Military scrambles to put out fires as burn-offs are banned

[marcusd]

Why not plow under crops with a plow?

Plows are expensive, as is petrol. Most hill farmers have very few modern hand tools let alone any modern mechanical ones. And if you drive around the areas in the mountains where farmers burn, you'll soon realize that most areas are not easily accessible to mechanized equipment.

It is not possible. The rice is cut long and then thrashed and the remaining stalk is left in a pile, then burned.

The government can NOT stop the burning. I moved from Lampang to Cha-am to escape it after my daughter spent 3 nights in the hospital suffering from a lung infection last year, meanwhile her loving Grandfather is out burning the forest so he can plant more tapioca root crops. He just didn't see the connection between smoke and getting sick. There is no way to stop it. People are doing the burning in remote locations and despite the MooBahn telling everyone that they will be fined and even arrested, no one is willing to turn in their neighbor. This type of problem requires a social education program which I doubt will happen. Sad situation because kids make out the worse. Their much more susceptible to the particulates. The private hospital in Lampang had at least a dozen kids in for related problems.

From a medical perspective, the moke not only causes Asthma and sinus issues, sore eyes, reduced lung capacity, and so forth, it also aids in heart and artery hardening and clogging

So not only the young but EVERYONE and just because the smoke stops the issues with health do not. The smoke in one week here in the north causes long term problems worse than smoking for years

[craigt3365]

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/Soaring-pollution-pushes-up-sales-of-air-purifiers/articleshow/46160600.cms

For example, Bangalore's air on any given day is as toxic as the smoke from six cigarettes a day while inhaling Delhi air is equivalent to puffing 20 in a day, according to a study by the United Nations Environment Program.

http://ajw.asahi.com/article/asia/china/AJ201302030021

BEIJING--Spending a day here when smog blankets the city and the air pollution is severe is equivalent to smoking 21 cigarettes, or about a pack a day, according to a survey by a company related to the environmental industry.

[sbf]

From an agricultural perspective, burning of crop residues is not a good thing to do. With rice for example roughly half the nutrients taken up by the crop are in the grain which is removed and sold or eaten. The other half are in the straw which when burnt largely volatilizes the nutrients which mostly then disappear up in the smoke. Thailand's soils are often nutrient deficient and have little enough organic matter in them in general. The straw and other organic matter should be being returned to the soils to retain nutrient, increase organic matter and feed microorganisms. This in turn would help to maintain yields and improve soil tilth.

However it is an educational thing with the Thai farmers. Many do not realise the importance of soil micro fauna, organic matter etc. Few have regular soils tests done to any sort of standard which would be acceptable to a western farmer, they simply do not understand very much about soil, as would few of us if we had left school at 12.

This is an issue which has impacted in other parts of the world and been solved with a similarly poorly educated farmer population. For instance the Punjab area of India had a particular problem with the burning of rice straw until a few years ago, many people in hospital with respiratory problems, much as described by the OP in the north of Thailand. The reason the rice straw was burnt in Punjab was the following crop wheat had to be drilled into the ground very soon after the rice harvest to get an acceptable crop. There was a 3-4 week window from memory. So the easiest way to start the land preparation was simply to put a match to the field.

Now however there have been different technological solutions developed, including direct seed drills etc which can cut, mulch and drill into the rice straw in one pass. Any rice farmers among us know how difficult that is, rice straw is pretty tough stuff, especially glutinous rice straw. With these developments in the Punjab and a campaign to educate farmers the problems have largely been alleviated by all accounts. I am sure with some thought and effort the same could be done here

[canuckamuck]

Why not plow under crops with a plow?

Plows are expensive, as is petrol. Most hill farmers have very few modern hand tools let alone any modern mechanical ones. And if you drive around the areas in the mountains where farmers burn, you'll soon realize that most areas are not easily accessible to mechanized equipment.

I hope you are not making excuses for the burn offs? They grow crops all year round so why only burn at the same time each year? They are bloody stupid that's why

The burning coincides with the time of year that most of the foliage is dry and dormant. Good luck getting stuff to burn in August.

A liter of fuel, a machete, and a lighter is all that is required to burn a field. This is the #1 reason they burn. It's easy and cheap. Facing no penalties, not being encumbered by critical thinking, or having any concept of the bigger picture; they would be fools not to burn.

I wish it was different, but there appears to be no political will to change the situation.

[angiolo]

Is smoke pollution worse than being a all day smoker? So this Thai smoke is a killer , but noone arrested . Time to find another couple of Burmese murderers

[elgordo38]

Why not plow under crops with a plow?

You must be the 100th person on TV to say this. For the 100th time they cannot afford a plow plus burning is free and also the leftover ash is a form of fertilizer for the next crop. Some of these guys are barely existing and well in the end the burning is killing them but that's tomorrows problem. Its only today that matters

[elgordo38]

Dear Thai Farmers,

I just bought some of your mushrooms at Whole Market for $23.53. Tasty. Keep up the great work. Tomorrow I will buy another imac and thank the chinese workers for their 23 1/2 work day.

Isn't globalization great!!

Yeah and its only getting started. There are secret trade talks going on that cover 40% of global trade to the tune of 27 trillion a year. Its called the Trans Pacific something or other. They are close to signing a deal. If it follows past patterns North America will come up the big loser again. North America does not have many more jobs to out source most are gone. Robots (and underpaid humans fall into this category as well) and 3D printing will finish off the rest. What a glorious future my children and grand children and their children have to look forward to. No jobs and stale hot polluted air.

[davemos]

Perhaps with some of the money used to put out the fires and fly overs the military could choose an example village to show the others the advantages of not burning.Invite the headmen to observe and even a small incentive to stop.

[ToddinChonburi]

To darn hot for the bull to pull the plow.

[Sparkles]

Why not plow under crops with a plow?

You must be the 100th person on TV to say this. For the 100th time they cannot afford a plow plus burning is free and also the leftover ash is a form of fertilizer for the next crop. Some of these guys are barely existing and well in the end the burning is killing them but that's tomorrows problem. Its only today that matters

Ash has very little value as a "fertiliser" as you call it,mulch does,Obviously Thai farmers, on their own, can't afford a tractor and implements however why don't the Gov create local co operatives where they share the machinery on a roster basis.No point in a tractor sitting idle most of the year.This is done in many countries and obviously requires co operation and supervision but its win, win all round.

Thai agriculture seems devoid of ideas.The price of limes has gone through the roof but where are the new growers for this crop and other veges/fruit ? Thai farmers need re educating to take advantage of new technology and markets.

In Australia I saw a market for Calamondin a small cumquat like fruit very popular in the Philippines as a drink and for cooking. I was getting $7 (200 baht) a kilo wholesale 20 years ago until others caught me up.Look at the price of lemons here for the growing "falang" market. Now 30 baht each,There are other crops apart from rice which already in the past has been in oversupply.

Just need some creative and common sense imput

[chiang mai]

Why not plow under crops with a plow?

Plows are expensive, as is petrol. Most hill farmers have very few modern hand tools let alone any modern mechanical ones. And if you drive around the areas in the mountains where farmers burn, you'll soon realize that most areas are not easily accessible to mechanized equipment.

I hope you are not making excuses for the burn offs? They grow crops all year round so why only burn at the same time each year? They are bloody stupid that's why

You can read it as an excuse or simple as the reasonable fact that it is, up to you. As for the year round part: crops only grow when there is water available, the dry season doesn't meet that criteria, it's therefore a good time for unproductive land to be made ready for production once again.

BTW have you ever been into the mountains/hills in the north to see these things for yourself.

[philw]

I've been driving Chiangmai to Maisot 3-4 times a month since Jan.

There are stretches where it seems 100's of km are on fire.

The hill ( a gentle description) between Tak and MS has been on fire since January and there is no way to get fire trucks into it.

The only way to extinguish the fires is from the air.

Occasionally you see small teams of 4-5 guys with a backpack sized water container and small hose trying to tackle what is effectively a forest fire.

It really is pissing into the wind.

They just do not have the necessary kit.

Meanwhile, the Vigens operate well, the aircraft carrier is doing a useful job and let's get a couple of submarines.......

I am sure a large proportion of this problem, enough to save peoples lives, could be solved with only a little bit of political will and decision making.

I would think it quite possible to lease the necessary aircraft from neighbouring countries and Australia, who probably has the best bush fighting expertise on the planet.

To the Thai bashers on this thread, I would say don't blame the Thai people, blame the system that exists.

Nobody wants to breathe shit like this, nobody.

Edited March 21, 2015 by philw

[petedk]

As usual too little,TOO LATE,and it will be the same next year

and the year after and ........

regards Worgeordie

Luckily it's really all Myanmar's fault.

Seriously, that is what my Thai friend in Chiang Mai says.

Thais don't burn. It all comes from Myanmar.

[marcusd]

Why not plow under crops with a plow?

Plows are expensive, as is petrol. Most hill farmers have very few modern hand tools let alone any modern mechanical ones. And if you drive around the areas in the mountains where farmers burn, you'll soon realize that most areas are not easily accessible to mechanized equipment.

I hope you are not making excuses for the burn offs? They grow crops all year round so why only burn at the same time each year? They are bloody stupid that's why

You can read it as an excuse or simple as the reasonable fact that it is, up to you. As for the year round part: crops only grow when there is water available, the dry season doesn't meet that criteria, it's therefore a good time for unproductive land to be made ready for production once again.

BTW have you ever been into the mountains/hills in the north to see these things for yourself.

Yes many times and I also have flown over all the areas. There are ways to stop this simple. Government to plow the fields FREE and make sure they supply EVERYTHING including LOCAL labour and more than 5 people to do it!. provide some FREE fertilizer - and do it on a roster so each farmer area KNOWS when it is their tune and to get this money by charging a few baht BED TAX on all hotels and Condo apartment blocks that are rented out.

AND MAKE THE VILLAGE HEADS )I CANT SPELL POO YA BAAN!) tell everyone on those damned speakers throughout the season! And anyone caught with FIRE on their property to face stiff monetary penalties and or including SEIZURE of their land!!

it would stop in a week!

then there would be all year round tourism with people being able to see the lovely spring and summer flowers instead of smoke!

[canuckamuck]

Plows are expensive, as is petrol. Most hill farmers have very few modern hand tools let alone any modern mechanical ones. And if you drive around the areas in the mountains where farmers burn, you'll soon realize that most areas are not easily accessible to mechanized equipment.

I hope you are not making excuses for the burn offs? They grow crops all year round so why only burn at the same time each year? They are bloody stupid that's why

You can read it as an excuse or simple as the reasonable fact that it is, up to you. As for the year round part: crops only grow when there is water available, the dry season doesn't meet that criteria, it's therefore a good time for unproductive land to be made ready for production once again.

BTW have you ever been into the mountains/hills in the north to see these things for yourself.

Yes many times and I also have flown over all the areas. There are ways to stop this simple. Government to plow the fields FREE and make sure they supply EVERYTHING including LOCAL labour and more than 5 people to do it!. provide some FREE fertilizer - and do it on a roster so each farmer area KNOWS when it is their tune and to get this money by charging a few baht BED TAX on all hotels and Condo apartment blocks that are rented out.

AND MAKE THE VILLAGE HEADS )I CANT SPELL POO YA BAAN!) tell everyone on those damned speakers throughout the season! And anyone caught with FIRE on their property to face stiff monetary penalties and or including SEIZURE of their land!!

it would stop in a week!

then there would be all year round tourism with people being able to see the lovely spring and summer flowers instead of smoke!

You are welcome to come out and plow the sides of the valley we own. I'll pay for the fuel and your time, but not for the replacement of the tractor which will certainly roll down the hill on the first turn. You can't plow a mountain side, but light a match and you can grow corn there.

[davemos]

You don't have to plough the stubble it can be mulched by machines the size of lawnmowers in in difficult terrain.They are available in all sizes even ones that can masticate 8 inch diameter trees.Lots of info on Australia sites and USA .

[Johpa]

Does anyone know if the farmers are contracted to

grow produce for the big agribusinesses such as CP? Do the farmers sell to middle men or privately at local markets etc.?

The locals often are on contract to local middlemen who have contracts with CP. But given the amount of talk on current prices during harvest season, many are not on contract. My in-laws often sell their relatively small quantities of corn to other neighboring villagers, usually Mong, to be used as pig feed at prices slightly higher than what is being offered by wholesalers. But again, their fields are much smaller than the vast steep acreage seen in areas around Mae Chaem, Mar Sariang, Phrae, etc.

And it is the steepness of those slopes that prevents any thoughts of mechanical plowing. I find it difficult enough to walk along the slopes. But it is the CP group more than any interest in mushroom cultivation that has encouraged the replacement of forest with corn to feed their corporate pig raising operations.

[chiang mai]

I hope you are not making excuses for the burn offs? They grow crops all year round so why only burn at the same time each year? They are bloody stupid that's why

You can read it as an excuse or simple as the reasonable fact that it is, up to you. As for the year round part: crops only grow when there is water available, the dry season doesn't meet that criteria, it's therefore a good time for unproductive land to be made ready for production once again.

BTW have you ever been into the mountains/hills in the north to see these things for yourself.

Yes many times and I also have flown over all the areas. There are ways to stop this simple. Government to plow the fields FREE and make sure they supply EVERYTHING including LOCAL labour and more than 5 people to do it!. provide some FREE fertilizer - and do it on a roster so each farmer area KNOWS when it is their tune and to get this money by charging a few baht BED TAX on all hotels and Condo apartment blocks that are rented out.

AND MAKE THE VILLAGE HEADS )I CANT SPELL POO YA BAAN!) tell everyone on those damned speakers throughout the season! And anyone caught with FIRE on their property to face stiff monetary penalties and or including SEIZURE of their land!!

it would stop in a week!

then there would be all year round tourism with people being able to see the lovely spring and summer flowers instead of smoke!

You are welcome to come out and plow the sides of the valley we own. I'll pay for the fuel and your time, but not for the replacement of the tractor which will certainly roll down the hill on the first turn. You can't plow a mountain side, but light a match and you can grow corn there.

Exactly, I wouldn't imagine even walking in some of those areas let alone driving or using mechanical equipment.

[chiang mai]

You don't have to plough the stubble it can be mulched by machines the size of lawnmowers in in difficult terrain.They are available in all sizes even ones that can masticate 8 inch diameter trees.Lots of info on Australia sites and USA .

Perhaps the farmers should be advised to buy such machines and charge the cost of them to their Amex cards to spread the cost burden!

Seriously, one rai of land is about 0.4 acres, the profit on one rai of rice is about THB 6,000, if they are lucky, that's THB 18k profit per year if they manage three crops which is very doubtful - so USD 550 a year profit for their efforts and you want them to buy technology from Australia, the only technology in many of those farms is a rice cooker and perhaps a TV and that's it.

[davemos]

Perhaps the army could use their machinery thereby negating the need for ariel survey and water bombing possibly a saving ? Anyway something must be done .There are solutions.

[recycled]

Yep! Great job your boys are doing General/PM, but the stress must be enormous. Chasing young girls for posting 'underboob photos' and fighting fires, all in a days work hey General. "Pity though you are threatening future artists and models with 5 years jail but pyromaniacs who are killing people, get a slap on the hand. Glad to see you are getting them there priorities right Mr PM, they are defiantly in the Nations interest, even though the educated world kind of think you are an idiot.

[paulchiangmai]

82 rain making flights, anyone know if a single drop of rain has resulted from this scheme? My area has missed out, reports please on where all the rain is just in case I go near there.

[tigermonkey]

82 rain making flights, anyone know if a single drop of rain has resulted from this scheme? My area has missed out, reports please on where all the rain is just in case I go near there.

Rain making is based on seeding clouds, in an attempt to get them to release their moisture. 82 times the RTAF has looked up in the sky, and 82 times they have declared " I can't see anything through this smog." So then 82 times the RTAf have flown above the smog to discover clear blue sunny skies. However, I'm sure that both the aircraft and support vehicles have done their bit to add to the ground level smog.

[tigermonkey]

Today's culprit for smog production is the mountain corn growers. So far blame has been cast on the people of Myanmar, the Laotians, the hill tribes, the wild mushroom gatherers, those who demand fresh produce, the uneducated poor and heavens knows who else. I'm sure that I have missed several. The truth is that the annual smog is somewhat of a natural phenomenon, caused by a combination of topography and weather, exacerbated by all of the things/people that have been blamed.

The one area that is getting no attention is the complete lack of emission standards on Thai vehicles both new and old. Frequently I drive from south of Lamphun into Chiang Mai, and always the visibility decreases as I drive north. The change is most dramatic at this time of year, but even on a hot, dry day at other times of the year, it is the same. Why would smoke from farms make the visibility drastically decrease as you get closer to a city ?

It sure would be unpopular to implement some emission standards in Thaiiand, given how much pollution pours out of all the diesels and mopeds. The government doesn't want to talk about it.

Recently, I heard a rather proud announcement that the average PM2.5 reading (the really deadly stuff) for the year for Chiang Mai was ONLY 38. They completely ignored the fact that in many countries the legislated daily maximum is 25.

[davemos]

Just a thought if anyone is interested search Mc con el robocut aremote mulcher which can mulch at up 7 km per hour with a widths of just over a meter and can handle 55 degrees slopes ....