ICE vs EV, the debate thread

[transam]

1 minute ago, JBChiangRai said:

Generally, local guys don't need to charge locally, I never have.

 

It costs me 4.5 baht/unit approx to fill my car if not using solar, for the MG4 it's about 180 baht to go from 25% to 100% for a 50kwHr battery.  I don't think I've ever dropped below 25%.  Per month maybe 4 times that.

 

 

Thank you......????

[KhunLA]

8 minutes ago, transam said:

That is you on a trip, now what about a local guy wanting a charge, how far is the average distance between a charge station, we know that gas stations are planted very close together....

For you home charger chaps, what does it cost per month for "fuel" using PEA....

Locally, doesn't cost us anything, as I charge with excess solar.  IF paying PEA/MEA, would think <฿4/kWh would be the ballpark, as that is the only thing we would use the grid for, so low rate. Others, ฿4 +/-, depending on the usage rate.

 

How much for others, that's a long piece of string.  I've posted before, and you've seen the #s, excess solar (free), and the PEA/MEA rate ฿4ish vs petrol's ฿37+ now per Liter.  Amount of savings per charge, whether 320kms range per full charge when O&A, or 360kms knocking locally

 

I'm not repeating myself, every time you repeat your silliness.

 

On just 2 O&As, one to Phuket and one to Nan, we saved about ฿7563, and that's just 2 trips vs cost for same distance, if using the ICE version of our ZS.

 

Have a nice day

[JBChiangRai]

I used to worry about taking a long trip until I did one.

 

I was amazed on Highway 1 every large service area I saw had CS's.  I tested one for 12 minutes (1 of my 2 times using a CS) and was impressed. In didn't need to charge but I thought I might as well as I  wanted a coffee.  After that I made a point of slowing down and looking at service areas, they rarely have an EV sign, but they mostly seem to have at least a 2 port CS.

[Fruit Trader]

Solar power is a great way to charge EV's but one cannot claim the power is free (no cost) until the value of  electricity produced exceeds the cost of solar equipment.

[transam]

21 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

Locally, doesn't cost us anything, as I charge with excess solar.  IF paying PEA/MEA, would think <฿4/kWh would be the ballpark, as that is the only thing we would use the grid for, so low rate. Others, ฿4 +/-, depending on the usage rate.

 

How much for others, that's a long piece of string.  I've posted before, and you've seen the #s, excess solar (free), and the PEA/MEA rate ฿4ish vs petrol's ฿37+ now per Liter.  Amount of savings per charge, whether 320kms range per full charge when O&A, or 360kms knocking locally

 

I'm not repeating myself, every time you repeat your silliness.

 

On just 2 O&As, one to Phuket and one to Nan, we saved about ฿7563, and that's just 2 trips vs cost for same distance, if using the ICE version of our ZS.

 

Have a nice day

Oh dear, so my questions are silliness, I am surprised, you an MG owner too..........................????

 

P.S. The idea of questions and answers are for clarity, learn something, perhaps catch out, a bit of fun too, bit like being in Parliament....????

And as I keep repeating in these threads, we will ALL be driving electric in the not too distant future, oh, perhaps not me, I will be in my box on the way to being an........????

 

[Yellowtail]

3 minutes ago, Fruit Trader said:

Solar power is a great way to charge EV's but one cannot claim the power is free (no cost) until the value of  electricity produced exceeds the cost of solar equipment.

Not to worry, several guys will be around directly to address this...

[transam]

3 minutes ago, Fruit Trader said:

Solar power is a great way to charge EV's but one cannot claim the power is free (no cost) until the value of  electricity produced exceeds the cost of solar equipment.

And maintenance, do solar panels have a life span, I don't know.....????

[KhunLA]

1 minute ago, transam said:

Oh dear, so my questions are silliness, I am surprised, you an MG owner too..........................????

 

P.S. The idea of questions and answers are for clarity, learn something, perhaps catch out, a bit of fun too, bit like being in Parliament....????

And as I keep repeating in these threads, we will ALL be driving electric in the not too distant future, oh, perhaps not me, I will be in my box on the way to being an........????

 

NO, your question wasn't silly ... the first ... repeatedly is simply trolling.

 

Save this image, so you never have to ask again.  It's self explanatory.

[transam]

1 minute ago, KhunLA said:

NO, your question wasn't silly ... the first ... repeatedly is simply trolling.

 

Save this image, so you never have to ask again.  It's self explanatory.

Of course, what you don't like to read is "trolling", but never mind, eh......???? 

[Fruit Trader]

4 minutes ago, transam said:

And maintenance, do solar panels have a life span, I don't know.....????

Yes they do and in many cases it will far exceed the return on investment period.

[KhunLA]

13 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

Not to worry, several guys will be around directly to address this...

Chiming in ... contracted house to build, 2020, plan to add solar when done, to meet the house's electrical needs.  Wanting to be off grid, so went big.

 

AT THE SAME TIME ... bought a new 2020 MG ZS ICE, obviously EV wasn't in the game plan, or we would not have bought new ICEV, simply kept the running good Mazda 2 we had at the time.

 

2 yrs later, MG ZS EV upgraded + Govt incentive (฿240k) + having more solar than we can use .... NO BRAINER, get the EV.  Didn't need to upgrade the solar to accommodate the EV's needs.

 

No additional cost to charge the EV,  ROI remains the same.

Edited July 26, 2023 by KhunLA

[transam]

Just now, Fruit Trader said:

Yes they do and in many cases it will far exceed the return on investment period.

Oh, think I should have a read up on it, the EV blokes here never mention that type of thing, especially one MG bloke who says I am trolling....????

[KhunLA]

3 minutes ago, transam said:

Of course, what you don't like to read is "trolling", but never mind, eh......???? 

And no comment about the ฿42.7k saved every year for the EV owners who have to pay PEA/MEA to charge.

 

Of course we get to save the whole ฿54.2k a year, using EXCESS solar.

[Yellowtail]

9 minutes ago, transam said:

And maintenance, do solar panels have a life span, I don't know.....????

No, they last forever and require no maintenance. 

[KhunLA]

2 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

No, they last forever and require no maintenance. 

@transam

Unlike the constant maintenance of an ICEV; oil changes, tune-up, going to and Q'ing up at the petrol station every week of so to buy petrol.  Spend spend spend.

 

Added savings for the EV owner ????

Before you repeat that one again:

 

[transam]

3 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

@transam

Unlike the constant maintenance of an ICEV; oil changes, tune-up, going to and Q'ing up at the petrol station every week of so to buy petrol.  Spend spend spend.

 

Added savings for the EV owner ????

Before you repeat that one again:

 

I run a 7 ltr car in the UK, many folk just pointed out my running costs, which had no impact on me whatsoever......????, but, they were welcome to their opinion and worrying....????

All I thought about was a gas station being open....????, I would probably be the same about an EV at this stage in the game in LOS....????

[JBChiangRai]

2 hours ago, transam said:

And maintenance, do solar panels have a life span, I don't know.....????

PV Lifespan is 25-35 years typically.

 

1 hour ago, transam said:

I run a 7 ltr car in the UK, many folk just pointed out my running costs, which had no impact on me whatsoever......????, but, they were welcome to their opinion and worrying....????

All I thought about was a gas station being open....????, I would probably be the same about an EV at this stage in the game in LOS....????

In the UK I have had lots of similar capacity ICE cars, but they never came close to the performance and refinement of an EV, and for downright fun, the EV's win hands down.  

 

There is a trend of replacing large capacity engines with smaller capacity, lighter twin/electric turbo charged engines which give a far better drive as you're not wrestling with a heavy lump of metal under the bonnet that doesn't want to go round that corner.

 

 

[Lacessit]

I haven't heard of any ICE vehicle being able to sink or seriously damage a ship.

Latest headline. Once is happenstance, twice is suspicious. The third time it is enemy action.

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-66310280

 

 

[ozimoron]

Seven major automakers say they’re joining forces to build a North American electric vehicle charging network that would rival Tesla’s and nearly double the number of fast-charging plugs in the U.S. and Canada.

 

General Motors, BMW, Honda, Hyundai, Kia, Mercedes and Stellantis said Wednesday that they will share in a multibillion-dollar investment to build “high power” charging stations with at least 30,000 plugs in urban areas and along travel corridors by 2030.

 

The dramatic move is intended to speed the adoption of electric vehicles, allaying fears that chargers won’t be available for long distance travel.

 

https://apnews.com/article/automakers-fast-charging-network-electric-vehicles-cbb6c0102345c0db38f2baf96db742da

[JBChiangRai]

6 hours ago, Lacessit said:

I haven't heard of any ICE vehicle being able to sink or seriously damage a ship.

Latest headline. Once is happenstance, twice is suspicious. The third time it is enemy action.

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-66310280

 

 

A quote from that article: "The coastguard said the cause of the fire was unknown, but had earlier suggested it might have been an electric car."

[Lacessit]

20 minutes ago, JBChiangRai said:

A quote from that article: "The coastguard said the cause of the fire was unknown, but had earlier suggested it might have been an electric car."

Occam's razor. There's a ship on the bottom of the Atlantic to support the hypothesis.

[JBChiangRai]

6 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

Occam's razor. There's a ship on the bottom of the Atlantic to support the hypothesis.

There's a moon up there so it must be Cheese.

[KhunLA]

29 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

Occam's razor. There's a ship on the bottom of the Atlantic to support the hypothesis.

Nobody knows the cause of that one either.  Feel free to speculate.

[JBChiangRai]

54 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

Occam's razor. There's a ship on the bottom of the Atlantic to support the hypothesis.

I think aliens came in a green spaceship made of marzipan and set the ship on fire.

 

There's a ship on the bottom of the Atlantic to support the hypothesis.

[Yellowtail]

5 hours ago, ozimoron said:

Seven major automakers say they’re joining forces to build a North American electric vehicle charging network that would rival Tesla’s and nearly double the number of fast-charging plugs in the U.S. and Canada.

 

General Motors, BMW, Honda, Hyundai, Kia, Mercedes and Stellantis said Wednesday that they will share in a multibillion-dollar investment to build “high power” charging stations with at least 30,000 plugs in urban areas and along travel corridors by 2030.

 

The dramatic move is intended to speed the adoption of electric vehicles, allaying fears that chargers won’t be available for long distance travel.

 

https://apnews.com/article/automakers-fast-charging-network-electric-vehicles-cbb6c0102345c0db38f2baf96db742da

From your link: "The administration of President Joe Biden attributed the announcement to his policies aimed at creating a U.S. electric vehicle manufacturing base and tax credits to increase sales in an effort to fight climate change." 

 

Apparently, taxpayers will be funding the network the "seven major automakers" are building as part of Biden's $2T Green New Idiocy...

 

 

 

[Lacessit]

3 hours ago, JBChiangRai said:

I think aliens came in a green spaceship made of marzipan and set the ship on fire.

 

There's a ship on the bottom of the Atlantic to support the hypothesis.

The electrical energy required to propel a vehicle 400 km is 60 kWh. Maybe more, if it is a luxury vehicle. One can ship an ICE vehicle from Europe to America with a couple of litres of gasoline in the fuel tank.

OTOH, one can't ship an EV with one or two kWh in the battery, as it may become inconveniently immobile during transfer operations.

Even at 30 kWh, it's a hell of a lot of stored energy. Plenty of evidence electrical fires are extremely difficult to extinguish.

Schiller said it best, against stupidity the gods themselves strive in vain. Thanks for the confirmation.

 

[transam]

15 hours ago, JBChiangRai said:

PV Lifespan is 25-35 years typically.

 

In the UK I have had lots of similar capacity ICE cars, but they never came close to the performance and refinement of an EV, and for downright fun, the EV's win hands down.  

 

There is a trend of replacing large capacity engines with smaller capacity, lighter twin/electric turbo charged engines which give a far better drive as you're not wrestling with a heavy lump of metal under the bonnet that doesn't want to go round that corner.

 

 

You do not have to explain to me anything about ICE rides, chummy....????

 

Your fun is different to mine, I like sounds from my fun, although I am a pensioner, unlike you, I don't need a silent grandpa ride, yet..........

[transam]

Well worth a watch, battery replacement on a 4 year old Chevy Volt.

Sadly the reason for the change, or cost were not mentioned, but it does show the 5 hour process on an "easy" swop.....

 

 

[JBChiangRai]

20 minutes ago, transam said:

You do not have to explain to me anything about ICE rides, chummy....????

 

 

Chummy? 
 

but apparently I do need to explain to you about EV’s

 

[JBChiangRai]

1 hour ago, transam said: unlike you, I don't need a silent grandpa ride, yet..........

Is this a silent grandpa ride?