Reliability. Honda vs Yamaha

[NoshowJones]

4 minutes ago, Mavideol said:

I like it but it's big and not easy to move around as I do with the Click

But the PCX is far more suitable than the click for longer journeys.

[CGW]

5 minutes ago, tlandtday said:

yes many reports of blown engines under 10k due to lack of oil to the engine... maybe why these aerox and nmax motors sound so rough at low rpm...

Where I live these bikes are Never run at low RPM, flat out so all can share the horrendous noise coming from the aftermarket 'exhaust" 

[tlandtday]

5 minutes ago, SteveK said:

Yamaha has a quoted failure rate of 11%, Honda 12%, so Yamaha is technically more reliable but there's not much in it. My last decade or so in the UK, I only ever bought Yamahas as the first one I bought was totally bullet proof. I had an R6 and an R1 and aside from routine maintenance nothing ever went wrong, and I drove them pretty hard all over the UK. Saying that, I had a Honda that never broke down also, I would say any of the Jap bikes should be reliable, although I'm not sure how big bike reliability related to scooter reliability but I suppose it should be a good indicator of the company's quality control. A lot of Thais seem to only buy Honda Waves, and I can see why, they just seem to keep going forever, even without proper maintenance.

I think Yamaha build quality may exceed Honda in some of their bikes but their current nmax and aerox are designed to undercut Honda's pricing and that has mean undercutting the quality of many components.  I really like both bikes but looking at the quality of body parts ranging from fuel filler caps to panels the quality is not good.  Additionally reported problems with the engines lacking oil have kept me from purchasing until I can see how these bikes hold out. I can say with confidence the honda scooter motors are superior to yamaha.  It will also be interesting to see how long the abs lasts on the yamahas as it will be expensive to replace.  So much of the production is being sent to China by so many companies it is bound to have a negative effect on quality as they penny pinch.

[Mavideol]

3 minutes ago, possum1931 said:

But the PCX is far more suitable than the click for longer journeys.

understand and appreciate the feed back, most of my driving around town is with the scooter, max one way around 30-35 kms if longer than that or out of town will take the car, thus my hesitation

[stubby52]

I have a 2012 PCX and can still get around 40k for it but at the local bike shops i saw several 2yr old aerox could be had for about the same,it's just because the thai's prefer honda and the very high price for the PCX(98k) a friend has had a 125 model and has done 70k kms with no serious problems ever but for around town a click is more practical you can fit a box of beer on the flat floor and lots of shopping.

[motorcycguy]

As a  resent Aerox owner  I am very satisfied. I bought the lower model that doesn't have  keyless ignition, however I'm enjoying the front ABS feature. When test-driving a Honda PCX 150 I ended up hitting the front brake too hard and stopping it with some damage. That was enough for me to decide on the Yamaha. If Honda offers dual abs I would buy it.

[Kinnock]

On 8/9/2019 at 12:39 PM, Farangwithaplan said:

There is more to that story. I'm willing to wager that piston has not ended up in that condition through normal use or with the bike receiving standard servicing. There must have been damage imposed in either the cooling or oil delivery service from misuse or impact damage or a lost sump plug or whatever. That piston damage is not caused through normal operating conditions.

 

..... and that's a big looking piston for a 155cc scooter?

[Moonlover]

2 hours ago, Daniel Laraway said:

As a  resent Aerox owner  I am very satisfied. I bought the lower model that doesn't have  keyless ignition, however I'm enjoying the front ABS feature. When test-driving a Honda PCX 150 I ended up hitting the front brake too hard and stopping it with some damage. That was enough for me to decide on the Yamaha. If Honda offers dual abs I would buy it.

You have me a bit confused Daniel. I have the Aerox brochure with me right now and it indicates that only the ABS version is actually fitted with ABS. The sales lady also told me the same thing.

 

The ABS version is definitely my 1st choice at 76,000 THB. I was looking at the R version in the showroom at 72,000 THB, but was told it did not have ABS, although rather strangely, it does have the slotted sensing ring.

 

You have me puzzled.

[Moonlover]

5 hours ago, tlandtday said:

yes many reports of blown engines under 10k due to lack of oil to the engine... maybe why these aerox and nmax motors sound so rough at low rpm..

Where are these 'many reports' and just how does a brand new engine end up with no oil in it?

[scubascuba3]

What's the Earox? sounds weird.

Honda Click 125i is perfect around town. Isn't the 150 the same size?

I've had the 125i for 20 months and its been flawless

[Mavideol]

40 minutes ago, Moonlover said:

You have me a bit confused Daniel. I have the Aerox brochure with me right now and it indicates that only the ABS version is actually fitted with ABS. The sales lady also told me the same thing.

 

The ABS version is definitely my 1st choice at 76,000 THB. I was looking at the R version in the showroom at 72,000 THB, but was told it did not have ABS, although rather strangely, it does have the slotted sensing ring.

 

You have me puzzled.

you are correct, yesterday (Friday) sales person confirmed that and I was offered a discount to 69,400 instead of 74,600 listing price with ABS

[Mavideol]

32 minutes ago, Moonlover said:

Where are these 'many reports' and just how does a brand new engine end up with no oil in it?

4 years old Clock still do oil change every 3 months (regardless of the Kms driven) .... scooter same as car need to maintain to keep in good shape/condition (wash car wash scooter)

[Moonlover]

Thanks to all for your inputs. Following a final prowl around the showrooms today, the decision is made.

 

As soon as immigration have approved my next extension, I'll be buying an Yamaha Aerox ABS.

 

And I'm looking forward to lots of fun.

 

 

[papa al]

On 8/8/2019 at 11:32 PM, lust said:

Aerox and Nmax have oil problems. Many come through my friend’s shop in need of new pistons. 

 

I would argue that they have better performance, but less reliability than the pcx.

...that will buff out...

[WhatsNext]

20 hours ago, stubby52 said:

I have a 2012 PCX and can still get around 40k for it but at the local bike shops i saw several 2yr old aerox could be had for about the same

Of course, the aerox is 63k new and the PCX, although the RRP is 83, is 93k ! 

You will lose about 20k on a 2 year old Aerox and about 30k on a 2 year old PCX

 

And as a side question to the Aerox owners : Do you sit with open legs on the thing, or how do you store your knees ?

[jaideedave]

On 8/9/2019 at 12:32 PM, lust said:

Aerox and Nmax have oil problems. Many come through my friend’s shop in need of new pistons. 

 

I would argue that they have better performance, but less reliability than the pcx.

I've been riding a Honda PCX for the last 7 years.Perfect for me .Very reliable .I had a Click previous to this bike and the fuel tank was too small on the Click...looking for gas all the time.Only top up the PCX twice a month or less.Can't beat Honda for reliability...period.

[Moonlover]

16 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

What's the Earox? sounds weird.

A badly spelt Aerox. My fault right back at the start. ????

 

[wwest5829]

It was time to trade my Honda 110cc Airblade after 7 years and, ahem! bit of weight gain. The Honda PCX 150cc was priced at 89,000. Compared it to the Yamaha 155cc Aerox at 61,000 (and trade-in took off another 10K). I looked for underseat storage as well as a consideration. Quite happy with the Aerox after 8 months.

[transam]

Our PCX is now in it's 11th year, no ploblems...One battery and brakes relined..

[zaZa9]

My Thai lady has 22 scooters , and its both her and my opinion that the Honda is a better build.

Her NMaxes have such a thin black coat that they start oxidising almost straight up on the springs and mirror stalks . 

The Yamahas are noisy and lazy starters across the range.

The Honda 150cc should be the bees knees , but they have no kick start which really ruins it for me , and the PCX carrying space is sill small unless you add a box.

The new Click 125i is all I  ever borrow from her.

555

[scubascuba3]

My Thai lady has 22 scooters , and its both her and my opinion that the Honda is a better build.
Her NMaxes have such a thin black coat that they start oxidising almost straight up on the springs and mirror stalks . 
The Yamahas are noisy and lazy starters across the range.
The Honda 150cc should be the bees knees , but they have no kick start which really ruins it for me , and the PCX carrying space is sill small unless you add a box.
The new Click 125i is all I  ever borrow from her.
555

A lot of good experience there. Do you know whether a full face helmet fits under the seat of a 2017 Honda Click 125i?

[zaZa9]

Yes , the new ( and last  2 models)  Honda Click 125i , and  the new Click 150cc   have  the same  size  compartment and certainly fits a full face helmet .. But not a ff helmet AND  another helmet  in there as well .... On the Clicks  it has  little nodules to hook a 2nd helmet on to nr the front hinge on the seat....so the pillions helmet hangs outside  but the straps are safe  under the seat.

The PCX tries to do the same ,  it  has a tool kit and within it is a little extension cable to do the same via the cable and an underseat hook - fiddly to say the least.

Both PCX  and the Yamahas market a bigger capacity for  storage , but I havent met anyone who doesnt complain the space is just long and too shallow.

Honestly the NMax struggles to fit a ff helmet.

You almost have to bend the seat to close it.

All  bikes bar the Click have a hump between your knees ... meaning you cant slide a box of beer  across the 'step thru' floor , nor a ( soft ) bag when I travel  , or hang mutli bags of shopping easy on the front standard  and unobtrusive  hook.

You need to buy and fit a front hook on all the bigger bikes , tho they are cheap to add on.

The gf fitted one on one of her PCXs and that helps , but it sticks up and looks dangerous to me.

I go on about this aspect only because , for both of us its a constant pain to be turning the key to the exact spot and always opening the underseat for everything , only to forget an item and do it all again. And the NMax and Areox opener is even worse than the PCX for (in)convenience.

Some people are fine with the above , but we arent.

I also like my water handy , and the PCX water holder is bad. Yammy wins on that , but the Clicks  holder is the best size.

Dunno if you like the phone recharger option already fitted , but only the Hondas offer that ... so too idle stop.. ( in traffic it does save fuel ).

The NMax offers abs and front and back disc braking , and there is  no doubt they stop the best. In stop start traffic the abs is a winner. Areox doesnt measure up ...

But I hate the fact our Yammies  dont 'coast along' toward a stop  like the  Hondas , we are forever powering up or down - they never seem to just glide into the next duty , they are much more jerky doing their job. Honda beats them hands down on smoothness.

 

Back to their  finish, where Honda wins easily , which may well be  reflected in Hondas bigger price ( and less depreciation - Im seeing 2 year old Aeroxes at 45k ).

Yamaha has for some reason chosen not to put an extra coat on anything black - we live near the sea and most things metal and black started going white within months .

Get an Aerox/Nmax , and buy a can of WD40 straight up and start using it immediately.

 

Not so Honda , but the handle bar and chrome would need it after a year or 2 as well , 'chrome' being what it is today. But Hondas metal clips/horn etc , easily stay blacker longer.

A huge criticism of Yamaha , is having to replace the front forks on one of her NMaxs after just 4,000 kms because  one 'stem' got a small  rust bubble on it  that was tearing the shock seal as it depressed and caused the shock seal to leak. "No wallanteee" on that part btw , surprise suprise , and  the bill was 3,800 baht. ( 18 months old ).

If you look at the front forks , Hondas chrome is way superior , click or PCX.

 

And Ive checked ot the Aerox , and its an inferior build yet again to the NMax ...only in my opinion , of course.

 

I borrow her scooters constantly.

If Im going on tour I take a PCX , with a top box ,  and down size my luggage -  over newer NMax's  also with a box to.

And thats every time... theres way more Honda shops than Yamaha shops should I need one as well.

But  for longer distance with a full ( soft ) bag  , and around the towns daily  I'd rather a nifty - squeeze thru traffic , Click.

I actually had my heart set on  buying a new 150 Click until I saw that it was based on a PCX and  therefore had no kick start.

Another negative was the Click 150  had 'keyless ignition' ....

What ?

So is it really a dead ( battery ) reliable scooter?

You cant start if the battery is kaput , and you cant start it if the remotes battery is dead or wet and you cant  even just start it  with a spare key ?

 

I'll just be buying a very late model 125i now instead  ...

Why?

I can pick up one in top condition and maybe 1 year old with 3000 to 5000 on the clock for 38k baht or so.

Then , when it has 35k  done trouble free kms on it in 3 or 4 years time , as Ive seen so many times with my girlfriends bikes , I'll sell it for 20k.  ( btw , she only seems to change the oil regularly and they go and go )

 

The  only issues shes had with her 125s is LED  speedo fade , and lots of bulb replacements.

 

Hope this helps.

 

 

 

 

 

Its no coincidence you see so many 'top boxes' on the NMax , and lately quite a few PCX.

[idman]

My two cents, get at least a 150 CC. scooter with ABS brakes if you want performance and safety. That narrows your choices

Sent from my CMR-AL19 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[Moonlover]

6 hours ago, zaZa9 said:

I actually had my heart set on  buying a new 150 Click until I saw that it was based on a PCX and  therefore had no kick start.

Another negative was the Click 150  had 'keyless ignition' ....

What ?

So is it really a dead ( battery ) reliable scooter?

You cant start if the battery is kaput , and you cant start it if the remotes battery is dead or wet and you cant  even just start it  with a spare key ?

I share your sentiments regarding the Click. We've had one for four years now and it has passed every test we've thrown at it, especially with regards to reliability.

 

The Click 150cc is my second choice after the Aerox ABS and as both are keyless and lack a kick start, I am in no way deterred from buying either on those grounds. But are these factors really a problem?

 

The only time our Click let us down was when I came out of a village shop and found that I had a flat battery and I had to kick start it. A point in your favour you might say, but not really.

 

I had, in fact been ignoring the symptoms of a dying battery for a couple of weeks or so and kept saying to myself 'I really must get a new battery'. Had I followed the basic rules of preventive maintenance it wouldn't have happened.

 

Likewise with the key fob. Simply replace the (very cheap) battery say, every two years, and you should never have a problem.

 

I'm a great fan of the Click and I may yet end up buying a new 150cc. The main Yamaha and Honda dealers are right next door to each other, it's simply a case of turning left instead of right.

 

Happy riding. ML

[scubascuba3]

I share your sentiments regarding the Click. We've had one for four years now and it has passed every test we've thrown at it, especially with regards to reliability.
 
The Click 150cc is my second choice after the Aerox ABS and as both are keyless and lack a kick start, I am in no way deterred from buying either on those grounds. But are these factors really a problem?
 
The only time our Click let us down was when I came out of a village shop and found that I had a flat battery and I had to kick start it. A point in your favour you might say, but not really.
 
I had, in fact been ignoring the symptoms of a dying battery for a couple of weeks or so and kept saying to myself 'I really must get a new battery'. Had I followed the basic rules of preventive maintenance it wouldn't have happened.
 
Likewise with the key fob. Simply replace the (very cheap) battery say, every two years, and you should never have a problem.
 
I'm a great fan of the Click and I may yet end up buying a new 150cc. The main Yamaha and Honda dealers are right next door to each other, it's simply a case of turning left instead of right.
 
Happy riding. ML

I've seen some dated Aerox's around so I'm not sure how well the paint job lasts. Looks nice initially for sure. Plus factor in potential scratching depending on where you park. I have a Click 125i which is perfect except the 150i has a better choice of colours

[losworld]

On 8/12/2019 at 3:04 AM, zaZa9 said:

Yes , the new ( and last  2 models)  Honda Click 125i , and  the new Click 150cc   have  the same  size  compartment and certainly fits a full face helmet .. But not a ff helmet AND  another helmet  in there as well .... On the Clicks  it has  little nodules to hook a 2nd helmet on to nr the front hinge on the seat....so the pillions helmet hangs outside  but the straps are safe  under the seat.

The PCX tries to do the same ,  it  has a tool kit and within it is a little extension cable to do the same via the cable and an underseat hook - fiddly to say the least.

Both PCX  and the Yamahas market a bigger capacity for  storage , but I havent met anyone who doesnt complain the space is just long and too shallow.

Honestly the NMax struggles to fit a ff helmet.

You almost have to bend the seat to close it.

All  bikes bar the Click have a hump between your knees ... meaning you cant slide a box of beer  across the 'step thru' floor , nor a ( soft ) bag when I travel  , or hang mutli bags of shopping easy on the front standard  and unobtrusive  hook.

You need to buy and fit a front hook on all the bigger bikes , tho they are cheap to add on.

The gf fitted one on one of her PCXs and that helps , but it sticks up and looks dangerous to me.

I go on about this aspect only because , for both of us its a constant pain to be turning the key to the exact spot and always opening the underseat for everything , only to forget an item and do it all again. And the NMax and Areox opener is even worse than the PCX for (in)convenience.

Some people are fine with the above , but we arent.

I also like my water handy , and the PCX water holder is bad. Yammy wins on that , but the Clicks  holder is the best size.

Dunno if you like the phone recharger option already fitted , but only the Hondas offer that ... so too idle stop.. ( in traffic it does save fuel ).

The NMax offers abs and front and back disc braking , and there is  no doubt they stop the best. In stop start traffic the abs is a winner. Areox doesnt measure up ...

But I hate the fact our Yammies  dont 'coast along' toward a stop  like the  Hondas , we are forever powering up or down - they never seem to just glide into the next duty , they are much more jerky doing their job. Honda beats them hands down on smoothness.

 

Back to their  finish, where Honda wins easily , which may well be  reflected in Hondas bigger price ( and less depreciation - Im seeing 2 year old Aeroxes at 45k ).

Yamaha has for some reason chosen not to put an extra coat on anything black - we live near the sea and most things metal and black started going white within months .

Get an Aerox/Nmax , and buy a can of WD40 straight up and start using it immediately.

 

Not so Honda , but the handle bar and chrome would need it after a year or 2 as well , 'chrome' being what it is today. But Hondas metal clips/horn etc , easily stay blacker longer.

A huge criticism of Yamaha , is having to replace the front forks on one of her NMaxs after just 4,000 kms because  one 'stem' got a small  rust bubble on it  that was tearing the shock seal as it depressed and caused the shock seal to leak. "No wallanteee" on that part btw , surprise suprise , and  the bill was 3,800 baht. ( 18 months old ).

If you look at the front forks , Hondas chrome is way superior , click or PCX.

 

And Ive checked ot the Aerox , and its an inferior build yet again to the NMax ...only in my opinion , of course.

 

I borrow her scooters constantly.

If Im going on tour I take a PCX , with a top box ,  and down size my luggage -  over newer NMax's  also with a box to.

And thats every time... theres way more Honda shops than Yamaha shops should I need one as well.

But  for longer distance with a full ( soft ) bag  , and around the towns daily  I'd rather a nifty - squeeze thru traffic , Click.

I actually had my heart set on  buying a new 150 Click until I saw that it was based on a PCX and  therefore had no kick start.

Another negative was the Click 150  had 'keyless ignition' ....

What ?

So is it really a dead ( battery ) reliable scooter?

You cant start if the battery is kaput , and you cant start it if the remotes battery is dead or wet and you cant  even just start it  with a spare key ?

 

I'll just be buying a very late model 125i now instead  ...

Why?

I can pick up one in top condition and maybe 1 year old with 3000 to 5000 on the clock for 38k baht or so.

Then , when it has 35k  done trouble free kms on it in 3 or 4 years time , as Ive seen so many times with my girlfriends bikes , I'll sell it for 20k.  ( btw , she only seems to change the oil regularly and they go and go )

 

The  only issues shes had with her 125s is LED  speedo fade , and lots of bulb replacements.

 

Hope this helps.

 

 

 

 

 

Its no coincidence you see so many 'top boxes' on the NMax , and lately quite a few PCX.

very good breakdown.... I assume she has not had engine issues with the 155 cc yamahas? how many km on the yammys?  in fairness to yamaha they can and do build excellent bikes but as i mentioned they did some cutting to bring such competitive pricing on their 155cc models.  sure honda has more markup but some of it is quality.  honda engines are far smoother for sure.  one of the easiest cost reduction exercises for a manufacturer is put in cheap shocks or suspension and it appears yamaha has done this as i have seen many nmax and aerox with either replacement shocks or forks up for sale.  i like the bikes a lot but the quality/longevity is questionable until more time passes.  hey the gt125 is a good little low cost bike from yamaha similar to the click and should be considered by many here.

[losworld]

On 8/11/2019 at 10:18 AM, wwest5829 said:

It was time to trade my Honda 110cc Airblade after 7 years and, ahem! bit of weight gain. The Honda PCX 150cc was priced at 89,000. Compared it to the Yamaha 155cc Aerox at 61,000 (and trade-in took off another 10K). I looked for underseat storage as well as a consideration. Quite happy with the Aerox after 8 months.

how is the aerox comparing with your airblade.... the airblade was a high quality bike and it still exists in vietnam and other countries in a 125cc version.  i wish honda would have put a 150cc in the airblade and sold it here.  the nmax reminds me of a larger airblade but i believe the airblade is higher quality.

[wwest5829]

14 minutes ago, losworld said:

how is the aerox comparing with your airblade.... the airblade was a high quality bike and it still exists in vietnam and other countries in a 125cc version.  i wish honda would have put a 150cc in the airblade and sold it here.  the nmax reminds me of a larger airblade but i believe the airblade is higher quality.

Cost was a consideration for me. I live on the 3rd ring road in CM so it’s a bit of a drive into the city but I also have a car for inclement weather. No issues for me riding almost every day. Oh, and the Aerox comes with an electric plug for charging my iPhone. Certainly feel the additional power over the 110cc Airblade.

[Noob81]

Honda is fine as long as you stay away from Zoomer and especially MSX. Both have amazingly bad blinkers which fall apart after about 1.5 years (UV I guess), you gotta buy new ones every time at 500 baht/piece. 2k every 1.5-2 years is a lot compared to regular 4000 km maintenance procedures which cost couple of hundred of baht.

My MSX is an absolute disaster. I hardly drive it, 5000 km in 5 years, had to replace half of the bike already (fuel pump, LCD speedo, front wheel hub bearing, which is falling apart again by the way, battery, blinkers - numerous times), ignition wiring got loose at some point, had to learn jump start