Just Received Some Bad News For US Citizens. No More Income Affidavits.

[moe666]

I guess immigration has become tired of the low life liars and cheats staying in Thailand for long term. If you do not have the money bye bye. Those big bills at the hospitals where to much when the person unable to pay had claimed 65,000b a month income

[Nyezhov]

18 minutes ago, NCC1701A said:

how will they know your Social Security statement is correct? you should ask the embassy if they will do any legwork along those lines. 

let us know what they say.

I beleive you can get certified copies from the Soc Sec administration. Regardless I dont beleive that the Consulate can refuse to notarize an affidavit of fact from you. But its academic at this time until we know what Thais will require. But I bet folks can be expecting visits from Immigration ????

[Thailand]

13 minutes ago, robblok said:

Not as easy as swearing to something that is not true. This involves a lot more trouble. I mean even loaning 800K can be done and fakes. But its all just a bit harder to fake then just swearing to something that is untrue. 

 

There is no foolproof system but its less susceptible to fraud then the old ways. 

When I first came here Siam Commercial Bank actually offered a 3 month loan to meet immigration requirements.

I see a potentially huge business for out of Thailand lenders.

Maybe the Chinese, lending 800K for 3 months, remitting to Thailand to secured bank accounts, returning to offshore accounts on completion of visa.

For a nice handling fee of course!

And currently it would be completely legal.

 

 

[david555]

" money pooling " could help some who has 2-3 trusted friends , like the agents game ,only must use the 3 months seasoning time intact  ????

[moe666]

1 minute ago, Nyezhov said:

I beleive you can get certified copies from the Soc Sec administration. Regardless I dont beleive that the Consulate can refuse to notarize an affidavit of fact from you. But its academic at this time until we know what Thais will require. But I bet folks can be expecting visits from Immigration ????

Thats all they had been doing, they stamped a affidavit that you swore to be accurate. Thai immigration accepted it for many years even though they knew the embassy did not verify the amount

[david555]

48 minutes ago, KittenKong said:

Pay an agent to sort it out for you. I know far more people who do it that way than I know people who either deposit the cash or get income letters.

Next step from B.J. immigration ….. send th "agents " out of offices …?

[moe666]

2 minutes ago, david555 said:

" money pooling " could help some who has 2-3 trusted friends , like the agents game ,only must use the 3 months seasoning time intact  ????

ther you go already making the 800,000 deposit a scam and now you will have to prove the money came from abroad

[garyk]

Over 100 billion baht just dropped into the laps of the Thai banking system.

Pretty good payday IMO.

[david555]

1 minute ago, moe666 said:

ther you go already making the 800,000 deposit a scam and now you will have to prove the money came from abroad

not for the 800 k , never asked me in 5 times 

[ubonjoe]

Another off topic post has been removed. The is a serious topic and there is no room for jokes or other nonsense.

From now on there will be no notice of removals. I your post disappears you can assume that you stepped over the line.

 

[david555]

1 minute ago, garyk said:

Over 100 billion baht just dropped into the laps of the Thai banking system.

Pretty good payday IMO.

and for the IRS in future for some cases

[Nyezhov]

12 minutes ago, Airalee said:

Thinking out loud here...

 

Why is it, that when one applies for a METV, Thailand is ok with verifying  financial stability by having the applicant submit statements showing how much money he/she has in their US bank account but when extending a “retirement” visa, they want the money in a Thai bank account? ???? 

Because its their country, their rules....I feel that speculating as to "whys" all the time clouds the issues. Its government. It makes no sense sometimes anywhere,

Edited October 26, 2018 by Nyezhov

[Pib]

I got the email from the American Citizen Services also. So much for those verbal, email, telephone replies saying business as normal.

I have used the Bt800K in the Thai bank method for around the last 8 years; only used the income letter method on my first extension 9 years ago.

But having the option to use the income letter method in case I just didn't want to keep big money in Thailand or just no longer had an income of at least Bt800K was a backup option much appreciated...gave a sense of security.

As already said by others the ball is now in Thai Immigration's court as to if they will offer a method to replace in the income letter method. Or will their current rules remain unchanged which means a person would basically only have the big money in a Thai bank option which I'm sure will be hard for some.

[inThailand]

I am surprised it to this many decades for immigration to wake up that the embassy letter was no verification of income.

 

 

[Nyezhov]

7 minutes ago, moe666 said:

Thats all they had been doing, they stamped a affidavit that you swore to be accurate. Thai immigration accepted it for many years even though they knew the embassy did not verify the amount

No its different:

"I, state your name, hereby swear that the attached certified Social Security Staement is a true and exact copy of the SS Statement sent to me by the US Government SS Admin and that the amounts reflected therein are the amounts I receive from the US SS Admin, blah blah blah."

 

You can get certified copies from SS. 

[flexomike]

Just got my email also, sad day for US citizens, now we need some clarification from Thai Immigration if you can still use the 65,000 a month without Embassy letter or only the 800,000 in the bank

[mtls2005]

For the 65,000 monthly income minimum...

 

does this have to be deposited into one single account, on the same day each month, over how many months?

 

and, how does "proof" of a combination method get satisfied? Can you have 400,000 in an account (for 90 days), and then deposit another ~ 33,000 each month, into the same account? over how many months (3?, 6? 12?).

 

I assume Immigration will only be accepting bank book(s) w/same-day bank certification letters, and not foreign pension/income/tax documents?

[gunderhill]

1 hour ago, Nyezhov said:

I guess the issue is: what does the Thai Government want? Do we know yet? Is the combination method dead?

Thai elite visas get new  boost next I think.

[garyk]

Just now, Nyezhov said:

No its different:

"I, state your name, hereby swear that the attached certified Social Security Staement is a true and exact copy of the SS Statement sent to me by the US Government SS Admin and that the amounts reflected therein are the amounts I receive from the US SS Admin, blah blah blah."

 

You can get certified copies from SS. 

Yes, SS will let you get a copy of your benefits. All the country's I have looked into getting a retirement visa from,  require this.

If the Thai immigration only wants money in the bank. Then it is pretty clear where this is coming from. 

 

[Jingthing]

1 hour ago, ubonjoe said:

They are not allowed by law to verify anything at a US embassy.

OK, but couldn't they issue a document saying something like -- Joe Blow has presented us with a letter from Social Security stating his current U.S. government Social Security pension income of $xxxx per month. Joe Blow swears under penalty of (?) that it is a valid document truthfully and accurately stating his income from the U.S. government Social Security pension program.

 

Military pensions too of course.

 

I'm suggesting that with this idea they would not issue documents for any other kind of income. As the U.S. government issuing a document about U.S. government pensions carries more credibility even if they don't literally validate the income. 

 

At the very least, couldn't the U.S. embassy officials ASK Thai immigration if they would accept such a document for their U.S. government pension recipients? That is, if they really want to help at least some of our citizens here. (That may be too generous an assumption.) 

 

It's implied that if people have this evidence of their U.S. government pensions to show to the embassy that they would have the same evidence to present to Thai immigration on request.

 

 

Edited October 26, 2018 by Jingthing

[johnjohn2]

Now with a steady stream of Brits and Americans going to Thai Immigration with questions on how to show income without an embassy letter, hopefully we will get an idea of their intentions soon.

[Vacuum]

55 minutes ago, wpcoe said:

I don't really want to tie up B800,000 in a Thai bank each year for three months

Actually, it's a one time deposit that you can enjoy until you'll leave this planet. Can't really see the problems that US people have with this.

[Pattaya46]

14 minutes ago, garyk said:

Over 100 billion baht just dropped into the laps of the Thai banking system.

Pretty good payday IMO.

I doubt it even reach 1/10 of this amount.

How did you estimate the number of UK&US expats who used the income letter option ??

[zydeco]

1 minute ago, mtls2005 said:

For the 65,000 monthly income minimum...

 

does this have to be deposited into one single account, on the same day each month, over how many months?

 

and, how does "proof" of a combination method get satisfied? Can you have 400,000 in an account (for 90 days), and then deposit another ~ 33,000 each month, into the same account? over how many months (3?, 6? 12?).

 

I assume Immigration will only be accepting bank book(s) w/same-day bank certification letters, and not foreign pension/income/tax documents?

Not without the letter. With no letter, no combination method.

[Suradit69]

1 hour ago, ThaiWai said:

Well it doesn’t say I can’t still get one at the consular outreach in Phuket in November so will do so as planned. My pension is well over the required income amount it’s up to Thailand to explain what proof they will want of that moving forward but my pension company simply offers letters stating that fact not leather bound presidential decrees signed in blood and sealed with the Whitehouse crest. Knowing Thailand they will want just that.

Yes, I have three sources of retirement income. Social Security and Pension have fairly believable printed evidence, but the third source I can only verify with print outs from their website. They are pretty much paperless now.

 

I do have Thai bank book verification of money brought in which averages more than Baht 65,000 a month, but from one month to another it varies since I usually bring in what I assume will be needed for the next month.

 

I hope they clarify the combination method. Hopefully if you put Baht 200,000 in a Thai bank and have easily verifiable monthly income/deposits of Baht 600,000/12 = > Baht 50,000 a month that will suffice.

 

Not really sure how they calculate the combination method since 12 x 65,000 is Baht 780,000, not Baht 800,000. I realize the difference between the two is negligible, but curious about the way they decide what monthly income is required if a balance in a Thai bank is part of the equation.

 

 

[flexomike]

1 hour ago, wpcoe said:

Lovely.  My retirement extension is up for renewal mid-January, so it's now too late to have the B800,000 on deposit in a Thai bank for 90 days.  What the heck am I supposed to do?

You can still get the letter until the end of the year

[pmarlin]

I agree with this as I personally knew of several people who cheated. After the British Emb made their announcement I believed them that the US was going that way I went ahead and topped up my Thai Bank account  in order to go the Money in ih Bank way. didn't like doing it but I also like staying here,

[Sheryl]

Thinking out loud here...
 
Why is it, that when one applies for a METV, Thailand is ok with verifying  financial stability by having the applicant submit statements showing how much money he/she has in their US bank account but when extending a “retirement” visa, they want the money in a Thai bank account? [emoji848] 

Because METVs are supposed to be used for tourism purposes only by people still living in their home country. Obviously they would not open Thai bank accounts.

People on retirement extensions are assumed to be living in Thailand and thus can reasonably be expected to have the necessary funds for their living costs in a Thai bank account.


Sent from my SM-J701F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[garyk]

11 minutes ago, Pattaya46 said:

I doubt it even reach 1/10 of this amount.

How did you estimate the number of UK&US expats who used the income letter option ??

125,000 total U.S. + U.K expats x 800,000 = 100 billion baht?

Just speculation on my part but I would bet 95-98% used the letter. It was required, and anyone that actually put 800K in a Thai bank just for that purpose would be ignorant IMO.

Edited October 26, 2018 by garyk

[Suradit69]

1 hour ago, wpcoe said:

Lovely.  My retirement extension is up for renewal mid-January, so it's now too late to have the B800,000 on deposit in a Thai bank for 90 days.  What the heck am I supposed to do?

You should still be able to get the income letter now. If the renewal date is mid-January you should be able to do the renewal before the end of this year.