Opponents of 'no-deal' Brexit defeat PM Johnson, who promises an election

[sirineou]

8 minutes ago, Joinaman said:

would appreciate it very much if you could give me the facts to back up your statement

Could you give me the true facts on the consequences of leaving, as opposed to the consequences of staying ?

I her so may people saying how really bad it will be to leave, but unsurprisingly , they can never back this up with any facts

Even our so called M Ps can not give true facts about the cost of leaving, against the true cost of staying

Can you, or is it just your misguided opinion 

Why can you all be honest and state the truth, you have no idea what will happen if we leave, and why do you refuse to accept the changes and costs that the Lisbon treaty will make on the UK

 

The subject has being discussed at nauseum 

 If you don't by now know the consequences of a no deal leaving,Nothing anyone can say would help you.

A simple google search "cost of no deal brexit" will give you the answers you seek.

Good luck.

 

 

[vogie]

3 minutes ago, sirineou said:

The subject has being discussed at nauseum 

 If you don't by now know the consequences of a no deal leaving,Nothing anyone can say would help you.

A simple google search "cost of no deal brexit" will give you the answers you seek.

Good luck.

 

 

The Chief Economist from Deutche Bank disagrees with you, but I guess you know best.

 

 

[JamesBlond]

51 minutes ago, johnnybangkok said:

We have asked Leavers about the benefits many, many times. 

It's got something to do with getting back the sovereignty we never lost; not cowtowing to a 'Federalist Super State' (despite said superstate working very well for the man on the street) and of course their old favourite of taking charge of our borders even though we've always been in charge of them.

That's about it.

Blinkered and short-sighted. I wonder what 'man on the street' you are talking about? Presumably an immigrant as only they could benefit from the bleeding heart-leftist-inclusivist social policies that have been quietly herding them in. Personally I don't even want to go back to Britain even for a visit - it's no longer Britain - I don't know what it is, some kind of cultural experiment gone badly wrong. And it's not just Britain, look at the mess that Europe has made of itself ? Now the far right are on the rise - quite predictably - as a result. The whole mad experiment needs to be stopped.

You can have your precious trade deals when all that is over.

[metisdead]

Posts of a racist nature and the replies have been removed. 

 

Troll posts and the replies have been removed. 

 

[Jip99]

43 minutes ago, bangrak said:

...Aren't you lying, Jip99?

 

 

I might be Bangrak..... ????

[brewsterbudgen]

The people appoint (elect) parliament. The two main parties in this parliament both stood on manifestoes to honour the results of the 2016 referendum, and to take the UK out of the EU. In 2016, and in the 2017 election, the people voted to leave the EU.
 
As manifesto betrayals go, this is about as egregious as they get!

Nobody voted to leave without a deal. Why do Leavers seem to think time stands still. Move on, please.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[oldhippy]

12 minutes ago, JamesBlond said:

Blinkered and short-sighted. I wonder what 'man on the street' you are talking about? Presumably an immigrant as only they could benefit from the bleeding heart-leftist-inclusivist social policies that have been quietly herding them in. Personally I don't even want to go back to Britain even for a visit - it's no longer Britain - I don't know what it is, some kind of cultural experiment gone badly wrong. And it's not just Britain, look at the mess that Europe has made of itself ? Now the far right are on the rise - quite predictably - as a result. The whole mad experiment needs to be stopped.

You can have your precious trade deals when all that is over.

That's exactly what I was saying.

Economics don't play any part in the discussion about brexit.

It's about a white UK.

And the whites have to be protestant as well.

 

 

[sirineou]

4 minutes ago, vogie said:

The Chief Economist from Deutche Bank disagrees with you, but I guess you know best.

 

 

 Like I said, "if you don't know by now" ........

I am sure you can find  experts that can agree with your opinion, The overwhelming opinion and reports are that a no deal brexit will have a negative affect on the UK economy,As I said a simple google search will give you the answers you seek.

Even your expert admits that there will be negative economic  effects but thinks without analysing why,  that in the long term it will recover.

That's the economic effects, How about the political and social effects?

The value of the pound is a reflection of the strength of a UK economy,  Would a Scottish independance and or an Irish reunification make the UK economy stronger? 

Would a weaker / smaller Uk have the same negotiating power? 

  

[vogie]

4 minutes ago, sirineou said:

 Like I said, "if you don't know by now" ........

I am sure you can find  experts that can agree with your opinion, The overwhelming opinion and reports are that a no deal brexit will have a negative affect on the UK economy,As I said a simple google search will give you the answers you seek.

Even your expert admits that there will be negative economic  effects but thinks without analysing why,  that in the long term it will recover.

That's the economic effects, How about the political and social effects?

The value of the pound is a reflection of the strength of a UK economy,  Would a Scottish independance and or an Irish reunification make the UK economy stronger? 

Would a weaker / smaller Uk have the same negotiating power? 

  

Again you are guessing, the UK is strong enough to retain our United Kingdom, sorry if this doesn't go along with your rhetoric.

But when I want to know whats happening with Brexit I always check your posts, they are always so informative, so thanks for that.

[DannyCarlton]

2 hours ago, Percy P said:

Brexit Party will come to the add of the PM .Farage isn't going to be defeated by the rebel MPs

Remind me. How many MP's does the Brexit party have?

[oldhippy]

29 minutes ago, vogie said:

The Chief Economist from Deutche Bank disagrees with you, but I guess you know best.

 

Corbyn better than no-deal Brexit, say investment banks as anti-capitalist Labour wins unlikely new City fans

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2019/09/03/corbyn-better-no-deal-brexit-say-investment-banks-anti-capitalist/

 

So Vogie, this settles it:

No deal brexit and Corbyn takes over - I think we can agree at last!

 

[kingdong]

12 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Great news for those who wanted Parliament back in control.

parliament?that rabble,all these remainers will be laughing on the other side of their faces when momentum,sorry corbyn get in,or will it be another "coalition"throw a few of the fringe parties in for good measure,see how "the markets" react to that,well don,t delay changing your £s to baht,25-£1 coming soon,remainers?talk about turkeys voting for an early christmas,and don,t forget who it was that nutted the hornets nest.

[dunroaming]

Question time on at the moment.  Johnson in denial and not answering any points put to him.  Just throwing insults at Corbyn.  Playground stuff and very embarrassing.  No wonder the world is laughing at us.

[nauseus]

4 minutes ago, oldhippy said:

Corbyn better than no-deal Brexit, say investment banks as anti-capitalist Labour wins unlikely new City fans

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2019/09/03/corbyn-better-no-deal-brexit-say-investment-banks-anti-capitalist/

 

So Vogie, this settles it:

No deal brexit and Corbyn takes over - I think we can agree at last!

 

Investment banks are just highly funded ponzi schemes.

[kingdong]

45 minutes ago, oldhippy said:

Oh please.

 

Let's stop talking about the benefits / disadvantages of brexit for the economy.

They are not relevant for the discussion.

Brexit has nothing to do with economics.

 

Brexit is about a very white UK, as it existed once upon a time - it died together with the dinosaurs (ok ok, I admit there are some dinosaurs left in these brexit threads).

if in doubht or confused just play the race card.

[bannork]

3 minutes ago, Joinaman said:

would appreciate it very much if you could give me the facts to back up your statement

Could you give me the true facts on the consequences of leaving, as opposed to the consequences of staying ?

I her so may people saying how really bad it will be to leave, but unsurprisingly , they can never back this up with any facts

Even our so called M Ps can not give true facts about the cost of leaving, against the true cost of staying

Can you, or is it just your misguided opinion 

Why can you all be honest and state the truth, you have no idea what will happen if we leave, and why do you refuse to accept the changes and costs that the Lisbon treaty will make on the UK

 

Nobody can give precise figures about the cost of leaving because no country has ever left a trading bloc before but consequences can be foreseen.

With no deal, businesses would not know whether or when there would ever be any sort of preferential trading arrangement going beyond WTO commitments with the EU.

The EU have repeatedly said if the UK is not prepared to accept any of the obligations of Single Market and Customs Union membership, then it can't expect to continue trading on similar terms to those enjoyed by members.

After exit, even the opening of any trade negotiation requires unanimity amongst the 27 members.

On ‘mini deals' the legislation the 27 put in place to govern economic relations with the UK after a no deal exit, there has been no consultation with the UK, let alone negotiations.

EU regulators across many sectors will press firms after a ‘no deal’ to comply with their requirements about location and ownership.

No trade deal with the USA, China and India will ever be agreed without delivering major economic dividends for them.

Much more of our trade is with Europe – notably in services, in which the UK is highly competitive and all cross-border trade liberalisation is immensely difficult, precisely because it inevitably impinges heavily on domestic regulatory sovereignty. What terms will they offer to a country that has just left the bloc?

We export more services to the EU than to our next eight markets put together.

Any ‘no deal’ exit will force us to negotiate from a position of complete vulnerability.

 

 

 

 

[kingdong]

2 minutes ago, nauseus said:

Investment banks are just highly funded ponzi schemes.

and when they screw up  like in 2008,think its their god given right for the government to bail them out

[oldhippy]

6 minutes ago, kingdong said:

parliament?that rabble,all these remainers will be laughing on the other side of their faces when momentum,sorry corbyn get in,or will it be another "coalition"throw a few of the fringe parties in for good measure,see how "the markets" react to that,well don,t delay changing your £s to baht,25-£1 coming soon,remainers?talk about turkeys voting for an early christmas,and don,t forget who it was that nutted the hornets nest.

QUOTE: parliament?that rabble

 

Yep, says it all.

 

[oldhippy]

4 minutes ago, kingdong said:

if in doubht or confused just play the race card.

Thank you for confirming my point.

[kingdong]

2 minutes ago, bannork said:

Nobody can give precise figures about the cost of leaving because no country has ever left a trading bloc before but consequences can be foreseen.

With no deal, businesses would not know whether or when there would ever be any sort of preferential trading arrangement going beyond WTO commitments with the EU.

The EU have repeatedly said if the UK is not prepared to accept any of the obligations of Single Market and Customs Union membership, then it can't expect to continue trading on similar terms to those enjoyed by members.

After exit, even the opening of any trade negotiation requires unanimity amongst the 27 members.

On ‘mini deals' the legislation the 27 put in place to govern economic relations with the UK after a no deal exit, there has been no consultation with the UK, let alone negotiations.

EU regulators across many sectors will press firms after a ‘no deal’ to comply with their requirements about location and ownership.

No trade deal with the USA, China and India will ever be agreed without delivering major economic dividends for them.

Much more of our trade is with Europe – notably in services, in which the UK is highly competitive and all cross-border trade liberalisation is immensely difficult, precisely because it inevitably impinges heavily on domestic regulatory sovereignty. What terms will they offer to a country that has just left the bloc?

We export more services to the EU than to our next eight markets put together.

Any ‘no deal’ exit will force us to negotiate from a position of complete vulnerability.

 

 

 

 

yet it is the antics of the remainers making a good deal [[not that scheme may tried to push through that would have kept us in forever]possible,well you,ve got what you set out to do,mob rules prevailed,and you know what,it,ll be the remainers who are going to suffer most in the coming years.

[kingdong]

4 minutes ago, oldhippy said:

Thank you for confirming my point.

i was talking about you.

[oldhippy]

2 minutes ago, kingdong said:

yet it is the antics of the remainers making a good deal [[not that scheme may tried to push through that would have kept us in forever]possible,well you,ve got what you set out to do,mob rules prevailed,and you know what,it,ll be the remainers who are going to suffer most in the coming years.

You are getting emotional - who will pick up the toys you are throwing out of the pram? And I think that the average immigrant has a better command of English than you.

 

[yogi100]

2 hours ago, Nigel Garvie said:

Never watched the HoC live before it seems!

No strong drink should be permitted anywhere near the HoP let alone tax payer funded subsidised bars! 

 

It was just a few years back that investigators found traces of cocaine in all the toilets of the Parliamentary buildings yet that was soon covered up and swept under the carpet.

 

Little wonder there is concern about alcohol and cocaine addiction among the middle classes. Our politicians are probably the ones that set the trend.

[Mike Teavee]

3 hours ago, adammike said:

It's the British Isles that's the geographical term,Great Britain is a political term I think!

Great Britain is actually an Island, as it name suggests it's the largest of the British Isles...

Great Britain is an island in the North Atlantic Ocean off the northwest coast of continental Europe. With an area of 209,331 km² (80,823 sq mi), it is the largest of the British Isles, the largest European island, and the ninth-largest island in the world.^{[6][note 1]} In 2011, Great Britain had a population of about 61 million people, making it the world's third-most populous island after Java in Indonesia and Honshu in Japan.^[8][9] The island of Ireland is situated to the west of Great Britain, and together these islands, along with over 1,000 smaller surrounding islands, form the British Isles archipelago.^[10]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Britain  

 

...  but is also a Political term used to describe the Union of England, Scotland & Wales... So if Scottish Independence happens, then Scotland would leave Great Britain (The Political Term) but still be part of Great Britain (The Island) ???? 

 

Anyway the point I was originally trying to make was that Brexit impacts the whole of the UK not just England or Great Britain 

 

 

[oldhippy]

Come on Vogie.

Make up your mind.

 

 

First you post: 

"The Chief Economist from Deutche Bank disagrees with you, but I guess you know best."

 

Next you put a "like" emoticon with

20 minutes ago, nauseus said:

Investment banks are just highly funded ponzi schemes.

and when they screw up  like in 2008,think its their god given right for the government to bail them out

 

[DannyCarlton]

3 hours ago, bristolboy said:

Actually, Krugman didn't say that. First off, the Euro came after there were common policies. Krugman has always been critical of the Euro as have most American economists.

Krugman's thoughts on the EU mirror mine and many other remainers.  No one wanted the Euro and we didn't get it. Same with the Shengen agreement. Same with Thatcher's hard fought for rebate.. Same with taking a percentage of Merkel's 2m refugees. There are many examples of us kicking back against the EU and UK winning the day.

 

Slaves to the EU oligarchs? Never have been, never will be. All a Brexiteer fantasy/ Cummings lie. We're Brits for crying out loud, we should be staying and fighting to retain our rightful place near the top of the largest trading block in the world. Not running and hiding like a scolded dog, hiding in a corner until we starve and die.

 

Remainers, the true Brits, are fighting back, unlike the spineless Brexiteer surrender monkeys. Bunch of limp wristed toffs.

 

"Once more unto the breach my friends

I see you stand like greyhounds in the slips,

Straining upon the start. The game's afoot:

Follow your spirit, and upon this charge

Cry 'God for Harry, England, and Saint George!'

Come on lads, time to put some cold steel into those spineless, Eton Toff Brexiteers. They're on their knees, let's finish'em off!

We have awoken and the lion roars!

 

 

 

Edited September 4, 2019 by DannyCarlton

[sirineou]

9 minutes ago, vogie said:

Again you are guessing, the UK is strong enough to retain our United Kingdom, sorry if this doesn't go along with your rhetoric.

But when I want to know whats happening with Brexit I always check your posts, they are always so informative, so thanks for that.

How from my post did you ascertain that I am "guessing, the UK is strong enough to retain our United Kingdom  "???? I am not guessing anything, this is what is being reported.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/sep/03/sturgeon-seek-legal-powers-hold-new-scottish-independence-referendum

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2019/jul/31/sinn-fein-border-poll-ireland-unity-must-follow-no-deal-brexit

Hopefully none of that will happen, but reporting seems to indicate that there is a good chance that it will.

As an American , I have the advantage of being able to look at this from the outside and see the forest rather than the trees, and from my perspective it does not look good, but have the disadvantage of not organically through natural osmosis feeling the thing so I could be wrong and could be missing a crucial factor. 

  I happen to like and enjoy my British friends on both sides of this issue and hope I am wrong.

I will tell you this. while listening to Bloomberg Financial news a currencies expert was being interviewed concerning the latest devaluation of sterling. He was asked if at this low price if it was time to buy, his reply "No, it has not hit bottom yet" and I paraphrase  "the price sterling enjoyed was do to valuations reflecting UK's relation to the EU, and UK cohesion, both of these are now an open question "

I sincerely, (really mean it) wish you all the best luck.

 

 

[kingdong]

50 minutes ago, oldhippy said:

That's exactly what I was saying.

Economics don't play any part in the discussion about brexit.

It's about a white UK.

And the whites have to be protestant as well.

 

 

is that the best you can do,coming out with childish,racist remarks?

[tebee]

10 hours ago, bannork said:

The consequences of a no deal Brexit are far more frightening than the anger of ill-informed leavers who don't realise how difficult it will be to set up new trading deals post no deal Brexit.

 

1 hour ago, Joinaman said:

would appreciate it very much if you could give me the facts to back up your statement

Could you give me the true facts on the consequences of leaving, as opposed to the consequences of staying ?

I her so may people saying how really bad it will be to leave, but unsurprisingly , they can never back this up with any facts

Even our so called M Ps can not give true facts about the cost of leaving, against the true cost of staying

Can you, or is it just your misguided opinion 

Why can you all be honest and state the truth, you have no idea what will happen if we leave, and why do you refuse to accept the changes and costs that the Lisbon treaty will make on the UK

 

 

I hope you don't think this source is too biased in favour of remain, but here goes 

 

 

A No Deal Brexit next month could lead to public disorder, travel chaos and shortages of fresh food, medicines and petrol, according to a leaked government document.

The bombshell report, produced by the Cabinet Office, warns that few individuals and businesses have prepared for the impact of No Deal because they have believed government assurances that Boris Johnson is seeking a deal with Brussels.

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7421045/No-Deal-Brexit-lead-months-chaos-public-disorder.html

[Bruntoid]

3 hours ago, JonnyF said:

That's a new one on me. ????

 

I saw the BBC trying to spin it as Parliament vs. the government, but never the people vs. the government.

 

In reality this is Parliament vs. the people.

Is it ? I’m a people, parliament did just grand ! 

 

Seems to be be a lot of happy forums around today 

 

You’re behind the times