Government asked to review its decision to phase out double-deckers

[freedom4life]

We all know WHO should be phased-out instead...those buses are wonderful and add a distinction to Thailand's domestic travels. They are quite comfortable and enjoyable to be on...How childish and ignorant these Thai-officials are. Always something to be taken away or restricted because of a person's behavior..grow-up and be made responsible. No one to blame but yourselves..

Edited January 7, 2016 by freedom4life

[kiwikeith]

Transport Ministry to phase out double-deckers claiming that they are unsafe and vulnerable to road accidents.

Has anybody else seen the rebuilt,previous rolled double deckers? they don't scrap much in Thailand!

It would be nice to see vehicle testing stations in Thailand that vehicles would have to go through every six months for a warrant of fittness.

Buses should be checked more than that.

I have been through the government rego testing station where they only check the VI N number even though they have capacity to check brakes and underneath vehicle for faults.

I don't know how much mechanical failure is involved in accident stats but I would bet my house that loonatic drivers are more to blame by a long shot in all vehicle types of accidents.

[craigt3365]

These buses are not built up to international standards. The video in the link at minute 7:00 below, shows how there are no plans and obviously no understanding of safety standards. Many are built of wood and disintegrate upon impact. After a crash, the bus company is dissolved and a new one created. Protecting the owners. And due to the ineffective and corrupt legal system here, few face prosecution for their infractions.

Add to this the absolutely terrible design of the roads. U-Turns in the middle of highways with no traffic lights where these huge vehicles try to turn. Incredibly dangerous. I'd hate to think of how many deaths have occurred at the floating market here in Pattaya when they use to allow these buses to do a U-Turn just meters past where they were parked. Pulling right out into traffic. Sometimes parked 4 across right into the 3rd lane of one of the busiest roads here. Unreal. And of course, shuffling passengers across the road with no pedestrian crossing and no traffic lights.

http://www.channel4.com/news/the-undocumented-dangers-of-thailands-roads

The bus you are talking about is a old bus that was sold off by a proper bus company and refurbished by a unqualified repairer, it should not have been on the road, it was not a new bus. it is what they call a pirate bus, a illegal bus. please get your facts right.

You did read the results of the NSTDA report? Completely different from what you are saying. Sorry, but I'd lean to what they've reported. Buses here are not designed properly.

[canuckamuck]

The tilt test should be done while the driver is overtaking a 6 wheel truck on corner in a mountain pass at high speed. Because that is a condition to be expected.

[pedro01]

The association said that about 20,000 people would be made redundant if the existing double-deckers are to be banned from the streets. Toacquire a new bus, at least two million baht will be needed for each bus, the association added.

I highly doubt the veracity of this claim. Single deck busses would mean more buses, more manufacturing, more drivers and more support staff at terminals, possibly even new terminals. I never ride the busses, or the vans any more, and it is because of the drivers not the vehicles.

In this country it is very much the vehicles.

They are not built to Thailand standards. There is a documentary about the building of these death traps here & how it goes on completely ignoring local regulations and procedures.

[pedro01]

The post about shoddy built buses in Thailand are stupid, the running chassis , motor, gear boxes and everything is imported from Benz, or Volvo or what ever company that makes the running gear. the body is built in Thailand the same as every other country, nothing wrong with the way the buses are built, I know I have been in the motor trade most of my working life. I think the paranoid Thai basher should take the year off have a holiday,, all year.

So you would be happy sitting in the seats that in some designs have just a full glass window to the floor beside them.

Buses are built the same in Thailand as other countries, so are the cars that are built in Thailand and they are at world stranded. so are the design of buses in Thailand no different, if the cars are built OK so are the buses, you should post about something you know about.

Completely incorrect.

Buses are cobbled together here

[Doc46]

Why the hell are they trying to blame the vehicles/double deckers? It's the Roads and Drivers that cause the accidents Not the vehicles!

[joboss]

The post about shoddy built buses in Thailand are stupid, the running chassis , motor, gear boxes and everything is imported from Benz, or Volvo or what ever company that makes the running gear. the body is built in Thailand the same as every other country, nothing wrong with the way the buses are built, I know I have been in the motor trade most of my working life. I think the paranoid Thai basher should take the year off have a holiday,, all year.

So you would be happy sitting in the seats that in some designs have just a full glass window to the floor beside them.

Yes.

[thaiguzzi]

plywood, fibreglass, and a nice paintjob - from a distance...

[poohy]

retiring from this topic but in closing can you imagine a Thai bus or driver completing this test

[SOTIRIOS]

....just riding in one at the upper level it is obvious....

...the lower level is also not right....

...'V.I.P'....because you get a malfunctioning 'toilet' with a bonus large bucket ....???

[outsider]

Another knee-jerk decision that hasn't been very well thought-out. Double-decker buses may be inherently less stable than single-deckers, due to the higher centre of gravity of the double-deckers. On the same argument, the single-deckers are less stable than say, pick-up trucks, which are in turn less stable than passenger cars, for the same reason. So ban all buses and pickup-trucks then?

Did it ever occur to these people that most of everything is due to the person operating the machine - i.e. the driver, in this case? Training and education are key. Teach these orangutans how to properly engage the grey matter between the ears in a modern society. Speaking of grey matters... oh well, nevermind.

[spidermike007]

At the very least, do not allow these monstrosities to ply the beach roads in Cha-Am, Ban Krood, Samui, nor any other smaller beach town areas. It is such an inappropriate thing, to see these monsters on those little roads. It is such an admission, of a complete lack of control, or law and order.

[ramrod711]

The association said that about 20,000 people would be made redundant if the existing double-deckers are to be banned from the streets. Toacquire a new bus, at least two million baht will be needed for each bus, the association added.

I highly doubt the veracity of this claim. Single deck busses would mean more buses, more manufacturing, more drivers and more support staff at terminals, possibly even new terminals. I never ride the busses, or the vans any more, and it is because of the drivers not the vehicles.

In this country it is very much the vehicles.

They are not built to Thailand standards. There is a documentary about the building of these death traps here & how it goes on completely ignoring local regulations and procedures.

I drove commercial vehicles, Gross vehicle weights up to 63,500kg and a length of 80 feet for 30 years, 1.8 million miles. How the body is built, as long as it is attached properly to the manufacturers pre built chassis is irrelevant, other than passenger safety in a crash. A short anecdote; When I would still ride on vans and busses, I always did a walk around inspection, something I've never seen here. I noticed an axle bolt missing on the drive axle of the bus, the wheel coated in oil. I showed it to the driver, told him that the loss of oil could cause the differential to lock unexpectedly and cause an accident. His response was to get a bucket of water, clean the wheel and say "Mai Pben Rai". It is very much the drivers.

[swerver]

They could pass a 50 degree test and you wouldn't be any safer when the driver is either drunk, on stimulants, or has anger issues. And all three are likely here.

Fully agree with what you say.

The bus in the photo is standing STILL consequently not under the influence of running forces in particular when going around a curve in the road or going around a corner, in which case you also have to content with centrifugal forces, this is why the Swedish road test is performed running at 40KPH doing zigzags.

Another problem with these busses in question in Thailand is that the load is concentrated on the top deck practically the lower deck is were the bar is located with only a few patrons.

Then this being Thailand were the word PREVENTATIVE MAINTENANCE has as yet not find the Thai Dictionary. These busses have air suspension and if the air pressure in the suspension airbags is not regularly checked I have been behind these busses when it navigated a curve and I was concerned it would tip over because obviously the airbag pressure was way below its required pressure.

The double decker in Thailand originated a few decades ago in Belgium a part of the world were PM (Preventative Maintenance) is adhere to like a religion and were bus drivers under the influence is a rarity and in case there is one he will be given free room and board for an extended period of time and once released will be unable to find a job, any job that is, because on account of his background.

As for Thailand, it still has a long way to go before reaching, if ever, the above named rules and regulations. .So if they cannot handle other people's livest safely then do not let them have it, whatever it is.

[joboss]

retiring from this topic but in closing can you imagine a Thai bus or driver completing this test

Sure.. Somchan went first and knocked most of the cones over.

Obtained a licence for life and also one each for his brother and Uncle and cousin and also some neighbours.

They all got revved up on yaba and got pissed to celebrate.

[Transporter]

So presumably they will load each seat with 63Kg as they do in the UK.

Maybe it would be better to tilt test the driver?

[Transporter]

retiring from this topic but in closing can you imagine a Thai bus or driver completing this test

Sure.. Somchan went first and knocked most of the cones over.

Obtained a licence for life and also one each for his brother and Uncle and cousin and also some neighbours.

They all got revved up on yaba and got pissed to celebrate.

Thats how they drive them through Udon Thani when fully loaded anyway.

[Basil B]

Acquiring some ex London Ruotemasters for public transport use in Cities could help reduce traffic congestion as they can carry twice as many passengers, would sort out the overhead wiring as well.

[finnomick]

Don't think any of the upper deck passengers in this bus would argue....if any were still alive

[apetley]

The post about shoddy built buses in Thailand are stupid, the running chassis , motor, gear boxes and everything is imported from Benz, or Volvo or what ever company that makes the running gear. the body is built in Thailand the same as every other country, nothing wrong with the way the buses are built, I know I have been in the motor trade most of my working life. I think the paranoid Thai basher should take the year off have a holiday,, all year.

The chassis may be good but what about the bodywork? Where I live there is a small operation repairing old buses. There is no rollover protection at all because the entire upper deck is usually constructed of wood and the aluminium skin attached to that. The seats are bolted to the plywood floor. Seatbelts?

Whilst there are many perfectly safe buses in the roads here there are also many that fall woefully short of modern safety standards and that needs to be swiftly addressed.

[Travelman868]

Thailand’s Junta Orders Ban on Double-Decker Buses

BANGKOK – Transport Minister Arkhom Termpittayapaisith has reported that Prime Minister Prayut Chan-o-cha has ordered a ban on the registration of new double-decker tour buses and stricter road worthiness checks for all public transport vehicles.

Minister Arkhom Termpittayapaisith said Gen Prayut issued the instructions during Tuesday’s cabinet meeting in the wake a record road-toll over the New Year holiday.

According to Arkhom the 4,800 double-decker buses and 16,000 regular buses already in operation with a height of more than 3.6 meters must now pass a strict tilt test on a 30 degree slope. Any that fail to pass the test must be taken out of service.

Full story: http://www.chiangraitimes.com/thailands-junta-orders-ban-on-double-decker-buses.html

-- Chiang Rai Times 2016-01-07

How many roads have a 30 degree slope? I wonder how many rat infested single deckers cannot climb a 20 degree slope

[Dumbastheycome]

The bus bodies in Thailand do deteriorate in trim etc but as mentioned the chassis and running gear are imported. Tragic accident reports most often reveal the cause is predominantly driver error. Removing high deck busses may decrease fatalities but not the driver error! Significant incidents are as a result of the attempt to avoid collision from another offending driver. Either driver is unikely to have any trained or acquired skill which results in accidents.

But the most frightening bus ride of my life was in Nepal. The driver had skill...he managed to slide the back end of the bus around most corners This while his assistant knelt on the floor with his hands inside the engine cover holding the accelerator link in place. I concentrated on that rather than the 500 metre plus drop that was directly below my window much of the time. At east in Thailand busses may fall over in most places rather than down !

[jamestip2013]

NCA. (Nakhon Chai Air) bus company has no double decker buses because the intelligent management say they are UNSAFE!!! They run a successful company with the safe , comfortable . Air con buses with ABS .. If they can make money doing transport safely others should also be able to do so .. Also do you ever see a group of Europeans or Russians getting out of a double decker bus..???? Of the many tour buses that stop at MacDonalds at Samut Songkran I have only seen " farangs" on tour getting out of a standard height single decker bus... ???? The answer is because overseas tour providers are aware as are Nakhon Chai Air that these buses under some circumstances are not as safe as a single decker bus.. These same companies in "farang" countries have a legal "duty of care" and are responsible in their country for the safety of their customers.. Hence most specify on there contracts with their Thai counterparts "no double decker buses allowed"..

It is not hard to work out when you look at the rear of a double decker bus that the centre of gravity must be a lot higher than a normal vehicle. That with 10 people downstairs at 70 kg each = 700n kg downstairs. If they have 40 people upstairs on the same formula would be 2800 kgs upstairs.. The centre of gravity in this situation is much higher than the tilt test with an empty bus..

What about the single decker buses which seam to be nearly as high as a double !!!!! Is their view from all been seated high worth more than their safety..

[poohy]

Yes i ran foreign tour company .. never any double deckers used EVER! on contract!

[JAG]

I've never really taken much notice of these double deckers up until now ( other than to smile at the garish artwork) but stuck in traffic just now (held up by dozens of plod waiting for another VIP convoy to whiz through - they must be all on holiday up here in Chiang Rai), I took a good look at several next to me.

They must be absolutely lethal, flimsy bodywork ( you can see the aluminum panels flexing), acres of glass and very thin frames which can have no strength at all. They also seem very narrow relative to their height. They were all proudly branded "Scania". I wonder if that company, which presumably just supplies the chassis, knows (or is bothered? ) that these death traps are whizzing around bearing their name?

Edited January 8, 2016 by JAG

[merlen10002]

I would like to clarify thing about this thread, some posters on here don't seem to understand the different between the term NEW and USED and Rebuilt, The New Car manufacturing industry, the New Truck manufacturing industry and New Bus manufacturing industry is a success story for Thailand all built to world stranded.

There is a huge Bus rebuilding industry in Thailand,, you can not call that New , used parts imported from overseas and rebuilt with some new parts , probably more rebuilt buses than new buses in Thailand, the bus in the video on this thread is not a new bus it is a very old bus that is being rebuilt it should not be ever be on the road again, some of the rebuilding company probably built good safe buses but many may not, I have only said New buses nothing about rebuilt buses, you can not call a bus or anything else new if it has used parts in it or has been rebuilt. I would only ever go in a bus from a respectable good bus company like NCA, Chan Tour, Air Udon, all I have been in were in good condition clean and driven in a sensible manner.

[merlen10002]

The post about shoddy built buses in Thailand are stupid, the running chassis , motor, gear boxes and everything is imported from Benz, or Volvo or what ever company that makes the running gear. the body is built in Thailand the same as every other country, nothing wrong with the way the buses are built, I know I have been in the motor trade most of my working life. I think the paranoid Thai basher should take the year off have a holiday,, all year.

So you would be happy sitting in the seats that in some designs have just a full glass window to the floor beside them.

Buses are built the same in Thailand as other countries, so are the cars that are built in Thailand and they are at world stranded. so are the design of buses in Thailand no different, if the cars are built OK so are the buses, you should post about something you know about.

I know i wouldn't sit in a seat by a window that goes down to the floor so how about you? which is what i asked, a straight one word answer Yes or No please any more will prove your full of

Yes

[swerver]

NCA. (Nakhon Chai Air) bus company has no double decker buses because the intelligent management say they are UNSAFE!!! They run a successful company with the safe , comfortable . Air con buses with ABS .. If they can make money doing transport safely others should also be able to do so .. Also do you ever see a group of Europeans or Russians getting out of a double decker bus..???? Of the many tour buses that stop at MacDonalds at Samut Songkran I have only seen " farangs" on tour getting out of a standard height single decker bus... ???? The answer is because overseas tour providers are aware as are Nakhon Chai Air that these buses under some circumstances are not as safe as a single decker bus.. These same companies in "farang" countries have a legal "duty of care" and are responsible in their country for the safety of their customers.. Hence most specify on there contracts with their Thai counterparts "no double decker buses allowed"..

It is not hard to work out when you look at the rear of a double decker bus that the centre of gravity must be a lot higher than a normal vehicle. That with 10 people downstairs at 70 kg each = 700n kg downstairs. If they have 40 people upstairs on the same formula would be 2800 kgs upstairs.. The centre of gravity in this situation is much higher than the tilt test with an empty bus..

What about the single decker buses which seam to be nearly as high as a double !!!!! Is their view from all been seated high worth more than their safety..

What about the single decker buses which seam to be nearly as high as a double !!!!!

These buses you refer to - their lower part is the cargo area when operated on regular long-haul routes and while used in tourist operations the lower area is were the tourist passengers' suitcases are stored. Total weight of all the garbage baggage tourist carry with them it will cause the CG (Center Gravity) to be way below were the passengers are sitting. On regular routes these buses carry Express cargo for business located along its route. All long-haul Greyhound buses are like that. Note: Greyhound bus company operates in more countries than US alone and often not under the name Greyhound.

[craigt3365]

I would like to clarify thing about this thread, some posters on here don't seem to understand the different between the term NEW and USED and Rebuilt, The New Car manufacturing industry, the New Truck manufacturing industry and New Bus manufacturing industry is a success story for Thailand all built to world stranded.

There is a huge Bus rebuilding industry in Thailand,, you can not call that New , used parts imported from overseas and rebuilt with some new parts , probably more rebuilt buses than new buses in Thailand, the bus in the video on this thread is not a new bus it is a very old bus that is being rebuilt it should not be ever be on the road again, some of the rebuilding company probably built good safe buses but many may not, I have only said New buses nothing about rebuilt buses, you can not call a bus or anything else new if it has used parts in it or has been rebuilt. I would only ever go in a bus from a respectable good bus company like NCA, Chan Tour, Air Udon, all I have been in were in good condition clean and driven in a sensible manner.

Not sure I agree with you. The Honda you get here is not like the one I get back home. More bells and whistles and seems to be a better build back home. That's been my experience.

And this article is about Thailand stopping production of NEW double decker buses, they must be on to something.....

According to the Transport Ministry, registration of new double-deckers will be stopped

The automotive industry is a success story. But not all are happy here:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/771941-toyota-may-shift-manufacturing-hub-for-fortuner-from-thailand-to-philippines/