when did you know you were ready to retire financially and leave farangland?

[olfu]

I dont know better but being a slave to your job and place for most of life not really exciting.

Freedom to explore the world sounds much better idea and on a top you can always ask questions nobody has answer.

And no matter what your health declining and priorities changing and you understand

life is tough and then you die.

[wwest5829]

Sorry, a Yank here,  so my thinking dealt with the US and USD. I had 5 by-passes in the US in 2005 and a male paternal line with all dying from heart attacks so that played into my decision of when to retire. Another consideration was being on an academic calendar year. I determined that I would retire a bit earlier than my age 65 full retirement year, leaving instead in July 2011 (age 64 1/2). I sold all property in the US, thus not being subject to any state taxes as I am not a resident although I am still subject to US income tax. As to financing, about half my 65,000 baht monthly retirement budget comes from earned US Social Security. The other half comes from my retirement funds and personal savings which are invested and managed. Thus far (knock on wood for the future), I am able to have a comfortable working middle class retirement unavailable to me at anywhere near the same cost in the US. In addition, in the decade since retirement, my invested net worth has continued to grow.

[murraynz]

On 9/19/2021 at 4:43 PM, georgegeorgia said:

But you paid taxes there ....arent you interested in getting the old age pension from there? thats your entitlement unless your a multi millionaire then you dont qualify.

What about keeping a house there just in case ?

I can relate extra well with your post.. 

I'm from Auckland, have my own condo in Pattaya, last 5 years. 

I'm a very healthy 70yrs old.. 

I get my full Nz pension sent to my Thai bank.. Needed to read in NZ 45 yrs to be eligible. 

I still own several houses in NZ. And have very substantial  passive income from other investments. Including commercial property in Adelaide.. 

The houses give minimal income, but good cap gains,  which keeps me ahead of inflation. 

The main point here is... Create long term passive income.. 

Keep some good property to reap cap gains.. 

If I wish to return to Nz.. I don't have to sell my condo.. It's only pocket money.. 

Don't burn bridges with home country. 

Make sure you maximise your pension claim.. 

Keep healthy... Don't loose your brains over Thai women or booze.. 

Life then then be very good in Thailand. 

NOW is good time to send money to Thailand, while exchange rates are good... 

I retired at 63.  But worked 7 days a week, long hours, most of my life.. I don't recommend that.. 

I expect many more good years in Thailand.. Have very ample funds that won't run out.. 

[newnative]

    Another Yank.  I retired at age 54 from my state job after getting my 30 years in--I was getting burned out.  Then worked part-time until age 59, when my Thai partner and I moved to Thailand in 2010.  Took SS at age 62 and don't regret taking it early at all.  I have a state pension and with SS it is enough to live comfortably in Thailand. 

   I feel very fortunate to have a steady, safe, predictable monthly income that has yearly cost of living increases that are easily keeping pace with inflation.  I'm lucky to be in the shrinking group of retirees that have a traditional pension, in my case mostly paid for by the state I worked for.

    We sold our condo in the US as we didn't want to try to manage it from Thailand.  We used the proceeds as a start to buy condos in Thailand that we fixed up and flipped; it turned out to be a fun sideline and a continuation of what we had been doing now and then in the US. 

   As others have mentioned, healthcare is a big expense as the US Medicare for seniors is not available for me to use in Thailand.  I'm spending around $9000 US dollars a year for health insurance with a European-based company--expensive but I want to stay with the same company I've had for 10 years and not start over with another company. 

    My father lived to age 95, my mother until 101.  I think anyone should plan to be around until at least 90.  The last 10 years of my mother's life, in a nice nursing home, cost, on average, $70,000 a year.  My pension and SS together are a little more than half that.  I'll need a Plan B.   

[1FinickyOne]

On 9/19/2021 at 1:45 PM, georgegeorgia said:

I went to see a financial planner here in Australia

A 25 yr old financial planner? How could he possibly know more about your life situation, hopes and dreams, and facing the latter part of your personal destiny, than you? 

[simon43]

If you wait until you think you have enough money to retire in Thailand or south-east Asia.... then you will never retire and move here!

 

I moved from the UK to Thailand at the age of 43, due to a lung illness - the hot and humid climate in south-east Asia suited my lungs better than the UK.

 

My monthly income started off at about 1 million baht per month when I moved to Thailand, but decreased slowly and surely as my UK remote business circumstances changed, aided by the greed and expenses of my mad ex-wife #2.  Finally, I hit rock bottom, reliant on close  friends for food....

 

Not one to jump from a tower block, I slowly improved my financial position by working in Myanmar.  Today, I live in Laos and I have a steady income of about 80,000 baht a month.  I save 35,000 baht in a high-interest account and spend the rest on rent, medical insurance, utilities, food and my ham radio hobby.  Since I don't drink, smoke, gamble, do drugs, have a GF (the 3rd marriage was the last straw!),  I can easily afford to eat in restaurants every day.

 

I have made plans to downsize on my restaurant activities when I stop working and have to rely on my UK state pension.  But I should still be able to enjoy a modest, healthy life ????

[gearbox]

OP I quickly glimpsed through your figures, I'm not a financial advisor but it seems to me with 600K super and your own apartment you won't qualify for age pension...so you may need to spend/hide some money to reduce assets.

 

Don't sell the apartment unless you are savvy investor and can get better returns elsewhere. Keep in mind in Australia it is better from OAP and assets prospective to own your home, if you sell your apartment you may kiss the OAP goodbye, as your assets in regards to OAP eligibility will increase very unfavourably. To reduce your assets back to the OAP thresholds you need to play good hearted hansum man a lot and cure sick buffaloes.

 

I don't have a residence back in Australia but have lots of investments there. I was thinking to buy something for safety, but can't be bothered. It is hard to me to qualify for OAP unless I take piles of money outside Australia and bury it somewhere...and not tell the taxman about it.

 

You can do quick check here how much your super will last here:

 

https://www.dinkytown.net/java/investment-distributions.html

 

for 600k initial investment, return 4%, inflation 2% and $2500AUD per month (around 60k baht) it should last around 26 years. Of course if you drop below the OAP thresholds you can start drawing the Aussie welfare, plus you can get rental income. For me with the 60k baht per month spending you should be good to go.

 

 

 

[khunPer]

On 9/19/2021 at 8:45 AM, georgegeorgia said:

...BUT if i rent it out to tenants after real estate expenses,council rates ,strata body corp fees,taxes, etc,  i worked out i would receive around25,000 to  30,000 thai baht clear per month rental,say 25k to be safe 

 

i have approx1  3- 14 million thai baht ($600,000 australian)  i would recieve in superanuation/retirement funds i could get now if i retire fully .....but.....i cant get the age pension until 67 and probaly unlikely i will qualify plus australia has a stupid policy that you must of stayed in australia 2 years before applying,im not going to sit here between 65 and 67 just to qualify

 

i dont drink much nor smoke but do you think this will be enough to last at least 20 -25 years ,i wont sell the apartment though ,i could get a extra 15 million baht from that if i sell up,which one day i would want to .

 

please give me your rough age, area or part of asia you live in and approx month budget 

im tossing up between thailand and phillipines to live,i dont like cambodia 

 

i know say Pattaya would be more expensive than say udon thani ,but what about you guys who live in cambodia ,vietnam etc ,what is your ideal yearly retirement wage 

AND did you sell off your main residence in farangland ???

When I first seriously considered to settle in Thailand at age 54, I had equivalent to 8 milion baht in savings, and many years before a small government retirement pension would be paid. I considered to keep 5 million baht in bonds in my Danish home country, which would pay me about 250,000 baht per year, or 20,000 baht per month, and use the remaining 3 million baht to settle in Thailand with 1 million for a home; 1 million for a small car, moving cost, and needed assories for a home; and the last million to establish a business my Thai girlfriend could handle, which should pay 10,000 baht per month to each of us, i.e. a budget of 40,000 baht per month.

 

In the always unbearably crystal bright light of hindsight I'm very happy that I didn't do that.

 

I moved to Thailand two years later and checked finally officially out of my home country after one more year - I needed to sell my property, as was not allowed to own a full time home when moving abroad - but during those two years my financial situation had been improved drastically, mainly because of property prices, and so had my Thai girlfriend; i.e. I changed my gold digger-version to a more affordable make.

 

With 13-14 million baht plus an ongoing payout of around 25,000 baht it should be possible - many of my home country fellowmen survives on a small government pension of hardly 30,000 baht, plus a little extra work pension, totaling up around 35,000 baht to 40,000 baht a month, and only small or no savings; i.e. just manage to stay under marriange extension, either based on income or with 400,000 baht savings in deposit.

 

I published my budget in another local forum thread from the island Samui, where I decided to settle in Thailand, I'm giving you a link instead of repeating major parts of the post...

 

With a modest to normal lifestyle, I use to suggest the mandatory 65,000 baht per month for a retiree as a good base to count from. For that amount of money you can have an excellent life, but it's not an up-end hi-so style, nor enough for having a lot of female (or whatever sex) companionship or a gold digger partner; or aiming for producing a bunch of kids that needs to be send in international school.

 

I summed a budget of 51,500 baht total a month, i.e. 618,000 baht a year, for my lifestyle - which might both be different from your lifestyle, or quite similar. That sum is without including my child, otherwise it around one million baht per year. On top is the 800,000 baht deposit in a Thai bank account for extension of stay based on retirement, and some extra emergency savings in a "rainy day account". I also invested in an affordable car, some kind of transportation is often needed to be included in a bedget.

 

If you rent a home, and count equivalent to 10 million baht as investment -3-4 million used for deposit, move, eventual vehicle, rainy day-savings, and to settle in a new environment - it can pay you in average around 3 percent in dividends per year, i.e. 300,000 baht or 25,000 baht a month. You can also count on expected lifetime - count in worst case, in case you live longer than expected - included an average inflation and figure out how long you savings will last when you use it, instead of living of the dividends. You might for example be able to use about 400,000 baht a year (in 2021 money value) for 25 years with a fair level of inflation security, if the money is carefully invested.

 

Settling in a tourist area might not costs you more than Udon Somewhere. The best advise is to get around in the kingdom and test different places of interest, before you settle, and rent before you decide to buy anything. Finding the right spot in a tourist area might not cost more than Nakhon Nowhere, and might be less boring; however totally depending of lifestyle and personal preferences.

 

Buying a home makes sense in long term, as you after approximately 15 years of rent have paid your home fully, compared to renting something similar. But before "investing" in property, you shall be fairly sure that you aim for a long time stay in Thailand. In general a building loose value, while the land under a building increase in value. As it from present rules is extremely difficult for a foreigner to own property in Thailand - apart from a condo - you need to carefully check your options before buying a house; you can own a house, but you cannot legally own the land under the house; however there are various ways to get around it.

 

I was 56 when I made the move - I would rather enjoy some good years than working longer, and perhaps be too old to enjoy all the extra money I might make - I checked various part of Thailand, but settled in what I found as best options for my dream of paradise; options that included long stay term, shopping facilities, hospitals, schools, commuting etc.

 

Looking back in the always utterly crystal bright light of hindsight, I was extremely lucky with my decisions, the year after my move the financial market crashed, and so did the real estate prices, it took 15 year for a property like mine in my home country to again reach up the price I sold for. Back in the late 1980s and early 90s I joked with that when I could pack my business into something carry-able and wireless be in remote contact with my bank, then I would move to a paradise island and sit under a coconut palm while young women brought me cool drinks. One day I was catch by reality, and bound to my promise. So far I don regeret it, because I do sit in the shadow under a coconut palm on a paradise island, and I get cold drinks served by a lovely girlfriend...????

[Maha Sarakham]

1 hour ago, khunPer said:

I was 56 when I made the move - I would rather enjoy some good years than working longer, and perhaps be too old to enjoy all the extra money I might make.

Knowing what you know now, would you have pulled the plug earlier in your life around 50 - once you qualified for a retirement visa?

[habuspasha]

When did I decide?  I’m deciding now.  For the same reason I almost decided to retire a few years ago.  The long commute.  Over an hour each way from my Manhattan apartment to the college in the country.  That day before Thanksgiving a few years ago, a sudden ice storm turned the evening commute into a six-hour horror.  This time it’s the realization that I cannot drive safely at night.  Then and now, my savings will keep me comfortable—unless my wife’s Alzheimer’s lasts more than another ten years.  But this time I’m over 80.  And my loving and gorgeous Thai GF is almost 40.  So I will split my time and stop worrying about living till 140.

[YITB1980]

I successfully transitioned from being a "saver" to being ok with spending a bit of my savings in my late 50's.  Having saved a bit of every paycheck I ever earned, it was difficult to break that habit but once I did, I began to realize all of the possibilities. 

[habuspasha]

1 hour ago, YITB1980 said:

I successfully transitioned from being a "saver" to being ok with spending a bit of my savings in my late 50's.  Having saved a bit of every paycheck I ever earned, it was difficult to break that habit but once I did, I began to realize all of the possibilities. 

That is a very helpful way of thinking about what I am going through.  I was never a big saver but I have always thought of my savings as not to be spent down. My declining savings would mark my declining years.  For me and my wife.  And my wife's ever declining health could continue indefinitely and result in eventual impoverishment.  Instead I imagined I could work forever if necessary.  That way my savings would constantly expand and I could grow (instead of decline) indefinitely.  For now, the work no longer appeals.  If I have to get back to it in my 100s I'll worry about it then.

[Rampant Rabbit]

On 9/19/2021 at 1:45 PM, georgegeorgia said:

but im so bored and disinterested in my job

Well when I first started  work for myself (22yrs  old)  rather than someone else )18 yrs  old) I enjoyed it, great satisfaction in a job well  done (construction) as the years wnet  by  it seemed  people didnt  care about a job well done anymore and  just wanted a  cheap  job. At this  point I had had enough and quit at 42.

I did  it  slowly though and for 4  years only worked half the year spending the rest of the time here. Having never had  kids  or  getting married I had  no real ties except  parents and they would never make  me feel  like I had to stay tio "take  care" of  them.

So around 46 I gave up entirely. Id  saved  all those  years and  had a few  lucky breaks with UK  property when prices sky rocketed some going up 400% in 6  years and sold all except  one and cashed in.

Met the Wife introduced her to real estate and let her run with it. She was  like a  crazy thing as it was  boom time in Thai real  estate and she did  very well, keeping me and still does. Now i'm 57, she re invested in real estate and she  collects  rent off the ones she owns herself from her saving during the  good  times.

She earned 12k a month when I first met  her at a  normal  job, she quit  6  months  after we  married  on my request to take  care of her own rooms of  which I bought the first 3  then she bought the remaining 5  out of her  earnings over the years.

[Andycoops]

Fed up in the UK, I came in 2008 as I had arranged to take my company pension early at 52.

 

Had already met the missus, so got married, built a 3 bed, 3 bath in Isaan where I am now.

 

Have put both kids through university, boy finishes next spring.

Even with the uni fees you can manage on 40k THB.

 

You need an income to do it.  Don't live of savings, seen a couple of fellas spend it all and scuttle back from whence they came.

If you have an income of 60k plus it gives you some wiggle room to save and buy those things that suddenly stop working, washing machines etc.

[sirineou]

When both our houses in Thailand and in the US were mortgage free, I was fully vested in my trade Unions pension and qualified for Social security benefits, I put in my retirement papers  and never looked back. We are renting our US house to a friend, for a couple of years to see how things work out here. Then we will decide what to do. 

Advice: Don't retire if you have to sell everything you own to finance it, if things don't work out you will be (deleted LOL). Leave yourself a way back, and maintain links with friends and family 

[tonray]

"when did you know you were ready to retire financiallyand leave farangland?"

 

By farangland you mean lower Sukhumvit right ?

[rickudon]

Well, a good maxim is to work out what you think you need, then double it. And here's why.

 

I was made redundant at age 55, and knew that a new professional job was unlikely, so decided on semi-retirement. First we downsized the house, to pay off the mortgage. Something which i knew needed to be done, as i couldn't pay it off even if i worked until 60. So there we were, no mortgage or rent to pay, and a failing marriage.

I had a small pension and investment and savings income of about 4,000 GBP per year. I found a part-time job for 6,000 GBP a year, which was sufficient to pay the bills. I would get another pension when i got to 60, and state pension at 65.

 

So i took a holiday to Thailand, and loved it. So i planned to retire there at 60. That was in January 2008. I worked out that at the exchange rate then prevailing i would be able to meet the 65,000 baht a month requirement for a retirement visa when i was 60.

 

Then everything changed. I got seriously involved with a girl there, and lost my job due to an injury which prevented heavy lifting. Meanwhile, investments crashed, the exchange started to fall, and savings interest started to decline. So i moved plans up and went to Thailand at 58. To fund it i took my second pension early, so it was reduced. Never mind, i could dip into savings until i got the state pension and there was also the inheritance from my mum in the future who was in a nursing home.

My monthly income was now under 50,000 baht.....

The exchange rate fell further. Savings interest fell further. The new wife got pregnant. The roof of her house needed replacing, and other structural problems. My inheritance went to pay the nursing home bills. My savings melted away. Even when i got my state pension, i would never get an income of 65,000 baht (Brexit saw to that).

 

I survived, and even started saving a little. But it has never been the comfortable, free spending retirement i planned for.

 

So double what you think you need.

[georgegeorgia]

7 hours ago, habuspasha said:

When did I decide?  I’m deciding now.  For the same reason I almost decided to retire a few years ago.  The long commute.  Over an hour each way from my Manhattan apartment to the college in the country.  That day before Thanksgiving a few years ago, a sudden ice storm turned the evening commute into a six-hour horror.  This time it’s the realization that I cannot drive safely at night.  Then and now, my savings will keep me comfortable—unless my wife’s Alzheimer’s lasts more than another ten years.  But this time I’m over 80.  And my loving and gorgeous Thai GF is almost 40.  So I will split my time and stop worrying about living till 140.

you retired in your 70's ?????    i think personally thats way too long but maybe you enjoyed it but way toooo long for me.

There are guys at my workplace  in their 70's ,i think they will never enjoy retirement.

 

I always think about one guy back in 2001 at my workplace he was 74yo and i remember his then filipino wife coming in to bring his lunch and shouting at him to ask the boss for overtime on weekends ,i imagine he would be dead by now....and she probaly would be rich????

Edited September 21, 2021 by georgegeorgia

[habuspasha]

No, I didn't retire then.  I'm about to retire now that I'm over 80. I have to decide by October 1. 

[georgegeorgia]

11 hours ago, newnative said:

    Another Yank.  I retired at age 54 from my state job after getting my 30 years in--I was getting burned out.  Then worked part-time until age 59, when my Thai partner and I moved to Thailand in 2010.  Took SS at age 62 and don't regret taking it early at all.  I have a state pension and with SS it is enough to live comfortably in Thailand. 

   I feel very fortunate to have a steady, safe, predictable monthly income that has yearly cost of living increases that are easily keeping pace with inflation.  I'm lucky to be in the shrinking group of retirees that have a traditional pension, in my case mostly paid for by the state I worked for.

    We sold our condo in the US as we didn't want to try to manage it from Thailand.  We used the proceeds as a start to buy condos in Thailand that we fixed up and flipped; it turned out to be a fun sideline and a continuation of what we had been doing now and then in the US. 

   As others have mentioned, healthcare is a big expense as the US Medicare for seniors is not available for me to use in Thailand.  I'm spending around $9000 US dollars a year for health insurance with a European-based company--expensive but I want to stay with the same company I've had for 10 years and not start over with another company. 

    My father lived to age 95, my mother until 101.  I think anyone should plan to be around until at least 90.  The last 10 years of my mother's life, in a nice nursing home, cost, on average, $70,000 a year.  My pension and SS together are a little more than half that.  I'll need a Plan B.   

Do you have a old age government pension available in the USA ? and are you able to get it overseas in thailand ?

I did recall meeting one American guy a few years ago living in the Phillipines who was a young 55yo on the disability pension so i guess it works the same?

[Maha Sarakham]

1 hour ago, habuspasha said:

No, I didn't retire then.  I'm about to retire now that I'm over 80. I have to decide by October 1. 

Get out!

[georgegeorgia]

1 hour ago, habuspasha said:

No, I didn't retire then.  I'm about to retire now that I'm over 80. I have to decide by October 1. 

you still travelling a hour each day to work?  Do you have to get the train each morning? 

not something i would like to do at 80 but i guess if you enjoy it

Edited September 21, 2021 by georgegeorgia

[newnative]

20 minutes ago, georgegeorgia said:

Do you have a old age government pension available in the USA ? and are you able to get it overseas in thailand ?

I did recall meeting one American guy a few years ago living in the Phillipines who was a young 55yo on the disability pension so i guess it works the same?

   I get Social Security from the US government and I also have a retirement pension from the state of Virginia as I was a state employee for 30 years.  

[NoshowJones]

On 9/19/2021 at 2:29 PM, bookstore said:

I am in a little different boat. I was on disability in the US and when I turned 62yo they made me take early retirement. I was stationed in Thailand for 2 years when I was in the military. So when they forced retirement on me I moved to thailand. I had $80,000 saved and about $1,500 a month  I have been living here now for 4 years quite nice on my pension. As long as you stay out of the bars and limit your self to the beautiful women here you will be ok

That would be the case when I first came to live in Thailand about 15 years ago, but things have gone right downhill for both expats and tourists since the country was stolen by an unelected PM and his soldiers. It would be a big mistake for anyone to come to Thailand now to retire.

[bookstore]

2 hours ago, possum1931 said:

That would be the case when I first came to live in Thailand about 15 years ago, but things have gone right downhill for both expats and tourists since the country was stolen by an unelected PM and his soldiers. It would be a big mistake for anyone to come to Thailand now to retire.

Same as the election in the US but where is a man to live

[khunPer]

12 hours ago, Maha Sarakham said:

Knowing what you know now, would you have pulled the plug earlier in your life around 50 - once you qualified for a retirement visa?

Knowing what I know now I would have come here in the happy hippie era and partying on Koh Samui and Koh Pahngan's Sunrise Beach with all the gorgeous young ladies; however it would not have been financially possible in the long run, and I might well have ended like one of the old hippies from that time, who now sits almost penniless on Sunrise Beach...

 

If I had had the financial capabilities, knowing what I know now in the unbearable crystal bright light of hindsight, yes, then I would pulled the plug and settled on Koh Samui around age of 50; however I did not have the financial needs, so luckily I waited another six years.

 

Even that it's said - and also a book title - that you can "live in paradise for pennies on the dollar", the truth is slightly different, if your dream of paradise is not that far from mine. Struggling to survive almost day by day on a very low budget is not my "dream of paradise", and living extremely primitive like on "Bounty Island" in the shade of a coconut palm, and not much else, might also be boring in the long run - don't forget that many of the female companions might suddenly find someone more "handsum", i.e. "someone more rich"...????

 

I'm still very happy with both my choice and my timing...????

[khunPer]

2 hours ago, possum1931 said:

That would be the case when I first came to live in Thailand about 15 years ago, but things have gone right downhill for both expats and tourists since the country was stolen by an unelected PM and his soldiers. It would be a big mistake for anyone to come to Thailand now to retire.

This country has been "stolen by an un-elected PM" about 20 times since 1932...????

[Mike Teavee]

3 hours ago, possum1931 said:

It would be a big mistake for anyone to come to Thailand now to retire.

Hope not, I only made the move last year... but the $64,000 question is, if not Thailand then where?

 

[NoshowJones]

14 minutes ago, Mike Teavee said:

Hope not, I only made the move last year... but the $64,000 question is, if not Thailand then where?

 

Depends on what your looking for.

[Mike Teavee]

1 hour ago, possum1931 said:

Depends on what your looking for.

Of the top of my head, a place that has...

1. Reasonably easy to stay (have no problem doing the 1 year visa extensions, if I did then I'd get the 20 year Thai Elite Visa)
2. Reasonably cheap to live (I have a great lifestyle on £2,500 / 100K THB pm)
3. No cold winters (though I do miss spring in the UK)
4. Decent waters/beaches (though I would  have moved to the Philippines if this was more important) 
5. Access to Western comforts & Asian cuisines
6. Decent infrastructure 

+ It doesn't hurt to have a GF that's 20 years younger????  

 

I very nearly moved to the Philippines (had a Filipino GF for 8 years & went 1/2s on a house in Davao) but at the end of the day Numbers 5 & 6 weren't up to the standard that I was looking for.

  

Only other options I could think of were Portugal (Not easy for a Brit to move there nowadays) or South America (I've only visited on day trips from cruises, & the planned a 3-6 month tour of a few of the SA countries got scuppered by Covid). 

 

TBH, if I could, I would have spent the 1st few years of my retirement touring the US but it's very difficult for a Brit to spend more than 6 months of the year there. 

 

 

 

So if you were retiring today, where would you retire to?

 

Edited September 21, 2021 by Mike Teavee