Changes made by TransferWise transfers to Thai bank accounts

[soalbundy]

Just now, Pib said:

Bangkok Bank Public Company Limited.  The Bangkok Bank employees will often refer to their bank as BBL in some conversations...or at least they have with me.   

Thank you, I was getting confused, I didn't know this.

[pookiki]

2 hours ago, Pib said:

 

Why Bangkok Bank New York branch has already developed a way for a person to continue to route transfers them.  Been available since April 2019.  See post below for details....and I expect you can still be the first one to use the alternate transfer method to get the cherished FTT coding.

 

The BBL Customer Service Representative that I spoke to yesterday told me that this service would stop in September.  To clarify -- this is the service that was to stop in April.

 

Edited July 16, 2019 by pookiki
grammar

[billd766]

1 hour ago, soalbundy said:

What is BBL ? do you mean BKK bank?

It is Bangkok Bank Limited hence the term BBL.

 

Pib in post #120 explained it better than I did.

[Pib]

35 minutes ago, pookiki said:

The BBL Customer Service Representative that I spoke to yesterday told me that this service would stop in September.  To clarify -- this is the service that was to stop in April.

I think you are confusing the current ACH transfer method which was originally suppose to stop in Apr (then extended to Sep) with the Thai Baht Remittance System described in the post.  A Thai Baht Remittance System that would allow people to continue to use Bangkok Bank for transfers.  Heck, the form you need to complete for each transfer is very similar to a SWIFT transfer form.

 

Bangkok Bank came out with the Thai Baht Remittance System in response to their planned stopping of non-IAT transfers on 1 Apr (extended to 1 Sep)....their Thai Baht Remittance System was going to be their replacement if you still wanted to route funds thru their NY branch to your in-Thailand account.   It's similar to the system that came out of UK folks if they still wanted to route funds thru the London branch after the UK tightened-up some money transfer rules.

 

Now Bangkok Bank never widely advertised their Thai Baht Remittance System....never put it on their website....they would only tell you about if you asked how to continue to use them to transfer funds.    And maybe one reason they never widely advertised it is because they got an extension from the US Treasury to continue current non-IAT transfer until 1 Sep for personal transfer and 1 Jan 2020 for govt/private pension transfers.

 

I wouldn't be surprised to see Bangkok Bank widely advertise/post on their Bangkok Bank website their Thai Baht Remittance System around 1 Sep when they are suppose to start rejecting non-IAT transfers.

 

[pookiki]

27 minutes ago, Pib said:

I think you are confusing the current ACH transfer method which was originally suppose to stop in Apr (then extended to Sep) with the Thai Baht Remittance System described in the post.  A Thai Baht Remittance System that would allow people to continue to use Bangkok Bank for transfers.  Heck, the form you need to complete for each transfer is very similar to a SWIFT transfer form.

 

Bangkok Bank came out with the Thai Baht Remittance System in response to their planned stopping of non-IAT transfers on 1 Apr (extended to 1 Sep)....their Thai Baht Remittance System was going to be their replacement if you still wanted to route funds thru their NY branch to your in-Thailand account.   It's similar to the system that came out of UK folks if they still wanted to route funds thru the London branch after the UK tightened-up some money transfer rules.

 

Now Bangkok Bank never widely advertised their Thai Baht Remittance System....never put it on their website....they would only tell you about if you asked how to continue to use them to transfer funds.    And maybe one reason they never widely advertised it is because they got an extension from the US Treasury to continue current non-IAT transfer until 1 Sep for personal transfer and 1 Jan 2020 for govt/private pension transfers.

 

I wouldn't be surprised to see Bangkok Bank widely advertise/post on their Bangkok Bank website their Thai Baht Remittance System around 1 Sep when they are suppose to start rejecting non-IAT transfers.

 

Pib, you're absolutely right about my confusion.  This is the first I've heard of the Thai Baht Remittance System.  I don't know why they just don't roll it out now.  I've asked how to continue my transfers on multiple occasions but was never told about this. You are very well informed. I will go back to my contact at BBL and ask about this.  Thanks for the heads up!

 

As an aside, it was Sheryl who set me straight on how to set up my account with TransferWise.  I was trying to 'push' my transfer to TW instead of allowing them to 'pull' my money.  I never quite understood the distinction but the 'pull system worked when the push system didn't.  If TW can pull funds, why can't BBL?  If the new Thai Baht Remittance System solves this issue, there's no need to explain.  Thanks, again!!

Edited July 16, 2019 by pookiki
grammar

[Pib]

1 minute ago, pookiki said:

  If TW can pull funds, why can't BBL. 

When you open an account with TW it basically like opening a bank account with a US bank.  You can then use TW to Pull money from other US banks to fund your transfer.  Then TW does that peer-to-peer transfer thing...they are not using the ACH or SWIFT system to move money from the US to Thailand.

 

For Bangkok Bank to pull funds from another US bank you would need to open an account with the Bangkok Bank New York branch..repeat, the "New York" branch.  However, the NY branch is a wholesale/cooperate type bank...they do not offer retail accounts for the common man.  You can still use them for remittance services but you can't get a retail bank account.   But even if they did provide you a bank account at the NY branch and you then wanted to do an "ACH" transfer they would still have to comply with the ACH IAT rules.  

 

Their Thai Baht Remittance Service is basically a pseudo-SWIFT transfer based on the form/info you must complete each time.

 

    

[pookiki]

22 minutes ago, Pib said:

When you open an account with TW it basically like opening a bank account with a US bank.  You can then use TW to Pull money from other US banks to fund your transfer.  Then TW does that peer-to-peer transfer thing...they are not using the ACH or SWIFT system to move money from the US to Thailand.

 

For Bangkok Bank to pull funds from another US bank you would need to open an account with the Bangkok Bank New York branch..repeat, the "New York" branch.  However, the NY branch is a wholesale/cooperate type bank...they do not offer retail accounts for the common man.  You can still use them for remittance services but you can't get a retail bank account.   But even if they did provide you a bank account at the NY branch and you then wanted to do an "ACH" transfer they would still have to comply with the ACH IAT rules.  

 

Their Thai Baht Remittance Service is basically a pseudo-SWIFT transfer based on the form/info you must complete each time.

 

    

I certainly don't have a problem with a 'pseudo-SWIFT' transfer if it is reliable and gets me the proper code for doing my extension of stay.  The BBL transfer system was/is a bit clunky because you never knew what exchange rate you would get until the money arrived and it was/is definitely slow. What do you expect from the 'new' system?

[MeowBundit]

Will not be surprised if TW transfers will "magically" revert to "proper ones" like before July. Actually as soon as transfer actually sent out (and email come) can check receipt and know which bank is receiving one. 

[jacko45k]

20 hours ago, mfd101 said:

So you're saying that BKK Bank no longer uses the FTT tag for ANY transfer of funds from overseas? whether via TW or another bank?

That is not the case.

Transferwise used a different partner bank than Bangkok Bank in the case of this transfer and it was completed domestically. 

[Pumpuynarak]

18 hours ago, Pumpuynarak said:

I did a transfer at 10am Thai time and it was in my SCB account at 2pm same day. The costs are difficult to work out as the fee that SCB charge is hidden in the Baht transfer amount, they just deduct from the amount. I have read somewhere in all the topics it ranges from 300-500bht according to the amount transferred and that would stack up on the amount i received, of course SCB's rate is one of the worst so you also have that to contend with but i have the foreign transaction code guaranteed as its a direct swift transfer.

 

 

18 hours ago, Tanoshi said:

HSCB charge £4 for an online transfer up to £50,000.

The intermediary clearing bank will typically charge £20-£30.

You should always send in £'s and let the Thai bank convert to baht as the exchange rate is better.

Transfers typically take up to 4 working days.

 

https://www.hsbc.co.uk/1/2/!ut/p/c5/04_SB8K8xLLM9MSSzPy8xBz9CP0os3gPI08LDwMTIw__YCdjA0cz36AwS09zIwNzQ6B8pFm8s7ujh4m5j4GBQZinq4GniZOJgamvm6GBpzEB3QW5oYoAtburIA!!/

 

You mention intermediary clearing bank but to my knowledge there is no use of such as the transfer is Swift direct from HSBC to SCB.

[Tanoshi]

55 minutes ago, Pumpuynarak said:

 

You mention intermediary clearing bank but to my knowledge there is no use of such as the transfer is Swift direct from HSBC to SCB.

That is the local service fee for SCB converting your currency transfer to Thai baht.

 

If you look at your HSBC statement, you should find their £4 transfer fee listed.

All foreign bank transactions have to go through an intermediary clearing banks and these charges are usually made to your HSBC account up to two or three weeks after the transfer was made.

 

HSBC is actually one of the 4 main clearing banks in the UK, but transfer through one of their subsidiary branches in a different Country.

If you ask SCB for a full print out of the foreign transaction, it will provide the details of your HSBC account, plus the Intermediary bank involved, but will not provide charges made.

 

I suspect HSBC hide the actual transfer fees within the transaction itself.

It's vey easy to make a comparison of your actual charges by HSBC by comparing the amount you sent and received, then use the TW site entering the same sent amount and compare the difference in what you exactly received in THB through HSBC and what you would have received in THB through TW.

 

You could also calculate the transfer cost using Bangkok Banks London office to make the transfer and Bangkok Banks exchange rate as to what you'd receive as a comparison.

Edited July 17, 2019 by Tanoshi

[Pib]

14 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

That is the local service fee for SCB converting your currency transfer to Thai baht.

Actually it's a "receiving" (remittance) fee for an international transfer regardless of what currency arrives--even baht.   No exchange/conversion needs to take place for the fee to be applied.  

 

Now the fee does "not" apply to a Transferwise transfer as it's not arriving thru the SWIFT/ACH/BACS systems which are true international transfer systems compared to Transferwise's peer-to-peer transfer system/final leg of the transfer actually being domestic. 

Edited July 17, 2019 by Pib

[Pib]

12 hours ago, pookiki said:

I certainly don't have a problem with a 'pseudo-SWIFT' transfer if it is reliable and gets me the proper code for doing my extension of stay.  The BBL transfer system was/is a bit clunky because you never knew what exchange rate you would get until the money arrived and it was/is definitely slow. What do you expect from the 'new' system?

What do I expect from the new system?  Well, like my summary statement in my detailed review in the link I gave you earlier, it's a expensive, paper-based, slow system.  Review that link I gave before.

[Tanoshi]

33 minutes ago, Pib said:

Actually it's a "receiving" (remittance) fee for an international transfer regardless of what currency arrives--even baht.   No exchange/conversion needs to take place for the fee to be applied.  

In the case of SCB, possibly.

BKK call it an exchange fee.

Whichever it's an unwelcome fee for depositing funds into their bank.

[Pib]

23 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

In the case of SCB, possibly.

BKK call it an exchange fee.

Whichever it's an unwelcome fee for depositing funds into their bank.

 

A few snapshots from Bangkok Bank fee schedules.  It simply a "receiving" fee...it does not matter whether the funds arrive in a foreign currency or baht.   This way banksters make a fee even when they are not involved in the currency exchange.  

 

Also, been quite a few TV posts over the years who let their foreign sending bank convert to baht before sending and when those baht arrived the receiving fee is still applied.   

 

says receiving fee

 

says "transfer value"...weasel words regardless of what kinds of funds arrive...foreign or baht.

[soalbundy]

I don't know if this will be of any help. I wrote again to TW explaining our difficulties and asked for the email of their German office so that I could forewarn them that I wanted the partner bank to be BKK bank and I would telephone them before I sent any money. They wrote back in English so I don't suppose this came from the German office although maybe it did as I wrote in English. :-

 

Thanks for reaching out to us. I hope you're well. 

We do send money via Kasikorn Bank to ensure that our customers receive money within the delivery estimator. I have put a tag to your THB bank account so that the payment to the same receiving bank will be routed via Bangkok Bank. However, do note that there's no guarantee that it will be routed via Bangkok Bank as we have to factor in the possible technical difficulties / unforeseen issues in the preferred payment mode. 

On your end, you may request for the FET form which local Thai police will use this form to recognize the transfer as a foreign transfer. 

You'll need to reach out the nearest Kasikorn Bank International Trade Center (click here to find out the locations) and provide the following documents to them: 

1) Recipient Bank Savings Passbook or Statement showing the specific transaction
2) Passport of Recipient
3) Visa of Recipient 

Once you've given the above documents to Kasikorn Bank, they should be able to produce the FET form.

I hope that helps. Feel free to respond back to this email if you have further questions. We'd be happy to assist.

Best wishes, 
Natasha
TransferWise

I don't know what an FET form is and the addresses supplied didn't include an international trade center, an FX bank in Korat was included, a long way from me.

[lopburi3]

10 minutes ago, soalbundy said:

I don't know if this will be of any help. I wrote again to TW explaining our difficulties and asked for the email of their German office so that I could forewarn them that I wanted the partner bank to be BKK bank and I would telephone them before I sent any money. They wrote back in English so I don't suppose this came from the German office although maybe it did as I wrote in English. :-

 

Thanks for reaching out to us. I hope you're well. 

We do send money via Kasikorn Bank to ensure that our customers receive money within the delivery estimator. I have put a tag to your THB bank account so that the payment to the same receiving bank will be routed via Bangkok Bank. However, do note that there's no guarantee that it will be routed via Bangkok Bank as we have to factor in the possible technical difficulties / unforeseen issues in the preferred payment mode. 

On your end, you may request for the FET form which local Thai police will use this form to recognize the transfer as a foreign transfer. 

You'll need to reach out the nearest Kasikorn Bank International Trade Center (click here to find out the locations) and provide the following documents to them: 

1) Recipient Bank Savings Passbook or Statement showing the specific transaction
2) Passport of Recipient
3) Visa of Recipient 

Once you've given the above documents to Kasikorn Bank, they should be able to produce the FET form.

I hope that helps. Feel free to respond back to this email if you have further questions. We'd be happy to assist.

Best wishes, 
Natasha
TransferWise

I don't know what an FET form is and the addresses supplied didn't include an international trade center, an FX bank in Korat was included, a long way from me.

Believe they mean Foreign Exchange (international money exchange) authorized banks - only some handle such activity if like Bangkok Bank - believe those that have currency exchange desks.

Suspect FET would be Foreign Exchange Transaction (or something close).

Edited July 17, 2019 by lopburi3

[Pumpuynarak]

2 hours ago, Tanoshi said:

That is the local service fee for SCB converting your currency transfer to Thai baht.

 

If you look at your HSBC statement, you should find their £4 transfer fee listed.

All foreign bank transactions have to go through an intermediary clearing banks and these charges are usually made to your HSBC account up to two or three weeks after the transfer was made.

 

HSBC is actually one of the 4 main clearing banks in the UK, but transfer through one of their subsidiary branches in a different Country.

If you ask SCB for a full print out of the foreign transaction, it will provide the details of your HSBC account, plus the Intermediary bank involved, but will not provide charges made.

 

I suspect HSBC hide the actual transfer fees within the transaction itself.

It's vey easy to make a comparison of your actual charges by HSBC by comparing the amount you sent and received, then use the TW site entering the same sent amount and compare the difference in what you exactly received in THB through HSBC and what you would have received in THB through TW.

 

You could also calculate the transfer cost using Bangkok Banks London office to make the transfer and Bangkok Banks exchange rate as to what you'd receive as a comparison.

Thanks for your post, i'm on the case and will do as you suggest with my next transfer on 1st Aug and report back. I did do a small 100gbp transfer using Swift a week ago and only had the 4gbp charge from HSBC and then the hidden charge from SCB, here is the result.....

 

3473.75bht which equates to 34.73bht to the GBP but of course the SCB service fee has been taken off which i estimate to be 300bht so without the charge i would have received 37.73, that figure stacks up as SCB gives one of the worst rates in Thailand but at least i get the foreign transaction code, no other fees as yet from HSBC on my statement.

Edited July 17, 2019 by Pumpuynarak

[Pib]

Any intermediary bank fee will not show up on your Sending or Receiving bank statement...any intermediary fees are just sliced off as they flow thru the system...a little less arrives the receiving bank.  Like if you would go to SCB and ask how much arrived "before" they exchanged/posted to your account that would tell you the exact intermediary bank fee (if there was one).  If you sent 100 pounds but only 80 arrived the receiving bank then an intermediary bank sliced off 20 pounds. 

 

And the Thai bank receiving fee is not reflected on your statement either as that fee is applied before posting to your account. 

 

When people try to figure out the exchange rate they got they need to figure out what fee(s) were applied before the bank finally posted the funds....handed you the money.  Without adjusting for any such fees it can make it look like you got a really crappy exchange rate when in fact your got their normal TT Buying Rate used for incoming international transfers.  But bottomline, a person needs to fully analyse "both fees and exchange rate" to determine which way is the best deal....the best deal that gives the most baht at the least total cost.

 

 

 

Edited July 17, 2019 by Pib

[Sp4wnY]

Guess I will use another provider because else I will be liable to pay Thai Taxes if I can not proof that the money is made outside of Thailand.

Too bad really, byebye free transferwise transfers.

[billd766]

2 hours ago, Pib said:

Any intermediary bank fee will not show up on your Sending or Receiving bank statement...any intermediary fees are just sliced off as they flow thru the system...a little less arrives the receiving bank.  Like if you would go to SCB and ask how much arrived "before" they exchanged/posted to your account that would tell you the exact intermediary bank fee (if there was one).  If you sent 100 pounds but only 80 arrived the receiving bank then an intermediary bank sliced off 20 pounds. 

 

And the Thai bank receiving fee is not reflected on your statement either as that fee is applied before posting to your account. 

 

When people try to figure out the exchange rate they got they need to figure out what fee(s) were applied before the bank finally posted the funds....handed you the money.  Without adjusting for any such fees it can make it look like you got a really crappy exchange rate when in fact your got their normal TT Buying Rate used for incoming international transfers.  But bottomline, a person needs to fully analyse "both fees and exchange rate" to determine which way is the best deal....the best deal that gives the most baht at the least total cost.

 

 

 

I find that by using TW I know in advance how much I will pay in fees, what exchange rate I will be getting (it is guaranteed to stay at that rate until the transaction is completed) and when it will be in my bank account. I can track which way it came as well.

 

When I used to use the SWIFT method from my pension providers I knew how much was being sent in GBP but that was all. I had to work out what the exchange rate was that I had been given, and it was always lower than TW by 50 sating or more per GBP, but I never found out the actual costs of the transfer fees.

 

I figure on staying with TW for a while longer as so far I have found nothing better.

[Tanoshi]

8 hours ago, Pib said:

 

A few snapshots from Bangkok Bank fee schedules.  It simply a "receiving" fee...it does not matter whether the funds arrive in a foreign currency or baht.   This way banksters make a fee even when they are not involved in the currency exchange.  

 

Also, been quite a few TV posts over the years who let their foreign sending bank convert to baht before sending and when those baht arrived the receiving fee is still applied.   

 

says receiving fee

 

says "transfer value"...weasel words regardless of what kinds of funds arrive...foreign or baht.

Thanks for the update, I must admit it's been quite a while since I last viewed their website and note it was all updated last year. It used to be referred to as an exchange rate, now it's a transfer fee.

The charge of 0.25% remains the same though, with min and max applied.

[billd766]

10 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

Thanks for the update, I must admit it's been quite a while since I last viewed their website and note it was all updated last year. It used to be referred to as an exchange rate, now it's a transfer fee.

The charge of 0.25% remains the same though, with min and max applied.

Well the amount of baht I receive from BBL is the same figure that TW quote me and since January this year BBL have not charged me a transfer fee. The first one I got this month from BBL via KBank was the same, no transfer fee from either bank.

[Tanoshi]

8 hours ago, soalbundy said:

On your end, you may request for the FET form which local Thai police will use this form to recognize the transfer as a foreign transfer. 

The required form was described as just a 'Foreign Transaction' form by TW.

But Foreign Exchange Form (FET) as suggested by Pib sounds about right.

 

8 hours ago, soalbundy said:

You'll need to reach out the nearest Kasikorn Bank International Trade Center (click here to find out the locations) and provide the following documents to them: 

1) Recipient Bank Savings Passbook or Statement showing the specific transaction
2) Passport of Recipient
3) Visa of Recipient 

Once you've given the above documents to Kasikorn Bank, they should be able to produce the FET form.

Exactly as I discovered today after 2 hours in the local KK branch.

Chomphon Road, Nakhon Ratchasima is the nearest office, about a 4 hour 252Km drive from Roi Et and must be requested in person supplying the documents you advise above.

 

Wonder if they tell you to collect next day 

[Tanoshi]

9 minutes ago, billd766 said:

Well the amount of baht I receive from BBL is the same figure that TW quote me and since January this year BBL have not charged me a transfer fee. The first one I got this month from BBL via KBank was the same, no transfer fee from either bank.

The charges/fees we discussed Bill were for direct bank transfers, not transfers through TW.

[Pib]

23 minutes ago, billd766 said:

Well the amount of baht I receive from BBL is the same figure that TW quote me and since January this year BBL have not charged me a transfer fee. The first one I got this month from BBL via KBank was the same, no transfer fee from either bank.

The 0.25%  (Bt200 min, Bt500 max) fee does not apply to Transferwise fees since it not a traditional SWIFT/ACH/BACS type transfer....it's really not an incoming international transfer.  It's a peer-to-peer domestic transfer.

 

Now  BBL will code it as an international transfer if they are also the partner bank accomplishing the final leg of the transfer but that's just an in-house thing they do. 

[billd766]

2 hours ago, Tanoshi said:

The required form was described as just a 'Foreign Transaction' form by TW.

But Foreign Exchange Form (FET) as suggested by Pib sounds about right.

 

Exactly as I discovered today after 2 hours in the local KK branch.

Chomphon Road, Nakhon Ratchasima is the nearest office, about a 4 hour 252Km drive from Roi Et and must be requested in person supplying the documents you advise above.

 

Wonder if they tell you to collect next day 

I suspect that for me living on rural Khampaeng Phet the nearest Kasikorn Bank International Trade Center would be either in CM or BKK, each about 400 km away.

[soisanuk]

For those in Pattaya, appears to be Laem Chabang (Sriracha area).

https://kasikornbank.com/en/branch/Pages/result.aspx?q=dummy&option=6&lat=13.724599&lng=100.6331106

[Skeptic7]

On 7/13/2019 at 3:49 AM, Puchaiyank said:

I would think a transaction copy from your home bank showing the money to Transferwise being withdrawn from your account would work to verify the origin of the transfer.

Makes sense...so exactly the reason it won't work here, nor be understood, nor considered, nor cared about. Of course "we" would think so...but thinking is something in very short supply here on the Thai side. 

[billd766]

I got 2 payments from TW yesterday having called them to confirm that they would be using BBL.

 

Updated my passbook this morning. Both FTT.