemicals/coatings. We wouldn't want to depend on it to hold up a heavy metal object over our bed, complete with rotating blades, if we'd appreciate a sound night's sleep, now would we?!

[Ackybang]

Sorry man, looking at my original post, I forgot to say and couldn't edit.

It probably needs no explanation, but when you replace the gypsum, bridge / fill the gap between wood and ceiling where you want to screw into with another small piece of gypsum - you should find the gypsum is the perfect thickness of the aluminium frame, so you can screw in tight, without fracturing the ceiling in any way. I've fixed a number of fans this way, and just left the wood free floating above the frame - as long as the wood is long enough, and you screw into it snugly, it's in no danger of vibrating loose.

I don't know if it's me, but I only seem to find the metal bladed fans are noisy, and tend to vibrate a lot after time. I tend to use the wooden 'effect' 5 bladed ceiling fans, as I prefer them in terms of aesthetics, and all the ones I've fitted have been silent running, and had no issues with vibration. All came with a suspended 'horseshoe' type fitting, that you screw into the ceiling first, where the actual fan motor had an attached pole with a ball on the end, that you lift into and then drop into the fitting from the side - it just hangs under it's own weight, and can swing around freely, like a universal / ball joint. I'm not sure this compensates for any vibration ? Actually, thinking about it, none of them needed balancing, or came with any additional weights to do so. Whatever fans you are using, I would recommend cleaning the blades at least every 6 Months or so, as the dirt / dust build up can knock them off balance, as can rust.

Once again - good luck !

Edited December 2, 2012 by Ackybang

[linno2]

One other option if it turns out that there are problems with the ceiling support could be to use high rating building adhesive to stick a mounting bracket or wood block to the concrete ceiling that reached down to the height of the ceiling [snip]

DANGER, DANGER WILL ROGERS!!!

much concrete construction uses a form-release chemical that is left on the concrete if it is intended to be concealed, no finish applied later. It will impede the bond of many chemicals/coatings. We wouldn't want to depend on it to hold up a heavy metal object over our bed, complete with rotating blades, if we'd appreciate a sound night's sleep, now would we?!

Yes understand!! In my place no form release chemical - just rough cast concrete with some remaining bits of wood! It was not a new house when I bought it! Cheers!

[bbradsby]

One other option if it turns out that there are problems with the ceiling support could be to use high rating building adhesive to stick a mounting bracket or wood block to the concrete ceiling that reached down to the height of the ceiling [snip]

DANGER, DANGER WILL ROGERS!!!

much concrete construction uses a form-release chemical that is left on the concrete if it is intended to be concealed, no finish applied later. It will impede the bond of many chemicals/coatings. We wouldn't want to depend on it to hold up a heavy metal object over our bed, complete with rotating blades, if we'd appreciate a sound night's sleep, now would we?!

Yes understand!! In my place no form release chemical - just rough cast concrete with some remaining bits of wood! It was not a new house when I bought it! Cheers!

sorry, dude. didn't mean to offend you. my post was meant more to warn unsuspecting folks about the danger if they don't know about form release chemicals - only construction pros usually know about this stuff. When I see all the cheap, unbalanced fans in LoS that wiggle around and shake the ceiling, as an architect, I can't stop thinking about what's actually holding them up and it would do if one fell on someone.

[sirineou]

The OP said:

Posted Yesterday, 19:17

I asked the same question in the general forum, but got the usual non-productive responses.

I was told its better to give it a try here

Hey!! I told you exactly how you need to do ir and even took the time to draw you a diagram ( see copy below)

you are welcome

Posted Yesterday, 15:42

From your picture I can see that there are metal studs that support the drywall ceiling. the metal studs are strong enough to support the weight of the drywall ceiling, so they strong enough to support a cooling fan.

Simply screw a wide metal stud, bridging two of the drywall supporting metal studs,(if you dont have a wide metal stud , use two of the same narrow metal studs they used to frame your ceiling) and on this bridging metal stud or studs, mount your ceiling fan electrical box.You can use self tapping screws to do that.

Edited December 2, 2012 by sirineou

[Langsuan Man]

Here is what I had to do to install three ceiling fans. Had to cut the "gypsum" ceiling and attach an extension bar to the cement ceiling above. The fans were then hung on these extensions and the ceiling repaired. Basically the same process for the upstairs fans but instead a attaching to the cement was able to attach to the steel ceiling trusses

[David48]

David48 was right, much better response here.

Does this borad have some iq filter to access it ?

Many have said that the strength of Thai Visa are the sub-forums.

The Visa, Medical, Farming Forums also rate highly.

.

[nullx8]

Hey!! I told you exactly how you need to do ir and even took the time to draw you a diagram ( see copy below)

Oh, forgive me, at this time i probably removed the notification on the general forum already.

I will do somthings you did propose, i just getting the metal pipe made longer to cover the 60cm to the ceiling.

I just have to figure out a way mounting all this trough a 10x10cm hole ..

[nullx8]

On the other hand, tearing down a bigger part of the original ceiling could offer me the chance to insert another wire, to get the wall-remote working (i really hate this chains hanging down from the fan inviting peoples to destroy them ...

Still thinking about that.

On a sidenote, does anyone know someone can fix the ceiling properly ?

I mean i can fix it myself, but it wont look nice then

[sirineou]

Hey!! I told you exactly how you need to do ir and even took the time to draw you a diagram ( see copy below)

Oh, forgive me, at this time i probably removed the notification on the general forum already.

I will do somthings you did propose, i just getting the metal pipe made longer to cover the 60cm to the ceiling.

I just have to figure out a way mounting all this trough a 10x10cm hole ..

you don't need to work through 10x10 cm cm hole in the ceiling, cut a square piece of drywall about 24 x 24 inch, ( or what ever size you need as long as it is smaller than the metal studs supporting the drywall).you can use a utility knife to cut the drywall.

do not throw the piece you cut , out , you will be using it to close the hole.

do all the bridging and electrical work you need to do.

then take a piece of wood , like a 2x4 by what ever length the hole is plus a few inches longer and place it on top of the hole half of it sticking in the hole

see sketch

screw wood in to ceiling drywall

replace drywall piece that you removed in the hole and screw in to the wood

tape and plaster

[sirineou]

On a sidenote, does anyone know someone can fix the ceiling properly ?

I mean i can fix it myself, but it wont look nice then

This is a youtube video on drywall taping

go yo you tube and do a search for drywall repair, or taping.

a lot of good info there

remember if you are not sure of your self, when doing drywall repairs do thin coats of joint compound it might take you a little longer to finish, but in the end it will come out perfect..

[sezze]

Whats wrong with the anchorbolt and chain or wire ?? I did not see that answer here , and that is what most people would use . A anchorbolt fixed in the solid structure above , and a piece of 3mm steel wire or small chain and will never go out or loose .

[Langsuan Man]

Whats wrong with the anchorbolt and chain or wire ?? I did not see that answer here , and that is what most people would use . A anchorbolt fixed in the solid structure above , and a piece of 3mm steel wire or small chain and will never go out or loose .

You need the bar for rigidity, if you try a chain or wire the oscillation of the fan will continue to enlarge the hole

On the other hand, tearing down a bigger part of the original ceiling could offer me the chance to insert another wire, to get the wall-remote working (i really hate this chains hanging down from the fan inviting peoples to destroy them ...

No need to hardwire the wall remote, you should be able to purchase an add on wireless remote, which only requires a receiver to be installed in the bottom of the fan

[sezze]

Whats wrong with the anchorbolt and chain or wire ?? I did not see that answer here , and that is what most people would use . A anchorbolt fixed in the solid structure above , and a piece of 3mm steel wire or small chain and will never go out or loose .

You need the bar for rigidity, if you try a chain or wire the oscillation of the fan will continue to enlarge the hole

On the other hand, tearing down a bigger part of the original ceiling could offer me the chance to insert another wire, to get the wall-remote working (i really hate this chains hanging down from the fan inviting peoples to destroy them ...

No need to hardwire the wall remote, you should be able to purchase an add on wireless remote, which only requires a receiver to be installed in the bottom of the fan

Got 4 ceiling fans in 3 rooms . 3 are on most of the time . They are fitted to the roof with a steel wire ( cable ) of 3mm each being about 1.5 m long ( a lot higher then your contrete ceiling above ) . They do not wobble and do not cause vibration . A properly installedv ceiling fan does not wobble and the gypsum ceiling does not wear out when it doesn't wobble .

[David48]

In the other thread, referring to the Summer/Winter or reversing switch, I wrote ...

Different applications and different uses for all ... but just so that you know ... that 'little switch' which you refer to is used in cooler climates to run the fan in Winter!

I know it seems contrary to logic to run the fan in winter, but remember that hot air rises and if the fan is switched on in reverse (slowly) then it gentle circulates the rising warm air around the room.

Believe it or not ...

[David48]

Was in a large government building yesterday, a hospital, and they all used the steel tube method though the ceiling and attached to the concrete above.

.

[linno2]

I have, and like ceiling fans - I suppose the other option, apologies if already mentioned, is to get a wall mounted one. My wife prefers this over the ceiling fan - easier to clean and not so prone to wobbling. Cheers!