Sharp tax hike on alcohol and tobacco effective immediately

[Muggi1968]

I think this will just make the tax free beer lao more available......

 

[ripstanley]

I bought 2 cases of Leo big bottles  at Tesco Phayao about an hour ago Still the same price of 584 Baht each. The boxes were dated 22/08/2017. 

[dick dasterdly]

In short - we've still no idea as to how the tax increases will increase the price of cigarettes and beer/wine etc.?

[happysanook]

5 minutes ago, rodney earl said:

I am so glad that I dont drink or smoke. I hope they put the tax up again.!!

Looking forward to when they tax the fuk out of something you enjoy.

[SpeakeasyThai]

Thais drink too much anyway. Lets  hope it deters drink driving which appears to be the national sport. As for cigarettes - they are ridiculously too cheap and stink!

[hobz]

2 minutes ago, rodney earl said:

I am so glad that I dont drink or smoke. I hope they put the tax up again.!!

I assume you want people to stop drinking and smoking, and I agree!

 

But, it's a tricky thing to use taxes as a way to make people stop drinking or smoking.

 

Sweden has one of the highest alcohol taxes in the world, and it's still not stopping people from drinking. Ok, whatever, Swedes apparently can afford to drink despite the taxes.. ok...

 

Another example from Sweden .. some 20 years ago or so, Sweden implemented a massive tax hike on cigarettes, only to backtrack and bring it down again because it created a massive smuggling trade and cigarettes actually got available cheaper than before the tax..

You see, once you hike up the taxes enough, it becomes profitable for smugglers to start to operate (cigs from cambodia, laos, whatever?) ... It's pure math .. Once the numbers adds up, the smuggling will start. It's 100% predictable and inevitable ...

 

So what will happen is that smuggling will now become more profitable because the demand for cheap beer and cigarettes will sky-rocket. 

People will drink and smoke just as much (if not more) than before.

Tax revenue will DECREASE.

 

Are you glad now?

 

 

 

[rott]

3 minutes ago, Muggi1968 said:

I think this will just make the tax free beer lao more available......

 

Please explain "tax free beer lao".

[SpeakeasyThai]

2 minutes ago, happysanook said:

Looking forward to when they tax the fuk out of something you enjoy.

Extra Tax on spelling lesson tutorials?

[leither69]

Bought a bottle of wine at lunchtime.  Same price as last week

[SpeakeasyThai]

1 minute ago, hobz said:

I assume you want people to stop drinking and smoking, and I agree!

 

But, it's a tricky thing to use taxes as a way to make people stop drinking or smoking.

 

Sweden has one of the highest alcohol taxes in the world, and it's still not stopping people from drinking. Ok, whatever, Swedes apparently can afford to drink despite the taxes.. ok...

 

Another example from Sweden .. some 20 years ago or so, Sweden implemented a massive tax hike on cigarettes, only to backtrack and bring it down again because it created a massive smuggling trade and cigarettes actually got available cheaper than before the tax..

You see, once you hike up the taxes enough, it becomes profitable for smugglers to start to operate (cigs from cambodia, laos, whatever?) ... It's pure math .. Once the numbers adds up, the smuggling will start. It's 100% predictable and inevitable ...

 

So what will happen is that smuggling will now become more profitable because the demand for cheap beer and cigarettes will sky-rocket. 

People will drink and smoke just as much (if not more) than before.

Tax revenue will DECREASE.

 

Are you glad now?

 

 

 

You seem to know the future. Do you do the stock market by any chance and always get it right?

[Dmaxdan]

3 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said:

In short - we've still no idea as to how the tax increases will increase the price of cigarettes and beer/wine etc.?

Have a look back at the link for The Nation in post #91

[hobz]

6 minutes ago, Muggi1968 said:

I think this will just make the tax free beer lao more available......

 

100% this.

 

It's pure math. 

 

Now smuggling becomes much more profitable.

Demand for smuggled alcohol and cigs will skyrocket.

Every mom and pop store will start selling the smuggled stuff now.

Everybody will stop buying at 7/11.

People will get cheaper beer and cigs than before.

Tax revenue will DECREASE!

Smoking and drinking will stay at the same lever or even INCREASE depending on the price of the smuggled stuff.

[hobz]

3 minutes ago, SpeakeasyThai said:

You seem to know the future. Do you do the stock market by any chance and always get it right?

Stocks are much harder to predict.

 

But alcohol and cigarette taxation always works out the same way.

 

*edit* Obviously I could be wrong... I'm sorry if that did not come across.. But this is how it usually goes...

 

2 things could make me wrong I guess:
 

1. Maybe cost of smuggling into Thailand is higher than I think ... (but we all know how corrupt and incompetent law enforcement here is..)

 

2. Maybe the risk of selling smuggled goods is higher than I think ... Meaning, maybe mom&pop won't risk it .. Or they have to charge high prices to be worth the risk ... 

Edited September 16, 2017 by hobz

[ajarnmarc]

I ran into a strange situation last night (15/9/17).

I tried to purchase a carton of cigarettes from two of the local stores, 

where I usually can always find several cartons of cigs available.

Yet last night, there were no shops willing to sell a carton,

just packs, and not more than two packs.

 

What was really strange, was that these same shops are family owned, 

and these stores typically sell alcohol all day, and night, while they are open, 

regardless of what the laws state for sell times.

 

Yet they were all to happy to prohibit the sell of cartons on the day before the price hike...

 

Today, after the increase, it's business as usual.

 

 

[Golden Triangle]

6 minutes ago, rodney earl said:

I am so glad that I dont drink or smoke. I hope they put the tax up again.!!

Not even worth a retort.

[Ltcolumbo]

In many cases "sin taxes" are used to subsidize deficit tax coffers; in the case of Thailand this deficit in tax revenue stems from the 100,000's of unregistered shops conducting business in all areas of Thailand and paying zero tax. The tax base is largely undeveloped and unenforced in Thailand.

Simple solution is to prop up the coffers by huge tax increases on alcohol & tobacco products.

[hobz]

2 minutes ago, ajarnmarc said:

I ran into a strange situation last night (15/9/17).

I tried to purchase a carton of cigarettes from two of the local stores, 

where I usually can always find several cartons of cigs available.

Yet last night, there were no shops willing to sell a carton,

just packs, and not more than two packs.

 

What was really strange, was that these same shops are family owned, 

and these stores typically sell alcohol all day, and night, while they are open, 

regardless of what the laws state for sell times.

 

Yet they were all to happy to prohibit the sell of cartons on the day before the price hike...

 

Today, after the increase, it's business as usual.

 

 

Not strange at all. 

They bought their stock BEFORE the tax raise.

And today the are selling it with the new price? Pure profit.

[hobz]

1 minute ago, Ltcolumbo said:

In many cases "sin taxes" are used to subsidize deficit tax coffers; in the case of Thailand this deficit in tax revenue stems from the 100,000's of unregistered shops conducting business in all areas of Thailand and paying zero tax. The tax base is largely undeveloped and unenforced in Thailand.

Simple solution is to prop up the coffers by huge tax increases on alcohol & tobacco products.

The <insert any law> is largely undeveloped and unenforced in Thailand.

[dick turpin]

What about the tax hike on wine gums.....no, I would not put it past them

[JAG]

If they are in your suitcase in the car,/trunk or in the luggage compartment of the bus do they check that thoroughly?

If it becomes known that Falang are doing "booze runs" you can bet your bottom dollar they will start.
Fined, confiscation and subsequent "informal arrangements for disposal"?

[dick dasterdly]

2 minutes ago, Dmaxdan said:

Have a look back at the link for The Nation in post #91

I'm so glad someone understands the new tax rules!

 

So how much are L&M going to cost today/tomorrow/Monday and when will these increases happen?

 

Similarly, what will be the price of fruit wine boxes - and when will the increased price happen?

 

[mtls2005]

In addition to the confusing nature of the two taxes (22% of "retail price" and 430 baht/L of alcohol content) along with the implementation period, it seems like the "authorities" could have been a bit more transparent implementing this change? Instead, they secretly passed it earlier this week, gazetted it last evening and implemented it today.

 

Previously the alcohol component was 100 baht/L, and now it is 430 baht/L, so assuming 5% and a small bottle 330 ml and a large 630 ml, that's an increase of 5.4 baht and 10.4 baht respectively.

 

No clue how to calculate the 22% of retail price component impact; I don't know how that is calculated currently, nor do I know the rate(s), nor do I understand who will define the "retail" price?

 

Assuming the 22% component is equal to the current component (and it could be more, or it could be less - I honestly don't know), the alcohol component would alone lead to a ~13% - 14% consumer retail price increase. 

 

 

 

[JAG]

We will probably never know but I can't help wondering if prices on beer and spirits etc. in the multitude of military Officers Mess' around the country are tax exempt for the elite defending the country's borders.
Just for comparison in Vietnam.
Bottle of JW Red Scotch at BigC store Hanoi = 467 TBH
450ml Hanoi beer (4.25 al/vol) in crates of 24 from local corner store = 9.1 TBH per bottle.
4 litre shiraz red in cask at BigC store = 620 TBH (wine attracts tax in Vietnam to protect local industry)

Oh, I suppose that they don't partake - after all, are they not all lean mean steely eyed killing machines, honed to an absolute peak of physical and mental condition?

[sammieuk1]

Brits on a budget could be struggling with the value of the pound and now this big tax rise can someone start a crowd funding page  please .

[hobz]

6 minutes ago, dick turpin said:

What about the tax hike on wine gums.....no, I would not put it past them

I've been craving whine gums lately actually... do they have good ones in rimping?

[hobz]

2 minutes ago, sammieuk1 said:

Brits on a budget could be struggling with the value of the pound and now this big tax rise can someone start a crowd funding page  please .

5555 "Thirsty brits in need!"

[chilli42]

Someone has got to pay for that new military equipment.

[LannaGuy]

Junta spreading happiness again

[hobz]

Just now, chilli42 said:

Someone has got to pay for that new military equipment.

Yeah, those submarines will not pay for themselves... oh Wait,, maybe they can fill them with cheap beer and cigs from Cambodia or Laos? 

[hobz]

Just now, LannaGuy said:

Junta spreading happiness again

happiness for smugglers for sure.