Thaksin 'urges Yingluck to stay' as Prayuth demurs

[rametindallas]

I find it very difficult to believe that the rest of the world would accept Yingluck being held accountable if "something happens". What kind of rubbish is this? Thailand would become (even more of) an international laughing stock in the event that an elected PM is held responsible for the actions of anti-democratic street thugs. That would lead to sanctions, trade embargoes, investors fleeing the country, ASEAN intervention. It's complete rubbish. Classics case of blaming the victim.

Avoiding acknowledging the 'elephant in the room' are we? The OP is about a former Thai PM, who is a convicted felon living abroad to escape a prison term, ruling through his baby sister and telling her what to do in every circumstance.

[jayjay49]

It's a crazy country, where the democratic processs is frustrated, where protests turn into a party, where authorities allow protesters to build barricades, where families seem to rule, where yellow and red are like black and white, where corruption is part of society, where buddhism doesn't make people more understanding, where the monarchy is ruling, but not to be discussed, where political parties refuse to talk, where a win-win solution seems hard to find, where the smile turns grim, where their could be paradise, if only .................................................... Thailand, I should pray for you! Chokdee!

Getting more specific. The whole country is/was like a puppet-on-a-string. The Sutheps and Abhesits from this world also seem to think that they are like the gods, both have been proven corrupt, both are surrounded by a lot of family-members from their clans. Democracy is far to be found if the ' Aristocrat (?) families keep on ruling Thailand. Then corruption will stay part of society. I wish a mediator would bring parties to the negotiating table and look for win-win solutions and strong actions against corruption. All corrupt politicians should be banned for live. ...........I have a dream, perhaps a dream dreamt by more people in the past.

[mojorison]

I find it very difficult to believe that the rest of the world would accept Yingluck being held accountable if "something happens". What kind of rubbish is this? Thailand would become (even more of) an international laughing stock in the event that an elected PM is held responsible for the actions of anti-democratic street thugs. That would lead to sanctions, trade embargoes, investors fleeing the country, ASEAN intervention. It's complete rubbish. Classics case of blaming the victim.

Avoiding acknowledging the 'elephant in the room' are we? The OP is about a former Thai PM, who is a convicted felon living abroad to escape a prison term, ruling through his baby sister and telling her what to do in every circumstance.

There's too many elephants to count, comrade.

[LevelHead]

Just when I was getting to like Yingluck she goes and receives her instructions from her brother again which is one of the reasons the country is in <deleted>.

Do you have unequivocal factual evidence that she got instructions from her brother as is is reported in this article, an article which is based on unknown and unnamed sources who may be totally illegitimate and could be perpetuating lies for the purpose of propaganda, unbeknown to the writer of the article and the editor at the Nation ?

I generally ignore any unnamed source articles in the Thai press.

Name the name and make the person libel to libel or defamation if its false............ and if the person is unwilling to be named, ignore it.

[LevelHead]

I find it very difficult to believe that the rest of the world would accept Yingluck being held accountable if "something happens". What kind of rubbish is this? Thailand would become (even more of) an international laughing stock in the event that an elected PM is held responsible for the actions of anti-democratic street thugs. That would lead to sanctions, trade embargoes, investors fleeing the country, ASEAN intervention. It's complete rubbish. Classics case of blaming the victim.

Avoiding acknowledging the 'elephant in the room' are we? The OP is about a former Thai PM, who is a convicted felon living abroad to escape a prison term, ruling through his baby sister and telling her what to do in every circumstance.

I am confused here a little, perhaps someone can help ? I am referencing to the bold type above about the convicted felon.

Thaksin was convicted because his former wife committed an offense and purchased land from the government - is this correct ?

But the former wife of Thaksin was never actually convicted of any offense. I think the history books will show she was never actually convicted of any offense.

So, is it therefore correct that Thaksin was convicted by association to an illegal offense his former wife committed, even though she was never actually convicted of anything illegal.

Just want to be sure that in this case, nobody was convicted of any offense, apart from Thaksin for association with something that was not, it seems, illegal, according to the facts that nobody was convicted apart from him ?

Wonder if anyone can put some meat on that bone, is it correct ?

[Roadman]

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Southeast_Asia/SEA-01-130114.html

History shows way out of Thai conflict

By Jeffrey Race

Deposed former prime minister police lieutenant colonel Thaksin Shinawatra brought something new to Thailand. It is what is preventing a peaceful settlement of the conflict now raging in Bangkok's streets, and it is not his political opening to the rural underclass as the press and public commentary superficially explain.

Thanks for posting Barontt. An excellent piece by a long term observer of Thailand. More accurate that most of the latest Red tinted opinions that have been on TV.

[siampolee]

LevelHead post # 162.

Do you have unequivocal factual evidence that she got instructions from her brother as is is reported in this article, an article which is based on unknown and unnamed sources who may be totally illegitimate and could be perpetuating lies for the purpose of propaganda, unbeknown to the writer of the article and the editor at the Nation ?

I generally ignore any unnamed source articles in the Thai press

Name the name and make the person libel to libel or defamation if its false............ and if the person is unwilling to be named, ignore

Well as your name and avatar render you anonymous, unbeknownst etc. should anyone take notice of your comments?

As you seem to have set yourself up as a ''Barrack Room lawyer'' I for one would certainly forgo your dubious services concerning both libel and deformation matters.

[Gandtee]

Pinocchio lives. Her nose has not grown yet so she deserves benefit of the doubt. Meanwhile let her sing 'I've got no strings............A lovely little puppet. But she deserves more.

[kennypowers]

While I understand why people hate the Taksin family, what I don't understand is why supporters of the opposition won't wait for the democratic vote on Feb 2. Do they not realise that if the Bangkok shutdown achieves some sort of new government over the coming weeks, that same government will be accused of gaining power illegally and they'll see more protests from a new opposition within the next 2 years. The country will keep going around in circles.

Whether people like Yingluck or not, she was voted in by a majority, regardless of who her brother is. If the opposition have evidence of vote rigging/buying, then they've had plenty of time to prove this in the courts. They haven't.

I am of no political allegiance here, but it's clear the opposition don't want a democratic vote because they fear losing. However, a shutdown and potential violence could prompt a coup, in which case Yingluck or other members of her party will get the chance to run in an election at some time in the near future when the army decides to relinquish power, anyway. They'd more than likely get in again.

The smart move would be for the opposition to run a proper election campaign that appeals to the popular vote in the North and Northeast. Show the Yingluck supporter a better alternative and give them solid reason to believe they'd be better off with a new government. The current tactic of "us Vs. them" only seeks to divide and cause conflict.

The passion of the opposition is admirable, but it would appear they really haven't thought this through.

[Roadman]

It's a crazy country, where the democratic processs is frustrated, where protests turn into a party, where authorities allow protesters to build barricades, where families seem to rule, where yellow and red are like black and white, where corruption is part of society, where buddhism doesn't make people more understanding, where the monarchy is ruling, but not to be discussed, where political parties refuse to talk, where a win-win solution seems hard to find, where the smile turns grim, where their could be paradise, if only .................................................... Thailand, I should pray for you! Chokdee!

Getting more specific. The whole country is/was like a puppet-on-a-string. The Sutheps and Abhesits from this world also seem to think that they are like the gods, both have been proven corrupt, both are surrounded by a lot of family-members from their clans. Democracy is far to be found if the ' Aristocrat (?) families keep on ruling Thailand. Then corruption will stay part of society. I wish a mediator would bring parties to the negotiating table and look for win-win solutions and strong actions against corruption. All corrupt politicians should be banned for live. ...........I have a dream, perhaps a dream dreamt by more people in the past.

Welcome to the board. It's good to have new input, but when bull sh!t is being spouted then Enough is enough. You have accused Khun Abhisit of being corrupt. Can you please front up with this evidence and apart from the he said, they said over military service. Some hard fact please.

[Skywalker69]

What authority does this man have from a legal standpoint on this situation?

Could this article (if taken from statements directly from her and also possibly from the brawler himself) be an admission of associating with and acting on behalf for the benefit of a known fugitive?

If Thai law does not cover this kind of activity then perhaps it is time Thai law was modernised into the digital era to reflect this type of crime. This goes not only for dialogue between PTP and Thaksin but all other fugitives of the Kingdom - he is not the first and will not be the last unless the law is changed.

What authority does this man have from a legal standpoint on this situation?

He is the PTP`s paymaster.

[scorecard]

... "and talked via Skype with Thaksin, who said the Constitution did not allow her to resign"... "She would face a jail term, he warned."

This is hilarious. A fugitive criminal instructing the caretaker PM not to step down. Not even Monty Python could come up with comedy like this.

Well, Thaksin is Yingluck brother, right?

Just from the beginning, Thaksin for sure was the one who convinced Yingluck to run for PM. Now Yingluck is in the trouble, it is only rational to advise her on what to do.

How sweet.

[indyuk]

This article is not credible. The fact is that Suthep's attempted sedition has failed. Now Suthep's sponsors are continuing with a damage limitation campaign with a warm and friendly message.

PM Yingluck remains determined to proceed with her twin option philosophy until the election. She will not resign.

Commander in Chief of the Thai Army Prayuth Chan-ocha is a competent military officer that is known for the tough and discrete manor in which he controls the Thai Army, he simply would not speak as quoted in this article.

As for Thaksin's Skype discussion I doubt it happened.

Edited January 14, 2014 by indyuk

[ginjag]

Well done to her for not resigning, her resignation would lead to a huge void that would be filled with anything but a democratic government.

Do you mean like NOW--as in Void good there is a void, one has to think on what scale the country was being plundered in ! DAY, I would love to know. this has gone on for 3 years.

FRIGHTENING. pity for elderly-infirm-cripples-backward persons-homeless-mental hospitals-schools-hospitals-rail and road.

A government that can grab for themselves and disregard the basics here, bankrupt the country does not deserve any say in any polls or negotiations.

[Torrens54]

As I've said previously, as a guest in this country, I refrain from making direct comments on the political situation here. I leave all of that to my wife, whom I constantly urge to run for parliament.

However, I am not at all impressed with reports of the US State Department, telling Thailand to "sort out the current difficulties."

How dare those people attempt to influence Thailand ? They can't even run the US and its various War Commitments properly, as can be seen in the wake of the murder of a US Ambassador and three other Americans.

Obama and his State Department would be better-off getting to the bottom of that before attempting to lecture Thailand on what it should be doing.

No wonder America has become a laughing stock with people like Obama, Hillary Clinton and now, "Lurch" running the show.

[scorecard]

I find it very difficult to believe that the rest of the world would accept Yingluck being held accountable if "something happens". What kind of rubbish is this? Thailand would become (even more of) an international laughing stock in the event that an elected PM is held responsible for the actions of anti-democratic street thugs. That would lead to sanctions, trade embargoes, investors fleeing the country, ASEAN intervention. It's complete rubbish. Classics case of blaming the victim.

Avoiding acknowledging the 'elephant in the room' are we? The OP is about a former Thai PM, who is a convicted felon living abroad to escape a prison term, ruling through his baby sister and telling her what to do in every circumstance.

I am confused here a little, perhaps someone can help ? I am referencing to the bold type above about the convicted felon.

Thaksin was convicted because his former wife committed an offense and purchased land from the government - is this correct ?

But the former wife of Thaksin was never actually convicted of any offense. I think the history books will show she was never actually convicted of any offense.

So, is it therefore correct that Thaksin was convicted by association to an illegal offense his former wife committed, even though she was never actually convicted of anything illegal.

Just want to be sure that in this case, nobody was convicted of any offense, apart from Thaksin for association with something that was not, it seems, illegal, according to the facts that nobody was convicted apart from him ?

Wonder if anyone can put some meat on that bone, is it correct ?

Not correct.

Yes there is discussion that a Thai wife must get the permission of her husband to buy land, but that's not quite correct, it's more of a common practice (to some extent from the past) rather than the law.

Now the real reason why the paymaster got sentenced to two years in jail. He was convicted of abuse of power. In Thailand (as in probably in every other country in the world, the law totally prohibits prime ministers (and other elected folks) from both buying state property and from signing documents (as the person who must sign to sell on behalf of the state) to sell to family members.

The law is quite clear, he broke the law (no maybe), he was convicted and sentenced to 2 years in jail.

It cannot even remotely be labeled as a politically motivated case.

The case was heard and the sentence pronounced during the tenure of his own political party.

Did his then wife also break the law? Probably not, however she is a very experienced business woman including vast long-term experience in real estate and had lawyers in her employ, and there can be little doubt that she knew the appropriate laws (as mentioned above) very well, and therefore knew what was happening was illegal.

Did the beaurocrats who prepared the state documents and witnessed the paymaster signing the documents (there was a photo op and the pics appeared in newspapers) break the law? Who knows, but there can be no doubt that they knew what they were witnessing was illegal.

[billd766]

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Southeast_Asia/SEA-01-130114.html

History shows way out of Thai conflict

By Jeffrey Race

Deposed former prime minister police lieutenant colonel Thaksin Shinawatra brought something new to Thailand. It is what is preventing a peaceful settlement of the conflict now raging in Bangkok's streets, and it is not his political opening to the rural underclass as the press and public commentary superficially explain.

That was a very good link and it has made it a bit easier for me to understand the current conflict. Thank you very much.

[morpho]

Anything Thaksin says will only further inflame an already highly tense situation...on both sides!

[tingtongteesood]

And she claimed many times that she acts on her own and thinks for herself, yet once again big brother fugitive is telling her what to do....Let her quit, no jail term, just leave with all our blessings....Next, Surapong.

[tezzainoz]

I find it very difficult to believe that the rest of the world would accept Yingluck being held accountable if "something happens". What kind of rubbish is this? Thailand would become (even more of) an international laughing stock in the event that an elected PM is held responsible for the actions of anti-democratic street thugs. That would lead to sanctions, trade embargoes, investors fleeing the country, ASEAN intervention. It's complete rubbish. Classics case of blaming the victim.

So easy you forget it is yinglucks mob that held the last government reponsible for what the red shorts did

you are so one sided it showa your bias

[Muhendis]

Many people would say that what The Nation offers as fact would be veiwed by more crdible media sources as rumour, gossip, innuendo....offering one-sided, juvenile 'analysis' and presenting simplistic answers to complex questions.I no longer buy it.

I'm a bit surprised at your comment since you clearly read it here.......Aah yes of course. On here it's free.......

[Skywalker69]

Whether right or wrong...., exiled former leaders advising in "absentia"..., been happening for hundreds of years.

Not taking sides..., only pointing out a fact.

You forgot two words "convicted criminal".

[kennypowers]

And she claimed many times that she acts on her own and thinks for herself, yet once again big brother fugitive is telling her what to do....Let her quit, no jail term, just leave with all our blessings....Next, Surapong.

Why would she get a jail term? Or are you referring to her brother? She was voted in democratically. There is nothing in the constitution that says if someone in your family is a criminal that you can't be a PM. The current shutdown, however, is illegal, and should a leader be elected from the organisers, he or she would no doubt be taken to court by future opposition.

And what do you think you're going to get "next"? Who would you like to see as PM?

[Snig27]

I find it very difficult to believe that the rest of the world would accept Yingluck being held accountable if "something happens". What kind of rubbish is this? Thailand would become (even more of) an international laughing stock in the event that an elected PM is held responsible for the actions of anti-democratic street thugs. That would lead to sanctions, trade embargoes, investors fleeing the country, ASEAN intervention. It's complete rubbish. Classics case of blaming the victim.

It's The Nation - hardly a credible source. Still, it give it gives ammunition to the inevitable mindless rote repetitions of "puppet" and "man in Dubai".

[ginjag]

And she claimed many times that she acts on her own and thinks for herself, yet once again big brother fugitive is telling her what to do....Let her quit, no jail term, just leave with all our blessings....Next, Surapong.

Why would she get a jail term? Or are you referring to her brother? She was voted in democratically. There is nothing in the constitution that says if someone in your family is a criminal that you can't be a PM. The current shutdown, however, is illegal, and should a leader be elected from the organisers, he or she would no doubt be taken to court by future opposition.

And what do you think you're going to get "next"? Who would you like to see as PM?

There were some ??? prior to her being chosen as PM. also do you think the bankrupt country is anything to do with her ??? also virtually no audit on monies revealed. dismissing Thai authority decisions --3rd in the world most corrupt countries. as was stated on TVF topic I believe ???

and you said WHY would she get jail term. ??? when you get it for stealing from 7-11. here. or caught taking a drug.

[Prbkk]

Many people would say that what The Nation offers as fact would be veiwed by more crdible media sources as rumour, gossip, innuendo....offering one-sided, juvenile 'analysis' and presenting simplistic answers to complex questions.I no longer buy it.

I'm a bit surprised at your comment since you clearly read it here.......Aah yes of course. On here it's free.......

yes, you got me there, but I used to pay...

[aircarepilot]

Is the country a democracy or not? In the US there are many people, something like 49 percent, did not vote for President Obama, including me! While I do not like the man, no not because he is black, but because of his policies that are destroying my country. So taking Thailand's example, the 49 percent go out into the streets and start demonstrating until he resigns? That is not how a democracy works! It seems to me that the leader of the group of demonstrators that are shutting down Bangkok wants to take the country into a classic Chinese communist type of government. Does majority rule or not? The present government won the elections, and are the rightful elected government. The rightful elected government has every right to have the police arrest the leader or leaders of the demonstrators, and charge them with any crimes they have committed, such as insurrection, inciting a riot, etc.

As for Thaksin, he should come back to Thailand and stand trial. Hopefully it would be a fair trail based on the evidence, and not a kangaroo court or glossed over. If found guilty, then serve his sentence. this would take away a flashpoint for the present demonstrators.

In my country, the US, we have had our problems and still do have many, and are still growing and learning, hopefully from our mistakes. The one thing we have going for us is our constitution, and the rule of law.

I hope that Thailand comes out of this stronger and better as a nation, since I have decided to live there.

[JRSoul]

And she claimed many times that she acts on her own and thinks for herself, yet once again big brother fugitive is telling her what to do....Let her quit, no jail term, just leave with all our blessings....Next, Surapong.

Why would she get a jail term? Or are you referring to her brother? She was voted in democratically. There is nothing in the constitution that says if someone in your family is a criminal that you can't be a PM. The current shutdown, however, is illegal, and should a leader be elected from the organisers, he or she would no doubt be taken to court by future opposition.

And what do you think you're going to get "next"? Who would you like to see as PM?

"Why would she get a jail term?"

Do you think allowing your fugitive criminal brother access to cabinet meetings is legal?

Do you think allowing him to suborn your MPs to promote his policies is legal?

Do you think promoting his policies despite clear conflicts of interest is legal?

[kennypowers]

And she claimed many times that she acts on her own and thinks for herself, yet once again big brother fugitive is telling her what to do....Let her quit, no jail term, just leave with all our blessings....Next, Surapong.

Why would she get a jail term? Or are you referring to her brother? She was voted in democratically. There is nothing in the constitution that says if someone in your family is a criminal that you can't be a PM. The current shutdown, however, is illegal, and should a leader be elected from the organisers, he or she would no doubt be taken to court by future opposition.

And what do you think you're going to get "next"? Who would you like to see as PM?

There were some ??? prior to her being chosen as PM. also do you think the bankrupt country is anything to do with her ??? also virtually no audit on monies revealed. dismissing Thai authority decisions --3rd in the world most corrupt countries. as was stated on TVF topic I believe ???

and you said WHY would she get jail term. ??? when you get it for stealing from 7-11. here. or caught taking a drug.

As of Jan 2014 Thailand has international reserves of 166 Billion USD, so I doubt it's bankrupt. But anyway, if there is evidence to convict Yingluck and her government of these crimes then the Police and the courts can act independently of the government and take action. Regardless, if Thailand wants to move forward as a democracy, the PM of the country must be voted in through a fair election, not bullying tactics by a couple of ego maniacs.

I have no evidence to show but I am sure you are right in suspecting that her government have stolen money from public funds. But Thailand is a country riddled with corruption, from the local traffic policeman right up to the top of government. Do you believe Suthep could change that?

[bigbamboo]

And she claimed many times that she acts on her own and thinks for herself, yet once again big brother fugitive is telling her what to do....Let her quit, no jail term, just leave with all our blessings....Next, Surapong.

Why would she get a jail term? Or are you referring to her brother? She was voted in democratically. There is nothing in the constitution that says if someone in your family is a criminal that you can't be a PM. The current shutdown, however, is illegal, and should a leader be elected from the organisers, he or she would no doubt be taken to court by future opposition.

And what do you think you're going to get "next"? Who would you like to see as PM?

Let's see. Waoyappa is free at the moment, having handed her safe seat over to her son for safe keeping. She wouldn't let Sooty mess with her and still be walking around with a smile on his face. Then there's Surapong, he has most of the key jobs already so he might as well be PM too. Then there's Oak, he's a smart, honest, upright chap you can trust or just as qualified is young Pipe. OK, so he has no political experience but neither did his mum and look how well she's done.