Study reveals how much money you need to retire in Thailand

[ThailandRyan]

2 minutes ago, ICELANDMAN said:

Pakistan is the cheapest with a tent and a camel, no bar girls.

Ah the true Nomadic lifestyle living with the sand fleas.

[RocketDog]

4 minutes ago, Salerno said:

 

As is reading the thread before posting, pretty sure sirineou must be getting sick of the multitude of BMs picking him up on something he acknowledged 15 hours ago.

Sorry, that's the way it is on TVF. Live with it or not. Social media these days is not for the feint of heart. 

[Andrew65]

Just now, ThailandRyan said:

Don't forget it is also about your lifestyle and how you chose to live either healthily or eating like a glutton with added vices thrown in to the excess as well.

Very true, but I would think 79 is probably a good average age. Someone else points out that many in Thailand are in their 70's but have wives who are in their 30's (and the extended families that go with them). There are so many variables.

[sead]

Almost 4000thb daily. Who calculated this <deleted>.....

[BritManToo]

40 minutes ago, Harveyboy said:

needs adjusting for families...house to pay ...bills to pay car to run  kids school fees..kids out of school activities..im buggered if that's how how much is needed for a single person living in an apartment..would some one like to do a calculation  based on family of 4 tks would be interesting to know just how buggered i am  ..lol

Like I said, I'm doing that on 40k, 1 kid at university, 1 kid in junior school.

You don't have to send your kids to private schools, they're for the rich.

[Andrew65]

2 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Like I said, I'm doing that on 40k, 1 kid at university, 1 kid in junior school.

You don't have to send your kids to private schools, they're for the rich.

How many people in the 65-79 age group have kids at junior school?!????

[BritManToo]

Just now, Andrew65 said:

How many people in the 65-79 age group have kids at junior school?!????

Me for one.

[overherebc]

46 minutes ago, PGSan said:

or 20/30 even.

Hope not. I'm a grumpy old fart already. Can't imagine how bad I would be after another 20.

[vandeventer]

41 minutes ago, khunjeff said:

 

That's life expectancy at birth - life expectancy at age 65 for men in the US is about 83, and almost 86 for women. So yes, right away that's a fairly major problem with their calculation. But if you look at this more as a comparison among various countries than a specific savings goal, it's still moderately useful.

 

https://data.oecd.org/healthstat/life-expectancy-at-65.htm

You have to look in the area where you live. Not where you were born. Look at the food you eat the air you breathe the water you drink. My area in Thailand  the average age  of death is 58,but most of us eat better than the Thais. Less sugar less salt.

[ibtg68]

15 hours ago, ThailandRyan said:

So if all one happens to have a lifetime Pension that pays a tidy sum  monthly and has nothing in savings then they are not able to retire in Thailand, or other countries, is that the gist of the article?  Or lets see, only having a savings of 1 million USD, but no pension, then they can afford to retire in Thailand as well as elsewhere?  So confused.  Everyone's life style is different and what one wants to buy and eat for their meals, and just like where they choose to live differs, Each individual should learn to live within their means.  I know a few who live in Thailand on just their SS from the US and they are happy as can be.  I also know a few who can afford to live the hi-life and do so but are not happy because they do not have enough in their view.  We all made our beds a long time ago and you either enjoy what you have or you don't, no use crying over spilled milk.

I think the article is mainly talking about savings. I didn’t see anything referencing pensions unless I overlooked it. In 2018 I retired at the age of 50 with 29 years’ credit for my pension. I had nowhere near the amount of savings mentioned in the article at the time of my retirement. My pension allows me to live comfortably here in Thailand without having to worry about finances. 

[ThailandRyan]

Just now, ibtg68 said:

I think the article is mainly talking about savings. I didn’t see anything referencing pensions unless I overlooked it. In 2018 I retired at the age of 50 with 29 years’ credit for my pension. I had nowhere near the amount of savings mentioned in the article at the time of my retirement. My pension allows me to live comfortably here in Thailand without having to worry about finances. 

My point exactly, as does my pension. Of course I have added assets that keep putting money in the bank every month. Retired at 53, forced out after 31 years.  Wanted to work longer but oh well.

[bolt]

Perhaps the post should have been re tilted, living expense for 14 years, or living expenses for 1 or 10 years, but the amount seems reasonable approx. $2k per month

my personal budget is ave 125kTHB per month, however I'm sure i can trim that down as its based on spending the full amounts each month, maybe i will stay in a little bit more once i retire.

Edited March 3, 2021 by bolt

[aussienam]

For the Aussies - At current exchange rate, that amount equates to approximately $500,000 AUD ($36,000 AUD approx per year).  We are screwed as Aussies with our terrible conversion to THB and other currencies.  

 

Many of us Aussie expats are not eligible for the old age pension as we exceed the assets threshold; so we have to eke out a self funded income via investments and hopefully enough in a Superannuation (similar to 401k in US) account.   If your career and/or life circumstances along the way did not put enough away then it's going to end up impossible to survive well enough on your self-funded income.  

 

And any old age pension (for those eligible) in Australia is reduced if you reside outside Australia beyond a short period of time anyway.  Plus, to be eligible for the old age pension, Aussie citizens need to prove they were in Australia as a resident for 2 straight years up to the retirement age pension application date. 

Quite a lot of expats who cannot afford a self funded life anymore go back to sit out the two years before coming back on a reduced pension.  But living is not easy on that and falls below the estimate given in this article. It is a frugal existence with little luxuries. 

I agree with the estimate as I am living below that amount by a few thousand dollars a year and it is a frugal life.  No luxuries. 

Forget sponsoring/supporting a girlfriend/wife here ever, with the culture of man being the provider for most ladies.  Poorer guys realistically having zero chance really of ever finding love here as no woman would accept that from a farang (just the way it is). 

 

  And the 800,000 THB visa requirement on top that cannot be spent without voiding the OA visa means a further struggle.  Plus mounting health insurance costs as you age with much higher premiums.  

 

Longevity risk means for many, living too long is a real problem (plenty of articles on that subject).  Hence the flying club here in Thailand is always something to consider by those of us who did not do so well in life.  Something I consider if funds drop to unsustainable levels. And am comfortable with that. I Know of one fellow I knew personally who went that way. I hope I do not live too long. 

 

Going back to Oz as an old age broke retiree would mean extreme misery IMO and if no property to go back to, the Public Housing waiting list is very long and likely would live on the streets, unless you have a family who could take you in and become a burden to them.  This is the world we live on now.  It's only going to get more and more expensive.  And COVID would have decimated the retirement dreams of many as well.  

 

 

 

[Benmart]

16 hours ago, sanuk711 said:

Do you ever think of reading the article before you post sirineou.......all those questions are answered.

No need to read the article, as the Department of Corrections is always on the job.????

[WhatupThailand]

Study must have been done by another of those Xperts, like the ones who gave the BIG numbers that caused all the world to lock down.

 

[aussienam]

16 hours ago, internationalism said:

very few pensioners do have saving that large. Even if they sell their house before moving to thailand.

but each has pension, and that's sufficient to survive reasonable well in thailand.

so it's possible to lower standard of living in thailand and have some savings for medical care

Countries like Australia have an assets test to be taken into consideration to be eligible for the old age pension.  Many pensioners who own a property in Australia cannot sell it because the cash in the bank disqualifies them from receiving the pension.  Then, they need to spend those sale proceeds enough to fall below the maximum allowed savings to re-apply (and be in Australia for 2 years prior to applying for the pension).  So it is a very hard juggling act for many.  And of course there are those who want to Will that property to their children.  

 

[PeteDaKat]

12 hours ago, ChaiyaTH said:

It is 28 years if assuming 7% yearly returns on capital, which is acceptable to expect. Just get bitcoin already lol, or get creamed...

Good golly, yes. So many people so late to getting aboard Bitcoin. Talking about 7% returns, when Bitcoin in the last single year is up 477%. Many people are asleep at the switch. I just sit and listen to the others moan about the $->฿ exchange rate on the pension wire transfers. I don't talk about it much, because people don't want to hear it. So many extremely sour grapes.

The Q.E. is concerning with all the debt-backed money being printed at a wild pace by the US.

[Magenta408]

Balderdash but I did notice moderate drinking.  It is getting a tad more expensive but then again SO IS THE REST OF THE WORLD.

Edited March 3, 2021 by Magenta408
typo

[Tropposurfer]

At current rates of exchange, and a lifestyle of not eating western food every night/day this estimated budget sounds about right for an average lifestyle.

For folks who want a whole lot more who see paying 100,000 K a month for a mega-plush condo in Bangkok or Phuket for example of course 70K would not work.

As for eating Western food every night day .... WHAT! ... and miss out on my weekly hits of delicious Gao tod and som tum, Khao soi gai, banana and honey Roti and gaffee buran etc ????????! 

I got a moderate drinking habit of a few icy cold beers every other day, a strong hot oil massage every week, occasional manicure, pedicure and facial and a few Thailand holidays with maybe a Euro holiday every few years saved up for.

I could live on 70K odd very easily (I budgeted a lot less in my plan), and live a pleasant life (included in my budget is the full indexed pension from home).

I do hope to live into my late 80's so this I estimated a little bit more each month to age 85  - I hope to  ???????? ... stay fit n active as long as possible - and drop dead working-out, swimming laps of the beach, carving on a wave face, in the garden, or humping is my goal lol ????

I live at Surin beach now on about 45 to 50K baht a month (temp rental while my custom spec villa is being built), and want for nothing. 

[Sheryl]

17 hours ago, sirineou said:

What does  $389,835 Mean ?

Is that to retire for the rest of your life?  at what age?  and  how many years would that last you. ?

 

As per the article that is to live for only  for around 14 years after retirement.  Which is a big caveat indeed.

 

Many people live much longer and especially those who retire at earlier ages.

 

BTW this amount is about the same as what Immigration considers the necessary amount (800k baht a year) for 14 years.

 

 

[gamb00ler]

Financial estimates as given in the original post are not that complicated to make. But of course they will be for the "average" retiree. A monthly pension can easily be converted to a present value (lump sum value) based on life expectancy, current investment returns and current inflation rates. Since the authors/creators of the report only stated their assumptions for life expectancy the required retirement nest eggs given may not be very relevant. Perhaps the comparisons between different locations are more useful than the amounts needed to retire in a specific location. If you measure several of your friends with the same flawed yardstick, you would still know who's tallest.

Edited March 3, 2021 by gamb00ler

[sandhurstmolonski]

17 hours ago, snoop1130 said:

Study reveals how much money you need to retire in Thailand

 

 

Anyone thinking about retiring to Thailand should have the equivalent of around 11 million Baht in savings (approx USD$390,000), that’s according to a new study on the cost of retirement around the world.

 

The study, carried out by online lender NetCredit titled The Cost of a Comfortable Retirement Around the World, looked at how much someone might need to retire aboard and enjoy their same quality of life.

 

This was determined as going out once a week, takeout coffee once a week, no smoking, moderate drinking, no taxis or rideshares, eating mainly Western food at home, two vacations and renting a 1 bed apartment in a city centre, among other factors.

 

The figures are based on someone living for around 14 years after they retire - with the average age of retirement in America (64) and the average life expectancy (78.7). The same calculations were then applied to almost every country. 

 

The study found that a person retiring to Thailand would need $389,835 in savings in order to maintain the same standard of living they were used to in the West.

 

The amount of savings required for Thailand were considerably lower than the amount needed to retire comfortably in both the United Kingdom ($515,742) and the United States ($601,489.63).

 

 

Regionally, Southeast Asia remained an affordable option for retirement, with Indonesia ($290,599), Malaysia ($321,614), Vietnam ($353,906) and the Philippines ($369,340) offering cheaper alternatives to Thailand, while Cambodia ($389,146) was on a par with the Land of Smiles in terms the amount of savings needed. 

 

In order to retire in Singapore ($946,993) or Hong Kong($871,578), you’d need around three times the amount of savings needed to retire in Thailand.

 

Around the world, Bermuda was found to be the most expensive country, where you’d need savings of more  than $1 million dollars for a luxury retirement in paradise.

 

Elsewhere in North America, Mexico was the cheapest place for retirement where savings of $257,078 is enough for a comfortable retirement.

If they mean amount of capital required to generate the income required , they are about correct .

 

If they are referring to " Spend till you drop " then they are not taking into account those on some thing of benefit , social security , or pension .

With what's excluded , it must be a strange way of living ..

Take out once a week ?.and Zero transport  ?. People live at very differing levels , I appreciate that .

 

After rent and car ,you need 10 k barht a week , 520 k barht PA , plus rent pa , and transport whatever that may be , this is a good rule of thumb , and less than that , you are not doing much . So what's the point.

17 hours ago, snoop1130 said:

 

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[mar zarych]

This study give inaccurate information and assumptions at best. The difference in the cost of living downtown  Sukhumvit vs. downtown Tak or anywhere in between cannot be accurately compared using these figures.   Its misleading to throw out a figure of $389,835.00. The Thai government requires you having a yearly USD income of$18,000 adding up to  $252,000.00 over the same 14 years if I am not mistaken.

[BritManToo]

4 hours ago, PGSan said:

Very parsimonious towards the other three! 

Mortgage repayments are 11k/month, no matter how I split the pension.

If I were single, that would still need to be paid.

[DefaultName]

Or, no savings at all and a good, safe, pension.

 

[JimGant]

5 minutes ago, gamb00ler said:

A monthly pension can easily be converted to a present value (lump sum value) based on life expectancy, current investment returns and current inflation rates.

Indeed. This study was short in explanation, but obviously the $389,835 figure included present value of pensions, annuities, and social security payments. How could it not, as there are many pensioners with zip in the bank ('cause, maybe they just bought an immediate pay annuity) but whose income stream in the next 14 years has a present value well to match (or beat) the $389k benchmark. And if these pensions are indexed for inflation -- well, just more attractive numbers. No, whoever did this study should have provided more explanation. But, as a comparison of how retirement countries stack up against each other -- useful information, when taken with caveats.

[GeilGeilertzen]

17 hours ago, ThailandRyan said:

So if all one happens to have a lifetime Pension that pays a tidy sum  monthly and has nothing in savings then they are not able to retire in Thailand, or other countries, is that the gist of the article?  Or lets see, only having a savings of 1 million USD, but no pension, then they can afford to retire in Thailand as well as elsewhere?  So confused.  Everyone's life style is different and what one wants to buy and eat for their meals, and just like where they choose to live differs, Each individual should learn to live within their means.  I know a few who live in Thailand on just their SS from the US and they are happy as can be.  I also know a few who can afford to live the hi-life and do so but are not happy because they do not have enough in their view.  We all made our beds a long time ago and you either enjoy what you have or you don't, no use crying over spilled milk.

Don’t you think people and the survey makers knows about pension systems or what? Or did you expect them to lay out hundreds of of different estimates taking each and one pension amount into account? 
You see that is up to you to put into the calculation and deduct from those numbers.  
If this article made you so confused,

now then go and get yourself a bar girl and get back to the basics of human behavior. That won’t confuse you.  

[bullseye66]

I plan to retire at 60 with around 600,000 dollars in savings. I already have a property in Thailand so no rent needed. Sounds do able if this is correct.

[gamini]

A ridiculous survey. For a start who would want to eat two Western meals a day when Thai food is one of the best in the world. In fact it is one of the attractions of living in Thailand. I could go on and on.

 

[Kwasaki]

11 million a year I guess that about right. ????????????