Non o visa based on marriage renew problem

[tracker1]

No matter what you do Immigration seems to always find something else just to annoy one !

[Scott]

Name and shame post reported and removed.

 

[atpeace]

It was 10 years ago but I registered the USA marriage here in Thailand.  No need to get re-married here as I remember.  I had to have my marriage certificate translated and obtained the docs below.

 

A Marriage Certificate (Kor Ror 3) and Marriage Registration (Kor Ror 2). If the applicant got married abroad, the applicant or the Thai spouse must report the marriage to the amphur and obtain Kor Ror 22.

 

I got the Kor 3 and Kor 2 in bangkok and the Kor 22 at government office in Pattaya.  Not a fun process but only need to do it once!  I remember it being easy other than the traveling between offices and cities.

 

I'm sure your marriage will last but if not, registering it here has definite legal advantages if a divorce is needed.  A divorce is a simple trip to your local government office. Takes one hour and is recognized in the USA if she wasn't coerced or anything obviously illegal wasn't done.

 

[atpeace]

You need a letter that is not written by you.  The "you" part is important.  Basically a 100 word or less letter with paragraphs in Thai from a lawyer explaining how the two marriage certificates are linked.  Then deal with it every year but please for the love of buddha, do not detail what happened yourself.  The officer might shoot you or himself 30 minutes into the ramble.

 

My post above doesn't apply to the OP.  Wow, OP - use paragraphs! I had to read to spend 20 minutes deciphering what you were describing and everytime I would get dizzy and lose my place.  Finally semi gave up.

 

Forgive me - still dizzy from reading your post but here is what I gathered:

 

You first  registered  your marriage in Bangkok using your marriage certificate from a USA court and then  decided to register your marriage locally in Ubon  using a different marriage certification document provided from the state of Florida.  The rest of your post just is confusing.

 

Why you decided to register your marriage in thailand with two different certifications is strange but I could see myself doing something even more strange in the moment.  Sorry, you're perpetually screwed because it is hard to fix when you did everything correct and so did the Thai authorities.  Bureaucracies suck at times and hard for common sense to prevail.

 

 

Edited September 13, 2021 by atpeace

[sencelebi]

You don't need to get your marriage certificate translation at the embassy. I had my US marriage certificate translated here in Thailand at the translation office and they certified it. That's it. I renewed my NON-O 3 times also and every time there was a 30 day stamp. That's the way they do it. And I got my approvaal 45 days later. Also you can not get married here too, you are already in the system. Your applivation might get refected and deportation can be issued. Just not try to go around the law as some people recommend it. Because it's not them if you get into trouble. They will sit back have their beer and you will be the one who suffers. It's easy for someone to say go around the law.

Edited September 13, 2021 by sencelebi
Added more comments

[raptorea]

6 hours ago, atpeace said:

You need a letter that is not written by you.  The "you" part is important.  Basically a 100 word or less letter with paragraphs in Thai from a lawyer explaining how the two marriage certificates are linked.  Then deal with it every year but please for the love of buddha, do not detail what happened yourself.  The officer might shoot you or himself 30 minutes into the ramble.

 

My post above doesn't apply to the OP.  Wow, OP - use paragraphs! I had to read to spend 20 minutes deciphering what you were describing and everytime I would get dizzy and lose my place.  Finally semi gave up.

 

Forgive me - still dizzy from reading your post but here is what I gathered:

 

You first  registered  your marriage in Bangkok using your marriage certificate from a USA court and then  decided to register your marriage locally in Ubon  using a different marriage certification document provided from the state of Florida.  The rest of your post just is confusing.

 

Why you decided to register your marriage in thailand with two different certifications is strange but I could see myself doing something even more strange in the moment.  Sorry, you're perpetually screwed because it is hard to fix when you did everything correct and so did the Thai authorities.  Bureaucracies suck at times and hard for common sense to prevail.

 

 

Let me see if this clears it up.

 

Thank you, Please let me try to explain I did this step when I came to Thailand with my marriage cert from usa I got a affidavit at the usa embassy done got it translated then sent to MFA but on this marriage certificate it only had a application number which is what I wrote on the affidavit as it was the only number on the certificate and took all this to my local amphur for the kor ror 22.

 

This time Immigration wanted a translated copy of the actual marriage certificate stamped by the MFA done, and the way to do that is to get it legalized from the USA department of state and the THAI embassy in Wash dc I did that step to but this where it gets messed up.

 

The new copy of my marriage certificate that came from the bureau of vital statistics had a state file number on it and not a application number which I first used at amphur so after getting a translated copy of the one with the state file number on and getting it stamped at the MFA.

 

Immigration said that the numbers dont match on the kor ror 22 which is true and they wanted amphur to update the number and amphur said no they cant change the number because once it is recorded in the system it cant be changed, I hope this makes since and if you have any suggestions to please help me. Thank you  

[EricTh]

@raptorea

 

It would be easier to read if you break up your very long essay into several small paragraphs.

Edited September 13, 2021 by EricTh

[raptorea]

3 minutes ago, EricTh said:

@raptorea

 

It would be easier to read if you break up your very long essay into several small paragraphs.

Thank you, Please let me try to explain I did this step when I came to Thailand with my marriage cert from usa I got a affidavit at the usa embassy done got it translated then sent to MFA but on this marriage certificate it only had a application number which is what I wrote on the affidavit as it was the only number on the certificate and took all this to my local amphur for the kor ror 22.

 

This time Immigration wanted a translated copy of the actual marriage certificate stamped by the MFA done, and the way to do that is to get it legalized from the USA department of state and the THAI embassy in Wash dc I did that step to but this where it gets messed up.

 

The new copy of my marriage certificate that came from the bureau of vital statistics had a state file number on it and not a application number which I first used at amphur so after getting a translated copy of the one with the state file number on and getting it stamped at the MFA.

 

Immigration said that the numbers dont match on the kor ror 22 which is true and they wanted amphur to update the number and amphur said no they cant change the number because once it is recorded in the system it cant be changed, I hope this makes since and if you have any suggestions to please help me. Thank you  

 

 

I am thinking to go back to the USA embassy in Bangkok and doing another affidavit done but this time listing my application number and my state file number that came from the two different certificates get that translated and send to the MFA for a stamp and present to immigration. 

[EricTh]

10 minutes ago, raptorea said:

Thank you, Please let me try to explain I did this step when I came to Thailand with my marriag

 

If you are married to a Thai person, wouldn't it be better to apply and get a Thai marriage cert in Thailand itself since you will be staying in Thailand?

 

 

 

Edited September 13, 2021 by EricTh

[raptorea]

Just now, EricTh said:

 

If you married to a Thai person, wouldn't it be better to get a Thai marriage cert in Thailand itself since you will be staying in Thailan?

 

I thought it was illegal to get married to the same person twice?

[DrJoy]

15 minutes ago, raptorea said:

 

 

 

I am thinking to go back to the USA embassy in Bangkok and doing another affidavit done but this time listing my application number and my state file number that came from the two different certificates get that translated and send to the MFA for a stamp and present to immigration. 

Yes, just make a sworn affidavit from the US embassy.

Thai authorities love embassy stamps.

[EricTh]

5 minutes ago, raptorea said:

I thought it was illegal to get married to the same person twice?

You're not getting married to the same person twice in the same country. You're getting a marriage certificate the first time in Thailand.

 

It's just like you got a US driving license in the USA, now you are getting another Thai driving license in Thailand.

 

 

 

Edited September 13, 2021 by EricTh

[ubonjoe]

5 minutes ago, EricTh said:

You're not getting married to the same person twice in the same country. You're getting a marriage certificate the first time in Thailand.

It is not legal and it would require making a false statement on the affirmation of permit to marry affidavit.

He has already registered his foreign marriage at a amphoe as well.

[raptorea]

2 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

It is not legal and it would require making a false statement on the affirmation of permit to marry affidavit.

He has already registered his foreign marriage at a amphoe as well.

Ubonjoe, I think my best option is to do another affidavit stating both the application number and state file number get translated and stamped by the MFA and I would think that this would suffice local immigration (Hope so!) 

[ubonjoe]

49 minutes ago, raptorea said:

Ubonjoe, I think my best option is to do another affidavit stating both the application number and state file number get translated and stamped by the MFA and I would think that this would suffice local immigration (Hope so!) 

That should satisfy immigration. Not sure why they are being so pickey.

In reality immigration should be satisfied with what is on the Kor Ror 22 since it is official documents that proves your marriage has been registered here.

[lopburi3]

22 minutes ago, EricTh said:

You're not getting married to the same person twice in the same country. You're getting a marriage certificate the first time in Thailand.

 

It's just like you got a US driving license in the USA, now you are getting another Thai driving license in Thailand.

 

 

 

Once married is either USA or Thailand you are married in both.

[raptorea]

44 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

That should satisfy immigration. Not sure why they are being so pickey.

In reality immigration should be satisfied with what is on the Kor Ror 22 since it is official documents that proves your marriage has been registered here.

Totally agree on top of that my 3rd year doing this and have a dual citizen daughter 8 years old, all the docs were fine before but this time they wanted the translation done and stamped by the MFA. Who knows what will be next maybe have to run an exercise course under 60 seconds. 

[roobaa01]

Good even Ing, 

 

Today I obtained my bank letter for immigration jomtien. Tomorrow afternoon i want to do my extension of stay marriage to a thai national. Prior to immigration i will update

My bankbook. Do I face an isSue ???

Wbr

Roobaa01

[Eibot]

On 9/12/2021 at 7:15 AM, ubonjoe said:

You might not of gotten it from embassy if from a country that requires you to get it there. 

Netherlands..It was 12 years ago but don't remember getting any sort of form like that. 

[Eibot]

On 9/12/2021 at 7:23 AM, MJCM said:

+1

 

I am (I think) from the same country as @Eibot and when we got married (here in Thailand) approx 10 years ago, the "affirmation of freedom to marry" was one of the documents needed from my Embassy. We then had to have it translated in Thai and then off to the MFA (Ministry of Foreign Affairs) to have it stamped that it was a genuine document. After that we could go to the Amphur and get married!

Netherlands. Mine was 12 years ago and I don't remember getting any such form. We were married at an amphur in Bangkok were we were renting a condo in the area. The whole process was very quick. My wife did had to proof the divorced her previous husband some years prior to that, but nothing was asked of me..

[lopburi3]

3 minutes ago, Eibot said:

Netherlands..It was 12 years ago but don't remember getting any sort of form like that. 

This was done at an official office in Bangkok without using a paid service?   This would be extremely unusual as no office will normally do without the proof of being fit to marry paperwork and it being registered with MFA - and it is checked for validity.  This is a step done days or weeks before the visit to office to register marriage.

[Eibot]

7 minutes ago, lopburi3 said:

This was done at an official office in Bangkok without using a paid service?   This would be extremely unusual as no office will normally do without the proof of being fit to marry paperwork and it being registered with MFA - and it is checked for validity.  This is a step done days or weeks before the visit to office to register marriage.

No paid service was included no... What might be of interest is that I was 18 years old at the time. Don't think this should have anything to do with it, but then again it does seem strange I was never asked to proof this in hindsight. 

[steve187]

On 9/10/2021 at 10:35 PM, Eibot said:

Marry under Thai Law. 

 

Took us 40 minutes many years ago. 

 

Then you're all done with this legalizing stuff. 

you can only get married once without getting a divorce, what about the Freedom of marriage doc you have to get from your embassy, not really thought through

op why did you not just get the 1st marriage cert translated and stamped instead of getting one from a different office,

 

[raptorea]

8 minutes ago, steve187 said:

you can only get married once without getting a divorce, what about the Freedom of marriage doc you have to get from your embassy, not really thought through

op why did you not just get the 1st marriage cert translated and stamped instead of getting one from a different office,

 

Because from I what read on this website and other research that was all that was needed and could not get legalized once I was in Thailand from the Usa embassy here. I read that an affidavit was sufficient enough get the affidavit translated and stamped by the MFA and then get the kor ror 22 but this Im office asked for a translated copy of the marriage cert from USA and since I cant do that here I had to get it legalized from the USA and the marriage cert that was legalized in the Usa did not include the application number it only stated a state file number but all other information was correct and by the way from the same office in the USA all marriage cert come from each state from the bureau of vital statistics.  

[Maestro]

On 9/11/2021 at 6:49 PM, Eibot said:

Legally maybe not, however they didn't enforce it with us at all. Again, TIT, everything goes.

 

Had you also, like the OP, put your foreign marriage on record at your local district office and received the KR.22 before you got married again in Thailand?

[atpeace]

17 hours ago, raptorea said:

Ubonjoe, I think my best option is to do another affidavit stating both the application number and state file number get translated and stamped by the MFA and I would think that this would suffice local immigration (Hope so!) 

Why complicate the process with two application numbers. Use the same number that is on the cert from the state which will match the number at local immigration.  Providing two numbers might cause issues and don't see any advantage. 

 

The new affidavit and local registration match. Done!

 

My only question - can you get multiple affidavits from MFA ( have no idea what MFA is but assume an official office in Bangkok).

[lopburi3]

6 minutes ago, atpeace said:

( have no idea what MFA is but assume an official office in Bangkok).

Ministry of Foreign Affairs (like US Department of State) - they are official registry of foreign documents to make them legal in Thailand.

[raptorea]

3 minutes ago, atpeace said:

Why complicate the process with two application numbers. Use the same number that is on the cert from the state which will match the number at local immigration.  Providing two numbers might cause issues and don't see any advantage. 

 

The new affidavit and local registration match. Done!

 

My only question - can you get multiple affidavits from MFA ( have no idea what MFA is but assume an official office in Bangkok).

I am not sure can get multiple from MFA (Ministry Of Foreign Affairs) but right now the number the matches the local office (Amphur) is the one with the application number which I cannot legalize here and the one that is official and legalized by The Secretary Of State Florida, USA department Of State and the Royal Thai Embassy is the one with the state file number I think listing specific application number and state file number on a new affidavit will resolve this mess, 

[Eibot]

12 hours ago, Maestro said:

 

Had you also, like the OP, put your foreign marriage on record at your local district office and received the KR.22 before you got married again in Thailand?

No I did not.

[atpeace]

26 minutes ago, raptorea said:

I am not sure can get multiple from MFA (Ministry Of Foreign Affairs) but right now the number the matches the local office (Amphur) is the one with the application number which I cannot legalize here and the one that is official and legalized by The Secretary Of State Florida, USA department Of State and the Royal Thai Embassy is the one with the state file number I think listing specific application number and state file number on a new affidavit will resolve this mess, 

How unfortunate and unlucky. Are you sure you can not get a local lawyer to talk to the Amphur office and have them change the number? Also, why do you think you can change the number on the new affidavit at MFA?  

 

If it were me, I would exhaust all possibilities of changing at the local amphur before moving forward.  Your explanation is confusing so just tell them you registered an unofficial document with the Amphur and it needs to be replaced with the official certificate of marriage and corresponding cert # that is recognized by Thailand.  

 

Many visa agencies in Ubon I think? Just send a few emails stating you need to fix the marriage certificate document that was used in error at the amphur  with the correct certificate that is recognized by Thailand.

 

Good luck