Blood pressure

[ThaiHerbs]

reasons to be cautious

Pulling Back the Curtain on the Organized Crime Ring That Is the Pharmaceutical Drug Cartel

http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2013/10/16/drug-commercials-misleading.aspx

[KhunBENQ]

amlodipine 5mg x100=220bht..

Not quite that cheap today at Tesco's pharmacy.

Amlodipine, 5 mg, Berlin Pharma Bangkok (Brandname: Amlopine).

10*10 = 320 Baht,

After so many years I am still surprised what kind of medication can simply be bought over the counter.

I just bought 10 tablets of 5mg Amlodipine for 40 Baht. They are generic from the Thai company Berlin Pharm. This is the first time I used Berlin.

Rip off

Edited May 25, 2014 by KhunBENQ

[partington]

My father: had perfect blood pressure all the time all his life, it was a subject of conversation in our house. From memory, it was always 120/80 or very very close to that number. He died at 89yo but during the last approx 30 years he had a series of strokes, often many many years apart. He lost partial use of one hand, one eye went wonky (pointed off to one side), and he had short periods of recovery time where his thinking was a bit confused. Between strokes his blood pressure continued to be "normal".

One size does not fit all, we are all unique and continually changing. The above true story of my father breaks the accepted theory of high blood pressure being THE cause of strokes. It may be one of the causes for some people but I believe much more is involved.

Doug

There is NO claim that high blood pressure is THE only cause of strokes. This is a misunderstanding and is not supported by any evidence or the advice of any health authority.

This misunderstanding is so common in discussions of all health conditions with risk factors that it must be hard wired into the way people think.

If the risk of stroke is increased by high blood pressure, this just means you are more likely to have a stroke if your blood pressure is high.

It does NOT mean ( and never is claimed to mean):

1. If you have high blood pressure you will always get a stroke

2. High blood pressure is the only cause of strokes so if you don't have high blood pressure you will never get a stroke.

Think of it this way. Not looking both ways before you cross the road increases your risk of being run over. Do you believe this?

Then do you also believe:

1. If you do not not look both ways before you cross the road you will always be run over

2. If you look both ways before crossing the road you will never get run over

Of course not, it's just common sense...

Health risks are risks not certainties. The vast majority of health problems do NOT have a single cause, almost none do. For example strokes can be triggered by congenital weakness in a blood vessel in the brain. This can occur in the absence of abnormal blood pressure. Does this mean abnormal blood pressure isn't important? NO.

Edited May 25, 2014 by partington

[arjunadawn]

Thats not his own "medical standards" but an ongoing dispute about the acceptable values.

Those who determine the values/standards are not independent reseachers. but sit in the boards of the pharmaceutical companies or earning otherwise from these companies.

I read that they want to lower the values even further, Everyone above 130: take pills!

What a chance...

Actually, not at all true. "Those who dteterine values/standards" are government health agencies/expert panels and do not work for/get paid for -- let alone "sit on the boards of" -- pharmaceutical companies.

And they do not recommend that everyone with a systolic over 130 -- or any other number - "take pills".

Lifestyle modifications -- weight loss, exercise and sodium restriction -- are universally recommended as the first step in managing hypertension with medication reserved for those in whom these measures are insufficient.

130 falls into what is currently considered "pre-hypertension". This will almost always respond to just lifestyle modification.

Sheryl, its genuinely a pleasure to read your posts. Thank you! Edited May 26, 2014 by arjunadawn

[bunnydrops]

I got an Omran fully automatic for around 1600 Baht at Boots.

Omron

What we have (Omron HEM-7211):

http://www.ddmedicalshop.com/index.php?route=product/product&keyword=HEM-7211&category_id=0&product_id=116

I have ordered it online. 3090 Baht. Paid too much?

Model overview:

http://www.ddmedicalshop.com/index.php?route=product/category&path=59

I am considering buying one of these myself. I would suggest that any time you visit a doctor and have your BP taken you bring along the home unit and test at the same time. This will allow you to establish a calibration number to adjust the reading of the home unit. I intend to do this any time I have my BP taken by a proffesional.

As long as the doctor/nurse is using a sphygmomanometer with a mercury column, which is the gold standard. All the hospitals I have been visited here use a mechanical device themselves which may or may not have been calibrated recently. If you request a sphygmomanometer though, they will likely accommodate you.

My last stay at the hospital showed my BP high using one of the mechanical devices. They brought in old mercury column type and it showed normal. Hers is a question. I have heard that taking the BP a second time (mechanical) right after the first will give a wrong lower reading. I have seen this for myself about the lower reading, but is it wrong?

[Sheryl]

Yes, it is wrong.

A repeat BP measurement, however taken, will not result in an inaccurately low reading. On the other hand, if the high reading was due ti nervousness at being in the hospital/having BP taken, by a second reading this effect will often be reduced.

Many people have elevated BP readings in hospitals/doctor's offices but normal at home, the so called "white coat syndrome". Simplest way to know is to buy your own monitoring device and measure at home, at rest.

[ginglee]

_{Before trying meds....try- increase exercise, lower salt intake, and take celery 'SEED' extract.....}

[ravip]

Do NOT fool around with blood pressure.

THIS is NOT the place to find the solution.

GO visit a doctor.

HBP = Silent killer.

The answers here will drive your pressure beyond all limits that even THAI drivers could not achieve.

[Kalbo]

I think I pay less than ฿10 a tablet for 5mg of amlodipine at a family pharmacy in a district town in Isaan. I would say your wife is paying way to much. If she is farang they are charging her a farang price. I had a pharmacy in my local town try to do that to me, I went down the street and never went back.

Sent from my i-mobile IQ 6 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Amlopine 5mg (generic Amlodipine) varies between B45-B60 for a strip of 10 tablets in Bangkok

[glcdc]

In order to get the right answers we must ask the right questions..what pills can i take will give you symptom based answers that will lead to masking an underlying problem..Asking a question that addresses the cause will give you solution based answers.

Chok dee

[ThaiHerbs]

http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2014/06/09/hypertension-prevention-treatment.aspx

An excellent article IMO. A bit long but covers most all the bases discussed on this thread. I copied a very small section below, but I do recommend reading the entire article which includes potential serious side effects of taking various drugs. At a minimum I suggest printing it down to read later at your leisure.

* I have to correct one error in my earlier post, my father died at 86, not 89.

* Also I likely gave the wrong impression about my average blood pressure readings. Although my bp sometimes hits 170/90 it likely averages 140-145/85-90 from past readings. Read the last sentence below about recommendations to "avoid medication until you are above 150/90". I am 66yo, slim and healthy, however I do not exercise enough.

As I mentioned there are serious side effects from taking most medications. If you are on meds read the article as it talks about that, plus there is excellent info on the internet about serious side effects of medical drugs (even the manufacturers offer that info online). Do the research, google the drug you are taking and read about side effects.

Lifestyle changes that I apply include:

- consume minimal amounts of processed foods

- only consume natural sea salt (we need salt to live) or my preferred salt is Himalayan Salt which can be purchased at Rimping and other places in Thailand listed here (I have no connection to the company, located in Pai btw)

http://www.starcrystalsalt.com/buy-in-thailand.html

Some interesting reading about salt on their homepage http://www.starcrystalsalt.com/ "talking their book" of course, but agrees with my extensive personal research over the years.

- eliminate processed sugar as much as possible, especially soda/pop. During the recent extremely hot weather I started drinking about one can a day of Schweppes Tonic Water (really picks me up in the afternoon during the heat wave) but never more than one can a day and only when heat stressed. Otherwise I do not drink pop, lots of fresh fruit tho.

- I cut back on my coffee consumption. I used to drink 2-3 cups in the morning and another cup or two in the late afternoon. I really sleep better now by only drinking coffee in the morning (before 10am).

I have been following Dr. Mercola for years and find his research outstanding! You can sign up for his free newsletters by clicking on the top right hand button on the page of his article.

Doug

http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2014/06/09/hypertension-prevention-treatment.aspx

Strategies to Prevent Hypertension

June 09, 2014 | 20,712 views

By Dr. Mercola

About one in three American adults have hypertension (high blood pressure), and according to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC),^1,2 hypertension is "the second greatest public health threat" in the US.

About half of all with hypertension have uncontrolled high blood pressure, which increases your risk for a number of more serious health problems, including heart attack, stroke, congestive heart failure, and end-stage kidney disease.³

Interestingly, 16 million Americans who take blood pressure medication still do not have their blood pressure under control⁴ — a fact that emphasizes the need for basic lifestyle changes to truly resolve this problem.

According to medical physiology textbooks, 95 percent of the causes of hypertension is idiopathic, meaning the underlying cause is unknown.

This is simply not true. Hypertension is typically a symptom of insulin and leptin resistance. And the vast majority of those who have hypertension can normalize their blood pressure without resorting to drugs. ...

...If you're between the ages of 18-59 without major health conditions, or if you're 60 or older with diabetes and/or chronic kidney disease, conventional medicine believes drug treatment is advised to begin if your blood pressure is at or above 140/90. In those over 60 who do not have diabetes or chronic kidney disease, the panel suggests delaying drug treatment until you're above 150/90. According to the JNC panel members:^{10 ...}

http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2014/06/09/hypertension-prevention-treatment.aspx

Edited June 9, 2014 by ThaiHerbs

[partington]

http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2014/06/09/hypertension-prevention-treatment.aspx

.....

I have been following Dr. Mercola for years and find his research outstanding! You can sign up for his free newsletters by clicking on the top right hand button on the page of his article.

Doug

The chief founder of the untrustworthy Mercola site, Joseph Mercola, is an ex-osteopath who is notable for his anti-scientific views. That is, he does not believe in the discovery of the truth by objective experimentation and evidence based conclusions. To say that you have followed "his research" is surprising, as as far as I can ascertain he has done no published medical research of any value at all in his entire career.

As one of the chief anti-vaccination charlatans currently writing, he must take direct responsibility for the reoccurrence of avoidable diseases like polio that is now being seen in developed countries like the US, and should spend some time roasting in hell for his part in this.

Mercola himself has been warned and fined by the US FDA for making fraudulent statements about technologies and treatments that he is selling.

He is an example of what happens when people lose their ability to think logically and follow their emotions instead of facts.

My advice: the Mercola site gives false, distorted and completely unscientific information, produced by biased people who have vested interests in doing so.

But he does sell a great vegetable washer liquid that also cleans knives!

Edited June 9, 2014 by partington

[Sheryl]

Doug,

If your BP averages 140-145/85-90, whatever you are doing is not enough. That is not a healthy range.

[cassde]

It depends your age. If he is 65 or older my physician says that is normal range.

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[Sandman77]

High just found this topic! Also have high blood pressure it begins around 3 years ago in Pattaya over songkran

For me to hot walk outside around 180 go every day to a clinic to come down

Eu doctors in my home country told

Hot temperature better then

Cool makes the venes more wide

About blood pressure testing device

Many time in Thailand some mashines

Was unable to calculate my blood

Pressure shows error after 2 minutes

Visiting 3 pharmays then it works

Callculation time very long

I bought on from Panasonic 35

€ calculates less then 50 Procent of that time a mashine here in Thailand would do !

Doctors say not measure to much

Make more fear!

Got this advice

Drink every morning a big glass of peppermint garden tea

And Avoid energy drinks!!!

[Sandman77]

Not any doctor within last 3 years found out the reason if

High bp , so why this is so difficult?

[meatboy]

amlodipine 5mg x100=220bht..

Not quite that cheap today at Tesco's pharmacy.

Amlodipine, 5 mg, Berlin Pharma Bangkok (Brandname: Amlopine).

10*10 = 320 Baht,

After so many years I am still surprised what kind of medication can simply be bought over the counter.

I just bought 10 tablets of 5mg Amlodipine for 40 Baht. They are generic from the Thai company Berlin Pharm. This is the first time I used Berlin.

Rip off

further to my last post on 19th may,amlopine[berlin] 180bht. 10x10 bought 2nd.june.

[expatsupreme]

i also recommend going to a doctor and having the right medication prescribed for your particular condition. there are more than 100 medications for high blood pressure out there; some old and some new. what's good for one individual may not be good for another.

many years ago i suddenly was having high blood pressure. my doctor prescribed Inderal. i took it for a couple of months and indeed my blood pressure returned to normal. but i also started to notice a very bizarre feeling come over me. it was like i could not express myself, if i was angry i could only sit there and hold it in. i couldn't recall names, i missed appointments and other strange things. by the time i had my follow-up appointment with the doctor 2 months later, i honestly could not remember anything that happened in my life during those couple of months -- to this day. i complained to the doctor and he said "oh, it had that effect on you". he went on to tell me that they used the drug on soldiers returning from Vietnam to literally wipe out their memory from war and reduce the symptoms from PTSD. i never took it again (or any other blood pressure medicine). my blood pressure returned to normal where it still is today, 20 years later.

omg that is scary

[expatsupreme]

I have a booklet that came with my blood pressure machine. It lists a normal rate as 140 over 90, a borderline rate as 160 over 95 and Hypertension as anything above this. This is an old machine (around 1990). I know that at that time the health authorities in North America went by those rates, as far as I can figure Thailand still does. A friend of mine once suggested that the rates were lowered because of pressure from Big Pharma, they wanted to sell more drugs. I tend to agree with him.

I completely agree, crazy americans wants to medicate you even if you have 130 BP, they are brain washed by medical pharma.

I am happy I dont live in USA, otherwise I would probablybe on meds because my BP is not 120 / 80, but little higher

But now I hear it for the first time that borderline is 160, I always thought it is 140......but I applaude that, it is certain, that Thailand is not into pushing drugs so much

[expatsupreme]

High just found this topic! Also have high blood pressure it begins around 3 years ago in Pattaya over songkran

For me to hot walk outside around 180 go every day to a clinic to come down

Eu doctors in my home country told

Hot temperature better then

Cool makes the venes more wide

About blood pressure testing device

Many time in Thailand some mashines

Was unable to calculate my blood

Pressure shows error after 2 minutes

Visiting 3 pharmays then it works

Callculation time very long

I bought on from Panasonic 35

€ calculates less then 50 Procent of that time a mashine here in Thailand would do !

Doctors say not measure to much

Make more fear!

Got this advice

Drink every morning a big glass of peppermint garden tea

And Avoid energy drinks!!!

wow, your english is just horrible, where are you from? Romania, Bulgaria; Russia?

[Sheryl]

Once again:

1. Normal ranges for BP are set by expert panels from government public health instituters. These people are nto in any way employed by or paid by "Big Pharma" in fact they are usually on rather bad terms with them

The current guidelines for BP are as follows:

Categories for Blood Pressure Levels in Adults (measured in millimeters of mercury, or mmHg)

Category

Normal: Systolic (top number) Normal Less than 120 And Diastolic (bottom number) Less than 80 Prehypertension 120–139 Or 80–89

High blood pressure Stage 1 140–159 Or 90–99 Stage 2 160 or higher Or 100 or higher

Age does not matter and it is not "OK" to have a higher BP when you are older, in fact it is especially dangerous as older people are at much greater risk of stroke etc.

Medication is not usually advised for people in the "pre-hypertensive category": as it will usually respond to lifestyle modifications.

Thailand is behind the times and tends to treat pre-hypertensive as normal. I suspect it is because Thai medical practice tends not to go in for counseling and lifestyle advise, which is what is warranted for people in that group. So they overlook it until it reaches the point where medication is indicated. Western doctors on the other hand usually will spend time advising patients to diet, exercise etc. and that is considered part of a physician's job in the West. (I find that many Thai doctors tend to assume it is a waste of time, and their training doesn't seem to emphasize it).

[Sandman77]

What exactly is allowed to eat and drink, and avoid under high blood pressure , can someone provide a overview thanks!

[Bernard Flint]

Before you start with pills, are you overweight/ obese, smoker???/ eat the wrong food, drink too much???

get stressed very quickly???

[Bernard Flint]

Once again:

1. Normal ranges for BP are set by expert panels from government public health instituters. These people are nto in any way employed by or paid by "Big Pharma" in fact they are usually on rather bad terms with them

The current guidelines for BP are as follows:

Categories for Blood Pressure Levels in Adults (measured in millimeters of mercury, or mmHg)

Category

Normal: Systolic (top number) Normal Less than 120 And Diastolic (bottom number) Less than 80 Prehypertension 120–139 Or 80–89

High blood pressure Stage 1 140–159 Or 90–99 Stage 2 160 or higher Or 100 or higher

Age does not matter and it is not "OK" to have a higher BP when you are older, in fact it is especially dangerous as older people are at much greater risk of stroke etc.

Medication is not usually advised for people in the "pre-hypertensive category": as it will usually respond to lifestyle modifications.

Thailand is behind the times and tends to treat pre-hypertensive as normal. I suspect it is because Thai medical practice tends not to go in for counseling and lifestyle advise, which is what is warranted for people in that group. So they overlook it until it reaches the point where medication is indicated. Western doctors on the other hand usually will spend time advising patients to diet, exercise etc. and that is considered part of a physician's job in the West. (I find that many Thai doctors tend to assume it is a waste of time, and their training doesn't seem to emphasize it).

122/74 and i am 62

[beau thai]

In UK many older people take dispersible aspirin daily to thin the blood a little. 75mg in uk but 80mg here and known as 'baby aspirin'

Some docs think the benefits are outweighed by the risk of stomach 'irritation' by aspirin so do your own research. I know it thins the blood as, when I had a small op, the surgeon could tell I was taking aspirin and told me I should have stopped 1 week ahead of the op. Well now I know...

So presumably if your blood is a little thinner, the heart/pump doesnt work quite so hard, and maybe alleviates higher blood pressure. Not sure though but no doubt Sheryl will advise...

[Sheryl]

What exactly is allowed to eat and drink, and avoid under high blood pressure , can someone provide a overview thanks!

1. Lose weight if at all overweight. This is probably the single most effective thing you van do and will almost always reduce the BP.

2. No added salt to food and avoid food with any sort of sodium added, which basically means most processed foods.

3. Easy on caffeine (tea, coffee, colas).

[Jip99]

What exactly is allowed to eat and drink, and avoid under high blood pressure , can someone provide a overview thanks!

1. Lose weight if at all overweight. This is probably the single most effective thing you van do and will almost always reduce the BP.

2. No added salt to food and avoid food with any sort of sodium added, which basically means most processed foods.

3. Easy on caffeine (tea, coffee, colas).

I would have expected to see smoking on that list.

[Sheryl]

You're right, of course. If a smoker - stop.

[Sandman77]

Doctors told be also people with normal weight can be affected not smoking not drinking

I have a friend he has normal weight not smoke not drink

Sport active

He never got and symptom of dizziness

Suddendly he got strong nose bleeding go to doctor and also now hbp

I heard that proberbly the industrialized food Is the problem

In Asia country's like here high blood seldom have

Because maybe the fish comes from the ocean the rice from the field and the fruit from the tree, there is nothing between in the food chain!

[lopburi3]

In UK many older people take dispersible aspirin daily to thin the blood a little. 75mg in uk but 80mg here and known as 'baby aspirin'

Some docs think the benefits are outweighed by the risk of stomach 'irritation' by aspirin so do your own research. I know it thins the blood as, when I had a small op, the surgeon could tell I was taking aspirin and told me I should have stopped 1 week ahead of the op. Well now I know...

So presumably if your blood is a little thinner, the heart/pump doesnt work quite so hard, and maybe alleviates higher blood pressure. Not sure though but no doubt Sheryl will advise...

Actually the normal blood thinning size is 81mg Aspirin here and highly advise not calling it "baby aspirin" as pharmacy will not sell for baby usage and have spent many hours trying to obtain over the years and being told 'no have' by every pharmacy asked if the word baby was used.