Why does it seem that so many people here are working class?

[lanng khao]

Definitely born into a working class family, I realized this on my 6 th birthday when my mum only had 3 candles so she put the cake Infront of a mirror...

[wwest5829]

I was raised blue collar in the USA. Dad was a welder and Mom went to work as a hospital lab receptionist after my Brother and I went off to college. I always refer to myself as part of the retired working middle class, having joined millions of other American Expats out-priced in the USA. We can enjoy a higher living standard of a working middle class retirement in a lower cost country. In the US, class is oft determined by income. My highest earning year was $55,000.00 USD. Education level - post-graduate degree. Poor financial choice … teaching in Kentucky (OK, and not a “yes man” when my knowledge and experience dictated giving reasons in opposing wrongheaded administrators).

[Freddy42OZ]

On 12/19/2021 at 5:16 PM, connda said:

I've been all three.  Where am I now in the scheme of things?  Retired.
I've done some of the dirtiest, grubbiest, dangerous work imaginable (look up the 10 most dangerous job in the US and done 5 of them if you don't include the military), I spent 8 years in the military (that makes 6), left, graduated at the top of my class out of university, and spent my last career years working a nice clean (sometimes rather cold - worked in server rooms a lot) job as a computer engineer and eventually migrated into management positions, not particularly out of choice but by upper management requesting that I fill in managerial gap - I could interface between labor and management.  And I've no regrets about anything I've done.  All those experiences shaped me.

So?  What class am I?  Do I give a flying ****?  (<--- that's my Military and blue-collar guy speaking)  No! Not really.   Plus people's fortunes wane and wax with the fickleness of fate and luck.  People with high risk tolerances probably have been both broke, rich, and all points in-between.

So really?  What difference does it make what class another person is unless you are a status conscious prig - and I'm not - as I can related first-hand to all of those classes - and I thoroughly respect them all.

What about you OP.  Do you speak Oxford English as well as Latin and hobnob with the "upper-crust?" Or are you a Thai?  Or just "gone native?" What drives your interest in social class? ????

I speak with received pronunciation after spending most of my life around other similar speaking people and going to boarding school in the UK.

Yes I learn't Latin at school, don't use it much but glad I was made to study it. 

My interest is purely based on the fact that growing up only really knew about working class people from TV and movies, I never actually met or knew anyone who was working class until I came to Thailand.  

[Freddy42OZ]

On 12/19/2021 at 4:46 PM, Kinnock said:

I was struck by the number of people answering the 'what was your careet' thread with stories of building sites, odd jobs and eclectic business start ups ..... but not in any judgemental way, just suprised there wasn't more teachers or corporate ex-pats relocated from colder climes.

 

But I think it may represent the Aseannow crowd rather than a true representation of Thai ex-pats?

 

Few of the Japanese and Korean engineers and managers working in the Thai automotive industries would be on this site.

 

I also think people with a more practical and hands-on approach to life can thrive (survive) in a developing country.

 

And 'class' is a very fluid concept now.  Two generations back my family roots were very much working class, but the 1960's saw many people in US and Europe progress to Middle Class.  I think this trend is reversing now, with most people slipping back, and a hyper rich few leaping forward.

 

Exactly!  That is what I find surprising, why on this forum does it seem to be heavily weighted towards blokes who did manual labour, blue collar jobs and why there are not a lot more guys who worked in corporate jobs, investment banking, etc  


 

[BritManToo]

6 minutes ago, Freddy42OZ said:

Exactly!  That is what I find surprising, why on this forum does it seem to be heavily weighted towards blokes who did manual labour, blue collar jobs and why there are not a lot more guys who worked in corporate jobs, investment banking, etc  

Probably because until 20 years ago almost everyone was working class.

In the 1970s, I was almost the only person at my school (nearly 2,000 pupils) that went to university. Now nearly all the working class jobs have been outsourced overseas, so if you live in the west, that option has all but gone.

Edited December 21, 2021 by BritManToo

[wwest5829]

On 12/19/2021 at 4:23 PM, transam said:

Isn't the 'class' thing from a bygone era....?

Valid question but I would say no, limiting my outlook to the USA. There are different ways of looking at “class”. In the USA a judgement is very heavily influenced by income. There are other measures, such as class mores. Thus we see the “Beverly Hillbillies”, suddenly having money but remaining far removed from the class of people living in Beverly Hills. Fiction? Yes, the idea of the “nouveau riche” remains valid, however. Should I mention the likes of Trump contrasted with the “old money” upbringing and outlook by such families as Rockefeller, Wanamaker, Rothschild, etc? The latter are of quite a different “class”. I can speak only for myself but I was not raised knowing a proper “place setting” if there was more that a plate, glass, knife fork and spoon (the poor might not even have that and the wealthy are aware of the correct red wine, white wine, water, champagne aperitifs, etc. glassware.

[gejohesch]

On 12/19/2021 at 9:49 AM, transam said:

I remember when a plumber went round on a push-bike, now they drive around in a Merc van, so what is he in the class scale. 

It all boils down to the definitions, and one issue is that people will have different definitions. To me, it does not matter that much how much money someone makes. I would see "rich working class" and "poor upper class" types, amongst others...

[Tippaporn]

2 hours ago, murraynz said:

Yes, I agree.. Putting people in types of class is totally ignorant and pointless.. 

Pointless unless the goal is to create division to separate men from each other.  There are those who are advantaged by established pecking orders.  They get to claim a superior position by defining imaginary and arbitrary boundaries.

[digger70]

In My book Everyone is Working Class, why you may ask.

Everyone Has to Work to make a Living if not they are Leaches /Bludging on the system.  ????

[transam]

2 minutes ago, gejohesch said:

It all boils down to the definitions, and one issue is that people will have different definitions. To me, it does not matter that much how much money someone makes. I would see "rich working class" and "poor upper class" types, amongst others...

I agree, I think 'class' was more around when I was a kid, now it seems a bloke who has made a few quid may think he is upper class....

[transam]

I think there are a few like this out there...

 

 

[zyphodb]

On 12/19/2021 at 6:13 PM, zzaa09 said:

The truer and hidden majority. Very reflective of the character here.

Ssshhh.....

Only the Middle class say they're classless...

[Tippaporn]

1 hour ago, Freddy42OZ said:

  

On 12/19/2021 at 4:33 PM, Tippaporn said:

What's your definition of success?

 

Wealth.  

Isn't wealth just a vehicle, or an avenue, for an even greater success?

[inThailand]

Aren't they more like fugitives running from the law or ex cons?

[gejohesch]

13 minutes ago, transam said:

I agree, I think 'class' was more around when I was a kid, now it seems a bloke who has made a few quid may think he is upper class....

Some may see that as being snobbish, but I would call the "bloke who has made a few quid and thinks he is upper class" (as you say) a "nouveau riche" or a "parvenu". Both terms are rather derogative in French. Often implying vulgarity - the "diamond ring as big as a cuckoo clock" syndrome.

That being said, I have always felt very comfortable with people of any class as long as they do not pretend to be what they are not. Vulgarity (or lack of) does not correlate 100% with wealth or class.

[Tippaporn]

3 hours ago, transam said:

The modern day 'upper class'.......????

 

 

You should have gotten a lot more haha reactions for that classic skit, transam.  

[The Hammer2021]

Although it is a frequently used term the phrase 'working class' is meaningless and riddled with contradictions and confusion.

[overherebc]

And everyone forgets no matter what your financial status is or what your voice sounds like or how well or how badly you dress ---- your sh-t still stinks.

[Yellowtail]

Where I come from, the working-class are (or at least were) middle-class, and most of the upper-middle-class work. 

 

 

[Tippaporn]

1 minute ago, The Hammer2021 said:

Although it is a frequently used term the phrase 'working class' is meaningless and riddled with contradictions and confusion.

All phrases for '<fil in the blank> class' are meaningless and riddled with contradictions and confusion.  Pagan definitions meant to define an identity which defies labeling or attempts to fit it inside a box no matter how spacious.

[chilly07]

On 12/19/2021 at 4:16 PM, Tippaporn said:

Where's the option for "None."  I'm classless.

Classy with it!

[The Hammer2021]

2 minutes ago, Tippaporn said:

All phrases for '<fil in the blank> class' are meaningless and riddled with contradictions and confusion.  Pagan definitions meant to define an identity which defies labeling or attempts to fit it inside a box no matter how spacious.

Perhaps. But 'working class' resonates with political and social significance and is bound up with polemics and the history of mass movements since the industrial revolution. This is not the same for middle class and upper class which are both clearly definable as they refer to which strata of society a group belong or are located. This is clearly not the case with working class.

[The Hammer2021]

2 minutes ago, chilly07 said:

Classy with it!

Clueless.

[The Hammer2021]

11 minutes ago, overherebc said:

And everyone forgets no matter what your financial status is or what your voice sounds like or how well or how badly you dress ---- your sh-t still stinks.

But out of respect we try to shield others from the stink

[Tippaporn]

13 minutes ago, The Hammer2021 said:

22 minutes ago, Tippaporn said:

All phrases for '<fil in the blank> class' are meaningless and riddled with contradictions and confusion.  Pagan definitions meant to define an identity which defies labeling or attempts to fit it inside a box no matter how spacious.

Perhaps. But 'working class' resonates with political and social significance and is bound up with polemics and the history of mass movements since the industrial revolution. This is not the same for middle class and upper class which are both clearly definable as they refer to which strata of society a group belong or are located. This is clearly not the case with working class.

Perhaps you misunderstand.  I'm opposed to using 'class' to define people, full stop.  Any attempt to do so is, as you say, riddled with contradictions and leads to confusion.  I'm opposed to pigeon-holing the human spirit of any individual using some arbitrary and imaginary scale which itself can only lead to divisions.  "This person fits here and you, over there, belong here."  "You're fitted here and no, there's no action you can take to move over there."  It's a silly game to play and one which I refuse to play.

 

Edited December 21, 2021 by Tippaporn

[Scott Tracy]

Why is it necessary to classify someone as working class, middle class, upper class? What's the purpose? If anyone asks.me, I would tell them I have no class. At least, that's what the wife told me the other day. 

 

Perpetuating this devisive horse <deleted> does no one any good. Stop it.

[Yellowtail]

17 minutes ago, Tippaporn said:

Perhaps you misunderstand.  I'm opposed to using 'class' to define people, full stop.  Any attempt to do so is, as you say, riddled with contradictions and leads to confusion.  I'm opposed to pigeon-holing the human spirit of any individual using some arbitrary and imaginary scale which itself can only lead to divisions.  "This person fits here and you, over there, belong here."  "You're fitted here and no, there's no action you can take to move over there."  It's a silly game to play and one which I refuse to play.

 

What's wrong with defining people by class? Sure, there are exceptions, but there are exceptions to most every rule. I think it much better than defining people by race which seems to be where we're headed. 

 

I have much more in common with a middle class black man than I do with a ruling class white man. 

[BritManToo]

6 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

What's wrong with defining people by class?

What's wrong is there is no class to define the current glut of worthless people given a free ride in the world. Many of whom have never worked and live off benefits all their life.

Edited December 21, 2021 by BritManToo

[Yellowtail]

18 minutes ago, Scott Tracy said:

Why is it necessary to classify someone as working class, middle class, upper class? What's the purpose? If anyone asks.me, I would tell them I have no class. At least, that's what the wife told me the other day. 

 

Perpetuating this devisive horse <deleted> does no one any good. Stop it.

You have to define sectors of society into classes so that you can adjust your policies to affect the sectors accordingly. 

 

Just because people fall within a class, they are not defined by the class. The rich aren't all greedy and selfish anymore than the poor are all hardworking and honest. 

 

[transam]

6 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

What's wrong with defining people by class? Sure, there are exceptions, but there are exceptions to most every rule. I think it much better than defining people by race which seems to be where we're headed. 

 

I have much more in common with a middle class black man than I do with a ruling class white man. 

Don't forget to tip your hat....????