Who will never vaccinate except if forced to for visa reasons ? and do you think that they will force us ?

[farmerjo]

Vaxers v antivaxers.

Is that the same as pro lifers v people with a perspective of natural survival of the fittest.

When vaccines start being given to the old and vulnerable after health care workers there were a lot of rumbles in the workforce,at least where i was.Obviously things have settled down from those early days but there will always remain a certain proportion who won't let it go.It's natural.

[earthscar]

1 minute ago, atpeace said:

Get a grip. What an awful life you must live to wish death on anyone.  The poor man died because he was foolish IMO and hope his death might convince other to get vaccinated. Your type of righteous and cooler than thou attitude is childish.  Grow-up!

I could agree w/ that if I hadn't dealt w/ 4 years of trump and are looking at possibly much longer due to his actions. 

 

USA is slipping, the GOPs plan to hungry hungry hippo every time they even get a small amount of power.

 

its not nice and some may just chant it because they like the edginess of it but there is also a real fear that with the dems not playing the same game as the GOP that we may be put into a situation where we have another civil war.

 

If the GOP want to Darwin themselves and help decrease the chance for a civil war. then ya i am okay w/ that. not happy, not excited but a grim nod because this guilt of saying it and seeing GOP coved deaths is far preferable to picking up a gun and fighting brother(thankfully i don't have one but that's beside the point).

 

If you look at the posts ppl didn't come in here and say death to all GOP/deniers/etc information was passed on w/ links to a whole host of various organizations running some of the most important medical institutes. 

 

I just ran across a joke that i guess is coming back in vouge

 

A fellow was stuck on his rooftop in a flood. He was praying to God for help.

Soon a man in a rowboat came by and the fellow shouted to the man on the roof, "Jump in, I can save you."

The stranded fellow shouted back, "No, it's OK, I'm praying to God and he is going to save me."

So the rowboat went on.

Then a motorboat came by. "The fellow in the motorboat shouted, "Jump in, I can save you."

To this the stranded man said, "No thanks, I'm praying to God and he is going to save me. I have faith."

So the motorboat went on.

Then a helicopter came by and the pilot shouted down, "Grab this rope and I will lift you to safety."

To this the stranded man again replied, "No thanks, I'm praying to God and he is going to save me. I have faith."

So the helicopter reluctantly flew away.

Soon the water rose above the rooftop and the man drowned. He went to Heaven. He finally got his chance to discuss this whole situation with God, at which point he exclaimed, "I had faith in you but you didn't save me, you let me drown. I don't understand why!"

To this God replied, "I sent you a rowboat and a motorboat and a helicopter, what more did you expect?"

 

help who you can and those you can't steal yourself for the waves of guilt of watching someone commit viral suicide. i will take that guilt over picking up a gun for a civil war anyway.

[robblok]

9 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Like I said earlier, I don't accuse you of lying, though you do omit to mention significant factors that undermine your point of view. 

 

 

It's not lying, but neither is it intellectually honest. 

 

Its called a lie by omission. Still lying. 

 

That is his whole point by leaving stuff out he is misrepresenting the situation. Its a known strategy. All his data might have been true, but by forgetting to mention that most deaths were from the small not vaccinated part of the population he misrepresented the whole thing.  The way he displayed it it would have seemed that there were no benefits to vaccination. 

 

Now if the data i had was added it would totally show a different picture. 

 

The only thing that might have saved him if he really did not know. But he did not even make a mention of it.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lie#:~:text=Lying by omission%2C also known,to correct pre-existing misconceptions.

Lying by omission, also known as a continuing misrepresentation or quote mining, occurs when an important fact is left out in order to foster a misconception. Lying by omission includes the failure to correct pre-existing misconceptions.

[robblok]

12 minutes ago, atpeace said:

Get a grip. What an awful life you must live to wish death on anyone.  The poor man died because he was foolish IMO and hope his death might convince other to get vaccinated. Your type of righteous and cooler than thou attitude is childish.  Grow-up!

Actually i really don't mind the popular antivaxxers dying. Especially those in the news. They are sprouting antivax nonsense and by them dying people actually get saved and the followers see that covid can kill. That is killing 2 birds with one stone. 

 

I certainly don't wish it on the normal silent antivaxer who does not persuade others to follow his dangerous lifestyle. But those really vocal ones who try their best to indoctrinate people. Sure they serve an example.

[freedomnow]

I know 3 people who won't -

 

1 "there is no virus, it's a plandemic hoax",

2+3 " there is some poison/tracking devices etc in the vaccine"

...all off their heads.

 

Edited October 30, 2021 by freedomnow

[Jeffr2]

2 hours ago, ebice said:

Lies you say, prove it, prove I have lied. You can't, and it infuriates you,  and now you need a bigger shovel soon, maybe a hydraulic excavator for your deepening hole.

Also, where does it say I am an anti-vaxer or I am against vaccines? Show me that.

 

Because I deal with reality and you bumble along in your alternate reality, you need to falsely accuse, use insults, get uptight, etc....oh yeah baby, u are a book, with huge FONT.

Hook, line & sinker.

You've been shown the proof many times but either don't want to accept it or can't understand it. Give up. Please.

[Jeffr2]

13 minutes ago, freedomnow said:

I know 3 people who won't -

 

1 "there is no virus, it's a plandemic hoax",

2+3 " there is some poison/tracking devices etc in the vaccine"

...all off their heads.

 

And therein lies the problem. People who fall for the fake news.

[atpeace]

7 minutes ago, robblok said:

Actually i really don't mind the popular antivaxxers dying. Especially those in the news. They are sprouting antivax nonsense and by them dying people actually get saved and the followers see that covid can kill. That is killing 2 birds with one stone. 

 

I certainly don't wish it on the normal silent antivaxer who does not persuade others to follow his dangerous lifestyle. But those really vocal ones who try their best to indoctrinate people. Sure they serve an example.

It benefits society to get vaccinated IMO but I may be proven wrong in the future.  Seriously doubt it but far from all knowing.  As for the silent antivaxers as you stated living a dangerous lifestyle, not the case for many.  A healthy under age 50 person is at very little risk of dying of Covid.  Many are making a point by not being vaccinated and the point is to wakeup society and start living a better healthy life.  They aren't silent and do not deserve to die.

 

This pandemic has, excluding the elderly, been a pandemic of the unhealthy. They have spread Covid and caused unimaginable harm.  Do I wish death upon them? No!  I hope they see what their gluttonous lifestyle has caused and start living healthier.  

 

 

 

 

[placeholder]

3 hours ago, Neeranam said:

Check the graph on the link here. 

 

https://covid19criticalcare.com/ivermectin-in-covid-19/epidemiologic-analyses-on-covid19-and-ivermectin/

These glowing reports from India made Uttar Pradesh the poster child for the effectiveness of Ivermectin. There are several problems with this claim. Here's a big one:

UP: 24 districts reported 110% more deaths between July and March than same period the previous year

Deaths in these districts rose to 3,75,000 in 2020-’21 from 1,78,000 deaths between July 1, 2019, and March 31, 2020, Article 14 reported.

https://scroll.in/latest/998069/up-24-districts-reported-110-more-deaths-between-july-and-march-than-same-period-the-previous-year

[robblok]

8 minutes ago, atpeace said:

It benefits society to get vaccinated IMO but I may be proven wrong in the future.  Seriously doubt it but far from all knowing.  As for the silent antivaxers as you stated living a dangerous lifestyle, not the case for many.  A healthy under age 50 person is at very little risk of dying of Covid.  Many are making a point by not being vaccinated and the point is to wakeup society and start living a better healthy life.  They aren't silent and do not deserve to die.

 

This pandemic has, excluding the elderly, been a pandemic of the unhealthy. They have spread Covid and caused unimaginable harm.  Do I wish death upon them? No!  I hope they see what their gluttonous lifestyle has caused and start living healthier.  

 

 

 

 

I wish it was that easy its not. But you keep believing in it that healthy people have no risk.  

[atpeace]

2 minutes ago, placeholder said:

These glowing reports from India made Uttar Pradesh the poster child for the effectiveness of Ivermectin. There are several problems with this claim. Here's a big one:

UP: 24 districts reported 110% more deaths between July and March than same period the previous year

Deaths in these districts rose to 3,75,000 in 2020-’21 from 1,78,000 deaths between July 1, 2019, and March 31, 2020, Article 14 reported.

https://scroll.in/latest/998069/up-24-districts-reported-110-more-deaths-between-july-and-march-than-same-period-the-previous-year

Might want to read up on correlation vs cause.

[atpeace]

1 minute ago, robblok said:

I wish it was that easy its not. But you keep believing in it that healthy people have no risk.  

never said no risk but it seems you want to win more than discuss.  I concede - game over.

[earthscar]

5 minutes ago, atpeace said:

It benefits society to get vaccinated IMO but I may be proven wrong in the future.  Seriously doubt it but far from all knowing.  As for the silent antivaxers as you stated living a dangerous lifestyle, not the case for many.  A healthy under age 50 person is at very little risk of dying of Covid.  Many are making a point by not being vaccinated and the point is to wakeup society and start living a better healthy life.  They aren't silent and do not deserve to die.

 

This pandemic has, excluding the elderly, been a pandemic of the unhealthy. They have spread Covid and caused unimaginable harm.  Do I wish death upon them? No!  I hope they see what their gluttonous lifestyle has caused and start living healthier.  

 

 

 

 

holy hell how can be still still be that dense. you can make covid response all about "my body, my choice" (well other then if your a woman w/ a cell that will one day maybe be a child)and how its all about being healthy(shocker its not) but your missing some really key things..

 

this is about empathy and having a chance in your life to take a action that might not get a docu series or not even a gold star but.. each one of those "unhealthy" ppl ,who you think are what this is about, you can say "my actions may have helped that person not die. 

 

https://www.cdc.gov/obesity/data/adult.html

 

According to research done by the Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health, it is estimated that around 40% of Americans are considered obese, and 18% are considered severely obese as of 2019. Severe obesity is defined as a BMI over 35 in the study.

 

that's a lot of unhealthy ppl..and we haven't even (not sure how to find the number and combo them) added in the overlap for alcohol, drugs(oh that opioid crisis i miss you), smoking , etc.

 

stop thinking this is about freedom or repression this is about you and all of us being heros and doing our part to get the human race to the end of this tunnel.

 

is there a end O.o

[robblok]

2 minutes ago, atpeace said:

Might want to read up on correlation vs cause.

Your right but so do the people who claim that ivermectin. Placeholder uses his data to support his case while the ivermectin supporters do the same with their data. While neither has done more then just show some data and then claim it supports their case.

 

Neither has proven correlation. There could be other explanations for both.

[robblok]

3 minutes ago, atpeace said:

never said no risk but it seems you want to win more than discuss.  I concede - game over.

Thank you for conceding now that I have won ill start celebrating... ok done... 

 

Seriously so many people who were younger and not overweight have died. There is no proof that just being normal weight makes much of a difference. But we do know that vaccines make a difference. 

 

I was a bit like you, thought that being sporty and not fat would help me, until i saw reports of  healthy people dying in my country. Dying of covid. Many not overweight also many not over 50. It probably reduces it a bit but i doubt it helps as much as a vaccine. 

[placeholder]

6 hours ago, ebice said:

Ah, but, w/o vaccination only 29 deaths compared to >300 deaths with high vaccination rate.

Stop telling falsehoods. In fact, for the first 20 days of october this yearout of all the deaths due to covid in Singapore, 84 were from the unvaccinated, 30 from the singly vaccinated, and 55 were fully vaccinated. This despite the fact that over 80% of the people in Singapore were fully vaccinated.

 

More Covid-19 patients in Singapore reported to have died in October than 18 months prior

In a press conference on Oct 2, Health Minister Ong Ye Kung also said that unvaccinated people are 14 times more likely to need intensive care or die, compared with those who are vaccinated.

Around three in four who were reported to have died in October were individuals who received a single dose of a vaccine or were unvaccinated.

The unvaccinated accounted for 84 out of 169 of the reported deaths here this month as at Wednesday, and 30 more of the reported deaths had only a single dose of the vaccine.

https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/more-covid-19-patients-in-singapore-reported-to-have-died-in-october-than-18-months-prior

[placeholder]

10 minutes ago, atpeace said:

Might want to read up on correlation vs cause.

I don't think you understand. The U.P. government claimed that very few deaths from covid occurred after treating people with ivermectin. But in fact there was a huge unexplained jump in mortality. Pretty amazing coincidence, no? Or just maybe the UP government was dishing out BS about the effectiveness of ivermection.

[placeholder]

23 minutes ago, atpeace said:

It benefits society to get vaccinated IMO but I may be proven wrong in the future.  Seriously doubt it but far from all knowing.  As for the silent antivaxers as you stated living a dangerous lifestyle, not the case for many.  A healthy under age 50 person is at very little risk of dying of Covid.  Many are making a point by not being vaccinated and the point is to wakeup society and start living a better healthy life.  They aren't silent and do not deserve to die.

 

This pandemic has, excluding the elderly, been a pandemic of the unhealthy. They have spread Covid and caused unimaginable harm.  Do I wish death upon them? No!  I hope they see what their gluttonous lifestyle has caused and start living healthier.  

 

 

 

 

Maybe before vaccinations it's been a pandemic of the unhealthy. But now it's a pandemic of the unvaccinated. And these selfish people are tying up hospital critical care resources.

[earthscar]

2 minutes ago, robblok said:

Thank you for conceding now that I have won ill start celebrating... ok done... 

 

Seriously so many people who were younger and not overweight have died. There is no proof that just being normal weight makes much of a difference. But we do know that vaccines make a difference. 

 

I was a bit like you, thought that being sporty and not fat would help me, until i saw reports of  healthy people dying in my country. Dying of covid. Many not overweight also many not over 50. It probably reduces it a bit but i doubt it helps as much as a vaccine. 

Joe Rogen steps into the room.. healthy getting sick w/ covid..nahhh hell no he just leg kicks them and has his doctors hit him w/ every expensive treatment in the book. I think he even said a kitchen sink was involved. how cool is that.

 

all joking aside thankfully i live in the USA w/ a awsome healthcare system so even though i can run 16 miles(i know not impressive but...just let me have that okay) I will walk into the hospital and get the same treatment as rogen becase usa is number 1 in healh care for all. we don't go broke after being well off becase of a illness. 

 

no if anything covid 19 has taught me is all i have to do is pull myself up by those boot straps and eat some oats while leg kicking a machine that costs more then my car and i can laugh off covid.

 

 

 

oops forgot the /s...tricky /s

[atpeace]

4 minutes ago, robblok said:

Thank you for conceding now that I have won ill start celebrating... ok done... 

 

Seriously so many people who were younger and not overweight have died. There is no proof that just being normal weight makes much of a difference. But we do know that vaccines make a difference. 

 

I was a bit like you, thought that being sporty and not fat would help me, until i saw reports of  healthy people dying in my country. Dying of covid. Many not overweight also many not over 50. It probably reduces it a bit but i doubt it helps as much as a vaccine. 

OK, but have you really researched the health of Covid fatalities? Think the evidence is conclusive and it helps tremendously to be healthy.  The data supports this viewpoint.  I'm not going to tell you anything because you strike me as the type that does his own research. Do it with an open mind and you may be surprised.

 

As for me, I'll look again into the health and covid outcomes later.  Have to go on my inti-covid run. The anger on this forum is hilarious ( not you ).

[atpeace]

15 minutes ago, earthscar said:

holy hell how can be still still be that dense. you can make covid response all about "my body, my choice" (well other then if your a woman w/ a cell that will one day maybe be a child)and how its all about being healthy(shocker its not) but your missing some really key things..

 

this is about empathy and having a chance in your life to take a action that might not get a docu series or not even a gold star but.. each one of those "unhealthy" ppl ,who you think are what this is about, you can say "my actions may have helped that person not die. 

 

https://www.cdc.gov/obesity/data/adult.html

 

According to research done by the Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health, it is estimated that around 40% of Americans are considered obese, and 18% are considered severely obese as of 2019. Severe obesity is defined as a BMI over 35 in the study.

 

that's a lot of unhealthy ppl..and we haven't even (not sure how to find the number and combo them) added in the overlap for alcohol, drugs(oh that opioid crisis i miss you), smoking , etc.

 

stop thinking this is about freedom or repression this is about you and all of us being heros and doing our part to get the human race to the end of this tunnel.

 

is there a end O.o

Chill out dude.  Your anxiety is going to kill you well before Covid.  I'm fully vaccinated and by your definition "a hero".  By my definition you are a angry sad soul.  Peace out child and try to throw some love around.  People might actually start to like and follow your lead.

[Chomper Higgot]

30 minutes ago, atpeace said:

It benefits society to get vaccinated IMO but I may be proven wrong in the future.  Seriously doubt it but far from all knowing.  As for the silent antivaxers as you stated living a dangerous lifestyle, not the case for many.  A healthy under age 50 person is at very little risk of dying of Covid.  Many are making a point by not being vaccinated and the point is to wakeup society and start living a better healthy life.  They aren't silent and do not deserve to die.

 

This pandemic has, excluding the elderly, been a pandemic of the unhealthy. They have spread Covid and caused unimaginable harm.  Do I wish death upon them? No!  I hope they see what their gluttonous lifestyle has caused and start living healthier.  

 

 

 

 

You are deluding yourself.

 

Regardless if age or lifestyle we non of us know what the impact of COVID infection would be on us.

 

Too many fit, healthy lovers of the ‘good life’ have been wiped out by this wretched disease for your self deception to stand unchallenged.

[Tony125]

3 minutes ago, placeholder said:

What has this got to do with the fact that the covid patients now tying up ICU beds are unvaccinated?

What the photo has to do with unvaccinated is this: it shows an unvaccinated , under 50 year old who looks in great shape/not obese who came down with Covid and almost died spending part of 6 weeks in an ICU

 

[earthscar]

2 minutes ago, atpeace said:

OK, but have you really researched the health of Covid fatalities? Think the evidence is conclusive and it helps tremendously to be healthy.  The data supports this viewpoint.  I'm not going to tell you anything because you strike me as the type that does his own research. Do it with an open mind and you may be surprised.

 

As for me, I'll look again into the health and covid outcomes later.  Have to go on my inti-covid run. The anger on this forum is hilarious ( not you ).

no clue if your a USA citizen but if you made it thru the 5 or so years we have had I'm a little concerned your not angery.

 

you got bolsenaro in brazil helping his population decrease. 

you got Putin attempting(and succeeding in some cases) with assonating ppl and not caring if we know

we have a American journalist get associated and our president all but sent a gift bag to the murderers boss.

we exited Afghanistan w/o supporting all the men, women and girls that we told the American dream is just around the corner.

we got president daturta joking about raping a nun on nation news and supporting the card board justice. hell its a non secret that he used to run death squads out of the town he use to run.

you got xi xing w/ his mass harvesting of organs from political prisnors

you get to see the rise of the world right leaning(i say right based of how the political party in usa works the right in a EU country might be more like our left even if called right so don't read to much into that)

 

we are still going. This anger didn't just pop because of covid oh no..this is a fruit salad of <deleted>.

 

w/ the rise of cameras everywhere we are finding out that "just do what he says" will not turn out well for you if your not white. leave it to beaver you lied to me. 

you got the blatant gerrymandering that continues to allow the minority in this contrary to dictate to the majority.

you have the horrified exp of watching trumps sludge like personality absorb the GOP..

 

We are mad because we have had to learn the hard way when we have a rational conversation w/ these ppl that we just end up coming out of it coved in muck. we are accepting the fact that we may need to soil our mental image we have of ourselves and start playing the GOPs game.

 

so ya when we see some miss information BS that will continue to damage my children's future. Your just getting a glimse of the flames its going to roar out of control if this isn't improved. 

[farmerjo]

Well if covid has taught me anything it's that a lot of vulnerable people who jumped the queue are sitting back going She'll be right Fred,i'm vaxed.C'mon the rest your dragging your heels.

There are a lot of people in my situation whom haven't been able to be vaxed yet and in result has cost the chance of gaining employment for two years.

The resent from the vaxed is starting to smell quite frankly.

[placeholder]

2 minutes ago, Tony125 said:

What the photo has to do with unvaccinated is this: it shows an unvaccinated , under 50 year old who looks in great shape/not obese who came down with Covid and almost died spending part of 6 weeks in an ICU

 

Now I understand. Thanks.

[earthscar]

3 minutes ago, atpeace said:

I would bet my life I'm healthier than the before picture.  It looks like he has had major heart surgery by the scar on his chest.    He looks much better in the after the picture but chicks dig the before look.  I would bet his blood pressure is lower and other health indicators at his weight will be better after fully recovering from Covid.  Very little can be gained by a picture without more data.  

possibly but assuming he isn't lying or omitting by mistake then...

 

https://globalnews.ca/news/6963878/coronavirus-nurse-muscle-loss/

 

A California nurse and bodybuilding enthusiast has revealed the shocking toll that the coronavirus took on his body after he spent six weeks in the hospital with complications from COVID-19.

Mike Schultz, 43, says he weighed about 190 pounds and had no underlying health conditions before he contracted the coronavirus in early March. He ended up spending 57 days in hospital with the virus and came out weighing only 140 pounds, he wrote in an Instagram post. The post also included before and after photos documenting the dramatic change that his body went through during the ordeal.

[atpeace]

3 minutes ago, earthscar said:

no clue if your a USA citizen but if you made it thru the 5 or so years we have had I'm a little concerned your not angery.

 

you got bolsenaro in brazil helping his population decrease. 

you got Putin attempting(and succeeding in some cases) with assonating ppl and not caring if we know

we have a American journalist get associated and our president all but sent a gift bag to the murderers boss.

we exited Afghanistan w/o supporting all the men, women and girls that we told the American dream is just around the corner.

we got president daturta joking about raping a nun on nation news and supporting the card board justice. hell its a non secret that he used to run death squads out of the town he use to run.

you got xi xing w/ his mass harvesting of organs from political prisnors

you get to see the rise of the world right leaning(i say right based of how the political party in usa works the right in a EU country might be more like our left even if called right so don't read to much into that)

 

we are still going. This anger didn't just pop because of covid oh no..this is a fruit salad of <deleted>.

 

w/ the rise of cameras everywhere we are finding out that "just do what he says" will not turn out well for you if your not white. leave it to beaver you lied to me. 

you got the blatant gerrymandering that continues to allow the minority in this contrary to dictate to the majority.

you have the horrified exp of watching trumps sludge like personality absorb the GOP..

 

We are mad because we have had to learn the hard way when we have a rational conversation w/ these ppl that we just end up coming out of it coved in muck. we are accepting the fact that we may need to soil our mental image we have of ourselves and start playing the GOPs game.

 

so ya when we see some miss information BS that will continue to damage my children's future. Your just getting a glimse of the flames its going to roar out of control if this isn't improved. 

I am American and far from angry.  Sure I think Trump was a fool but I'm not angry.  On the other hand you are so angry you can't clearly make a point. Your post is painful to read and feel sad you feel the only way to interact to is to rage.  Good luck with this approach - you are going to need it.

[earthscar]

Just now, atpeace said:

I am American and far from angry.  Sure I think Trump was a fool but I'm not angry.  On the other hand you are so angry you can't clearly make a point. Your post is painful to read and feel sad you feel the only way to interact to is to rage.  Good luck with this approach - you are going to need it.

then your in the minority you need look no further then how ppl are responding to the social challanges the world is facing. if you didn't find that list(infintesamly small amount of the overall image) something you think we should change then your a lost cause. do a search for the term "laying down" in china. ppl who say i feel sad for you as often as you do i generally run across in a tictok story posted on facebook w/ karen or ken in the tittle somewhere.

 

so you can be shocked when i'm not overy worried about your stance on me.

[freedomnow]

1 hour ago, Jeffr2 said:

And therein lies the problem. People who fall for the fake news.

Please sort and sift what constitutes fake news regarding covid-19 for us all.

Thanks.