Liverpool Lou Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 2 hours ago, richard_smith237 said: Are all tourist assumed to be guilty of overstay, stopped by the Police and have to prove otherwise [that they are not overstaying] ???.... OR, are these people who are caught for overstaying initially stopped and caught for some other reason then their overstay status is discovered ? No one is assumed guilty, but, yes, the police do have the right to ask any foreigner to produce his permission to stay but, having said that, the latter is very likely to be the case if the IB's systems didn't let them know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALLSEEINGEYE Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 10 minutes ago, FritsSikkink said: So to avoid that you leave on time or extend your visa on time. Thank you for that Captain obvious 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liverpool Lou Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 1 hour ago, spidermike007 said: I tend to agree. It is a very, very minor offense. It does not rise to the occasion of making an arrest. And the recent crackdown is beyond silly. You seriously think that those foreigners with no permission to be here, regardless of the length of time, should not be arrested and dealt with? What do think should happen to them when discovered, told "Tut, tut, overstay, never mind, off you go" so that there would be no need for anyone to ever get a visa/extension? Perhaps your rationalisation is that those on overstay should be left alone with no consequences and those legal foreigners who do renew their extensions should just have to get on with it? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liverpool Lou Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 1 hour ago, ALLSEEINGEYE said: Only 15 days overstay but Thailand will have no issues keeping him in IDC indefinitely unless he can pay the triple price airfare from IDC office to get out. He wouldn't have to pay "triple price air fare" if he had been here legally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liverpool Lou Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 1 hour ago, ThailandRyan said: Do Norwegians get the new 45 day entry or a 30 day? If he had a 30 day maybe he thought, based upon the recent change, he had 45 days, and if so he would not even have been on a 1 day overstay, but maybe he is still also on Norway time..... Maybe he can't read the permission to stay date clearly stamped in his passport? If he had bothered to read it he would not even have been on a one-day overstay! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liverpool Lou Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, Hummin said: My friend is positive he got scammed by an agent! I guess we just have to wait and see. What was the "scam" that he thinks he fell victim to? Did he pay an agent for an extension or change of visa? What is happening to him now, detention, deportation, court, maybe a deal? Edited December 12, 2022 by Liverpool Lou Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liverpool Lou Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 1 hour ago, hotchilli said: No job back home? Not now! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liverpool Lou Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 1 hour ago, ThailandRyan said: That is truly sad if he used an agent to obtain his visa and in the end got hosed....sucks, and he should be naming names to immigration...... If. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liverpool Lou Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, richard_smith237 said: What is the issue you see caused by someone who has overstayed by 15 days ? what harm is he causing someone ? He's not harming anyone but one doesn't have to harm others to commit criminal offences. In isolation, a 15-day overstay does just as much harm as a 1,500-day overstay. Edited December 12, 2022 by Liverpool Lou Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liverpool Lou Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, Peabody said: Saw them try to get a guy for 10 days overstay last week. Turned out to be a mistake in their computer records, but they were gonna get him! Any reason that a 10-day overstayer should have been allowed to remain here illegally if there hadn't been a "computer error"? Edited December 12, 2022 by Liverpool Lou Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard_smith237 Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 5 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said: 1 hour ago, richard_smith237 said: What is the issue you see caused by someone who has overstayed by 15 days ? what harm is he causing someone ? He's not harming anyone but one doesn't have to harm others to commit criminal offences. In isolation, a 15-day overstay does no less harm than a 1500-day overstay. Agreed... yet some people on this thread want the overstayers to face some rather extreme penalties... For an offence which (apparently) does not have an impact on anyone I’m not sure why someone who has overstayed for 15 days would face so much hate. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liverpool Lou Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 (edited) 55 minutes ago, Hummin said: My friend sent me his conversation with him, and he state he is going to get 5 year visa soon! We believe he had an agent promising him Elite visa! "Normal" agents do not provide Elite visas, only Thailand Privilege Card authorised representatives can provide them and, if he had the required funds and no previous record of overstay, he wouldn't need an agent. I suppose that if he was liquid enough for an Elite visa he could soon be enjoying a negotiated release. Edited December 12, 2022 by Liverpool Lou Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard_smith237 Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 31 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said: No one is assumed guilty, but, yes, the police do have the right to ask any foreigner to produce his permission to stay but, having said that, the latter is very likely to be the case if the IB's systems didn't let them know. Are you sure about that ? IF I’m not mistaken - only Commissioned officers can ask for ID (Government issued photo ID). An immigration officer needs to be present IF they want to check the Immigration Status of a person in the street. That said: If as you pointed out, the Immigration Police have asked for regular police to arrest someone for overstay, they are accused of ‘committing a crime’ and can be checked - in this case I believe an Immigration officer still needs to check the information (passport). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard_smith237 Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 34 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said: 2 hours ago, ALLSEEINGEYE said: Only 15 days overstay but Thailand will have no issues keeping him in IDC indefinitely unless he can pay the triple price airfare from IDC office to get out. He wouldn't have to pay "triple price air fare" if he had been here legally. & Someone else could get a ticket for him... (not triple fare of course)... I don’t think the ticket has to be purchased through Immigration. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liverpool Lou Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 (edited) 9 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said: 50 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said: yes, the police do have the right to ask any foreigner to produce his permission to stay but, having said that, the latter is very likely to be the case if the IB's systems didn't let them know. Are you sure about that ? Absolutely. I've been stopped on a bike taxi at Asok junction and asked to produce my passport at a (non-Immigration) police checkpoint. IB officers are RTP officers, police are police. Edited December 12, 2022 by Liverpool Lou Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard_smith237 Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 37 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said: 2 hours ago, spidermike007 said: I tend to agree. It is a very, very minor offense. It does not rise to the occasion of making an arrest. And the recent crackdown is beyond silly. You seriously think that those foreigners with no permission to be here, regardless of the length of time, should not be arrested and dealt with? What do think should happen to them when discovered, told "Tut, tut, overstay, never mind, off you go" so that there would be no need for anyone to ever get a visa/extension? Perhaps your rationalisation is that those on overstay should be left alone with no consequences and those legal foreigners who do renew their extensions should just have to get on with it? You're not wrong at all... Of course over stayers should be dealt with accordingly, they have broken the law. But, there does seem to be a ‘clamp-down’ and a disproportionate amount of focus. IF the Thai police applied this level of focus to ALL crimes it would easier to suggest this is the police simply doing their jobs... instead there seems to be an ‘element of targeting foreigners’ about this... Why aren’t over charging taxi drivers being dealt with the same way ??? OR, any other regular indiscriminate crime we see and witness daily here ? (Perhaps because the others don’t have 20,000 baht to pay a fine ?.... there’s no profit in targeting other crimes). I’m cynical... but I have learned to be here. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard_smith237 Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 5 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said: Absolutely. I've been stopped on a bike taxi at Asok junction and asked to produce my passport at a (non-Immigration) police checkpoint. IB officers are RTP officers, police are police. I've been stopped at Asoke and asked for my passport too.... That doesn't mean its a legal stop. There are regulations that the Police ‘should’ follow... but when we see them riding around without helmets, how can we expect them to follow their own regulations. As I understand it, ONLY an Immigration Officer can enquire about your Immigration Status. Only a Commissioned Officer (any Police) can ask for ID, OR, an non-commissioned officer in the presence of commissioned officers in a raid or at an official check-point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gearbox Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 2 hours ago, mikeymike100 said: According to the news the raids on venues, Walking Street, Tree Town etc, have stopped, but it seems the police are targeting people still who have overstayed according to their(immigration) records. Whether this is thru intelligence or spy's/whistleblowers etc we don't really know? I assume everyone is innocent, until proved guilty? You can't be innocent in many cases in Samui. When I did my last retirement extension in June, I was given an extra piece of paper to sign. I didn't read it carefully, but it was all about overstays and consequences. Didn't have to sign this an year ago, and it is quite possible all Non-O in Samui may need to sign it in the future. So you can't play innocent as your signature has acknowledged you are aware of what would happen if you overstay. I guess they probably don't bother much with the "normal" tourists entering on visa exempt, they usually stay a couple of weeks and head back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard_smith237 Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 1 minute ago, gearbox said: You can't be innocent in many cases in Samui. When I did my last retirement extension in June, I was given an extra piece of paper to sign. I didn't read it carefully, but it was all about overstays and consequences. Didn't have to sign this an year ago, and it is quite possible all Non-O in Samui may need to sign it in the future. So you can't play innocent as your signature has acknowledged you are aware of what would happen if you overstay. I guess they probably don't bother much with the "normal" tourists entering on visa exempt, they usually stay a couple of weeks and head back. All fairly moot..... Ignorance of the law is not a valid excuse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FritsSikkink Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 19 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said: As I understand it, ONLY an Immigration Officer can enquire about your Immigration Status. Only a Commissioned Officer (any Police) can ask for ID, OR, an non-commissioned officer in the presence of commissioned officers in a raid or at an official check-point. Do you have a link where it says that? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VinnieK Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 I hear, there's a Facebook group for overstayers ???????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeymike100 Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 1 hour ago, Liverpool Lou said: Are you suggesting that there's something wrong with upholding the law? I am absolutely not saying that! It was sarcasm, with a bit of humor to boot! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liverpool Lou Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 30 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said: I've been stopped at Asoke and asked for my passport too.... That doesn't mean its a legal stop. There are regulations that the Police ‘should’ follow... but when we see them riding around without helmets, how can we expect them to follow their own regulations. As I understand it, ONLY an Immigration Officer can enquire about your Immigration Status. I know that the RTP can ID anyone at anytime at their discretion. In my case I wasn't wearing a helmet, that made it legal, although they had no interest in that, even though they'd seen the win hand me a helmet in a panic. I know that any police officer can ask to check passports. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liverpool Lou Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 4 minutes ago, mikeymike100 said: 1 hour ago, Liverpool Lou said: Are you suggesting that there's something wrong with upholding the law? I am absolutely not saying that! It was sarcasm, with a bit of humor to boot! Well, as long as it was 'to boot', that's ok! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hotandsticky Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 8 hours ago, wombat said: Only 15 days? Hardly seems fair. There is no possible excuse for 15 days overstay. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vangrop Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 12 hours ago, RandiRona said: Well because these so called 'quality tourists' believe that law doesnt apply to them. Deport and ban and clean Thailand of these law breaking 'dirty falangs'. speculation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vangrop Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 9 hours ago, stoner said: you're really equating overstaying on a government issued visa and jaywalking ? totally see how you made that connection. preaching the good words Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taboo2 Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 Next time, just go home like I and most normal folks do when our privilege to stay has expired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vangrop Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 6 hours ago, Gottfrid said: For your information. 15 days or 2146 days, does not matter regarding breaking the immigration law or not. It only carries different penalties. And, it´s very good that they put only 15 days out in the news. That might send a clear message that you should not come to Thailand, overstay and take it all for granted. another preacher Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vangrop Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 The guy looks clearly like an hobo. The fact that there is no info about why the overstay says enough. Probably another farang on the run on the loss Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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